Poll: Does pirating a game to test it make it okay?

[fenrizz]

Is it ok to steal food in order to taste it?
Is it ok to steal clothes to see if they fit?
It is ok to steal a car to see test it?

Let's stick to the subject at hand, which is not theft.

but a question. is piracy justified when you have NO means whatsoever to get the original games?
i mean its like buy the pirated game or not buy at all cause you cant buy the original version. what about then?

I'd call it ok.
As long as the game is out of print and not available through Steam or similar services, it's not a problem.

Then again, I also think intellectual property should expire after 10-20 years and become public domain.

 

[Ham Blitz]

No it is not (although I've found my stance on piracy to be one of the harshest on this site...basically, it's never OK unless you literally can't get the item in question due to it's age).

There are sites that you can go to that will tell you these things.

http://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri (like this one! I'm sure there are others but this is the one I personally use)

I was originally going to say yes to the OP but then you posted this... Thank you so much! My laptop is crap and I have been scared to get so many games because I wasn't sure if I can run them, now I can know for sure!
You sir, have made my day and have my thanks.

 

[Iron Criterion]

Is it okay to hotwire a car to "test drive" it? Or to read a book in the bookshop in its entirety before buying it?

I'm not equating piracy with theft, because it isn't (nor is it a crime in the UK, it's an offence), but illustrating the stupid question that the OP could have answered himself if he had thought for 30 seconds prior to writing the question.

Straw Man arguments are fun, right? Your response reminds me of the old "you wouldn't steal a car" anti-piracy ads; it's such an over exaggeration to compare a minor offense to a petty crime.

Also, a lot of people must have a disposable income if they can afford to waste money on a game which might not work. I probably buy 6 games a year, because I can't justify wasting more than a couple of hundred pounds on video games; but you can so that's cool.

 

[Fenra]

Its one of those grey areas not as far as the act goes I find but as far as who you talk to as everyone has widely differing views on it.

I have done this myself, a prominent example being Bioshock 2, the first one ran fine on my PC but after seeing videos of the second and looking at the system specs, despite having above the recommended specs, I was still dubious. I found out it ran on my PC but average at best, poorly at other times, so that very night I uninstalled it, went to Amazon and bought it for the 360

From a legal standpoint its not right, but from a moral standpoint that's all up to the person and whether they do intend to actually buy it afterwards or are using that "I'm going to test it, that's all" as an excuse to justify them searching for torrents or what have you in the first place.

The slippery slope with it in my opinion is that once you've downloaded it, its on your hard drive, a full game right there and the temptation to just play it all and forget about it can be too much. Even if you simply wanted to test it to begin with now you have whatever the latest hot release on your PC for free. Whether you give in to said temptation is down to the person in question.

 

[Iron Criterion]

No it is not (although I've found my stance on piracy to be one of the harshest on this site...basically, it's never OK unless you literally can't get the item in question due to it's age).

There are sites that you can go to that will tell you these things.

http://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri (like this one! I'm sure there are others but this is the one I personally use)

I was originally going to say yes to the OP but then you posted this... Thank you so much! My laptop is crap and I have been scared to get so many games because I wasn't sure if I can run them, now I can know for sure!
You sir, have made my day and have my thanks.

Be wary, that site has been known to be very wrong in the past (check some of the posts here). So double check before following its advice.

 

[KingsGambit_v1legacy]

That's not analogous to the OP at all. You don't have to hotwire a car to test drive it. The dealership will most likely give you a set of keys if you're looking to purchase a vehicle. And you can read a few chapters in a bookstore just fine.

Wait, are you suggesting that there's a legal route to test driving a car, such as going to the dealership, instead of smashing the window and hotwiring it? Amazing! I wonder if there are lawful avenues for testing a game as well? Like renting, borrowing, downloading a demo, logging into Steam with an account that already has the game, or waiting for a free weekend? Nah, that would be silly; doing something the unlawful way makes *much* more sense. Pirating a game is obviously the only way a game can be tested.

 

[tippy2k2]

Spoiler: Why can't I hold all these quotes!

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Holy smokies, I'm popular! (or what I've said is disagreed by a lot of people). If I missed your quote, I apologize in advance.

Now all five of you I believe have the same point so I am just doing one super quote to respond. If I'm incorrect and you had a different point, feel free to re-quote me to get my attention.

Again, I would be surprised if I didn't have the most dictatory view on piracy on this site but yes, PC gaming is an inherent risk that you take when you purchase a game. You can do all the research you want but there is still a chance that it won't work on your system due to your flux-capacitor not playing nicely with the coding and that is a risk that you have to take if you are going to be a PC gamer. If you are unwilling to risk the money, download a demo. If (like most PC games), there is no demo, you either take the risk with the money, research forums to see if there are problems people are having, or you wait until the amount drops to an acceptable risk. If a company takes your money and runs...well, you know what companies to hold off purchases for until their stuff has plummeted in price.

If I purchase a console game and it doesn't work due to shitty coding, you don't get your money back on that (stores will swap it out for a new copy once it's opened but shitty code isn't going to get fixed with a new disc). Sure, there's less risk because all consoles are the same but that's still a risk that I accept when I purchase a game on my 360.

 

[Ham Blitz]

No it is not (although I've found my stance on piracy to be one of the harshest on this site...basically, it's never OK unless you literally can't get the item in question due to it's age).

There are sites that you can go to that will tell you these things.

http://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri (like this one! I'm sure there are others but this is the one I personally use)

I was originally going to say yes to the OP but then you posted this... Thank you so much! My laptop is crap and I have been scared to get so many games because I wasn't sure if I can run them, now I can know for sure!
You sir, have made my day and have my thanks.

Be wary, that site has been known to be very wrong in the past (check some of the posts here). So double check before following its advice.

Yeah, I just figured that out when I tested Killing Floor on it. I have played that game for so much time with very little problems and it says I can't handle it.
Though, upon checking the problem, this is what I see:
Features: Minimum attributes of your Video Card
it says I need 2.0, 2.0 and 64 MB for my Pixel Shader version, Vertex Shader version, and Dedicated Video RAM respectively then says I have 4.0, 4.0 and 128 MB

So it technically says I can by stats, but for some reason comes up as a failure.

 

[kasperbbs]

No it is not (although I've found my stance on piracy to be one of the harshest on this site...basically, it's never OK unless you literally can't get the item in question due to it's age).

There are sites that you can go to that will tell you these things.

http://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri (like this one! I'm sure there are others but this is the one I personally use)

This site doesn't always tell the truth, it told me that there was no way i could run crysis on my old PC, but i tried it anyway and it ran on medium/high settings perfectly fine. Therefore i often used OP's method of testing games before i bought them, since demos became extinct. I had a shitty job back then so i simply couldn't afford to spend 1/5 of my monthly pay on something that might not even work.

 

[KingsGambit_v1legacy]

Straw Man arguments are fun, right?

Errrr...what?

Your response reminds me of the old "you wouldn't steal a car" anti-piracy ads; it's such an over exaggeration to compare a minor offense to a petty crime.

I agree. You'll even note I said that. And piracy isn't a crime, at least not in the UK. It's an offence. It's civil, not criminal. That's because it's not theft as many claim, but copyright infringement.

Also, a lot of people must have a disposable income if they can afford to waste money on a game which might not work. I probably buy 6 games a year, because I can't justify wasting more than a couple of hundred pounds on video games; but you can so that's cool.

Not everyone is awesome like me, this is very true.

But I must also be the only person who has heard of the word "demo", or "borrow from a friend" or realises that different people can log in to Steam on the same computer.

 

[AzrealMaximillion]

If there is no demo, sure. Not every review actually describes how a game plays. Some reviews are horrible, and some games are harder to read/write a review of.

I also think pirating is ok in the cases where the company that made the game is out of business and therefore not receiving any money for the game, or the game is no longer in print and there is no digital distribution of it in any way shape or form.

 

[fenrizz]

But I must also be the only person who has heard of the word "demo", or "borrow from a friend" or realises that different people can log in to Steam on the same computer.

But what difference does it make if you log onto a friends Steam account to test it or if you download it instead?

I mean, it's pretty much the same thing, is it not?

 

[Something Amyss]

Such a grey area.

Most PC games don't have demos. And of course you can't buy a game, see if it works or not, and return it if it doesn't.

There is, of course, the completely legal option of doing without. Oddly enough, if people did without, there would simultaneously be fewer instances of piracy and a higher chance that demos will be released.

No it is not (although I've found my stance on piracy to be one of the harshest on this site...basically, it's never OK unless you literally can't get the item in question due to it's age).

There are sites that you can go to that will tell you these things.

http://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri (like this one! I'm sure there are others but this is the one I personally use)

While I do use CYRI as a guide, there are quite a few games my PC should be able to run (and smokes the settings on, BTW, not just "barely passes") that it won't. That's not an absolute way to work things.

 

[joshthor]

In your situation I think its fine (saying this as someone who never pirates games anymore and hasnt in 4 years) however, I also think its a very fine line. if it turns into she tests it and doesnt like it, or doesnt think its worth the 20 dollars, it simply turns into piracy. I dont like the idea of pirating a game to test it because if i did that, i would have probably 75% less games. not cause they are bad games, but because i would lose my interest goggles and be like... "eh, this game is ok, but not something i need"

 

[Something Amyss]

But I must also be the only person who has heard of the word "demo", or "borrow from a friend" or realises that different people can log in to Steam on the same computer.

But what difference does it make if you log onto a friends Steam account to test it or if you download it instead?

I mean, it's pretty much the same thing, is it not?

Steam has DRM built right into the platform. Your use, while questionable, would be finite.

 

[KingsGambit_v1legacy]

But what difference does it make if you log onto a friends Steam account to test it or if you download it instead?

I mean, it's pretty much the same thing, is it not?

The end result is the same, but the means used to achieve it are different. In this case, one is lawful and the other is copyright infringement. It's the difference I suggested above, of hotwiring a car to test-drive it, instead of going to the dealership.

 

[Winthrop]

This question is why demos should return.

There is another side to this, demos aren't as easy to create as you think. Developers can't just "cut out" a chunk of the game and package it into a functional program ready for playing, in most games the code & visuals are a horribly complicated interconnecting mesh, often being worked on by separate teams and then finally being assembled into one playable experience. In fact developers would have to do several beta tests of the DEMO itself to weed out all the bugs that may have popped up during the process of cutting-off the rest of the game. Then there's the additional costs of the release/launch cycle, along with advertising/promotion. Just for a freaking demo.

I don't know the intricate bits of it, but it's a lot more effort than what most people think and is one of the main reasons why demos have become so scarce.

Not only that, demos can actually result in a potential LOSS of sales. If someone thinks "oh god, I didn't like this demo one bit" there's a customer who is instantly lost because they judged the whole game based on the first 30 mins / first mission / whatever. If a demo wasn't available, there would've been a 50/50 chance of that person just taking a leap of faith and buying the whole game - in which case he would've given $60 to the developers and that would've been an instant win (for the developers/publishers I mean). See where I'm getting at?

I think the math-heads at EA/etc have probably calculated that packaging a demo is not worth the boost in sales it can potentially cause (or potential loss). Not true with every game though, looking at Mass Effect 3.

Personally I wish demos would come back (please?) but I can see the reasons why they have faded.

captcha: MARRY ME
No captcha, I'm not ready to commit to this relationship yet, need more time, etc etc

You know I've seen this "Loss in sales" things before (on extra credits not sure if thats where you saw it) and I don't think it takes things into account. My computer is pretty bad. I rarely buy a game if it doesn't have a demo because I'm worried I won't be able to play it. Therefore, if a game I really want doesn't have a demo, I won't buy it (unless its on a ridiculous sale). This makes me a lost sale on every game I want that doesn't have a demo. Still the other point about time and resources is very valid.

 

[Entitled]

The end result is the same, but the means used to achieve it are different. In this case, one is lawful and the other is copyright infringement. It's the difference I suggested above, of hotwiring a car to test-drive it, instead of going to the dealership.

No. Hotwiring a car isn't only wrong because it's a legal offense, but because it involves manipulating someone's property, and physically depriving them of it for a time.

On the other hand, using copyright infringement for a test instad of borrowing the copy, is acually better, since it DOESN'T deprive your friend of his own copy. You don't even need a friend or a Steam account to do it.

Making your own copy of a game that you want to try, is a better alternative than taking an existing copy, from every aspect but the legal one.