Poll: Dubstep. Music or not music?

[Womplord]

"The art of combining vocal sounds to produce beauty of form, harmony, and expression of emotion, using musical instruments from the four categories of instrument, brass wind, stringed and percussion.

tell me where digital fits in there?

I'm sorry but just because your university lecturers tell you something doesn't make it true, and just because something doesn't follow the tradition doesn't mean anything is wrong with it.

The English language is dynamic, and 'music' means whatever it is intended to mean by the most common definition used by the general public, which is obviously WAY wider than your definition.

Your opinions in your post are not only laughable, but obviously fueled by elitism and closed mindedness. Maybe you are just angry because the world has evolved far past your primitive music.

 

[TheOrb]

Also, this is probably the best cover of a dubstep song I have ever heard:

That was okay for the first two minutes and twenty-five seconds, but afterwards it just became noise, and I had to stop.

 

[Vault101]

They aren't my rules, this is all from my universities text books on musical theory.... ? once again are you retarded?...

I gave you the definition of music. It's not my fault you didn't read it...

I hate electronica yes, but by the definition it isn't music because there are no musical instruments involved... if it's music then hamburgers are pizzas...

here it is again "The art of combining vocal sounds to produce beauty of form, harmony, and expression of emotion, using musical instruments from the four categories of instrument, brass wind, stringed and percussion.

tell me where digital fits in there?

I was saying that WE WERE TAUGHT IT IS MUSIC ONLY TO KEEP SNIVELING MORONS LIKE YOU QUIET OTHERWISE IT IS NOT ACTUALLY DEFINED AS A GENRE, THERE ARE NO MUSICAL INSTRUMENTS AND THEREFORE CAN NOT BE MUSIC. TO SAY YOU CAN HAVE MUSIC WITH NO INSTRUMENTS IS TO SAY YOU CAN PLAY VIDEO GAMES WITH AN APPLE BECAUSE IT'S ART.


did that work or are you going to comment saying my arbitrary rules aren't clear? and that its music because you like it providing no further qualification for your statement...

thats it?

thats fucking it?

using musical instruments from the four categories of instrument,[b/] brass wind, stringed and percussion.[/b]

oh hey! let me find another one!

[quote/][i/]The art or science of combining vocal or instrumental sounds (or both) to produce beauty of form, harmony, and expression of emotion.
The vocal or instrumental sound produced in this way.[/i][/quote]

except here the "instrument" part is less defined...

lets try another one

[quote/][i/]1. The art of arranging sounds in time so as to produce a continuous, unified, and evocative composition, as through melody, harmony, rhythm, and timbre.
2. Vocal or instrumental sounds possessing a degree of melody, harmony, or rhythm.[/i][/quote]

I don't know about you but that seems rather open for interpretation

another one?

[quote/][i/]1.
an art of sound in time that expresses ideas and emotions in significant forms through the elements of rhythm, melody, harmony, and color.
2.
the tones or sounds employed, occurring in single line (melody) or multiple lines (harmony), and sounded or to be sounded by one or more voices or instruments, or both.[/i][/quote]



I mean really..a few fucking words..thats it. Thats your friggen argument where you reference all that musical knowelege you have.It comes down to a few specific words...my god


No, come on, don't lie, you simply dont like electronic..therefore you are MORE than happy to look at that definition you give and say it isn't music because electronic tools don't fit into any of those categories of instrument

I mean what is an instrument? a thing that produces sounds right?

now please do me a favour...why don't you pull your head out of whatever dark cavity it may be in and actually have a think about it

music is made up of all kinds of elements, yes? if those [i/]same[/i] elements can be produced electronically as well as organically then WHAT DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE?

 

[Grant Hobba]

They aren't my rules, this is all from my universities text books on musical theory.... ? once again are you retarded?...

I gave you the definition of music. It's not my fault you didn't read it...

I hate electronica yes, but by the definition it isn't music because there are no musical instruments involved... if it's music then hamburgers are pizzas...

here it is again "The art of combining vocal sounds to produce beauty of form, harmony, and expression of emotion, using musical instruments from the four categories of instrument, brass wind, stringed and percussion.

tell me where digital fits in there?

I was saying that WE WERE TAUGHT IT IS MUSIC ONLY TO KEEP SNIVELING MORONS LIKE YOU QUIET OTHERWISE IT IS NOT ACTUALLY DEFINED AS A GENRE, THERE ARE NO MUSICAL INSTRUMENTS AND THEREFORE CAN NOT BE MUSIC. TO SAY YOU CAN HAVE MUSIC WITH NO INSTRUMENTS IS TO SAY YOU CAN PLAY VIDEO GAMES WITH AN APPLE BECAUSE IT'S ART.


did that work or are you going to comment saying my arbitrary rules aren't clear? and that its music because you like it providing no further qualification for your statement...

thats it?

thats fucking it?

using musical instruments from the four categories of instrument,[b/] brass wind, stringed and percussion.[/b]

oh hey! let me find another one!

[quote/][i/]The art or science of combining vocal or instrumental sounds (or both) to produce beauty of form, harmony, and expression of emotion.
The vocal or instrumental sound produced in this way.[/i]

except here the "instrument" part is less defined...

lets try another one

[quote/][i/]1. The art of arranging sounds in time so as to produce a continuous, unified, and evocative composition, as through melody, harmony, rhythm, and timbre.
2. Vocal or instrumental sounds possessing a degree of melody, harmony, or rhythm.[/i][/quote]

I don't know about you but that seems rather open for interpretation

another one?

[quote/][i/]1.
an art of sound in time that expresses ideas and emotions in significant forms through the elements of rhythm, melody, harmony, and color.
2.
the tones or sounds employed, occurring in single line (melody) or multiple lines (harmony), and sounded or to be sounded by one or more voices or instruments, or both.[/i][/quote]



I mean really..a few fucking words..thats it. Thats your friggen argument where you reference all that musical knowelege you have.It comes down to a few specific words...my god


No, come on, don't lie, you simply dont like electronic..therefore you are MORE than happy to look at that definition you give and say it isn't music because electronic tools don't fit into any of those categories of instrument

I mean what is an instrument? a thing that produces sounds right?

now please do me a favour...why don't you pull your head out of whatever dark cavity it may be in and actually have a think about it

music is made up of all kinds of elements, yes? if those [i/]same[/i] elements can be produced electronically as well as organically then WHAT DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE?[/quote]

yup you are right .... and 2+2 =81743628 because I saw it on the internet.

I really don't care anymore.... your opinion is wrong and anyone can pull a definition from wiki... doesn't means it's correct, grow up mate.

musical instruments must fall into those four categories or they are not musical instruments, if there is music without musical instruments... why the fuck do musical instruments still exist... music is a form of art not an art form open to interpretation and adaption by every retard who doesn't like conformity, did you argue with your English teacher when she tried to teach you spelling because retards on the internet were spelling differently to her ?

I'll actually let you in on a secret I love suicide season cut up ( a dub step re release of a bring me the horizon album)

but, still by a correct definition it is not music...

the only thing more I can do is physically scan my text book for you, would you like that?

because I can't quote more factual information than that... it clearly states in every issue the classification of a musical instrument and the necessity of musical instruments in composing music.

because you clearly do not understand that simply because pop culture wants it, it doesn't make it a legitimate thing,

guess what, sexting was put in the dictionary doesn't make it a good thing or a real fucking word does it...

and a musical instrument isn't just something that makes sound... you saying that demonstrates you level of backward thinking and ignorance...

 

[Womplord]

"The art of combining vocal sounds to produce beauty of form, harmony, and expression of emotion, using musical instruments from the four categories of instrument, brass wind, stringed and percussion.

tell me where digital fits in there?

I'm sorry but just because your university lecturers tell you something doesn't make it true, and just because something doesn't follow the tradition doesn't mean anything is wrong with it.

The English language is dynamic, and 'music' means whatever it is intended to mean by the most common definition used by the general public, which is obviously WAY wider than your definition.

Your opinions in your post are not only laughable, but obviously fueled by elitism and closed mindedness. Maybe you are just angry because the world has evolved far past your primitive music.

Oh I get you now ? Ill tell the publishers of my text books they are incorrect because someone on the internet told me so, thank you! you have saved my university! are there any other subjects you disagree with because pop culture is more important that factual information ?

Ill tell all of those conductors and orchestras they are incorrect in using musical theory as it is dated ? yeah... okay.

oh and retard... I wouldn't call classical primitive you are a fucking joke if you think so....

dubstep is nothing more than bass and some guy pressing buttons on a machine... no skill or knowledge required... I guess that would be the primitive genre huh?

oh thats right... I don't just like rock, it's just what I know most about because thats the subject matter I am most interested in... people like you are what's wrong with the world...

electronic isn't some major breakthrough in the advancement of human kind... its stoners making bass sounds with computers... take a short walk off a long cliff mate, you are clearly a few brain cells short of a working human being

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKLpJtvzlEI if dub step is music this was a complete waste of a great musical composers time...

I bet frank zappa would turn in his grave at the thought of people like you.

"But the text book told me so!!!" is basically all I got out of that post, you had ZERO refutation of my argument and couldn't even use a quote from the text book to do so. I'm pretty sure it is a principle of higher education to use your brain instead of just outright believing everything you are told, so how about following that instead? I don't see why music theory can't apply to other instruments and neither can you, maybe you should try coming up with a logical reason to support your argument instead of spewing insults which makes everyone know you are an idiot who has no other way left to argue.

Anyway, have fun with your career in classical music, Mr. Educated Uniman, even though you yourself will be probably be forced to adapt to use computers to produce music with your degree because it's a growing medium.

I bet frank zappa would be open minded.

 

[Vault101]

[
yup you are right .... and 2+2 =81743628 because I saw it on the internet.

yes..because thats the kind of leap of logic I'm making /sarcasm


[quote/]I really don't care anymore.... your opinion is wrong and anyone can pull a definition from wiki... doesn't means it's correct, grow up mate.[/quote]

grow up?...heres a question for you which of us here have consistently resorted to insults......take your time, I can wait

and what makes your textbook the fucking gospel? granted you could say its somwhat more "reputable" but such works go through all kinds of revisions and changes...
my problem here is your just throwing thease definitions at me without explaination "THIS IS WHAT MY BOOK SAYS THEREFORE IT IS GOSPEL"

fine then...,but explain [i/]why[/i]


[quote/]musical instruments must fall into those four categories or they are not musical instruments,[/quote]

yes...ok then

[i/]why[/i]

a sound is a sound...a C flat is a C flat regardless of weather its made by those little wooden hammers hitting the chords inside of a Piano or if its made digitally

I want you to tell me [i/]why[/i] not throw your text book at me


[quote/]if there is music without musical instruments... why the fuck do musical instruments still exist...[/quote]
did I say that?...no..

[quote/]music is a form of art not an art form open to interpretation and adaption by every retard who doesn't like conformity, did you argue with your English teacher when she tried to teach you spelling because retards on the internet were spelling differently to her ?[/quote]
you like conformity huh? I didnt argue with my english Teacher because she didn;t say somthing like...saaay that swear words werent actually words


[quote/]I'll actually let you in on a secret I love suicide season cut up ( a dub step re release of a bring me the horizon album)

but, still by a correct definition it is not music...[/quote]
it fits 99% of the definition of music except the "percussion, strings or wind" part..so again...*shrug*


[quote/]the only thing more I can do is physically scan my text book for you, would you like that?[/quote]
forget about the god damn textbook for two seconds...please

[quote/]because I can't quote more factual information than that... it clearly states in every issue the classification of a musical instrument and the necessity of musical instruments in composing music.[/quote]

again....theres still why...

[quote/]because you clearly do not understand that simply because pop culture wants it, it doesn't make it a legitimate thing,[/quote]
there may actually be "music people" who disagree with you


[quote/]guess what, sexting was put in the dictionary doesn't make it a good thing or a real fucking word does it... [/quote]
unless you think slang words shouldnt be in the dictionary..but thats another issue alltogether


[quote/]and a musical instrument isn't just something that makes sound......[/quote]

perhaps I should have clarified..not any sound but the "music sounds"..notes or whatever...you know

[quote/] you saying that demonstrates you level of backward thinking and ignorance[/quote]


as for that statment there.....I....honestly don't know what to say...in fact I don't really need to say anything

 

[Womplord]

If anyone is in for a laugh, take a look at his new thread:

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.385982-Do-you-hate-people-who-argue-till-they-are-blue-in-the-face-even-though-you-know-they-are-wrong

 

[Vault101]

If anyone is in for a laugh, take a look at his new thread:

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.385982-Do-you-hate-people-who-argue-till-they-are-blue-in-the-face-even-though-you-know-they-are-wrong

I...I don't even

"go me!"..I guess XD

 

[Limecake]

It all comes down to how you classify music, it's the same thing with the whole 'video games as art thing. Those who believe art or music has a set definition that cannot change will say it isn't, those who believe that the definition of music and art can change believe it is.

after all it wasn't long ago that people were having a similar discussion about the electric guitar, I personally believe that art/music can be anything that stirs emotions in someone or makes them think. by that definition dubstep is music.

 

[Draxz]

I believe this is our answer:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/426588_512776912070122_1224243204_n.jpg

I don't know how to make the image appear on here though... It'll appear as a Jpeg in a new tab, either way.

 

[Jonluw]

I believe this is our answer:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/426588_512776912070122_1224243204_n.jpg

I don't know how to make the image appear on here though... It'll appear as a Jpeg in a new tab, either way.

Just write [img] and [/img] on either side of the image url.

Like this (quote me to see the underlying code):

 

[Draxz]

I believe this is our answer:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/426588_512776912070122_1224243204_n.jpg

I don't know how to make the image appear on here though... It'll appear as a Jpeg in a new tab, either way.

Just write [img] and [/img] on either side of the image url.

Like this (quote me to see the underlying code):

Ah, now I get it! Thanks!

 

[Jonluw]

I believe this is our answer:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/426588_512776912070122_1224243204_n.jpg

I don't know how to make the image appear on here though... It'll appear as a Jpeg in a new tab, either way.

Just write [img] and [/img] on either side of the image url.

Like this (quote me to see the underlying code):

Ah, now I get it! Thanks!

My pleasure.

 

[tehroc]

It's music. Dubstep doesn't really move me, usually there isn't much going on. Like this Skrillex guy, most of his songs I've heard consist of a drum track,a bassline, and hardly anything else. It's like 2000s British nu-breaks got even more minimal and morphed into dubstep. I'm sure there are some songs that I would like, but I'm too busy shaking my fist at these youngsters and their fancy musics.

I can get the same dirty bassline in almost any dnb/jungle song and get an easily danceable beat.

Funky Breaks is where it's still at for this old codger.

 

[Kouen]

Is "Dubstep" music? Yes, Yes it is.

However for the most part I do not like it at all due to it being too busy, noisy for bass kiddies.

However, I'm not so close minded to deny its a style of music. If you like / love Dubstep that is awesome, if you do not that is awesome too.

"Different strokes for different folks" as they say just be mindful that while you may think that Dubstep may be the best thing to happen to this planet, Others will not share your opinion. but do not get offended that's OK, Diversity is cool.

As Motoko says on Ghost in the Shell "Overspecialise and you breed in weakness" - If we all just liked Dubstep the music medium would get stale and old before Freddie Mercury could spin in his grave (at all the poor dubstep's done with Queen songs)

-Kouen

 

[GiantRaven]

Okay I'll try to keep this one short,

not using an instrument is for the musically talentless.

Wow. Just wow. This is quite literally one of the stupidest things I've ever heard a person say.

I mean seriously...wow. Are you suggesting that, for example, a person who understands music well enough to compose a piece of music, yet doesn't know how to play an instrument (although your view of what makes an instrument seems incredibly limited) is musically talentless. Why does the ability to play an instrument denote musical talent, not the ability to write music?

Oh an synthesizers are not instruments.

Completely ignoring, of course, that a keyboard synth is played in much the same way that a piano is. Nope. Not an instrument. Jordan Rudess? What a talentless hack! [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rW1KeRNaP-Q]

Art for the sake or art is one view that music should never have adopted... and the rules regarding musical theory are not arbitrary? to someone who studies music it's kind of blasphemous to say that... you may as well say laws are arbitrary.... or that organ functionality in the body is arbitrary... all rules rules have purpose, composition especially in classical... it wouldn't have existed and without that, you wouldn't have had music the way it is now... Heck even the writers behind pop music are using those rules and you can't tell me despite your views on pop that there is always a catchy song in the pop charts...

And eastern music that works outside western classical theory? The use of microtones? [http://www.likhati.com/2010/04/18/introducing-yourself-to-indian-classical-music-11-demonstrating-the-srutis-microtones-in-indian-classical-music/] Musical theory is not the be all and end all of music. It's just a set of instructions to help denote certain methods that 'work'. Music can be made by ignoring the classic music scales etc.

edit:

because you clearly do not understand that simply because pop culture wants it, it doesn't make it a legitimate thing

Lol, because it was pop culture that created electronic/digital/whatever music. Oh wait, no. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Musique_concr%C3%A8te] (to use just one example)

 

[Th37thTrump3t]

wubwub

96.5% more of it.

 

[Wuks95]

I really don't understand this stigma around dubstep music. It just a sub-genre of electronic music that has that "wub-wub" sound. It not nuclear physics, you don't need to analyze it that much. Crap or not, either way it IS music.

I remember during the 80s and 90s, rap and Hip-Hop was on the same page, but nobody is discussing it today. People will get used to it and new sound will emerge and people will be instantly bashing it, and just like ME3's ending, the cycle goes on.