Poll: Satanism

[Lieju]

I don't care what people believe in as long as they don't effect the rights of others.

There are different types of satanism, and I suspect not all who identify as such take it as seriously, but in general I think the basic message of it, being selfish and all is harmful.

But then again, so is Christianity or Islam or most of the religions, and at least satanists don't hold any real power, so they aren't really something I worry about.

More so about the culture of selfishness in general.

 

[BonsaiK]

I'm curious to see what people here think of Satanism as an ideology. Firstly, though, I want to know what you all actually know about Satanism BEFORE looking it up.

A great deal. Some of the musicians I'm in regular touch with are involved in this, and I gave one of the Council of Nine a lift in my car once. He paid for the petrol, which was appreciated.

Then once you've done that read this [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanism] and this [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LaVeyan_Satanism] and tell me your opinion on it

Terrible Wiki articles, damn. Especially when they start talking about music.

I support much of the basic concept but I generally have problems with the execution. I like the first half of the Satanic Bible where they talk about the philosophical side, it's a lot more well-written and humourous than The Bible or The Koran, but in the second half where they get into how to do a ritual and all that speaking in tongues-type stuff I tend to think that's a load of tiresome asspaper and LaVey is just having a wank. It's not very ideologically consistent but I have to hand it to LaVey, he knows how to reel you in.

I also think that Satanism fails as a "religion" as it doesn't perform the primary functions of religion very well. This is why I voted "good" in the poll, but it's also why I don't think that Satanism is a good thing to get a lot of people believing, I think society would have problems if Satanism was really popular. Orthodox religions are far more sensible from the social aspect, they have both better dogma and infrastructure for that sort of thing. Because of this, Satanism will never be something that interests more than a few people. That's a good thing for both the Satanists and everybody else.

 

[RevRaptor]

I tend to dislike organised religion in general.

Funny fact that upside down cross that Satanists use to show that they are against god is actually one of Christianity's most holy symbols. It refers to St. Peter being crucified upside down. Don't believe me then what's it doing here.

yep that's the popes chair and the reason that cross is upside down is because the upside down cross is more respectful to god apparently.

Dumbass Satanists.

http://www.shasta.com/sphaws/invertedcross.html

 

[Kpt._Rob]

LaVey style Satanism is a sort of extreme expression of the materialist viewpoint. LaVey is one of those characters who's most interesting for the ways in which he was a mad scientist of psychology, but the traditions he left behind him are hardly healthy for people to follow. I guess if you are driven to accept the materialist view of reality which is slowly being overturned by quantum physics then you could adopt it, but even if the materialist view is true then the only reason it's an acceptable view is because there would be no such thing as an unacceptable view in that case.

But I am not a materialist (rather I accept a more monistic viewpoint like what one would see in Hinduism) and I can honestly say that I think following the sort of lifestyle LaVey describes in his books (which I have actually read [The Satanic Bible, The Satanic Witch, and The Devil's Notebook all passed through my hands back in the day when I was critically analyzing every religion I could]) would be damaging to the soul.

 

[Soviet Steve]

There isn't much comparison to Scientology, because Satanism doesn't ask for your money, or your complete obedience, or your devotion to the "religion", so it's not really in it for commercial purposes

No but religious activities aren't taxed, so in essence Satanists with commercial aspirations just seek to steal from everyone, rather than the people they sell goods and services to. I know Scientology does the same, but Satanists don't have the moral superiority in that game.

 

[Corekrash]

I tend to dislike organised religion in general.

Funny fact that upside down cross that Satanists use to show that they are against god is actually one of Christianity's most holy symbols. It refers to St. Peter being crucified upside down. Don't believe me then what's it doing here.

yep that's the popes chair and the reason that cross is upside down is because the upside down cross is more respectful to god apparently.

Dumbass Satanists.

That depends on which Satanists you're calling dumb there. I've never known a satanist that actually worships the icon of an upside-down-cross. (To be fair though, I don't know very many)

As far as my opinion on Satanist religion, and religion in general, I'm a discordian (AND an Odinist), and that should say enough about what my views are.

 

[ImmortalDrifter]

Theistic or LaVeyan Satanism? I think theistic Satanism is just idiotic, and I think LaVeyan Satanism is just childish.

Being a LaVeyan Satanist, i would like you too explain your reasoning.

Well the commandments of Satanism would effectively, if followed to the letter, make you Charlie Sheen. If a child wants something he takes it. If a child is angry he responds with violence. Yes, it is because it was once natural to do that, but now, it is irrelevant and idiotic, humans have evolved beyond that.

I will not disregard the truth in your statement but that assumes that the person goes about following everything exactly. I follow the commandments as "mind your own business" stand point, as do many others that I have met. But i will disagree with "humans have evolved beyond that" they never truly will. Look at Jihadists (spelling?) North Korea, even "hostile" business takeovers can be viewed in the respect you condemned.

 

[Chairman Miaow]

Theistic or LaVeyan Satanism? I think theistic Satanism is just idiotic, and I think LaVeyan Satanism is just childish.

Being a LaVeyan Satanist, i would like you too explain your reasoning.

Well the commandments of Satanism would effectively, if followed to the letter, make you Charlie Sheen. If a child wants something he takes it. If a child is angry he responds with violence. Yes, it is because it was once natural to do that, but now, it is irrelevant and idiotic, humans have evolved beyond that.

I will not disregard the truth in your statement but that assumes that the person goes about following everything exactly. I follow the commandments as "mind your own business" stand point, as do many others that I have met. But i will disagree with "humans have evolved beyond that" they never truly will. Look at Jihadists (spelling?) North Korea, even "hostile" business takeovers can be viewed in the respect you condemned.

I will rephrase my statement then, Humans have evolved beyond the need for that. Also, had the question been, "what do you think of Satanists, I would have answered differently, but the question was "What do you think of Satanism" and so that remains my answer.

 

[Wutaiflea]

Prior to looking it up, my understanding of Satanism was that it was the worship of Lucifer (the angel who questioned God's will), that it had strong ties to magic and mysticism, and that Pagans are sometimes branded Satanists for worshipping what Catholics considered to be false Gods.
I see this is correct, although I didn't know there were so many other branches of Satanism, but I guess that goes for most religions anyway.

Personally, I think if you find you have faith in it, then that's up to you. Far be it from me to make a judgement on someone's faith. I seriously doubt, however, that the vast majority of people who claim to be Satanists actually are such- there are too many people who still consider it to be edgy.

 

[Frybird]

Theistic or LaVeyan Satanism? I think theistic Satanism is just idiotic, and I think LaVeyan Satanism is just childish.

This pretty much sums it up.

Satanism as self-worship is, quite frankly, childish, short-sighted and attention-grabbing. The 'philosophy' doesn't work all that well in modern society (eye for an eye isn't exactly compatible with current western law system) and the terminology used is needlessly attention-whoring. 'Ooh, cool you get to call your room something other than a room'.

Also, sex is magic? Wtf?

Theistic satanism is no better. Why would anyone worship something like that?

I'll take my rightful place in the agreement conga....or something....

But since i'm already here, some detail, even if it has been said before.
LeVeyan Satanism sounds to me like living a specific, religiously unspecific lifestyle (thats seemingly mostly based on self-indulgence and self-centeredness) and giving it a flashy name so one can sprout off whenever he's assumed to be a theistic satanist.
Wich happens mostly because he says to someone he's a "satanist", expecting the above reaction (and most likely breaking the first earthly rule of LV-Satanism). Even most of the "Satanic holidays" seemed to be based around that.

In short, imo it's mostly about attention whoring by calling something by a different name and dress it up a little.
Wich does make it pretty childish in my opinion.

Other than that, the LVS Definition of Magic has in my opinion nothing to do with "real magic" (As i see it, Magic is Alteration by opposing scientific laws, while LVS Magic is Manipulation by opposing or rejecting social laws)...giving it a very..."Twilight"-ish Vibe of "Our Vam...i mean Magic is Different"

 

[Corekrash]

Theistic or LaVeyan Satanism? I think theistic Satanism is just idiotic, and I think LaVeyan Satanism is just childish.

Being a LaVeyan Satanist, i would like you too explain your reasoning.

Well the commandments of Satanism would effectively, if followed to the letter, make you Charlie Sheen. If a child wants something he takes it. If a child is angry he responds with violence. Yes, it is because it was once natural to do that, but now, it is irrelevant and idiotic, humans have evolved beyond that.

I will not disregard the truth in your statement but that assumes that the person goes about following everything exactly. I follow the commandments as "mind your own business" stand point, as do many others that I have met. But i will disagree with "humans have evolved beyond that" they never truly will. Look at Jihadists (spelling?) North Korea, even "hostile" business takeovers can be viewed in the respect you condemned.

I'd change "Jihadists" with a more broad term like "Religious Extremists" as every religion has those who take it too far and prefer to interpret their chosen faith's teachings as they see fit. And I do agree, humans have not evolved beyond reacting on impulse despite the outcome, there is plenty of evidence that shows people can still act like savages in modern times. Besides, how many people can say they follow the commandments and edicts of their faith to the letter?

 

[scw55]

Hai, I'm an argogant twat. I don't want to "check my facts" with regards to something called "Satanism". If they wanted to be 'understood' and not discriminated, they shouldn't have called themselves that.

It's like people who make characters on MMO called Cancer. Ambiguous names that are really offensive to other players but "has another meaning". Humanity is pathetic.

*edit* I'm being honest. I'm not being sarcastic.

 

[barbzilla]

It falls under the same boundaries that any religion finds it self under. Religion is (generally speaking) a way to impose control over a populous. Some religions even give you a sense of self control by telling you not to let anyone control your life, yet in the same chapter will give you rules/guidelines on how to do this. In reality what most religion boils down to is a collection of fairy tales. Some may be the mother goose variety, while others fall under Grim's. I do not mean to knock anyone's religion as I feel religion is important, it is where a good portion of our societal morals come from (as you may notice when you travel, different cultures may find strange things perfectly normal). If you feel a spiritual connection with your religion or deity, who am I (or anyone) to stand in the way of your journey.

On Topic: I find that satanism is defined by the way it is practiced. If you can practice it in a way that doesn't interfere with someone else living their life, then I find nothing wrong with it. If you feel that your desires come above someone else's need for survival then I would say it is bad (the same can be said of any creed).

 

[Ruffythepirate]

Oooh I though this was a thread about santa.

I love you for that comment. Wanna go and make a thread about santa?

 

[InfiniteSingularity]

Hai, I'm an argogant twat. I don't want to "check my facts" with regards to something called "Satanism". If they wanted to be 'understood' and not discriminated, they shouldn't have called themselves that.

It's like people who make characters on MMO called Cancer. Ambiguous names that are really offensive to other players but "has another meaning". Humanity is pathetic.

*edit* I'm being honest. I'm not being sarcastic.

You appear to be under the assumption that "Satan" is evil by definition, however "satanism" implies there is another meaning. Satan is by no means evil, and the presumption that the figure of Satan is evil is merely because the portrayal of Satan by mainstream Christianity is that Satan is evil. The only reason he is assumed to be evil is because he goes almost entirely agains the will of God, who I believe to be not dissimilar to a fascist.

Satan isn't evil by any means or definition; Christianity only portrays Satan to be evil because he disagrees with God. He's just the reflection of a different perspective

 

[barbzilla]

Oooh I though this was a thread about santa.

I love you for that comment. Wanna go and make a thread about santa?

I'm all for it, should it be about his horrible elfin labor practices?

 

[ryuutchi]

It's self-absorbed, hideously boring, and I have never been able to figure out why Satanists get so mad when people assume they worship, you know, Satan.

The only upside to it is that Anton LeVay was HILARIOUS.

 

[Tanzka]

LaVey was an idiot who basically just took hedonism to another level with a 'cool' name.
That's what I know. Or think.

 

[InfiniteSingularity]

It falls under the same boundaries that any religion finds it self under. Religion is (generally speaking) a way to impose control over a populous. Some religions even give you a sense of self control by telling you not to let anyone control your life, yet in the same chapter will give you rules/guidelines on how to do this. In reality what most religion boils down to is a collection of fairy tales. Some may be the mother goose variety, while others fall under Grim's. I do not mean to knock anyone's religion as I feel religion is important, it is where a good portion of our societal morals come from (as you may notice when you travel, different cultures may find strange things perfectly normal). If you feel a spiritual connection with your religion or deity, who am I (or anyone) to stand in the way of your journey.

On Topic: I find that satanism is defined by the way it is practiced. If you can practice it in a way that doesn't interfere with someone else living their life, then I find nothing wrong with it. If you feel that your desires come above someone else's need for survival then I would say it is bad (the same can be said of any creed).

May i point out that the primary philosophy of Satanism is against control, and for individualism and free choice. And of course it will give you guidelines, because it sort of has to, because the morals of Satanism are one of the easiest to exploit. And the other side is that Satanism does not ask you to follow it, so if you don't like the rules, don't follow the religion. It is also by nature a religion which allows you to pick and choose what parts of the religion you see fit, as that is the primary philosophy of Satanism applied to itself. So it's emphasis is on the self

 

[ImmortalDrifter]

Theistic or LaVeyan Satanism? I think theistic Satanism is just idiotic, and I think LaVeyan Satanism is just childish.

Being a LaVeyan Satanist, i would like you too explain your reasoning.

Well the commandments of Satanism would effectively, if followed to the letter, make you Charlie Sheen. If a child wants something he takes it. If a child is angry he responds with violence. Yes, it is because it was once natural to do that, but now, it is irrelevant and idiotic, humans have evolved beyond that.

I will not disregard the truth in your statement but that assumes that the person goes about following everything exactly. I follow the commandments as "mind your own business" stand point, as do many others that I have met. But i will disagree with "humans have evolved beyond that" they never truly will. Look at Jihadists (spelling?) North Korea, even "hostile" business takeovers can be viewed in the respect you condemned.

I will rephrase my statement then, Humans have evolved beyond the need for that. Also, had the question been, "what do you think of Satanists, I would have answered differently, but the question was "What do you think of Satanism" and so that remains my answer.

Going with the derogatory explanation is fine. You see satanism as childish. I view it as an admission of human nature. Everyone wins.