Poll: Security Guards V.S. 12-year old punk

[Agayek]

Well you might find it silly, but I find the notion that you should be allowed to slap somebody just because its your kid is pretty silly as well.

To be honest, I find the concept that parents shouldn't slap their kids to be rather ridiculous. If you do it right, there's no better way to convey a point to unruly children, and it's really easy to do it right. Step 1) explain what they did wrong. Step 2) allow them to attempt to justify themselves. Step 3) slap them upside the head and admonish them for doing it. Step 4) explain why what they did was wrong and what was lacking in their justification. Step 5) ??? Step 6) Profit! (and reasonable children)

I've worked with a large number of kids at a variety of ages, and a sharp, temporary jolt of pain is one of the most effective ways to grab their attention and keep it. It underlines what you're saying and makes them actually listen.

Edit: I'd also like to point out that there is a vast different between physical punishments and beating children. The former underlines/supports the notion that the kid's behavior is unacceptable and should not continue. The latter is just taking out your frustrations on an innocent.

 

[Lenin211]

The people who voted Yes on this are idiots... but idiots have a right to their opinion so I can respect that... I guess.

I like how you state your opinion and make baseless, offensive accusations against anyone who disagrees with you. Explain your position.

 

[busterkeatonrules]

The kid asked for trouble - and hit the jackpot. This is simply a case of security guards doing their job because the kid's parents haven't done theirs.

 

[DanielBrown]

I did think the guard overreacted. That kid wasn't bigger than a stick... I don't think he didn't deserve it though. If he and his friends had shut the hell up and not struggled constantly that wouldn't have happened.

Passing murder threats to them isn't exactly the smartest idea either. For those of you who don't speak Swedish; the brat said "I swear, I'm gonna murder you, you fucking whore" around 00:24. Of course no one takes threats from a little shithead seriously, but such behaviour needs to be taken care of with force.

Aah... I hate kids.

 

[MrTub]

That might be true in your country but in Sweden its considered abuse if you lay hands on your kid. So with our laws its actually the same.

That's government for you. We still have silly laws on the books here in the U.S., too. Like in Texas. If two trains come to a crossing, both must stop, and neither may proceed until the other has passed.

Well you might find it silly, but I find the notion that you should be allowed to slap somebody just because its your kid is pretty silly as well.

I'm curious, then. How would you go about teaching a child that there are consequences to their actions? Because in my experience time out, grounding, taking something away, etc. doesn't work. What's your idea, then?

Well I will most likely never get kids so hopefully I will never have to deal with it. But I guess I would treat them like people? And if it doesn't work, then why am i not a sociopath that doesnt respect authority and goes around beating people?

I do not know anyone that was spanked/abused when they was kid and guess what.. They are good people.

 

[JochemDude]

I fail to see where the security did anything wrong. Seems like a excellent display of crowd control to me.

 

[JasonKaotic]

What's controversial here, exactly? All he did was floor him, then get his stick thing out to scare off the kids that were being mouthy. No-one was hurt in the slightest. The kid was in an uncomfortable position, whatever, but that's it.

It's just people being oversensitive douches and media being greedy assholes, that's just how the world works.

 

[HentMas]

Being an asshole isn't restricted to age. If that kid treats a security guard, a symbol of authority that way, let's take it a step further and wonder how he must treat his parents, teachers and fellow students. I'd say he's pretty damn lucky in this scenario and, if he's smart, he'll take the gentle lesson that was given to him gratefully.

Or should I point out that other video where the 12 year old was bullying an older kid and the guy picked him up and threw him down on the concrete? What he got here was a gentle slap on the hand, if he doesn't pick up on that, he's liable to get punched into a wall by someone far less nice.

oh god, yes please you just pointed out the mayor flaw on everyones argument about "he is just a little kid"

yes he is a little kid, but acting like a prick or an asshole should not be tolerated, if this is what he is doing to a security guard three times his size, imagine what he does to little kids!

 

[Schoengeist]

So you want the guards to do nothing and let the kids continue to risk their life?

Finally someone who knows what's going on. So were those kids climing on trains or
gliding down a handrail?

Where I come from there is something called defamation of a civil servant on duty, which those guys weren't and even if they were they should be professional enough to not take it seriously. If I'd get mad every time a kiddo acts stupid ... Assaulting is something different but that what I have seen in the video you can hardly call and assault. The whole situation is strange, with the guards having him detained and just standing there. What I would do if I were in the situation the guard is (heaven forbid) is to move a bit closer so he would be locked-in by the wall on one side and my body on the other. He's significantly lighter and has handcuffs on, so there is not much he can do anyway.

It doesn't matter why he did it. He chose to be a mouthy idiot and he was punished for it. I'm all for giving the kid a chance, but that doesn't mean absolving him of his actions. He made the choice, he must suffer the consequences of it.

The cause of his actions is, ultimately, irrelevant. There's nothing the security guard could have done about it, and there's nothing I can do about it. Honestly, the kid most likely just needs to be publicly humiliated a couple of times and he'll be fine.

Unacceptable behavior is unacceptable, no matter the reason. If the kid needs help, by all means help him, but don't you dare say that it excuses him for being a twat. Take that logic to its conclusion and everyone who's ever committed a crime is simply someone who has to "work out [their] feelings in a positive way". Circumstances driving someone to violate the social contract does not excuse them from the fact that they made the choice to do so.

Translation: "Nanana, I don't care what he did. The men with the black shiney boots are always right. And don't you try to reason with me, I have figured it all out. If he did nothing wrong, then why would he be in that situation? A figure of authority that acted out of line? That's unheard of!"

 

[anthony87]

That might be true in your country but in Sweden its considered abuse if you lay hands on your kid. So with our laws its actually the same.

That's government for you. We still have silly laws on the books here in the U.S., too. Like in Texas. If two trains come to a crossing, both must stop, and neither may proceed until the other has passed.

Well you might find it silly, but I find the notion that you should be allowed to slap somebody just because its your kid is pretty silly as well.

I'm curious, then. How would you go about teaching a child that there are consequences to their actions? Because in my experience time out, grounding, taking something away, etc. doesn't work. What's your idea, then?

Well I will most likely never get kids so hopefully I will never have to deal with it. But I guess I would treat them like people? And if it doesn't work, then why am i not a sociopath that doesnt respect authority and goes around beating people?

I do not know anyone that was spanked/abused when they was kid and guess what.. They are good people.

"Spanked" is NOT the same as "Abused".

Honestly, why is it so hard for people to grasp this concept?

 

[kickassfrog]

I totally support the guard there- the kid was way out of line.
Also, saying he shouldn't have done it because he's just a kid is BS- he chose to do the stupid stuff, why shouldn't he have to live with the consequences. It's letting people off with stuff like that which is why they grow up to get arrested all the damn time.

 

[Jake Lewis Clayton]

snip

snip

He's twelve, guys. TWELVE! Twelve. Years. Old. I get it, children are often annoying online and it's fun seeing the assholes who ruin your multiplayer gaming experience get a beating but that still doesn't change the fact that we're talking about a child here, not an adult.

You two keep talking about common sense and how at your age you understood bla and bla but did you really? I mean here you are, at an age when you're supposed to have "common sense", condoning violence against children and you have the audacity to claim you "understand" what common sense is? Really?

I think your forgetting the age of criminal responsibility in most places in europe is 10.

At 10 you are judged to know right from wrong and to suffer for any crimes you have commited, he was cuffed by the guards for something.

Then he assaults the security guard, at which point he could face a criminal charge and the possibility of a long lasting ban from the location he was at.

But instead the big hoohah among a few is how he was pushed to the floor to stop him from further acting up?



I'd hardly say putting someone on the ground in a safe way is violence.

 

[MrTub]

So you want the guards to do nothing and let the kids continue to risk their life?

Finally someone who knows what's going on. So were those kids climing on trains or
gliding down a handrail?

Where I come from there is something called defamation of a civil servant on duty, which those guys weren't and even if they were they should be professional enough to not take it seriously. If I'd get mad every time a kiddo acts stupid ... Assaulting is something different but that what I have seen in the video you can hardly call and assault. The whole situation is strange, with the guards having him detained and just standing there. What I would do if I were in the situation the guard is (heaven forbid) is to move a bit closer so he would be locked-in by the wall on one side and my body on the other. He's significantly lighter and has handcuffs on, so there is not much he can do anyway.

It doesn't matter why he did it. He chose to be a mouthy idiot and he was punished for it. I'm all for giving the kid a chance, but that doesn't mean absolving him of his actions. He made the choice, he must suffer the consequences of it.

The cause of his actions is, ultimately, irrelevant. There's nothing the security guard could have done about it, and there's nothing I can do about it. Honestly, the kid most likely just needs to be publicly humiliated a couple of times and he'll be fine.

Unacceptable behavior is unacceptable, no matter the reason. If the kid needs help, by all means help him, but don't you dare say that it excuses him for being a twat. Take that logic to its conclusion and everyone who's ever committed a crime is simply someone who has to "work out [their] feelings in a positive way". Circumstances driving someone to violate the social contract does not excuse them from the fact that they made the choice to do so.

Translation: "Nanana, I don't care what he did. The men with the black shiney boots are always right. And don't you try to reason with me, I have figured it all out. If he did nothing wrong, then why would he be in that situation? A figure of authority that acted out of line? That's unheard of!"

I linked a source earlier in this thread but here it is again

http://www.thelocal.se/36574/20111006/


"The incident took place last summer at the Slussen metro station after guards were called to deal with youngsters who were reportedly riding between the rail cars of the Saltsjöbanan tram line.

When the guards met up with the 12-year-old and his friends, the situation quickly turned heated."

?I climbed between the cars, and then went in again. Then they came up and said, 'follow us, don't resist',? the boy told Sveriges Television (SVT)."

And like I said, kicking somebody is assault in Sweden and he also says he will murder the guard (which also is illegal) and he also calls the guard whore (which Im pretty sure is against the law as well)

 

[Agayek]

Well I will most likely never get kids so hopefully I will never have to deal with it. But I guess I would treat them like people? And if it doesn't work, then why am i not a sociopath that doesnt respect authority and goes around beating people?

Most likely because of a combination of the fact that your parents were responsible enough to give a proper example, and because you were/are not naturally inclined to be a twat. Just a guess, but it's likely to be true.

Unfortunately, such a combination is surprisingly rare, due to some combination of irresponsibility, stupidity or simple mistakes.

 

[Jonluw]

The kid was being an ass. The security guard acted so as to make his being an ass not cause further issues.
I see no problems here.

 

[iNsaneMilesy]

I'm a cop and I'm 23. I can say the guard was well within his job description to do that. He subdued the little shit. I can tell you when you work in law enforcement you have to deal with societies ratbags and shit heads on a daily basis, while most of us are peaceful and dislike violence, we often relish the opportunity to mess with people who try to mess with us. Makes the job fun and serves the purpose in making them realise they cant get away with unacceptable behaviour... besides kids thesedays on average are undisiplined with no respect. Maybe if parents would actually do something we wouldn't have to.

 

[MrTub]

That might be true in your country but in Sweden its considered abuse if you lay hands on your kid. So with our laws its actually the same.

That's government for you. We still have silly laws on the books here in the U.S., too. Like in Texas. If two trains come to a crossing, both must stop, and neither may proceed until the other has passed.

Well you might find it silly, but I find the notion that you should be allowed to slap somebody just because its your kid is pretty silly as well.

I'm curious, then. How would you go about teaching a child that there are consequences to their actions? Because in my experience time out, grounding, taking something away, etc. doesn't work. What's your idea, then?

Well I will most likely never get kids so hopefully I will never have to deal with it. But I guess I would treat them like people? And if it doesn't work, then why am i not a sociopath that doesnt respect authority and goes around beating people?

I do not know anyone that was spanked/abused when they was kid and guess what.. They are good people.

"Spanked" is NOT the same as "Abused".

Honestly, why is it so hard for people to grasp this concept?

Why is it so hard for you to understand that spanking somebody is ABUSE IN SWEDEN.

 

[JochemDude]

The people who voted Yes on this are idiots... but idiots have a right to their opinion so I can respect that... I guess.

That's some Fox News level ignorance right there.

 

[Qitz]

Maybe I'm missing something but all I saw was a Security Guard put a kid on the ground and kneel on him. They do this to anyone whose acting irrational or violent. Swearing, threats of violence, spitting, ECT are all reasons for you to have a guard pin you down.