Poll: Should feminists be involved with anime mediums?

[Sung-Hwan]

I really think it's just the fact that I am Asian, and have always been with animated media, and you're just a Westerner, who's likely only known Marvel or DC. I don't find it strange if you can't get into anime, but don't claim things that aren't true like everything being pandering.

"Who's likely only known Marvel or DC?" First of all, why no Image comics? You think I'm the only one not to love Saga and The Walking Dead?

Spoiler: Secondly, check this out.

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2426_zps921d393e.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2427_zps2c0eba96.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2428_zps5fd6b801.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2429_zps4f6e45d5.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2430_zpsfa082c9f.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2432_zps7b2d5e6a.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2431_zpsd5bb38eb.jpg.html]

Those were a few pics of my collection. Now do you believe me?

Yes I do. I just don't get why you would hate anime then, since it's a medium strongly tied to manga.

I don't hate anime. Anime's great. Granted, I've only watched a few series, thirty at most (and I'm not claiming to have finished them all either), but I like what I've seen.

Didn't you just go on a rant of how misogynistic, sexist, and or childish the medium is not too long ago? I may have forgotten.

Have you ever heard of "I hate it because I love it"

In this case, I hate the pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers but love anime for it's potencal to tell stories and themes in a way that live action can't

Pointing out flaws within a medium does not make you a hater; if so, then Ebert would have been the most well known hater of movies ever and I remind you that he helped in several productions and even made a movie (admittedly, it's a bit of an oddball).

See, the issue here is where you said "pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers" and try to apply it to every anime that exists. That does not sit well with someone who has seen dozens of anime clearly outside of what you're assuming. Keep in mind that fanservice is not as liked by viewers as much as you assume either.

 

[Queen Michael]

Have you ever heard of "I hate it because I love it"

In this case, I hate the pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers but love anime for it's potencal to tell stories and themes in a way that live action can't

Pointing out flaws within a medium does not make you a hater; if so, then Ebert would have been the most well known hater of movies ever and I remind you that he helped in several productions and even made a movie (admittedly, it's a bit of an oddball).

See, the issue here is where you said "pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers" and try to apply it to every anime that exists. That does not sit well with someone who has seen dozens of anime clearly outside of what you're assuming. Keep in mind that fanservice is not as liked by viewers as much as you assume either.

Izanagi009's phrasing might have been a bit bad, but to me it seems that he meant this:

"There are some elements in anime that are pandering and idiotic, and these elements seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers. I hate those elements."

 

[CpT_x_Killsteal]

@Queen Michael

I see all feminists as extremists. Given the way they act, it's hard not to come to such a conclusion and view them with the highest disdain. Don't forget there's a topic describing how they've extended their antics to children's toys, or how Grand Theft Auto V is getting boycotted.

For the love of god

What you are refering to is the most fanatical 0.1% of all feminists in the world. Most feminists qualify as humanists and would see the advancement of human rights and improvement for all genders. This is like watching Transformers: Revenged of the Fallen and assuming that all movies are like that: it's narrow minded and unacademic.

Again, not trying to start a fight.
Could you refer me to a publication where these reasonable feminists are? Maybe I've just been stumbling upon the crazy arse "false rape accusations aren't bad", "male tears", "patriarchy", "male gaze", sites one after another. I used to call myself a feminist until these nutty things started popping up en masse in media. So if you can recommend a reasonable publication, that'd be nice.

Believe me, I dislike those insane idiots as much as any reasonable person but there are still reasonable people out there (not sure if this fits but give it a shot:http://www.feministpress.org/)

Also, I suggest avoiding the media and asking people in real life. Face to face contact implicitly imparts social rules that are not enforced on the net so most people hold their tongues better.

Thanks for the link, I kind of screwed up my wording though. I meant publication as in media, like the escapist (the very thing you told me to avoid >.<).

 

[Izanagi009_v1legacy]

I really think it's just the fact that I am Asian, and have always been with animated media, and you're just a Westerner, who's likely only known Marvel or DC. I don't find it strange if you can't get into anime, but don't claim things that aren't true like everything being pandering.

"Who's likely only known Marvel or DC?" First of all, why no Image comics? You think I'm the only one not to love Saga and The Walking Dead?

Spoiler: Secondly, check this out.

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2426_zps921d393e.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2427_zps2c0eba96.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2428_zps5fd6b801.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2429_zps4f6e45d5.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2430_zpsfa082c9f.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2432_zps7b2d5e6a.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2431_zpsd5bb38eb.jpg.html]

Those were a few pics of my collection. Now do you believe me?

Yes I do. I just don't get why you would hate anime then, since it's a medium strongly tied to manga.

I don't hate anime. Anime's great. Granted, I've only watched a few series, thirty at most (and I'm not claiming to have finished them all either), but I like what I've seen.

Didn't you just go on a rant of how misogynistic, sexist, and or childish the medium is not too long ago? I may have forgotten.

Have you ever heard of "I hate it because I love it"

In this case, I hate the pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers but love anime for it's potencal to tell stories and themes in a way that live action can't

Pointing out flaws within a medium does not make you a hater; if so, then Ebert would have been the most well known hater of movies ever and I remind you that he helped in several productions and even made a movie (admittedly, it's a bit of an oddball).

See, the issue here is where you said "pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers" and try to apply it to every anime that exists. That does not sit well with someone who has seen dozens of anime clearly outside of what you're assuming. Keep in mind that fanservice is not as liked by viewers as much as you assume either.

broad generalization is broad.

I could name a few examples of shows that either don't have fanservice or use it for tonal dissonance and narrative but the fact that I can name just as many if not more shows that have fanservice or pandering makes me ill or have woe for the medium

 

[Sung-Hwan]

Have you ever heard of "I hate it because I love it"

In this case, I hate the pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers but love anime for it's potencal to tell stories and themes in a way that live action can't

Pointing out flaws within a medium does not make you a hater; if so, then Ebert would have been the most well known hater of movies ever and I remind you that he helped in several productions and even made a movie (admittedly, it's a bit of an oddball).

See, the issue here is where you said "pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers" and try to apply it to every anime that exists. That does not sit well with someone who has seen dozens of anime clearly outside of what you're assuming. Keep in mind that fanservice is not as liked by viewers as much as you assume either.

Izanagi009's phrasing might have been a bit bad, but to me it seems that he meant this:

"There are some elements in anime that are pandering and idiotic, and these elements seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers. I hate those elements."

here are least five anime with none of the tropes he probably assumed applied to everything. I can probably name a hundred more if necessary...probably not.

 

[Izanagi009_v1legacy]

Have you ever heard of "I hate it because I love it"

In this case, I hate the pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers but love anime for it's potencal to tell stories and themes in a way that live action can't

Pointing out flaws within a medium does not make you a hater; if so, then Ebert would have been the most well known hater of movies ever and I remind you that he helped in several productions and even made a movie (admittedly, it's a bit of an oddball).

See, the issue here is where you said "pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers" and try to apply it to every anime that exists. That does not sit well with someone who has seen dozens of anime clearly outside of what you're assuming. Keep in mind that fanservice is not as liked by viewers as much as you assume either.

Izanagi009's phrasing might have been a bit bad, but to me it seems that he meant this:

"There are some elements in anime that are pandering and idiotic, and these elements seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers. I hate those elements."

actually, that's pretty much it, Guess I was too broad

 

[Ishigami]

I think feminists shouldn?t be involved with anything really so there is your answer.

I of course had a laugh at you mentioning hentais in particular. So a feminists is complaining about porn? someone not getting what porn is I take it and that is the ends of it for me.

I have a lot of issues (narrow target audience windows, surreal unnatural bad writing, design over substance etc.) with Anime/Manga these days despite being a huge fan a decade ago. But they are symptomatic to how the industry in Japan works (ratings, publication system, editors, training or lack thereof). And since mentioned industry only really cares about the national reception nothing said or done in west will really affect it.
And that?s then end of that?

 

[Sung-Hwan]

I really think it's just the fact that I am Asian, and have always been with animated media, and you're just a Westerner, who's likely only known Marvel or DC. I don't find it strange if you can't get into anime, but don't claim things that aren't true like everything being pandering.

"Who's likely only known Marvel or DC?" First of all, why no Image comics? You think I'm the only one not to love Saga and The Walking Dead?

Spoiler: Secondly, check this out.

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2426_zps921d393e.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2427_zps2c0eba96.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2428_zps5fd6b801.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2429_zps4f6e45d5.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2430_zpsfa082c9f.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2432_zps7b2d5e6a.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2431_zpsd5bb38eb.jpg.html]

Those were a few pics of my collection. Now do you believe me?

Yes I do. I just don't get why you would hate anime then, since it's a medium strongly tied to manga.

I don't hate anime. Anime's great. Granted, I've only watched a few series, thirty at most (and I'm not claiming to have finished them all either), but I like what I've seen.

Didn't you just go on a rant of how misogynistic, sexist, and or childish the medium is not too long ago? I may have forgotten.

Have you ever heard of "I hate it because I love it"

In this case, I hate the pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers but love anime for it's potencal to tell stories and themes in a way that live action can't

Pointing out flaws within a medium does not make you a hater; if so, then Ebert would have been the most well known hater of movies ever and I remind you that he helped in several productions and even made a movie (admittedly, it's a bit of an oddball).

See, the issue here is where you said "pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers" and try to apply it to every anime that exists. That does not sit well with someone who has seen dozens of anime clearly outside of what you're assuming. Keep in mind that fanservice is not as liked by viewers as much as you assume either.

broad generalization is broad.

I could name a few examples of shows that either don't have fanservice or use it for tonal dissonance and narrative but the fact that I can name just as many if not more shows that have fanservice or pandering makes me ill or have woe for the medium

just like how i could list dozens of trash films for dozens of good ones? You can't be serious with that single-minded bias.

 

[Soviet Heavy]

I'm not trying to start a fight or anything here, I'm just curious. When you say this, do you mean "a person who just happens to be a feminist can have an opinion on something outside of feminism", or do you mean something along the lines of "the feminist movement should get into whatever they want"?

The last thing anime/manga need is a group that tried to limited creative freedom.

I'll answer you both together, if that's alright. First of all, let me make it clear that I am not endorsing extremist feminism that intends to censor material. What I am saying is that feminists do have the right to have a say. From what I can gather, the person the OP was referring to on the other forum wrote up a feminist critique of an anime, that is to say, they wrote from a feminist perspective.

And that is absolutely fine by me, that's their opinion. I don't support feminism so much as I support equal rights. You're allowed to have a terrible opinion, or a dissenting opinion or whatever have you, I don't care. So long as you aren't actively limiting creative freedom, do whatever the fuck you want.

Killsteal, when you say "The feminist movement should get into whatever they want", I mean it in the sense that if someone feels they have something to say on any subject, they should have that right.

raikagetaicho, like I said above, I do not endorse extremist feminism or any movement that intends to censor things. See above: let them have their say and be done with it.

 

[Inglorious891]

I'm not a manga/anime/etc fan, so take my opinion with a grain of salt.

Should feminists be involved with anime/etc.? That depends on what you mean by, "involved". If they're going to be watching over the backs of the creators, making sure things they don't like are removed, or if they act like editors and iron out anything they don't like then no, they shouldn't be involved.

Should they get to yell at stuff for being sexist? Yes, they should. They can yell at anyone they want to. Odds are unless these people yelling are from Japan, the creators aren't going to give a shit, so I really don't know why you're so upset.

As for doujins/hentai, they're porn, so yelling at it for being sexist is especially silly. I'm not saying you can't do it, but I doubt anyone except people who already agree with you are going to listen.

 

[raikagetaicho]

I really think it's just the fact that I am Asian, and have always been with animated media, and you're just a Westerner, who's likely only known Marvel or DC. I don't find it strange if you can't get into anime, but don't claim things that aren't true like everything being pandering.

"Who's likely only known Marvel or DC?" First of all, why no Image comics? You think I'm the only one not to love Saga and The Walking Dead?

Spoiler: Secondly, check this out.

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2426_zps921d393e.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2427_zps2c0eba96.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2428_zps5fd6b801.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2429_zps4f6e45d5.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2430_zpsfa082c9f.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2432_zps7b2d5e6a.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2431_zpsd5bb38eb.jpg.html]

Those were a few pics of my collection. Now do you believe me?

Yes I do. I just don't get why you would hate anime then, since it's a medium strongly tied to manga.

I don't hate anime. Anime's great. Granted, I've only watched a few series, thirty at most (and I'm not claiming to have finished them all either), but I like what I've seen.

Didn't you just go on a rant of how misogynistic, sexist, and or childish the medium is not too long ago? I may have forgotten.

Have you ever heard of "I hate it because I love it"

In this case, I hate the pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers but love anime for it's potencal to tell stories and themes in a way that live action can't

Pointing out flaws within a medium does not make you a hater; if so, then Ebert would have been the most well known hater of movies ever and I remind you that he helped in several productions and even made a movie (admittedly, it's a bit of an oddball).

See, the issue here is where you said "pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers" and try to apply it to every anime that exists. That does not sit well with someone who has seen dozens of anime clearly outside of what you're assuming. Keep in mind that fanservice is not as liked by viewers as much as you assume either.

broad generalization is broad.

I could name a few examples of shows that either don't have fanservice or use it for tonal dissonance and narrative but the fact that I can name just as many if not more shows that have fanservice or pandering makes me ill or have woe for the medium

Stop waching anime then.

 

[Izanagi009_v1legacy]

Have you ever heard of "I hate it because I love it"

In this case, I hate the pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers but love anime for it's potencal to tell stories and themes in a way that live action can't

Pointing out flaws within a medium does not make you a hater; if so, then Ebert would have been the most well known hater of movies ever and I remind you that he helped in several productions and even made a movie (admittedly, it's a bit of an oddball).

See, the issue here is where you said "pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers" and try to apply it to every anime that exists. That does not sit well with someone who has seen dozens of anime clearly outside of what you're assuming. Keep in mind that fanservice is not as liked by viewers as much as you assume either.

Izanagi009's phrasing might have been a bit bad, but to me it seems that he meant this:

"There are some elements in anime that are pandering and idiotic, and these elements seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers. I hate those elements."

here are least five anime with none of the tropes he probably assumed applied to everything. I can probably name a hundred more if necessary...probably not.

And I can name several more that have them: Sword Art Online, No Game No Life, Elfin Lied, Love Hina, Infinite Stratos, Brunhider in the Darkness, Eikan, Cross Ange, Akame Ga Kill, Gotta be the Twintalls, High School DxD, High School of the Dead, Master of Martial Hearts and I will probably encounter more as i live

Keep in mind, some of these shows are good despite them or can be good with the absences of the tropes but the fact that I can name more shows with them than without is problematic.

 

[Izanagi009_v1legacy]

I really think it's just the fact that I am Asian, and have always been with animated media, and you're just a Westerner, who's likely only known Marvel or DC. I don't find it strange if you can't get into anime, but don't claim things that aren't true like everything being pandering.

"Who's likely only known Marvel or DC?" First of all, why no Image comics? You think I'm the only one not to love Saga and The Walking Dead?

Spoiler: Secondly, check this out.

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2426_zps921d393e.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2427_zps2c0eba96.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2428_zps5fd6b801.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2429_zps4f6e45d5.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2430_zpsfa082c9f.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2432_zps7b2d5e6a.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2431_zpsd5bb38eb.jpg.html]

Those were a few pics of my collection. Now do you believe me?

Yes I do. I just don't get why you would hate anime then, since it's a medium strongly tied to manga.

I don't hate anime. Anime's great. Granted, I've only watched a few series, thirty at most (and I'm not claiming to have finished them all either), but I like what I've seen.

Didn't you just go on a rant of how misogynistic, sexist, and or childish the medium is not too long ago? I may have forgotten.

Have you ever heard of "I hate it because I love it"

In this case, I hate the pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers but love anime for it's potencal to tell stories and themes in a way that live action can't

Pointing out flaws within a medium does not make you a hater; if so, then Ebert would have been the most well known hater of movies ever and I remind you that he helped in several productions and even made a movie (admittedly, it's a bit of an oddball).

See, the issue here is where you said "pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers" and try to apply it to every anime that exists. That does not sit well with someone who has seen dozens of anime clearly outside of what you're assuming. Keep in mind that fanservice is not as liked by viewers as much as you assume either.

broad generalization is broad.

I could name a few examples of shows that either don't have fanservice or use it for tonal dissonance and narrative but the fact that I can name just as many if not more shows that have fanservice or pandering makes me ill or have woe for the medium

Stop waching anime then.

I've been watching anime since I was 6 on Toonami, I have taken a small interest in Japanese culture because of anime and I am invested in the medium's growth in hopes that it can improve.

The times I see a Gundam Unicorn, a Madoka, or a Fate/Zero are worth the times I bash my head at the Infinite Stratos and Cross Ange of the medium

 

[cleric of the order]

@Queen Michael

I see all feminists as extremists. Given the way they act, it's hard not to come to such a conclusion and view them with the highest disdain. Don't forget there's a topic describing how they've extended their antics to children's toys, or how Grand Theft Auto V is getting boycotted.

look man, I know 2014 has been quite a year for feminists, perpendicularly the feminist shirt thing, not shirt gate the female slave labor they've bought to make the "I'm a feminist tee shirts." (Or man-spreading (seriously you don't have something between your legs, shouldn't you idiots be tackling third things, helping people directly or something.))
but even when i left feminism in anger and disgust would I have claimed that.
Not openly (i kid), people tend to take offense at that and haven't likely heard of Erin Pezziy.
There are problems with feminism. A number of people believe highly in it, believe they are doing the right thing and for high minded ideals for sake of egalitarianism.
Not everyone is a part of S.C.U.M. like Christina Hoff Sommers whom has my infinite respect as a person, at some point i should read her first book.

I have to say, I'm surprised a rather interesting majority decided to side against you in the poll. Perhaps i am just one of those live and let die kinds of people, (a rather poor guess because that isn't true) but that's forcing our views upon another culture and other artists.
Also I don't care.

> I am not generalizing...

> They're all hyper aggressive...

> Insulted someone with the worst insults imaginable because they said something may be sexist or have sexist elements.


There is so much self-awareness in this thread. XD

Having anime, and feminism/antifeminism in a single conversation results in this by nature.
Those topics might as well be denser then uranium on their own, when you through it on the internet you end up with the heaviest shit storm.
Don't be so hard on 'em, it is human nature to lack self awareness in at least one field. If every human had complete self knowledge the world would be, at least in some respect the world would be at least a little nicer.

 

[CpT_x_Killsteal]

I'm not trying to start a fight or anything here, I'm just curious. When you say this, do you mean "a person who just happens to be a feminist can have an opinion on something outside of feminism", or do you mean something along the lines of "the feminist movement should get into whatever they want"?

The last thing anime/manga need is a group that tried to limited creative freedom.

I'll answer you both together, if that's alright. First of all, let me make it clear that I am not endorsing extremist feminism that intends to censor material. What I am saying is that feminists do have the right to have a say. From what I can gather, the person the OP was referring to on the other forum wrote up a feminist critique of an anime, that is to say, they wrote from a feminist perspective.

And that is absolutely fine by me, that's their opinion. I don't support feminism so much as I support equal rights. You're allowed to have a terrible opinion, or a dissenting opinion or whatever have you, I don't care. So long as you aren't actively limiting creative freedom, do whatever the fuck you want.

Killsteal, when you say "The feminist movement should get into whatever they want", I mean it in the sense that if someone feels they have something to say on any subject, they should have that right.

raikagetaicho, like I said above, I do not endorse extremist feminism or any movement that intends to censor things. See above: let them have their say and be done with it.

Ok, thanks for clearing that up. 10/10

 

[Sung-Hwan]

Have you ever heard of "I hate it because I love it"

In this case, I hate the pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers but love anime for it's potencal to tell stories and themes in a way that live action can't

Pointing out flaws within a medium does not make you a hater; if so, then Ebert would have been the most well known hater of movies ever and I remind you that he helped in several productions and even made a movie (admittedly, it's a bit of an oddball).

See, the issue here is where you said "pandering, idiotic elements of anime that seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers" and try to apply it to every anime that exists. That does not sit well with someone who has seen dozens of anime clearly outside of what you're assuming. Keep in mind that fanservice is not as liked by viewers as much as you assume either.

Izanagi009's phrasing might have been a bit bad, but to me it seems that he meant this:

"There are some elements in anime that are pandering and idiotic, and these elements seek only to satisfy the minds of nihilistic teenagers. I hate those elements."

here are least five anime with none of the tropes he probably assumed applied to everything. I can probably name a hundred more if necessary...probably not.

And I can name several more that have them: Sword Art Online, No Game No Life, Elfin Lied, Love Hina, Infinite Stratos, Brunhider in the Darkness, Eikan, Cross Ange, Akame Ga Kill, Gotta be the Twintalls, High School DxD, High School of the Dead, Master of Martial Hearts and I will probably encounter more as i live

Keep in mind, some of these shows are good despite them or can be good with the absences of the tropes but the fact that I can name more shows with them than without is problematic.

I think you've proven what kind of person you are already. As the other person said, do not involve yourself with this medium, and hopefully you don't involve yourself with Persona either given that it also contains what your warped bias is against. I am not going to sit here and go back and forth with you going over which anime has pandering or not. That's hilarious and stupid.

 

[Rahkshi500]

My thoughts on this is probably similar to Insaninater's. If people, whether they're feminist or not, want to get involved in anime, then they are free to critically analyze it. I may not necessarily agree with some of the things they might say, but I ain't gonna tell them that they can't be involved in the medium.

 

[Sung-Hwan]

Anyways, I think this discussion has taken a nasty toll on my mind. I just thought that if people immediately assume something is bad because of fanservice, that's not only biased and childish, but it'd also mean anime like Bakemonogatari are supposedly bad. Yeahhhh no, I'm out.

 

[Leoofmoon]

I'm 50/50 on this, for one Feminist is mostly a USA and EU things they really don't exist in other countries and to be perfectly honest the female population in Japan do seem to have as much power as men, there country is more put of there culture and things of the past like blood types. The reason we see blood types pop up in character profiles in games is because there was something in Japan that said certain blood types would act a certain way so its like short had for telling how a persons personality acts. As well Japan is more sexually open then we are here in the west they never came from a Protestant background like is but they still did have a time of sexual representation but now they are very open about sexuality and sexual themes.

On the other I do feel some things can be improved by it, some characters I would much rather be more interesting characters in anime other then "hey boobs!" or a person to just suck on a banana in the background. When I see a anime that is mostly just having the female character just in bras and panties screams to me that the writers and animators where so bankrupt for ideas of a story and interesting action that they just resorted to a titty show.

This is the sort of generalization I absolutely despise. You cannot honestly assume an entire medium is what you describe due to a certain kind of pandering that is already frowned upon....IN the medium itself.

Apparently you missed the part where I said some anime, Highschool D&D is one that I feel story is worthless with the amount of fan service being thrown in a person face and all the Otaku so deeply defending it here in the states people get a bad taste out of what anime is in for. I grew up during the 90's when I had all the violent shit but we also had stuff like Trigun, Outlaw star, Cowboy bebop, ghost in the shell, all the different gundam sires.

Yes anime has evolved since then but all the trash anime is pushed to the forefront while better stuff is sitting quietly in the back because of one to two reason. I am a huge gundam fan but Gundam Build fighter was held back for a while mainly because the company itself wanted any US to pick up the WHOLE sires back from Turn A gundamn to current and that is a lot of money that can potentially go to wast for way more then one reason, bad translation team, bad audience and marketing, poor quality voice acting. When you run a company picking up a anime and translating it is costly.

And to go back on topic from how most of this people see is just Hentai images that they think is from the show mainly because sometimes they do make porn with the same company or same artist, or they just see things like this

being heavily marketed by american company's and think that this is all its about, when your a outsider to a community you have no idea what goes on inside or even what real fans are like.

 

[CpT_x_Killsteal]

A question to the people arguing above me:

Do you think fanservice anime, cutesy moe moe anime, ecchi anime, or fanservice ing eneral should be removed from the genre as morally wrong or creatively poor? These shows are clearly targeted at a certain set of people and other demographics have a high probability of inherently not liking them.
Hang on, let me get to the point here. Some of these anime could exclude women (among others). Is that neccesarily bad? There are some that are clearly targeted FOR women (Free! anyone?), so there's something for everyone. Is any of this really all that bad?