Poll: Should feminists be involved with anime mediums?

[Dizchu]

Thanks for making me side with the feminist this time.

If you get insulted that somebody criticised something you enjoy, you don't hurl hate at them. I'm sure there's many things that I enjoy that some feminists would object to. My reaction to them would be a calm, rational discussion. "I don't believe the portrayal of women in this is offensive or harmful and here is why". Not "go die you feminazi SJW stop trying to ruin my animu and mango".

If you had brought forward some compelling context for your discussion I might be able to sympathise with you but all you've done is make a feminist more convinced that they're right and made yourself look entitled and childish. I'm sorry.

As for the poll question? If feminists are into anime then they have every right to discuss it in a feminist context. If they're just coming in as an outsider to cause trouble I am personally not okay with that, but calm debate? That's fine, it might give some helpful insights.

 

[Sung-Hwan]

I mean, the way I see Westerner's react to anime, they only think its a medium about tits. Says a lot doesn't it? It's as shallow as if I went into Breaking Bad, didn't criticize it for all its inherent flaws, and scream that Walter White is badass.

 

[taylorton147]

anyone can get involved with anything they want as long as it doesn't harm anyone else, so why can't they get involved? it sounds to me someone is confused for getting banned by telling someone to go kill themselves. which is really worthy of getting banhammered I have to say. and this whole thread was really just set up on the off chance you could get some moral backing for what happened to you.

 

[taylorton147]

I mean, the way I see Westerner's react to anime, they only think its a medium about tits. Says a lot doesn't it? It's as shallow as if I went into Breaking Bad, didn't criticize it for all its inherent flaws, and scream that Walter White is badass.

seems like you are doing that whole generalizing thing you claim you don't do again....

 

[Queen Michael]

I really think it's just the fact that I am Asian, and have always been with animated media, and you're just a Westerner, who's likely only known Marvel or DC. I don't find it strange if you can't get into anime, but don't claim things that aren't true like everything being pandering.

"Who's likely only known Marvel or DC?" First of all, why no Image comics? You think I'm the only one not to love Saga and The Walking Dead?

Spoiler: Secondly, check this out.

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2426_zps921d393e.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2427_zps2c0eba96.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2428_zps5fd6b801.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2429_zps4f6e45d5.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2430_zpsfa082c9f.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2432_zps7b2d5e6a.jpg.html]

[http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/HerrNeon/media/DSCN2431_zpsd5bb38eb.jpg.html]

Those were a few pics of my collection. Now do you believe me?

 

[Dreiko_v1legacy]

TC, you need to learn to take joy in others' ignorance. You need to laugh at them for missing out on the joy of the VN or other material due to their ignorant fanaticism, not be offended. They're like children, they don't know any better and end up hurting themselves in the process. Nothing to be mad over. Just like how you wouldn't be mad a child spilled water all over your pants, you shouldn't be mad at a feminist for seeing something like Kana Imouto and calling you a pervert. Yes, there's sex that's there for titillation in the VN, there's also gut-wrenching depressing and amazing writing and story, too.

 

[Armadox]

I really think it's just the fact that I am Asian, and have always been with animated media, and you're just a Westerner, who's likely only known Marvel or DC. I don't find it strange if you can't get into anime, but don't claim things that aren't true like everything being pandering.

"Who's likely only known Marvel or DC?" First of all, why no Image comics? You think I'm the only one not to love Saga and The Walking Dead?

Those were a few pics of my collection. Now do you believe me?

*laughs* Or Boom, Action Lab, Comix Tribe, Blue Water, Valiant, Oni Press, IDW, Vertigo. Nearly every comic company has their classics, and just mentioning DC and Marvel is exactly the same as only knowing Funimation, Studio Ghibli, and Gonzo.

 

[DasDestroyer]

There's something particularly ironic about calling Fate sexist, when the story pretty much beats you over the head saying "don't be sexist and stupid like this guy".

Whenever I want to insult someone on the internet, I just ignore the person instead and that seems to work pretty well, so I'd say you were in the wrong on that front.

There's nothing wrong with feminists (or anyone for that matter) being involved with any medium, if you don't like the way things are done, do it the way you think is right, and if your way really is better it will succeed. It's when they start trying to decide for other people what sort of media they should or should not consume, whether through actual censorship, through coercive boycotts (not sure if there's a word for it but when someone goes "don't sell X or I'll gather a group of people and we won't go to your store" as opposed to simply not buying whatever it is you don't like), or even through pushing their morality onto people that I think they cross a line.

 

[Queen Michael]

I really think it's just the fact that I am Asian, and have always been with animated media, and you're just a Westerner, who's likely only known Marvel or DC. I don't find it strange if you can't get into anime, but don't claim things that aren't true like everything being pandering.

"Who's likely only known Marvel or DC?" First of all, why no Image comics? You think I'm the only one not to love Saga and The Walking Dead?

Those were a few pics of my collection. Now do you believe me?

*laughs* Or Boom, Action Lab, Comix Tribe, Blue Water, Valiant, Oni Press, IDW, Vertigo. Nearly every comic company has their classics, and just mentioning DC and Marvel is exactly the same as only knowing Funimation, Studio Ghibli, and Gonzo.

Vertigo is an imprint of DC, though. But yeah, of course I've read Book, Dynamite, IDW, Dark Horse, Valiant, Aardvark-Vanaheim and Ordbilder too.

 

[tippy2k2]

snip (That is a lot of books...)

I didn't jump into this conversation because it's painfully obvious that the OP is looking for people to agree with him, not to have a debate so I've stayed out. However....


Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaammmmmnnnnnnnnnnnn

I always thought your manga count was just kind of an exaggerated figure or a way for you to just express your love of manga in a unique way but...wow. I never got into manga or comics or any of the "visual novel"-type mediums but it's hard to not be impressed by that image. Well done.

 

[senordesol]

@Sung-Hwan, yes; not ALL anime is tits, but A LOT of it is. When I scan Netflix for anime, I find quite a bit of them. Thus, I could understand why someone new to the medium would be under the impression that tits comprise the vast majority if not all. As a self-proclaimed curator of the medium, I'd think you'd consider it your duty and pleasure to disabuse the neophytes of such notions by introducing them to works that buck those trends. That's what a reasonable person does.

 

[Queen Michael]

snip (That is a lot of books...)

I didn't jump into this conversation because it's painfully obvious that the OP is looking for people to agree with him, not to have a debate so I've stayed out. However....


Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaammmmmnnnnnnnnnnnn

I always thought your manga count was just kind of an exaggerated figure or a way for you to just express your love of manga in a unique way but...wow. I never got into manga or comics or any of the "visual novel"-type mediums but it's hard to not be impressed by that image. Well done.

Thanks. To be fair, most of the manga I've read isn't visible in the pics since I borrowed it from some library or other and then returned it. (I sometimes travel to distant cities to get the manga they've got in their libraries.)

 

[Queen Michael]

I mean, the way I see Westerner's react to anime, they only think its a medium about tits. Says a lot doesn't it? It's as shallow as if I went into Breaking Bad, didn't criticize it for all its inherent flaws, and scream that Walter White is badass.

You know, what you're doing isn't unusual. Lots of other people do it. Right-wingers who insist that liberals hate God and Jesus. Left-wingers who believe that all Republicans are racists. Christians who think that Atheists are fine with genocide. Senior citizens who go on about how horrible the youth of today is. It's fun to believe that other people are more ignorant or less moral than we are, because it makes us feel so superior to them. My stepdad doesn't know who Cao Xueqin was. That makes me feel good, because I've read Cao Xueqin, and can ponder how much more I know than my stepdad does. But it's not a good impulse, this impulse to want to believe that others are stupid, or evil, or both, just so that we can feel superior.

See, the impression I'm getting is that, possibly subconsciously, you want to believe that feminists are hyperagressive, and that anyone disagreeing with you in this thread just don't know anime the way you do, or aren't rational beings. And let me be clear here -- everybody does this to some extent. That doesn't necessarily make you a bad person, because it's part of human nature. But when you start saying things like this: "Maybe I just have to accept the fact that I am open-minded, mature, and patient enough to see any medium or genre for what it is worth. Most people are not like me..." ...that basically are about how you "need to accept" that you're unusually mature and open-minded (as though being virtuous was some sort of burden and not a sign that you're awesome) then you might want to think things over a bit.

 

[Ramzal]

Involved in watching it? Sure, why not that's their prerogative and their own time. Involved directly in someone else's development of art? No. Art is not a democracy and that goes for everyone, regardless of how you feel or what you think about anything. Even if it is offensive art, it is not a democracy and people need to stop being overly sensitive about everything nowdays about art.

 

[Trippy Turtle]

Well you probably went overboard I fully agree that if someone doesn't like something they should simply piss off rather than ruin it for everyone else.
I'm looking at you anita.

To answer your question: They can enjoy it all they want. They can keep their feminist opinions to themselves though. Within reason. For example this thread they can state why they dislike it or something, but going as far as to attempt to change the medium to suit their tender sensibilities is wrong. Target removing GTA 5 from their store for example. Nobody forced the group that moved to have it banned to like it or even notice it, but a bunch of bitter selfish women with nothing better to do decided to make others lives that little bit less convenient.

 

[[Kira Must Die]]

I forgot. What was this thread suppose to be about again?

OT: Whatever. Let people enjoy what they like. If there are some feminists that like anime or want to get into anime, I say go right ahead. They're not hurting me. I don't feel like I have a say as to who can watch anime or not.

As for the medium itself and whether it's sexist or not, I'm just looking to be entertained. I've liked some ecchi anime before. One of my favorite anime series is the Monogatari series, which can get very fanservice-heavy at times. I just don't care. If an anime has fanservice, I'll just shrug and go along with it. At this point I'm desensitized to it and just accept it as a part of the medium. I know not everyone is like that, but I don't concern myself with what others think.

 

[irishda]

This has to be some next level stuff I'm reading here. Like these posts can't be real. This has to be some sort of test sent by an angry deity.

 

[Josh123914]

This has to be some next level stuff I'm reading here. Like these posts can't be real. This has to be some sort of test sent by an angry deity.

Just reading some of these titles is like browsing through Fanfiction.net.

"Obama and Me" sounds like a romcom, Charity hosts getting angry at free publicity, and this thread's a total mess somehow.

2015's off to a great start.

 

[Armadox]

I really think it's just the fact that I am Asian, and have always been with animated media, and you're just a Westerner, who's likely only known Marvel or DC. I don't find it strange if you can't get into anime, but don't claim things that aren't true like everything being pandering.

"Who's likely only known Marvel or DC?" First of all, why no Image comics? You think I'm the only one not to love Saga and The Walking Dead?

Those were a few pics of my collection. Now do you believe me?

*laughs* Or Boom, Action Lab, Comix Tribe, Blue Water, Valiant, Oni Press, IDW, Vertigo. Nearly every comic company has their classics, and just mentioning DC and Marvel is exactly the same as only knowing Funimation, Studio Ghibli, and Gonzo.

Vertigo is an imprint of DC, though. But yeah, of course I've read Book, Dynamite, IDW, Dark Horse, Valiant, Aardvark-Vanaheim and Ordbilder too.

Although it's an imprint, there's so much different between it and DC that I like to express it as it's own thing, least they ignore it. If you'd like, please check out....

Saga,Sex Criminals, Chew, Copperhead, Oddly Normal, Death Vigil, Rat Queens, Bomb Queen-Image Comics
Princess Ugg, Sixth Gun, Courtney Crumrin- Oni Press
Princeless-Action Lab
X-O Manowar, Archer & Armstrong, Quantum & Woody- Valiant
Caligula, Neonomicon- Avatar Press
Samurai Jack, Ghostbusters- IDW
Iredeemable/Incorruptable, Supurbia- Boom!

(Also, I applaud you for Aardvark-Vanaheim, Flaming Carrot is amazing. Like Fantagraphics I think it deserves more for it's place in comics)

 

[Queen Michael]

I really think it's just the fact that I am Asian, and have always been with animated media, and you're just a Westerner, who's likely only known Marvel or DC. I don't find it strange if you can't get into anime, but don't claim things that aren't true like everything being pandering.

"Who's likely only known Marvel or DC?" First of all, why no Image comics? You think I'm the only one not to love Saga and The Walking Dead?

Those were a few pics of my collection. Now do you believe me?

*laughs* Or Boom, Action Lab, Comix Tribe, Blue Water, Valiant, Oni Press, IDW, Vertigo. Nearly every comic company has their classics, and just mentioning DC and Marvel is exactly the same as only knowing Funimation, Studio Ghibli, and Gonzo.

Vertigo is an imprint of DC, though. But yeah, of course I've read Book, Dynamite, IDW, Dark Horse, Valiant, Aardvark-Vanaheim and Ordbilder too.

Although it's an imprint, there's so much different between it and DC that I like to express it as it's own thing, least they ignore it. If you'd like, please check out....

Saga,Sex Criminals, Chew, Copperhead, Oddly Normal, Death Vigil, Rat Queens, Bomb Queen-Image Comics
Princess Ugg, Sixth Gun, Courtney Crumrin- Oni Press
Princeless-Action Lab
X-O Manowar, Archer & Armstrong, Quantum & Woody- Valiant
Caligula, Neonomicon- Avatar Press
Samurai Jack, Ghostbusters- IDW
Iredeemable/Incorruptable, Supurbia- Boom!

(Also, I applaud you for Aardvark-Vanaheim, Flaming Carrot is amazing. Like Fantagraphics I think it deserves more for it's place in comics)

Fuck, I forgot to mention Fantagraphics! And Top Shelf!

Anyway, I've bolded the recommendations that I've already read, because listing them would be too hard work. And my favorite Oni title is Blue Monday, and my favorite Image title is either Kabuki or Spawn.