Poll: Think you think straight? Think again...

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Nightrunex

New member
Mar 16, 2011
67
0
0
Raven said:
Do you believe that people should be free to make their own decisions and live out their lives doing what they want so long as they don't hurt anyone else?

Do you believe a person should be arrested if they sat next to you on a park bench and injected themselves with heroin in front of you and your kids?

Well, you can't actually have one without the other.
That does harm others actually - it harms the children by "robbing their innocence" so to speak.

Also, I disliked the test as it didn't expand enough on about 6 or 7 questions.
Got a 27% because of the questions not covering enough ground and being too vague.
 

slightly evil

New member
Feb 18, 2010
391
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0
Hairetos said:
I got 7%, but the artist one is bullshit. I mean, come on, Agree or Disagree, agree and you suck? Even if I disagree I'm making a judgment call on the artist.

They need a better answer than "agree or disagree".
I dont know his work, and inn any case it was clear in my head that this was a subjective question. Left it blank. is that cheating do you think?
 

dagens24

New member
Mar 20, 2004
879
0
0
20%. Is this good?

Upon further inspection, this test is stupid.

You agreed that:
The environment should not be damaged unnecessarily in the pursuit of human ends
But disagreed that:
People should not journey by car if they can walk, cycle or take a train instead

This is retarded. I CAN walk to the other side of the city, I don't NEED to take the car, but holy shit, I don't think it's realistic. I don't think there is ANY tension between those two ideas. Same thing with...

You agreed that:
There are no objective moral standards; moral judgements are merely an expression of the values of particular cultures
And also that:
Acts of genocide stand as a testament to man's ability to do great evil

and

You agreed that:
Judgements about works of art are purely matters of taste
And also that:
Michaelangelo is one of history's finest artists
 

conflictofinterests

New member
Apr 6, 2010
1,098
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bahumat42 said:
question eleven doesnt make sense
The second world war was a just war
does that mean we were justified in defending ourselves (which is always justified?)
or that the war itself was justified which is silly because no war is
AHHHH
It's just in opposition to the question about the intrinsic value of life

If there is NO reason to kill someone, then NO war is justifiable

If there is ANY reason to kill someone, then war MAY be justifiable.

If you believe any other combination of those two, then you are contradicting yourself.
 

Lullabye

New member
Oct 23, 2008
4,424
0
0
Tension Quotient = 20% Tension Quotient
low

Questions 1 and 27: Is morality relative?

76457 of the 172725 people who have completed this activity have this tension in their beliefs.

You agreed that:
There are no objective moral standards; moral judgements are merely an expression of the values of particular cultures
And also that:
Acts of genocide stand as a testament to man's ability to do great evil

Yeah. Well, that is kinda my own opinion, no? I get why if someone thought it was an absolute fact that it could be in tension, but i understand it to be my opinion and nothing more. So no tension.

Questions 24 and 3: How much must I protect the environment?

82337 of the 172725 people who have completed this activity have this tension in their beliefs.

You agreed that:
The environment should not be damaged unnecessarily in the pursuit of human ends
But disagreed that:
People should not journey by car if they can walk, cycle or take a train instead

erm, well i was taking this a bit to openly i suppose. Maybe the question meant a perfectly healthy person. But i knwo a guy who 'can walk to work' but he has a bad leg and it hurts him to do so. I think the question should have included 'if it doesn't affect a person negatively'.
So no tension.

Questions 14 and 25: How do we judge art?

78996 of the 172725 people who have completed this activity have this tension in their beliefs.

You agreed that:
Judgements about works of art are purely matters of taste
And also that:
Michaelangelo is one of history's finest artists

"The tension here is the result of the fact that you probably don't believe the status of Michaelangelo is seriously in doubt."
But I myself doubted it. again, i understand this to be of personal opinion. So no tension. I think I should have got zero.
 

Raven's Nest

Elite Member
Feb 19, 2009
2,954
0
41
Rationalization said:
Exactly, worded solely to trap you in semantics. I still scored 0%. But it could be argued that if you invert what you said it goes against it also. Not the greatest, positive opinions don't count.
I think the ability to wholly interpret the question is important. If you can recognise the value or at least existence of semantics, you have a better philosophical mind. It's a horrible question for sure, but it's designed that way for a reason... Even if it stinks to high heaven of trollbait.
 

MrGalactus

Elite Member
Sep 18, 2010
1,848
0
41
I challenge some of that quiz, like the one that says the value of art goes by personal taste and preference (or something like that) and Michaelangelo is one of the best artists of all time.
I agreed to both, which it said was a tension, but I don't believe it is. It's all down to personal preference, and in my own personal preference, i DO think Michaelangelo was one of the greatest artists of all time. I'm not stating it as fact, but as my own opinion.
 

Johnnyallstar

New member
Feb 22, 2009
2,928
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0
conflictofinterests said:
Johnnyallstar said:
You've fallen into the trap that I stated was the problem. You're assuming that the stated history books are "verifiable." The question never asked anything of the sort. It just asked about some esoteric history books, regardless of the verifiability of the information within. You read it like a student trying to get an answer right, I read it like a lawyer, and find the question lacking.
Fair enough, but let me read your post like a linguistic anthropologist and say that perhaps the sentence was not meant to be read like that. (Though, continuing on that train of thought, the fact that it was shows a certain amount of carelessness on the part of the inquirer.)
Also, I find that perhaps the definition of the word "objective" might have been a useful insert before the quiz began. I see so many arguments with the quiz in this thread which could be cleared up with that simple standardization.
True enough. It said read every word carefully, so I did it with my inner lawyer, because I really don't think I can get any more word for word careful. Many of their questions really shouldn't have been "go over every word, take everything literally" as the directions suggested.
 

Raven's Nest

Elite Member
Feb 19, 2009
2,954
0
41
conflictofinterests said:
HEY OP

Could you put up a definition of the word "Objective" before the link to the quiz? I think it would help.
Ahh but it's been a fun learning curve for some /sarcasm

Sure thing, I didn't realise so many people don't understand the difference...
 

the rye

New member
Jun 26, 2010
419
0
0
i got 7%
You agreed that:
Judgements about works of art are purely matters of taste
And also that:
Michaelangelo is one of history's finest artists

However i would like to point out that it is merely in my own personal taste i find Michaelangelo to be a great artist.
 

Superhyperactiveman

New member
Jul 23, 2009
396
0
0
I got 20% Let's see if I can bullshit my way out of these.

"You agreed that:
There exists an all-powerful, loving and good God
And also that:
To allow an innocent child to suffer needlessly when one could easily prevent it is morally reprehensible

These two beliefs together generate what is known as 'The Problem of Evil'. The problem is simple: if God is all-powerful, loving and good, that means he can do what he wants and will do what is morally right. But surely this means that he would not allow an innocent child to suffer needlessly, as he could easily prevent it. Yet he does. Much infant suffering is the result of human action, but much is also due to natural causes, such as disease, flood or famine. In both cases, God could stop it, yet he does not."

I agreed that the second act is morally reprehensible in the case of human morality. You can't ascribe human morality to God. He's got bigger things going on in His head. Let's say hypothetically that He could alleviate that innocent child's suffering, but doing so would put that child in a position where he would likely go to Hell. In that sense, alleviating that child's suffering is immoral. One could argue semantics day and night, but my basic response to this is that God is above human morality because our Earthly suffering is minute compared to the kinds of things He has to worry about.

"You agreed that:
The environment should not be damaged unnecessarily in the pursuit of human ends
But disagreed that:
People should not journey by car if they can walk, cycle or take a train instead"


For me this was an issue of semantics. In general, the second one is a good rule, but it's not an absolute rule. One has to, within the context of their own situation, decide if it's important to take the train or whatever or not. There are cases where one simply needs to drive, even if it is not, within a certain context, "necessary". For example, perhaps the subway is available to someone for transportation, but the station is in a bad part of the neighborhood and one's safety is in danger when they use it. The option is available, but no one would call it immoral for the person to value their safety enough to take the car.

"You agreed that:
Severe brain-damage can rob a person of all consciousness and selfhood
And also that:
On bodily death, a person continues to exist in a non-physical form

These two beliefs are not strictly contradictory, but they do present an awkward mix of world-views. On the one hand, there is an acceptance that our consciousness and sense of self is in some way dependent on brain activity, and this is why brain damage can in a real sense damage 'the self'. Yet there is also the belief that the self is somehow independent of the body, that it can live on after the death of the brain. So it seems consciousness and selfhood both is and is not dependent on having a healthy brain. One could argue that the dependency of the self on brain only occurs before bodily death. The deeper problem is not that it is impossible to reconcile the two beliefs, but rather that they seem to presume wider, contradictory world-views: one where consciousness is caused by brains and one where it is caused by something non-physical."

I view consciousness and self as non-physical aspects of the person, tied to their soul, not their mind or body. That said, we inhabit a body, and so long as we do we use our mind to understand that consciousness and self. Without it, we can no longer possess them in a full sense. Once we no longer have a body and exist as pure spirit, we will no longer require a brain to act as a filter between body and soul.

take that test!
 

Johnnyallstar

New member
Feb 22, 2009
2,928
0
0
THEJORRRG said:
I challenge some of that quiz, like the one that says the value of art goes by personal taste and preference (or something like that) and Michaelangelo is one of the best artists of all time.
I agreed to both, which it said was a tension, but I don't believe it is. It's all down to personal preference, and in my own personal preference, i DO think Michaelangelo was one of the greatest artists of all time. I'm not stating it as fact, but as my own opinion.
You know, I had the same problem. If I said no to Michelangelo, couldn't the same crisis of placing quality to art? The only way to justify the way it responds is if you presuppose that the questioner already thought that Michelangelo was one of the greatest artists.
 

Spleenboy

New member
Mar 8, 2008
26
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0
Raven said:
Atheism generally isn't a faith though... it's the lack of faith.

There aren't many atheists that will say they are for sure 100% there is and can be no god. Without a way to prove it, that idea becomes a faith. Such people are severely lacking in the logic department.
There shouldn't be ANY atheists that say there can be no God. It isn't possible to disprove the existence of God, but that doesn't mean He cannot exist, merely that He most likely does not. In a case where there can be no proof for either option, it is always a matter of faith.
 

Koeryn

New member
Mar 2, 2009
1,655
0
0
I don't pick Chaotic Neutral: I am chaotic neutral, though I do occasionally lean towards the side of 'good'.

That said, I scored 'low', the tension being in my views on what should be done with Nature, the objective / subjective view of art, and the proper testing of medicine.
 
Apr 28, 2008
14,628
0
0
33%

I blame the fact that the test used big words in ways that made my brain hurt.
I'm saying that I'm stupid. Although I did understand a few in order to form some sort of rebuttle.

Questions 17-28: Are there any absolute truths?

59392 of the 172790 people who have completed this activity have this tension in their beliefs.

You agreed that:
There are no objective truths about matters of fact; 'truth' is always relative to particular cultures and individuals
And also that:
The holocaust is an historical reality, taking place more or less as the history books report

If truth is relative then nothing is straightforwardly 'true' or 'factual'. Everything is 'true for someone' or 'a fact for them'. What then, of the holocaust? Is it true that millions of Jews, Gypsies, homosexuals and other 'enemies' of the Third Reich were systematically executed by the Nazis? If you believe that there are no objective truths, you have to say that there is no straight answer to this question. For some people, the holocaust is a fact, for others, it is not. So what can you say to those who deny it is a fact? Are they not as entitled to their view as you are to yours? How can one both assert the reality of the holocaust and deny that there is a single truth about it? Resolving this intellectual tension is a real challenge.

The holocaust did happen. There are multiple reports from soldiers, survivors, and the Nazi's themselves that show it did happen. Its, well, a fact. Of course the name could be debatable, but saying that 12 million or so people weren't killed by the Nazi's during WW2 is just wrong.

Questions 16 and 21: What should be legal?

70670 of the 172790 people who have completed this activity have this tension in their beliefs.

You agreed that:
The government should not permit the sale of treatments which have not been tested for efficacy and safety
And also that:
Alternative and complementary medicine is as valuable as mainstream medicine

But most alternative and complementary medicines have not been tested in trials as rigorously as 'conventional' medicine. For example, the popular herbal anti-depressant, St John's Wort, has recently been found to cause complications when taken alongside any of five other common medicines. This has only come to light because of extensive testing. Yet the product is freely available without medical advice. The question that needs answering here is, why do you believe alternative medicines and treatments need not be as extensively tested as conventional ones? The fact that they use natural ingredients is not in itself good reason, as there are plenty of naturally occurring toxins. Even if one argues that their long history shows them to be safe, that is not the same as showing them to be effective. This is not to criticise alternative therapies, but to question the different standards which are used to judge them compared to mainstream medicines.

Had I known that most alternative and complementary medicines have not been tested in trials as rigorously as 'conventional' medicine, I would have answered differently.