Poll: What is the answer to 48/2(9+3)?

[mps4li3n]

No dude, you're wrong. / always implies a fraction, yes, ALWAYS. / does not always imply that EVERYTHING following it is a fraction. 1/2+1 = 3/2, it does not equal 1/3. You aren't as aware of how to write out math as you think you are if you really think that there's any GOOD reason you can get this question wrong.

I'm quite aware how we write math HERE... just because there's one math doesn't mean there aren't multiple way to write it and that no one has different symbols for the operations...

As you pointed out, we're not computers, we don't have standardised programs that run us, and math didn't just appear in one place and everyone just followed some sacred law about what symbol means what...


It's the same thing with using the metric system... it's a standard that not everyone is using, doesn't mean they're not measuring the same thing... and just because you only ever heard of the metric system doesn't mean there aren't others.

Yes, math symbols aren't that different as m vs ft, but that doesn't mean there's no variation at all on the entire planet, remember that until pretty recently travel to the other side of the world wasn't a matter of hours.

 

[Taerdin]

the answer is 2.

2(9+3) is the simplified form of 2*9 + 2*3
NOT
2 * (9+3)

as written the equation should be seen as
48 / (2*9 + 2*3)

which when calculated out equials 2.

You're forgetting your BEDMAS/PEMDAS. You have to do the division before the multiplication, from left to right.

48/2 = 24

24 * 9 + 24 * 3 = 288

You should do some review on order of operations

 

[Joseph Webb]

He's doing the same thing the people that say it's 228 are, assuming that because his education system uses a sign in a distinct way all others must do the same, just because math itself is the same...

But the symbols aren't math themselves, they're just as arbitrary as any writing system... which is why the same symbol can be interpreted differently based on your region of the world.

Indeed.

I'll allow that the answer is 2 if you want to interpret the symbol "/" that way. But I'd argue that's not a common interpretation any more (if it ever was). Everyone I know would interpret that answer as 288, because they consider the / to be defined as "Divided by". the same way * is interpreted as "multiplied by" with the same precidence. But then, I hang around with computer programmers all day long, so perhaps my view is skewed in that direction more than most.

Listen to me, the ÷ symbol means the EXACT same thing as the / symbol. THEY BOTH MEAN DIVIDE. Dividing is setting up a fraction. You don't understand this, because you didn't pass math in the 8th grade. I'm not even kidding, I knew that ÷ and / both meant divide since the fourth grade. Math means the same thing everywhere, how do you think calculus was discovered in two different parts of the world at the same time? How do you think that algebra was discovered by a middle eastern man, and taught to europeans?

 

[Joseph Webb]

the answer is 2.

2(9+3) is the simplified form of 2*9 + 2*3
NOT
2 * (9+3)

as written the equation should be seen as
48 / (2*9 + 2*3)

which when calculated out equials 2.

You're forgetting your BEDMAS/PEMDAS. You have to do the division before the multiplication, from left to right.

48/2 = 24

24 * 9 + 24 * 3 = 288

You should do some review on order of operations

YOU are forgetting your PEMDAS. 48/2(9+3) is a simplified version of 48/(9(2)+3(2)). Ask any math teacher or student, you are doing it wrong.

 

[Joseph Webb]

No dude, you're wrong. / always implies a fraction, yes, ALWAYS. / does not always imply that EVERYTHING following it is a fraction. 1/2+1 = 3/2, it does not equal 1/3. You aren't as aware of how to write out math as you think you are if you really think that there's any GOOD reason you can get this question wrong.

I'm quite aware how we write math HERE... just because there's one math doesn't mean there aren't multiple way to write it and that no one has different symbols for the operations...

As you pointed out, we're not computers, we don't have standardised programs that run us, and math didn't just appear in one place and everyone just followed some sacred law about what symbol means what...


It's the same thing with using the metric system... it's a standard that not everyone is using, doesn't mean they're not measuring the same thing... and just because you only ever heard of the metric system doesn't mean there aren't others.

Yes, math symbols aren't that different as m vs ft, but that doesn't mean there's no variation at all on the entire planet, remember that until pretty recently travel to the other side of the world wasn't a matter of hours.

You are a troll. If you aren't, you are very uneducated. There are no two ways about it. Math is the same everywhere. Even in North Korea.

 

[mps4li3n]

I aced my equations exam as the only in my summerclass and since then I haven't been pointed out that I'm wrong. And I have to do a fair ammount of equations being an environmental science student and all, so if you have a different opinion I respect that, but don't think I'll "see the error of my ways" when a total stranger says so, compared to a school filled with teachers who give me the thumbs up for my work.

If your answer was 288, then you're wrong. http://www.purplemath.com/modules/orderops2.htm There's a link as to why, maybe it'll help you understand the error of your ways. It doesn't even include /difficult topics/ like the distributive method. REMEMBER, the division symbol they use is the EXACT same as the / symbol. Scroll down until you see them solve Simplify 16 ÷ 2[8 ? 3(4 ? 2)] + 1. that problem. It EVEN states how calculators solve these types of problems incorrectly! AMAZING!

And you're right... IN AMERICA (or where that's from).

It's not impossible that in other places they might use the symbols differently... or perhaps standardisation was actually reached the whole globe and everyone uses it like that... my point was that i don't have enough knowledge to say either way... the question is do you?



And obviously you didn't read the whole link:

"" The general consensus among math people is that "multiplication by juxtaposition" (that is, multiplying by just putting things next to each other, rather than using the "×" sign) indicates that the juxtaposed values must be multiplied together before processing other operations. But not all software is programmed this way, and sometimes teachers view things differently. If in doubt, ask!""


But you're right, 2 seems to be the number the consensus favours... so what?

You are a troll. If you aren't, you are very uneducated. There are no two ways about it. Math is the same everywhere. Even in North Korea.

Really, so you really think that the Ancient Sumerians used the same symbols we do?! Or the Ancient Egyptians?

Math is math, symbols are not math, just representations... and one should never assume that they always represent the same thing no matter where they're used, like math does.

I know i'm not good at making my point be crystal clear, especially since this is not my native language, but do try to take a step back and see what i'm saying.

 

[RonHiler]

Okay, done with you. You're insulting my credentials again. If you want to discuss an issue like an adult, that's one thing. But since you are stooping to personal attacks, we're done. You lose.

I have work to do anyway. Good luck with the discussion.

 

[Taerdin]

the answer is 2.

2(9+3) is the simplified form of 2*9 + 2*3
NOT
2 * (9+3)

as written the equation should be seen as
48 / (2*9 + 2*3)

which when calculated out equials 2.

You're forgetting your BEDMAS/PEMDAS. You have to do the division before the multiplication, from left to right.

48/2 = 24

24 * 9 + 24 * 3 = 288

You should do some review on order of operations

YOU are forgetting your PEMDAS. 48/2(9+3) is a simplified version of 48/(9(2)+3(2)). Ask any math teacher or student, you are doing it wrong.

I was having a discussion with my class earlier today...

To distribute into the brackets you can't just carry the denominator of the fraction in. It would be (48/2)*9 + (48/2)*3

I implore you to please review order of operations. Or if you prefer, utilise any calculator you wish to see the error of your ways (windows calc, google, wolfram alpha, etc.)

 

[Joseph Webb]

I aced my equations exam as the only in my summerclass and since then I haven't been pointed out that I'm wrong. And I have to do a fair ammount of equations being an environmental science student and all, so if you have a different opinion I respect that, but don't think I'll "see the error of my ways" when a total stranger says so, compared to a school filled with teachers who give me the thumbs up for my work.

If your answer was 288, then you're wrong. http://www.purplemath.com/modules/orderops2.htm There's a link as to why, maybe it'll help you understand the error of your ways. It doesn't even include /difficult topics/ like the distributive method. REMEMBER, the division symbol they use is the EXACT same as the / symbol. Scroll down until you see them solve Simplify 16 ÷ 2[8 ? 3(4 ? 2)] + 1. that problem. It EVEN states how calculators solve these types of problems incorrectly! AMAZING!

And you're right... IN AMERICA (or where that's from).

It's not impossible that in other places they might use the symbols differently... or perhaps standardisation was actually reached the whole globe and everyone uses it like that... my point was that i don't have enough knowledge to say either way... the question is do you?



And obviously you didn't read the whole link:

"" The general consensus among math people is that "multiplication by juxtaposition" (that is, multiplying by just putting things next to each other, rather than using the "×" sign) indicates that the juxtaposed values must be multiplied together before processing other operations. But not all software is programmed this way, and sometimes teachers view things differently. If in doubt, ask!""


But you're right, 2 seems to be the number the consensus favours...

Seriously, stop. Just stop. Really. Math is a universal language, this is a fact. You are making up lies. I'm not even kidding, you could tell an alien the Pythagorean theorem, draw a diagram, and it would understand EXACTLY what you're trying to tell it (granted it knows the Pythagorean theorem). It does NOT MATTER what symbol you are using. It will ALWAYS mean the same thing.

 

[Enrathi]

I aced my equations exam as the only in my summerclass and since then I haven't been pointed out that I'm wrong. And I have to do a fair ammount of equations being an environmental science student and all, so if you have a different opinion I respect that, but don't think I'll "see the error of my ways" when a total stranger says so, compared to a school filled with teachers who give me the thumbs up for my work.

If your answer was 288, then you're wrong. http://www.purplemath.com/modules/orderops2.htm There's a link as to why, maybe it'll help you understand the error of your ways. It doesn't even include /difficult topics/ like the distributive method. REMEMBER, the division symbol they use is the EXACT same as the / symbol. Scroll down until you see them solve Simplify 16 ÷ 2[8 ? 3(4 ? 2)] + 1. that problem. It EVEN states how calculators solve these types of problems incorrectly! AMAZING!

And to quote from your own reference:
(And please do not send me an e-mail either asking for or else proffering a definitive verdict on this issue. As far as I know, there is no such final verdict. And telling me to do this your way will not solve the issue!)

I will again stick with my answer of 288 because as has been stated by others, I'm a programmer and as I've been trained to read and write equations, 288 is the correct answer.

 

[Joseph Webb]

the answer is 2.

2(9+3) is the simplified form of 2*9 + 2*3
NOT
2 * (9+3)

as written the equation should be seen as
48 / (2*9 + 2*3)

which when calculated out equials 2.

You're forgetting your BEDMAS/PEMDAS. You have to do the division before the multiplication, from left to right.

48/2 = 24

24 * 9 + 24 * 3 = 288

You should do some review on order of operations

YOU are forgetting your PEMDAS. 48/2(9+3) is a simplified version of 48/(9(2)+3(2)). Ask any math teacher or student, you are doing it wrong.

I was having a discussion with my class earlier today...

To distribute into the brackets you can't just carry the denominator of the fraction in. It would be (48/2)*9 + (48/2)*3

I implore you to please review order of operations. Or if you prefer, utilise any calculator you wish to see the error of your ways (windows calc, google, wolfram alpha, etc.)

You are forgetting about the distributive method. Really. You AREN'T JUST carrying in the denominator, because (9+3) IS PART OF THE DENOMINATOR.

 

[kurupt87]

PEMDAS

(48/2)(9+3)=288
48/2(9+3)=2

Better?

BIDMAS

48/2(9+3)=288
48/[2(9+3)]=2

Better?

As many have already said, it's a poorly written problem.

The fact that "/" is used does not necessarily imply a fraction. "/" is the default sign for the operation called division and also to seperate a numerator from a denominator in computer language, this is where the problem lies.

I actually corrected myself when I went to lunch and discovered why I got the problem wrong. PEMDAS, which is what I was taught is an order of operations. What I forgot (or maybe never remember learning) was that M carries no more weight than D and A no more than S. So, in absence of P, the equation is solved left to right.

4*3+5=17
5+3*4=17

Correct?

Yes, that is why 288 is correct. It does not exclude 2 from being correct either though.

Again, the problem is the "/".

Does "48/2(9+3)" mean;

48 x (9+3)
2

or does it mean;

dd48dd
2(9+3)

A computer science student categorically will say the first. A math student is more likely to say the second.

 

[Taerdin]

You see, there's the flaw in your logic. We are not computers. It doesn't not matter how it is written for us, you should understand that (48/2)(9+3) =/= 48/2(9+3) The fact that you think that they are equal proves to me that you do not understand the distributive property. Stop arguing with your flawed logic, you will never be correct, because we will never be computers. Computers are provided with a flawed logic system in their programming, every math teacher (and decent math student) knows this. Math was designed before computers were. It doesn't matter how you phrase it, the question will always be the same if you phrase it correctly (which you aren't doing if you think the answer is 288).

You are right, we are not computers. People can interpret the question wrong, the computer is told how to interpret questions properly to correctly solve them.

Computers don't have flawed logic, that statement doesn't even make sense. Computers are nothing but logic, they don't have various interpretations of something, they have one, what was programmed into them. When it comes to math this means they are right. If computers were so flawed logically and terrible at math then why do we bother having calculators, or programs like matlab? We solve problems far too complex for humans to do by hand all the time on computers... it's practically what they were invented for.

 

[Pyro Paul]

Why? Because in order to change the order, when both operations have the same priority, you have to bracket the one who's priority needs to change and therefore make an exception on the left-to-right rule.

Saying (9+3) is part of the denominator is an assumption and not based on the facts that are our order of operations.

but it is based on your order of operations.

Parenthisis calls for you to distribute then calculate.

a better example of this
16/2(8)
verses
16/2*8

16/2(8) expands out to
16 / 2(8+0) which when distributed.
16 / (2*8 + 2*0) which calculates out to
16 / 16
1

16/2*8 is seen as just that.
in this we would follow the order of operations normally from left to right.
(16/2) * 8
8 * 8
64

the problem is, because of basic programing, computers don't create this distinction between the two. to a basic calculator 2(8) is the same as 2*8. there are very few calculators that will automatically distribute for you. i believe the Ti-84 does while the Ti-82 doesn't. of which when the same equation is plugged into both calculators, each will display a diffrent answer.

 

[Taerdin]

You are forgetting about the distributive method. Really. You AREN'T JUST carrying in the denominator, because (9+3) IS PART OF THE DENOMINATOR.

I think I've shown that I understand distributive method. (9+3) is not part of a denominator, it is being multiplied by the fraction forty eight over two.

 

[Joseph Webb]

I aced my equations exam as the only in my summerclass and since then I haven't been pointed out that I'm wrong. And I have to do a fair ammount of equations being an environmental science student and all, so if you have a different opinion I respect that, but don't think I'll "see the error of my ways" when a total stranger says so, compared to a school filled with teachers who give me the thumbs up for my work.

If your answer was 288, then you're wrong. http://www.purplemath.com/modules/orderops2.htm There's a link as to why, maybe it'll help you understand the error of your ways. It doesn't even include /difficult topics/ like the distributive method. REMEMBER, the division symbol they use is the EXACT same as the / symbol. Scroll down until you see them solve Simplify 16 ÷ 2[8 ? 3(4 ? 2)] + 1. that problem. It EVEN states how calculators solve these types of problems incorrectly! AMAZING!

And to quote from your own reference:
(And please do not send me an e-mail either asking for or else proffering a definitive verdict on this issue. As far as I know, there is no such final verdict. And telling me to do this your way will not solve the issue!)

I will again stick with my answer of 288 because as has been stated by others, I'm a programmer and as I've been trained to read and write equations, 288 is the correct answer.

That's great and all, but you are not a mathematician. Clearly. You do NOT solve this problem as a computer would, because computers SOLVE THIS TYPE OF PROBLEM INCORRECTLY. I'VE SAID IT TIME AND TIME AGAIN. Calculators assume that anything with a / is a fraction in and of itself. It is NOT smart enough to determine between a denominator and a fraction. If you are a computer, good job, you solved the problem correctly. Alas, we are human, and not machines, so we solve mathematical equations the good old fashioned way, with pen and paper. STOP arguing that machines are correct in this aspect. They are not.

 

[Joseph Webb]

You are forgetting about the distributive method. Really. You AREN'T JUST carrying in the denominator, because (9+3) IS PART OF THE DENOMINATOR.

I think I've shown that I understand distributive method. (9+3) is not part of a denominator, it is being multiplied by the fraction forty eight over two.

It isn't though, and that's why you'll get that problem wrong on your next test.

 

[Taerdin]

It isn't though, and that's why you'll get that problem wrong on your next test.

I've already finished basic algebra years ago... and calc... advanced calc... nowadays I just study video game design and development.

I can see how you read the question wrong, but I guess without a teacher to physically correct you, you will never see it. That's unfortunate, especially considering you could just type that equation into any calculator and see that you are wrong...

STOP arguing that machines are correct in this aspect. They are not.

You realise that a large group of really smart scientists developed computers right? They weren't designed to get math wrong, that would be stupid. The rules in place on computers follow for people as well, the correct answer is 288...

I love how people would go so far as to say that calculators, math applications, and programming languages are wrong in the face of their own work. Seriously? One random guy on the internet is smarter than all math software ever? Where's the nobel prize?

 

[Joseph Webb]

Why? Because in order to change the order, when both operations have the same priority, you have to bracket the one who's priority needs to change and therefore make an exception on the left-to-right rule.

Saying (9+3) is part of the denominator is an assumption and not based on the facts that are our order of operations.

but it is based on your order of operations.

Parenthisis calls for you to distribute then calculate.

a better example of this
16/2(8)
verses
16/2*8

16/2(8) expands out to
16 / 2(8+0) which when distributed.
16 / (2*8 + 2*0) which calculates out to
16 / 16
1

16/2*8 is seen as just that.
in this we would follow the order of operations normally from left to right.
(16/2) * 8
8 * 8
64

the problem is, because of basic programing, computers don't create this distinction between the two. to a basic calculator 2(8) is the same as 2*8. there are very few calculators that will automatically distribute for you. i believe the Ti-84 does while the Ti-82 doesn't. of which when the same equation is plugged into both calculators, each will display a diffrent answer.

THANK YOU FOR THIS POST. This is the most dumbed down version possible of solving this problem accurately. I'm being absolutely sincere by the way, thank you. I don't think anyone can argue that the answer is 288 now.

 

[Sightless Wisdom]

Equation should be written (48/2)(9+3) meaning 24*12=288. The only real question is not one of math but of syntax. The answer depends on the intended meaning of how it was written, if 2 is a coefficient of (9+3) it's different.

I don't see how this many "intelligent" people can disagree on the issue.