Poll: what was wrong with halo?

[Angryranter101]

Its a solid game but its too... modern American. Not only in the design of the tanks and the weapons (which is a good idea, not my thing, but making everything seem like sci-fi modern day tech it brings a level of accessibility I found somewhat appealing even from an objective standpoint) but in the attitudes of the characters.

You know that bit in MW1 where a chopper goes down with a tough but approachable female pilot inside and you run out with a time limit, risking your life to save her from the evil NotIraqistanies. That?s the American ideal of war, fight off completely evil people who deserve to die, save the girl and if you want some tragedy have her die in your arms after about a three minutes worth of dialogue where you profess your love for one another.

This dream like trance surrounding warfare is one that is held throughout the rest of the world, the only reason I call it American is because America makes all the films these days and bombs all the countries we don?t like. In the 19th centaury it would have been called the British ideal until WW1 came along and irrevocably damaged the optimistic spirit of the nation (according to a historian.)

Now that?s what makes it popular, it creates a world where there are lasers and spaceships and genocidal aliens to destroy all with a chirpy demeanor and a M4 that fires out needles and I as someone who hates it can really understand WHY people love it.

My problem is that it?s the furthest from a war game I could possibly hope for. I enjoy Warhammer because it?s harsh. People are meat for the grinder, true love does not conquer all, humanity has no last ditch attempt at salvation and the only good guys are the Forth Reich, struggling to keep humanity alive through whatever means necessary. Despite all that, there is some hope, there is still virtue and there is still something to admire in the darkness of the universe.

In Halo, all I find is the unchallenging black and white of evil aliens and a plot that tries very hard to be serious despite letting its characters act like their at an amusement park and not on a mission to save the human race. Compare Captain Cutter in Halo Wars, who?s characterized by his bravado and ability to get with the scientist who pretends not to be into him, to Captain Gabriel Angelous who shown to be willing to put his own homeworld to the torch and shoot his best friend when they turned traitor. Both of them are good if your looking for what they have to offer (charming and friendly or hard bitten andserious) but I find it hard to conceive that many people who like Angelous will like Cutter.

Its not a matter of Warhammer vs Halo, but those, in my mind at least, are the two separate camps.

 

[deshorty]

I quite enjoy Halo, but only LAN or by myself, NEVER ON XBL or co-op. The reason for my 'no-XBL' rule is, of course, the douches who ruin the experience. But aside from that, great story, shooting mechanics etc.

 

[Your Nightmare]

I lost interest after 3.
TBH, The only thing I liked in 3 was the create mode and all of those custom games and maps. In fact, I would probably still play infection if I had any friends who still play Halo as that was the only way to get into custom games.

 

[funguy2121]

Derka derka there's really not much to the Halo games. I dig melee and vehicle combat (at some point I'm sure someone will come along and make playable vehicle combat).

I don't get why any real gamer would prefer regenerating health to an actual challenge, or homogenous levels without boss fights and with few scripted events to break up the monotony. It would be myopic to blame Halo exclusively for the snoozefest that is the typical modern shooter, but it all really started with Halo. Halo was the first big offender. The guns look like Fischer-Price toys, the only cool elements of the art design are the product of Cameron larceny, and the alien invaders, who had a chance here to be really friggin' scary, are just goofy.

So for me, the fans saying "Nuh-uh! Halo rules, ******! I did your mom last night!" is just crap icing on an already crappy cake. I don't think the franchise is really horrible, just sinfully mediocre.

(1)Have you ever played halo in between (2)quoting zero punctuation and (3)deciding the personality of millions of people. (4)Just because the game is different to what you like does not make it an offender. Also, (5)why do you criticise games for being samey and having a generic design of levels yet seem to list a good game by very simplistic principles "why any real gamer would prefer regenerating health to an actual challenge, or homogenous levels without boss fights and with few scripted events to break up the monotony." so a startlinglly original and fun game is made by sticking to these principals and it becomes boring if it changes. I watched that zero punctuation episode aswell and youve simply copied his opinion.

I always figured scarabs were boss fights (weak points super powerful yet avoidable attacks etc)

By the numbers!

1. Yes! I've played Halo 2 and ODST (single and multi) and observed others playing all except Reach.
2. I may have plucked something from the collective conscious or stated something that slipped into my subconscious without realizing it. What did I say that was a quote of ZP?
3. That's quite an accusation to make without qualifying your statement. Where did I make a judgement call on popular opinion?
4. I would have thought that I properly described what I meant by offender. I guess not; there you go, it's now bolded, above. I will say, looking back at my statements, that I did make one error. Halo was not the first franchise to completely ape the Alien movies in art design, weapons, vehicles and the space marine motif. However, as with just about every other offense I mentioned above, when Halo did it it became popularized to do so. Just as after the COD games just about every FPS now has to be cast in grainy earthtones to convey some simulacric sense of "realism," the space marine thing became truly nauseating after Halo popularized said larceny on such a grand scale.
5. Homogeny does not = simplicity. I'm a fan of simplicity, but also of variety. Right now I'm on my first play-through of Monster Hunter. The learning curve is severe; most of the time you just have to wander around the map, under a time constraint, and guess where you're supposed to go. But it's damned fun. Where did I say that games need to be simple? You missed my point regarding regenerating health. I want a game to challenge me. If there is no challenge, I'll just watch a movie, as there are plenty of filmmakers who are far better at telling stories than even the best game designers. Regenerating health is exactly like the inability to die in games such as Prince of Persia and Kirby's Epic Yarn. It's easy to the point of being insulting to the audience, and its obvious intent is to expand mass market appeal, as if casual gamers have any interest in the Prince of Persia. Same with Halo and post-Halo FPSs. Please explain how a melee attack, an watering down of the difficulty for better mass consumption, and a lack of new, different experiences equals "startlingly original." And, again, I don't know what ZP review you are referring to - these are my own opinions and, whether or not you agree, they are not copy-pasted from anyone else's. How does a game become boring "if it changes?" If that's the case, why bother with sequels? You do realize that Madden isn't an example of high art but rather a cash cow, right?

If you really think I'm a Yatzhee yes-man, please visit my profile and tell me where in my posts I kissed his ass. He is more story-focused than I am, and I'm skeptical about games getting anywhere near where movies and literature are in storytelling in the next decade. He abhors motion control, and I rather like it when it's implemented well. Please, use an actual example of where I've regurgitated a verbatim ZP statement.

 

[loc978]

I don't really hate Halo. The first one wasn't a terrible game, I bought and played CE on my PC and found it a little easy (regenerating shields makes for an invincible me. Seriously, if you know what is going to come at you, you can't die) a little short, and a little sluggish in the player controls department... but its design wasn't incompetent.
I do hate what Halo is a symbol of, and that is the popularization of FPS games on consoles. I guess I'm just bitter that my old fun twitchy shooters are all dead now, replaced by these slow-moving, thumbstick wielding, aim-assisted, strawberry-jam covered knockoffs of terrible war-movies.
No sense crying over spilt milk, though. A genre I once loved for its game mechanics has become a genre I can't stand any part of... but I have others.

 

[ZeroMachine]

Original suffers from some copy-paste corridor level design, especially in later stages, but other than that I love the series. At least the Bungie-made ones. People just like to complain about popular things (well, everything, really) because it they think it makes them "cool" and "edgy".

Spoiler

(we can all just agree to forget about Halo Wars)

Oh? I loved Halo Wars.

Anyways, I think people didn't like it because the level design is just OK at best and shit at worst, the story in the games isn't told so well in any game but ODST, the weapons aren't exactly fun to play with, and the multiplayer is full of bitches.

And this is coming from someone who loves every game. The Halo universe (Haloverse?) is my favorite fictional universe.

 

[Owyn_Merrilin]

People are always telling me why they hate halo but I want to know why and ill be very dissapointed if all of the complaints are the douches on the XBL (the douche comment is aimed at the 8 year old teabagers and people who rage and say what are you doing give me the sniper rifle and get out of the tank why did you shoot me) sorry to those who where offended

I'm quoting you because only one person in this entire thread has gotten it right so far, and there's a good chance you missed his response.

It's really a "you had to be there" kind of thing, and according to your profile, you were too concerned about preschool at the time to really have "been there." When Halo came out, it gained a fan following that made the one for Final Fantasy VII look sane. People would talk about how it was the best game ever non-stop. Now, the problem with that statement is it's only true if you ignore all of the FPSs that came out on the PC prior to Halo. Anyone who had been playing FPSs on the PC prior to Halo saw it as a solid but ultimately mediocre and non-revolutionary game, and it got really, really annoying to hear people who had apparently never played Doom, let alone Quake, Unreal, Half Life, or even flippin' Goldeneye talk like Halo was the best game ever, or like it did anything that hadn't been done before in some other game.

To extend this, compared to PC shooters at the time, Halo was a slow, plodding affair with crappy jump mechanics leading to a very low mobility game. The two weapon limit was an annoying reaction to the lack of buttons on a gamepad compared to a mouse and keyboard, and what's more, it wasn't even the first game to do it -- the Delta Force series, for example, had it as far back as 1998. However, that didn't stop Halo fans from talking like it was the first game to ever do that, not to mention acting like it was a good thing in a game that wasn't trying to match the inventory of a real life soldier the way Delta Force did.

All this goes to say, Halo's fans gave so much praise to an overall mediocre game that fans of earlier FPS games couldn't help but hate it. It was made worse by the fact that Halo managed to influence the vast majority of FPSs released after it came out -- even the modern CoD games have as much Halo in them as they do Call of Duty. That said, it's not a bad game -- in fact, as slow as it was compared to games when it came out, compared to the games that are out today, it's a downright old school game, with relatively high mobility. It's still not as good as the games that came before, but it's better than a lot of the games that came after.

 

[Xannieros]

Halo 1 was okay. I liked it. It didn't try any gimmicks, decent weapons. A interesting story, being it was the first of the series, rest I didn't care for. It didn't improve the FPS genre, but it didn't put it to shame.

 

[Awexsome]

It's the same thing with Valve. Great, spectacular games even. Gets ruined by fanboys. Although with the rise of CoD it's overall fanbase has become smaller, yet nicer.

 

[Brian Hendershot]

I have a weird relationship with the Halo series.
I buy them all and then while playing, I realize that I don't really like Halo in the first place.
But when Reach came out, I just bought it again because you know, it's HALO.

Hmmmm... >_>

Exact same thing here. I think I keep buying them because I loved the first one to death. Me and my buddies would have these all night LAN parties and everything. Played through the campaign a billion times.

And every single Halo bought since Halo: Combat Evolved has been returned. Personally, I think it's because a.) the combat really hasn't evolved. It's still point point shoot. (That's why I like the new FPS that try and mix it up like Bulletstorm or Brink. ) and b.) their fanbase tends to be fairly horrible. I realize this is a generalization but still. HORRIBLE. FANBASE. They are loud and annoying. But maybe that's just me. I am sure some people find my quiet sarcastic voice annoying as well.

 

[ZeroMachine]

Original suffers from some copy-paste corridor level design, especially in later stages, but other than that I love the series. At least the Bungie-made ones. People just like to complain about popular things (well, everything, really) because it they think it makes them "cool" and "edgy".

Spoiler

(we can all just agree to forget about Halo Wars)

Oh? I loved Halo Wars.

Anyways, I think people didn't like it because the level design is just OK at best and shit at worst, the story in the games isn't told so well in any game but ODST, the weapons aren't exactly fun to play with, and the multiplayer is full of bitches.

And this is coming from someone who loves every game. The Halo universe (Haloverse?) is my favorite fictional universe.

Oh don't get me wrong, Halo Wars isn't awful. It's just that, as an rts, it has very little depth. It's somewhat shallow when compared to the greats in the genre (StarCraft, Dawn of War, Age of Empires - the last of which is the same company btw). As a console-rts, it's the best I've seen, and has cool ideas. Strictly as an rts though, it's passable.

I also love the Haloverse. I think it's an awesome and well put-together little world, and it's one I'd like to see more of. Let's hope Activison doesn't ruin it.

Oh, ok. Way I see it, though, the other Halo games had little depth as an FPS... so it's fitting

And also, two things regarding the Haloverse:

It's much more than just a "well put together little world". I'd say it's a huge, well put together universe. There's tons of stories and side stories and all that stuff, with rarely any of them being considered secondary canon and not many contradictions. That's rare.

Second, Activision doesn't own Halo. Microsoft, or more specifically there Halo-department 343 studios, owns it, and from what I understand quite a few people from Bungie have moved over to 343, so we'll have some of the same people working on the future of Halo. So no worries, at the very least it shouldn't suck.

 

[mikespoff]

My only real beef is that it was XBOX-exclusive.

I understand why, and that it was a big deal for MicroSoft to get a truly kick-ass game to bring customers to their new console, but as I only game on PC I've kinda missed out on all the HALO games.

 

[Reishadowen]

It was a pretty good game I thought. I really loved the gameplay, and I had a blast with it. It had some good multiplayer to play with your friends too. It was like the son/grandson to Goldeneye 64. I don't think it's the greatest game ever, sure it has a few flaws, but I think 95% of the hatred it gets is really caused by some of it's less respectful and rather impolite players, and the stereotypes they spread. T-bagging, 8-year-olds spending all day on it and beating grown players, or people whinning "OMG! HAX!" whenever they get killed because they, for whatever reason, have been led to believe they have transcended to godhood and are now infallible at Halo, etc etc etc. The list goes on, but really, Halo didn't spread this kind of reputation, the online player community did.

 

[Scorekeeper]

I dislike Halo. The story is awful and the gameplay is irritating. What I like about it are the music, Theater, Forge, and the party/lobby/matchmaking system. If I could remove the bells and whistles from the series and add them to a series with good gameplay, I'd jump at the opportunity. I couldn't care less about story quality in a multiplayer game, although Martin O'Donnell and Michael Salvatori would be welcome to compose the soundtrack for a good single-player game.

Regarding the story, I played the campaigns, read the novels, and watched Legends.

 

[FalloutJack]

I started out not liking it, but then I realized I just didn't like the people that play it.

So, I voted donkey.

 

[Mr. In-between]

The worst part about Halo is with its Fanboys.

You, sir, just hit the nail right on the head.

Not neccessarily, being able to jump 15 feet in the air and only run half a mile per hour is quite possibly the worst part of the series. With the exception of Bungie/Microsoft's ceaseless promotion of the series and main character in a vain attempt to get their shitty character, Master CRT-for-a-head on the same level as Mario and Sonic.

Hilariously, this did not come about by MC becoming a "household name" so much as it was the incessant PR campaign that dominated the early to mid aughts in order to put the gaming "subculture" on the radar.

 

[cgmetallica1981]

I love Halo. I don't see anything wrong with the game except for it started something bad: REGENERATING HEALTH. Sure it was shields in the game but it is the game that started regenerating health all together.

 

[Inkidu]

There's actually nothing wrong with Halo, it's a solid game in a very solid universe. Haters just be hatin', as the kids would say.

It's ground breaking by no means, but it's solid.

 

[General_Potatoes]

There all good. I've loved them all. Except for Legends.

 

[MetallicaRulez0]

Halo: CE was an outstanding single-player experience, and a great LAN party game. Halo 2 was the best multiplayer shooter ever in my opinion. Halo 3 was good, but not amazing. Reach is... alright.

Overall the series is very good. The first 2 games brought a lot of innovation to console games, controls and shooter stories in Halo: CE and online multiplayer in Halo 2. Everything since Halo 2 has been fairly mediocre though.