Portal Creator Sees End to Industry Sexism in 20 Years

[Smeatza]

I never said they were a majority. I just they're making me less inclined to join in with them. I feel like I have to separate myself from the community to avoid looking like one of them; I'm sure "proper" feminists feel the same way about the more extreme, outspoken ones.

So you realise they are a minority, you realise they do not accurately represent the culture as a whole, yet you shun the entire culture for their actions? That seems counter-intuitive to me.
It's like a German shunning their nationality so as not to seem like a Nazi.

May I ask what you mean by "media," by the way? Do you mean the media? Or just popular opinion as reported on by media outlets? Or any site that blogs news articles and presents opinions? How... how can I be brainwashed by the media when I disregard so many sources of "the media" while consuming from conflicting, contrasting sources? Where are you drawing the line?[/quote]

Perhaps mass media, or mainstream media would be better terms. News outlets are usually the main culprits but the trends tend to apply to all media that measures it success by the number of people consuming it.
I wouldn't use the term brainwash.
And perhaps I was wrong, I tend to assume at first that most sensationalism is the fault of the media, because, well it almost always is. I do tend to forget that an audience with a taste for sensationalism is required as well.

However the (news/factual - I still can't decide on a term) media as a whole, whether liberal or conservative, trustworthy or not, tends to be sensationalist. For example, "Mass Effect responsible for Sandy Hook shooting" is sensationalist. "Gun nuts try to take away our freedoms in response to Sandy Hook shooting" is also sensationalist.

Basically I would say news media that does not try to take a sensationalist standpoint in order to sell more papers, get more viewers is very rare.

 

[Milanezi]

There are less female programmers / software engineers than male ones so maybe thats why the industry employs more men rather than because it is sexist for the fun of it . . . .

Shit, that's true... Like in engineering everyone jokes about "there're no girls in Engineering Campus" and the there's all the macho jokes and stuff that are basically male stupidity and that makes all of us (men) to have a good time because we probably DO have some screws lose). But you don't hear that kind of joke coming from a Lawschool or a Medical student, because, well, there are many girls in those colleges (my Lawschool class had many more women than men).
So yeah, maybe it is somehow as you said, the fact of a male dominated professional area (programming/software engineering) might impact on the audience that gets the game.

On a side note, there's also the audience that WANTS the game, if once it was determined that the main audience is a male audience, games will attend to that public's expectations and realizations, which brings me to question: is it a sexism in video games thing? Or more likely a sexism in CULTURE thing? Would you open a whole branch of barbecue stores serving cow meat in India? No, you wouldn't. You won't m ake games for girls if they don't want to play them either.
BUT, times have changed, if we get pressed about sexism is either because: a) good option: women are now into the gamer demographic in a considerable number, and are pressing for changes, those changes must be met because they are now part of the target audience; b) bad option: women are still not interested in games, but developers want to sell more games so they want to to force them into liking games, and they'll do it by getting rid of "sexism", and by that understand anything at all that doesn't appeal to women.

The (many) women I know who enjoy games already enjoy them and have NEVER raised any comments or complaints about sexism in games, they might eventually roll their eyes to one thing or another, but never in the rage filled angst.

I am not sure if you are agreeing with me or not Well I will be honest I think the whole sexism in gaming thing is overblown to a MASSIVE degree particularly around here I dare say. Thats my opinion on it and I have been downright abused for it before. I was talking about the professional side of the industry rather than the consumer side and with regards to the former I think someone talented and driven will succeed from either gender, men just hold the majority on the relevant interests and qualifications.

Just to make it clear lol, I was agreeing with you heheheh

 

[Blind Sight]

Problem #1 is reversing the trend of women getting less technical and computer science degrees.

thats not actually a problem. Thats like saying, problem #1 is reversing this trend of women being kept out of the glamour job of being a rubbish truck driver.

Let me make this clear folks: Absense is not a synonym for exclusion.

Has it occured to people that there are less women in that industry due primarily to a lack of drive by women in general to be in that industry? I mean this is the same paradigm that convinces women sitting at home to complain about there not being enough women in an industry & then when you ask them "if you feel so strongly about it, why don't you study for 6 years racking up thousands of dollars worth of debt, to enter the highly competitive field" & they look at you like you just offered to have sexy wioth an infant, while eating a kitten sammich.

In 1984 37% of computer science degrees were given to women, by 2007 it's at 22% (figures from Jolie O'Dell). To be completely frank, there simply isn't enough competent female tech professionals to create gender duality in the tech industry in general, much less the video games industry. Aiming for the younger generation is the best plan so far, much better then unrealistic expectations of the gender gap closing anytime in the near future.

Best plan for what? Having more women in the industry doesn't fix a problem, since no problem existed to start with, since absence is not the same thing as exclusion. In fact women bring nothing to the industry except womeness. An since womeness is not actually a technical trait, women bring nothing new to the table. Being a woman is not a unique view, or even a different view. An it does nothing to change the games being made, since the technical crew rarely if ever has anything to do with the design choices or story direction that the company heads decide on.

Whats more women aren't a hive mind, so more women in an industry does not equate to any particular womans ideas being focused on.

So what exactly do we think more women in technical fields within the gaming industry is going to do exactly? An how is it not happening sexism exactly?

Really? The literal hundreds of complaints on twitter in the reasonswhy campaign shows there's plenty of sexism in the industry, and it's mainly directed at the belief that women are incapable in regards to technical skills. The absence of women in the industry is not due to exclusion, yes, but the TREATMENT of women within the industry clearly shows there is still a sexism problem. 'Since no problem existed to start with' is the most nonsensical denial of reality imaginable. If women want to be taken more seriously, simply having more of them actually on the technical side of the industry is a good start. You seem to think that I'm arguing my point just to get women in technical positions just because they're women. No, what I'm saying is that if women in the industry are in a position where they are seen as incapable, the best way to change that is to encourage women to take computer science degrees so you have a larger amount of competent, professional, female programmers, designers and developers available. Much better plan then touchy-feel good rhetoric.

 

[Lieju]

Problem #1 is reversing the trend of women getting less technical and computer science degrees.

thats not actually a problem. Thats like saying, problem #1 is reversing this trend of women being kept out of the glamour job of being a rubbish truck driver.

Let me make this clear folks: Absense is not a synonym for exclusion.

Has it occured to people that there are less women in that industry due primarily to a lack of drive by women in general to be in that industry? I

Yes, obviously, but then the question should be 'why'?
What Kim Swift is saying is that she wants to inspire girls, to let them know they can pursue those areas.

As a kid, I always assumed it would have been pretty much impossible for me to become a game designer, because all the games were made in Japan.
Similarly, if a girl assumes all the technical people are male, it will be less likely she will seriously pursue math.

And are there less female rubbish truck drivers that are male? If that's the case, it would be worth wondering why. After all, possessing a vagina doesn't make you allergic to trash or anything.

 

[Lieju]

It needs to go the same way that rampant racism/homophobia are heading, in that they are stigmatized rather than tolerated (if not condoned). And yes, it needs to start with young people who aren't being brainwashed by their parents.

It's obviously better to be brainwashed by homosexual lobbying groups than your own parents: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2012/05/americans-have-no-idea-how-few-gay-people-there-are/257753/

It's very difficult to answer the question of 'how many gay people there are?', because sexuality isn't a clear black-and-white issue. The majority of people probably are bisexual to some extent, but even if you have once fallen in love with someone of the same sex, you don't necessarily consider yourself gay.

Besides, it's not just 'homosexual lobbying groups' that can exaggerate how many gay people there are.

Quite a lot of homophobes like to think of themselves as a persecuted minority, and that the gay people are controlling the media and politics, and that legalising gay marriage would lead to no-one being heterosexual anymore.

No joke, I have heard numerous variations of the argument 'If we allow gays to marry, humanity will go extinct'...

Really, gay-rights shouldn't be an issue.

They just are an easy way to get votes. Fixing the economy is hard, but voting against gay-marriage is easy!

 

[pirateninj4]

What a boringly safe prediction. Gee, I also predict in 50 years America will see it's first female or gay president, that Tigers in the wild will be extinct, that everybody reading this post will have had sex at least ONE time, and that water will still in all probability be describable as "wet."

See? I can make amazingly bold predictions of a mundane nature as well.

OMG NO WAI.

Here's my predictions: Country music will still suck in 2020 and I will still avoid television like the plague.

 

[Phuctifyno]

Fake gamer girls have infiltrated to a development level?!?

I had no idea it had gotten this bad... Time to fortify, boys!

[small][small]Dogs rule![/small][/small]





[edit] aaaand that was my 200th post. I sure hope I'm as proud as I'm pretending to be.

 

[joshthor]

what is she? a care bear? Don't get me wrong, sexism at all is wrong, but just like racism it wont ever "end". And also - while we get douchebags in the pro gaming circuit and there are sexualized women in video games, the industry as a whole isnt sexist. it CANT be. it would get its balls sued off.

there are douchebags in every walk of life, there are sexualized women (and men) in EVERY media. What would be nice is to see her aiming to get women to create games for the female demographic, because they are few and far between. But having a large variety of male focused video games is not sexist, its just devs catering to what they know.

 

[Living Contradiction]

Ladies and gentlemen, I direct your attention to the thread on sexism. Watch the arguments devolve. Watch them splinter and scatter as defense systems power up and people try hard to ignore or suppress the issue without actually addressing it. [/barker mode]

Here are the facts: Sexism exists. Period. Has done since the dawn of time and will do for quite some time to come.

Have things progressed towards equality a bit from then to now? Yes.
Have they progressed enough? No.
Will they progress enough in the fullness of time? Perhaps.

Now for some harder-to-take ones:

Is sexism more prevalent and visible in the gaming community than in other areas of culture? Yes.
Are other forms of bigotry more prevalent and visible in the gaming community than in other areas of culture? Yes.
Does the community need to quit downplaying the effect of such hatred and start making an effort to change itself? Yes.
Is Ms. Swift being optimistic? Yes.
Should she stop speaking or making an effort? No.

Whether you believe it or not, whether you accept it or not, whether you acknowledge it or not, this is our reality. We live and breathe in this world, trolls and saints, haters and hated, players and NPCs all.

You don't have to care about it.
You don't have to listen to people discuss the issues in it.
You don't have to do a damn thing.

But if you don't care and won't listen, would you kindly let those who do care, will listen, and actually want to change things do their work?

 

[Grahav]

So, we have no more Ayla?


I shall enjoy the present even more.

 

[scorptatious]

I didn't know the creator of Portal was female. Huh. You learn something new everyday.