Re-Take The Cabin

[Pandabearparade]

All those quotes are is an attempt to justify the vitriol, to justify the demands that Bioware change something that belongs them, regardless of how broken it is.

Bioware is a business, and the Retake movement represents a large portion of their customers. It is -absolutely- the right of the customer to demand quality in a product, vitriol or not (though the organizers of the Retake movement have been very polite and cordial).

Of course the product is Bioware's property, no one is contesting that. What is contested here is whether or not the players should quietly just deal with a broken end, or ask for better. Why is asking for the broken ending to be fixed wrong?

 

[Eric the Orange]

Cabin in the woods was strange and unsettled for a point, infact a whole host of meta-points. Mass Effect 3's ending was just bad. Why all the tenuious digs Bob? Is the entire gaming press still out to shove the idea down out throats that there is something morally wrong with really hating the lazy ending to mass effect 3 or the outright lies that proceeded it?

You took a perfctly good artice about people 'not getting' an ending and runied it. You imply that Mass Effect 3 fans didn't 'get' the ending. I got the ending. I also got that it was shit.

You have to realize it's bobs job to get views. Views equal add revenue. So in this case he's taking the easy way out. Instead of making something that people want to read/watch he's just being controversial.

 

[Yeager942]

I still don't think Bob has any idea why the Mass Effect fans are mad.

 

[gmaverick019_v1legacy]

not to mention you entirely missing the point of the retake movement, especially after all this time.

One might think he's missing the point intentionally because he can't refute the actual point of the Retake movement, and he doesn't want to admit he was talking out of his ass.

He's too smug and self-important to admit when he's made a mistake.

i also think that's EA's and biowares problem. they refuse to acknowledge that it is a broken ending. if they just admitted to it, it'd go a long way i think to bridging a connection between developer/customer in either fixing the game, or coming to an understanding.

In a lot of entertainment media it's considered bad form to admit something was bad right out the front gate. Which is why you don't see big Hollywood names bash their own films shortly after release.

while that is true, i don't consider being honest bad form, hell it's quite admirable when a company can admit to it. It's like a little kid not admitting he stole from the cookie jar, you just dig yourself in a deeper and deeper hole that it becomes harder to trust you with that cookie jar around (a.k.a. my wallet full of money)

 

[wintercoat]

If only the ENDING wasn't so insulting

Which doesn't even come close to justifying the behavior I've seen. Shit endings are everywhere. The retakes deserve ridicule for being ridiculous.

If I'm given the perfect 3-course meal, but the dessert is a literal pile of shit, I'm not going to eat the shit and be happy with the amazing meal I just ate. I'm going to complain about the shit. I'm going to make a fuss. I'm going to demand my money back, and then never eat at that restaurant again. But no, I'm being entitled and should just shut up and eat it, right?

 

[Just_A_Glitch]

I refuse to believe there is anyone out there who did not get the point of Cabin in the Woods.

Same here. I'm skeptical about Bob's version of events here.

I'm kind of indifferent to Bob (watch/read his stuff, but always take it with a grain of salt), so I'm not saying this just to defend him.

I saw this with four other people. Two of them got it, two of them hated the film because they didn't understand it. So yes, there were people out there that let "Cabin" fly over their heads, and its so unfortunate.

 

[Bobic]

I do feel the need to point out, to those that are disheartened at people complaining about Cabin going a bit snooker loopy near the end, that the complainers are probably a minority, given its current rating on imdb of 8.2. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1259521/ (of course, there's always the argument that it's merely popular with internet denizens, but I'll leave that debate up to you, reader)

Anyway, nice look at the film, I didn't really pay much attention to subtext, I was too caught up in the whole, 'oh my god, this film is amazing, and not only that, it's actually something different and fresh in this often bland industry, hell yes'. I do like the theory that the film was essentially 2 hours of Joss Whedon sticking his middle finger up at the audience.

P.S. Also, I know you like to complain about the whole Retake Mass Effect Malarky, Bob, but including that jibe in this article has essentially derailed your own discussion.

 

[The Grim Ace]

If I'm given the perfect 3-course meal, but the dessert is a literal pile of shit, I'm not going to eat the shit and be happy with the amazing meal I just ate. I'm going to complain about the shit. I'm going to make a fuss. I'm going to demand my money back, and then never eat at that restaurant again. But no, I'm being entitled and should just shut up and eat it, right?

That is the best metaphor for Retake that I've seen. It's a damn sad state of affairs that we're fed shit for desert so often and that demanding a fitting desert after such a satisfying meal is now 'entitlement.' Demanding consistency and artistic integrity (like being able to justify the ending) is not too much to ask.

[small]Though, seriously, the FTC suit is a bit much...[/small]

 

[Risingblade]

Oh Bob it's like you want me to hate you

 

[2012 Wont Happen]

Glad you can't make an article without actively insulting fanbases Bob. It's really getting old.

Anybody who is part of the take back Mass Effect movement deserves to be insulted. It is a group of immature and entitled brats who think that a company making a bad sequel is some kind of an injustice.

 

[Avatar Roku]

Oh Bob it's like you want me to hate you

Same here. Bob, I want to like you. I've watched you for a long time, back since you were only the Game Overthinker. I was thrilled when you were picked up by The Escapist (despite your first Big Picture being about how the Master Chief is actually a Nazi, that was pretty WTF worthy), and for a while, it worked out quite well. More recently, though, you seem intent on just taking a contrary opinion for the sake of it and then being unable to justify it, between your stance on Other M and ME3 (for the record, I've read good defenses of both games. Yours were not among them).

Christ, what kind of parallel universe is this when fucking Jim Sterling can take a position closer to the middle than you?

 

[Metalix Knightmare]

To all those who claim Bob missed the point of the re-take movement I have to ask, what IS the point? All I see is that hipsteresque "You just don't get it" and little else. I'm thinking about sending you guys some plaid shirts with some eyeglasses with thick frames.

 

[Avatar Roku]

Glad you can't make an article without actively insulting fanbases Bob. It's really getting old.

Anybody who is part of the take back Mass Effect movement deserves to be insulted. It is a group of immature and entitled brats who think that a company making a bad sequel is some kind of an injustice.

To reiterate what others have said: their are twats in the Retake movement. Nobody denies that. But there are twats in any movement, and the non-twats in this one (which is most people in the movement) have been fairly reasonable. They (remember, I'm speaking of the non-twats here) have not been demanding a new ending, they have simply been pointing out that the one we have is bad, and given the Better Business Bureau's stance [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.366565-BioWare-Falsely-Advertised-Mass-Effect-3#14281832], that might not be so unreasonable.

 

[Metalix Knightmare]

If I'm given the perfect 3-course meal, but the dessert is a literal pile of shit, I'm not going to eat the shit and be happy with the amazing meal I just ate. I'm going to complain about the shit. I'm going to make a fuss. I'm going to demand my money back, and then never eat at that restaurant again. But no, I'm being entitled and should just shut up and eat it, right?

That is the best metaphor for Retake that I've seen. It's a damn sad state of affairs that we're fed shit for desert so often and that demanding a fitting desert after such a satisfying meal is now 'entitlement.' Demanding consistency and artistic integrity (like being able to justify the ending) is not too much to ask.

[small]Though, seriously, the FTC suit is a bit much...[/small]

Or you could just, I dunno. Not eat the shit dessert. Desserts tend to be an optional thing to begin with, and we could all do with a few less empty calories.

But you won't will you? It's not that you won't eat there ever again. You'll ***** and ***** and ***** for well over a month. You'll bring it up multiple times in forums that already have people bitching about the shit dessert and completely overtake the front page.

Or you could spend that time making a metaphor that doesn't suck so very hard.

 

[AMVP]

The metaphors in Cabin in the Woods are fine on the whole Audience/Filmakers dynamic... or at least it would be if there was a cevat that the ways they made sacrifices in the first place worked so they did it ad neaseum until the Elder Gods couldn't tolerate anything different, so they dug their own hole with the formula.

I think having the overused cliches rise up against their creators in the third act was a fairly effective conveyance of that very hole digging you mentioned. The one guy even gets killed by his dream scenario (the Merman), the equivalent of a filmmaker getting a chance at a dream project and having it bomb.

 

[keserak]

To all those who claim Bob missed the point of the re-take movement I have to ask, what IS the point? All I see is that hipsteresque "You just don't get it" and little else. I'm thinking about sending you guys some plaid shirts with some eyeglasses with thick frames.

Now, Bob, see this guy? This is the guy who makes you seem just as crappy as the twats you quoted at the end of your article. You all look like the same demographic. "I didn't understand that, I think that says something about me, so I hate it, waaaaaaaah!" In your efforts to manufacture parallels between Mass Effect and Cabin In the Woods, you instead created legitimate comparisons between the horrible audience of mainstream horror flicks and the smarmy critics in the Mass Effect controversy. That can't be what you're going for here.

Even the guy's insult proves too much. Sitting on high and declaring, in holier-than-thou fashion, that other people are too arrogant? I have to believe the quoted poster was wearing flannel when he wrote the above.

 

[wintercoat]

If I'm given the perfect 3-course meal, but the dessert is a literal pile of shit, I'm not going to eat the shit and be happy with the amazing meal I just ate. I'm going to complain about the shit. I'm going to make a fuss. I'm going to demand my money back, and then never eat at that restaurant again. But no, I'm being entitled and should just shut up and eat it, right?

That is the best metaphor for Retake that I've seen. It's a damn sad state of affairs that we're fed shit for desert so often and that demanding a fitting desert after such a satisfying meal is now 'entitlement.' Demanding consistency and artistic integrity (like being able to justify the ending) is not too much to ask.

[small]Though, seriously, the FTC suit is a bit much...[/small]

Yes, the FTC suit was a bit silly, but it was one guy and a clear grab for attention. The same goes for the people who wanted refunds from the Child's Play. We all agree that they're a bunch of asshats, but it was just a few people, not this giant group that people make it out to be.

 

[Avatar Roku]

To all those who claim Bob missed the point of the re-take movement I have to ask, what IS the point? All I see is that hipsteresque "You just don't get it" and little else. I'm thinking about sending you guys some plaid shirts with some eyeglasses with thick frames.

Now, Bob, see this guy? This is the guy who makes you seem just as crappy as the twats you quoted at the end of your article. You all look like the same demographic. "I didn't understand that, I think that says something about me, so I hate it, waaaaaaaah!" In your efforts to manufacture parallels between Mass Effect and Cabin In the Woods, you instead created legitimate comparisons between the horrible audience of mainstream horror flicks and the smarmy critics in the Mass Effect controversy. That can't be what you're going for here.

Even the guy's insult proves too much. Sitting on high and declaring, in holier-than-thou fashion, that other people are too arrogant? I have to believe the quoted poster was wearing flannel when he wrote the above.

Sooo, rather than explain to me the point of the movement, you choose to be an insulting little prick? And people wonder why the re-take movement has the critics it does.

If I can step in here, I'd be happy to explain. However, this thread is getting derailed enough, care to take it to PMs?

 

[Metalix Knightmare]

To all those who claim Bob missed the point of the re-take movement I have to ask, what IS the point? All I see is that hipsteresque "You just don't get it" and little else. I'm thinking about sending you guys some plaid shirts with some eyeglasses with thick frames.

Now, Bob, see this guy? This is the guy who makes you seem just as crappy as the twats you quoted at the end of your article. You all look like the same demographic. "I didn't understand that, I think that says something about me, so I hate it, waaaaaaaah!" In your efforts to manufacture parallels between Mass Effect and Cabin In the Woods, you instead created legitimate comparisons between the horrible audience of mainstream horror flicks and the smarmy critics in the Mass Effect controversy. That can't be what you're going for here.

Even the guy's insult proves too much. Sitting on high and declaring, in holier-than-thou fashion, that other people are too arrogant? I have to believe the quoted poster was wearing flannel when he wrote the above.

Sooo, rather than explain to me the point of the movement, you choose to be an insulting little prick? And people wonder why the re-take movement has the critics it does.

If I can step in here, I'd be happy to explain. However, this thread is getting derailed enough, care to take it to PMs?

Yeah. Sure. I'm cool with that.

 

[Metalix Knightmare]

If only the ENDING wasn't so insulting

Which doesn't even come close to justifying the behavior I've seen. Shit endings are everywhere. The retakes deserve ridicule for being ridiculous.

If I'm given the perfect 3-course meal, but the dessert is a literal pile of shit, I'm not going to eat the shit and be happy with the amazing meal I just ate. I'm going to complain about the shit. I'm going to make a fuss. I'm going to demand my money back, and then never eat at that restaurant again. But no, I'm being entitled and should just shut up and eat it, right?

Oh look it's this metaphor again. Meals are not art, some chefs at fancy restaurants may call there meals art, but you don't go into a restaurant looking for entertainment or art, you go there because you're hungry. Food is a product, not an art. Some gamers feel that games aren't art and should be treated like products. You aren't entitled to a good ending, you are entitled to whatever Bioware gives you. If the ending is bad, well that's it, it's bad, but it's the ending they wanted to make. You don't have creative control and you shouldn't "force" Bioware into caving into your demands.

You know what, that chef is entitled to make whatever the fuck he wants, and he wants to have that steak you wanted to be raw just at the tip, so that by the time you reach it, it'll be disgusting and undone. Whatcha gonna do? Complain? Oh man, you're just, like, so entitled and whiny, you already had MOST of the steak! Didn't like what you paid for? Too bad.

I'm liking this metaphor thing.

Actually, Chef's are NOT entitled to make whatever they want. They actually DO have to adhere to what the customer wants. That STILL doesn't work though. A chef has to work with personalized orders while a videogame has to go out for a much wider audience. If they tried to please everyone you'd just end up with a mess on par with ET for the 2600.