I'm just going to add my name to the list of people who've the best story ever told.Waffle_Man said:Impossible to care? It's obvious that you haven't witnessed the awesomeness of Sir Bearington!
Roleplaying The Old Republic
- Thread starter Yahtzee Croshaw
- Start date
idk, i disagree about "impossible to care" as long as the stories interesting. Heck i frequent the spoony experiment just to listen to the counter monkey series and all it is is spoony talking about his old DnD sessions.
See I have a little different outlook on the whole "character development". I always seem to figure out what I want my character to be as the story goes along. My Imperial Agent is a cyborg with these things over his eyes that look as if he has shades on all the time. Yet I have never given a good reason as to how he came over this, I just thought it was cool. Now playing as the good guy for the Imperials is a great place to develop story, but mine came over the coarse of leveling and watching the story play out. Playing on the Imperial side means you need reason to be good, and a damn good one. So I told myself the reason my character is doing the good deeds is because he has a hatred for the Sith and how he thinks they give him a bad name. That's why he always backtalk's them and laughs at them. The only reason he is a agent is because he enjoys the pay and the high life. This more or less came to me as I was playing. I wasn't as quick with it as some may be. It took me to the end of chapter 1 in the story to play this all out. Although you never mentioned the time it took you to actually think this through so I guess my view may not be so different after all.
So, you start by saying that it's hard, if not impossible, to care about other people's roleplaying characters, then go on to talk about one of your own. Dress it up in the Star Wars universe all you want, it's still meaningless to others. Perhaps it's just me, but it's basically about listening to someone's self-insert, and that's never really interesting.
Heh.Sixcess said:
This right here. Also, it may surprise you, but every single written work of fiction? Came right out of somebody's head. That could only hold significance within their own imagination, right? "Why didn't Huck Finn wear a black tie and cruise over the river on a magic carpet?" See, I just improved that story by one million percent. NOW it's interesting to everyone else.undeadsuitor said:
Reminds me a lot like my Imperial Agent. Borders on Psychotic and sociopathic, but will always act in the best interest of Imperial Intelligence, regardless of light or darkside.
I think part of the issue is the framing. I actually agree about finding it hard to care if someone is telling me about their new +5 Broadsward Of Dude Smiting and how their DM is a jackass most of the time. When someone frames their character, and their excitement about that character, as Yahtzee does when talking about his smuggler, however, it's a different story. I do find that character interesting and I couldn't care less about TOR.
Eh, I think it has a lot to do with whether you also play the game in question or not. If you don't play D&D, you're not likely to have any interest in D&D characters. I don't play TOR, so I have no real interest in TOR characters (sorry Yahtzee).
Ok, I'll give this a shot.
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn27/PipHalsey/SWTORLan.png
My character, Lan, was born on Dromund Kaas as everything an Imperial should be. With a strong bloodlines, and striking good looks, it was easy for him to get into Imperial Intelligence, however a lot of pressure was placed on him to succeed. Which is why one of his first missions was to spy on a Republic Mining colony, Isen Four. It wasn't hard to infiltrate the colony. He started out at the colony's Cantina. Playing a few pazaak games, while eavesdropping on some of the locals. It was at this Cantina, he first met Cadden. Deciding to take a break from his job, he flirted with Cadden to get to know her better, finding out that she was the colony's doctor. It wasn't hard to charm out an invite to Cadden's place. When he arrived at her home, he found out that Cadden was quite fond of plants, and flowers. As her home was practically a artificial forest. Lan grew more and more fond of Cadden by the minute, however when invited to her bedchambers he came upon a shocking discovery. Cadden was a male. A very effeminate male, but male non-the-less. However, this wasn't nearly as shocking as realizing that this fact didn't bother Lan at all. If anything, it made Lan even more intrigued of him. So Lan fell in love for the first time with another male. He spent several weeks with Cadden, all the while secretly continuing to spy on the colony. His lies grew heavily on his conscience, however. More so that he was using Cadden for this. No longer wishing to lie to Cadden, he finally told him the truth about who he was, hoping he would understand. Cadden however, was horrified by this, having strong prejudice of the Empire. Cadden told Lan that he wouldn't reveal his identity, so long as he left Isun Four, and never returned. Feeling heart broken, and abandoned, Lan left Isun Four. Lan would then volunteer for a mission that would bring him to the Planet Hutt. As he didn't want to go to any place that might remind him of Cadden's beautiful plants, and the highly polluted swamps of Hutt sounded like the perfect place for an Imperial like him. Lan was determined, however, to disprove the beliefs about the Empire, and that the Empire could be a force for good. Lan hoped some day he could return to Isun Four, and convince Cadden that the Empire wasn't as evil as it seemed.
Later on, Lan would have another mission bringing him back to Isun Four. To his horror, he learned that his enemies had killed almost all the Colonist, and blamed the Empire for it. He grimly realized that Cadden was likely killed, and thought the Empire was at fault.
http://i300.photobucket.com/albums/nn27/PipHalsey/SWTORLan.png
My character, Lan, was born on Dromund Kaas as everything an Imperial should be. With a strong bloodlines, and striking good looks, it was easy for him to get into Imperial Intelligence, however a lot of pressure was placed on him to succeed. Which is why one of his first missions was to spy on a Republic Mining colony, Isen Four. It wasn't hard to infiltrate the colony. He started out at the colony's Cantina. Playing a few pazaak games, while eavesdropping on some of the locals. It was at this Cantina, he first met Cadden. Deciding to take a break from his job, he flirted with Cadden to get to know her better, finding out that she was the colony's doctor. It wasn't hard to charm out an invite to Cadden's place. When he arrived at her home, he found out that Cadden was quite fond of plants, and flowers. As her home was practically a artificial forest. Lan grew more and more fond of Cadden by the minute, however when invited to her bedchambers he came upon a shocking discovery. Cadden was a male. A very effeminate male, but male non-the-less. However, this wasn't nearly as shocking as realizing that this fact didn't bother Lan at all. If anything, it made Lan even more intrigued of him. So Lan fell in love for the first time with another male. He spent several weeks with Cadden, all the while secretly continuing to spy on the colony. His lies grew heavily on his conscience, however. More so that he was using Cadden for this. No longer wishing to lie to Cadden, he finally told him the truth about who he was, hoping he would understand. Cadden however, was horrified by this, having strong prejudice of the Empire. Cadden told Lan that he wouldn't reveal his identity, so long as he left Isun Four, and never returned. Feeling heart broken, and abandoned, Lan left Isun Four. Lan would then volunteer for a mission that would bring him to the Planet Hutt. As he didn't want to go to any place that might remind him of Cadden's beautiful plants, and the highly polluted swamps of Hutt sounded like the perfect place for an Imperial like him. Lan was determined, however, to disprove the beliefs about the Empire, and that the Empire could be a force for good. Lan hoped some day he could return to Isun Four, and convince Cadden that the Empire wasn't as evil as it seemed.
Later on, Lan would have another mission bringing him back to Isun Four. To his horror, he learned that his enemies had killed almost all the Colonist, and blamed the Empire for it. He grimly realized that Cadden was likely killed, and thought the Empire was at fault.
"So as I said in the video I opted for a Republic Smuggler, and for race I chose Cyborg... blah, blah, blah... "Yahtzee Croshaw said:
Not interesting, not interested, who gives a fuck?
Did you really just call vaginas "salty tuna sandwiches"? Why would a presumably heterosexual man (though, with that hat, vest and goatee I may have my doubts) equate delicious lady bits to salty fish while at the same time comparing a man's wedding tackle to a scrumptious hot dog with all the trimmings?
Another person here who wants to thank you for making his night.Waffle_Man said:Impossible to care? It's obvious that you haven't witnessed the awesomeness of Sir Bearington!
Edit:
Oh, yeah, I disagree with yahtzee on this one. I really should have included that in the first post, but i'm tired and I wanted to thank waffle man. Made me completely forget about other things.
That's exactly it, though. When we discuss our characters from a game like Skyrim or Mass Effect, that's a tremendous amount of contextual experience instantly available. That character is immediately framed by a universe we care about, and scenarios and NPCs we're familiar with. This context gives us a reason to care about the decisions and behaviours of that character.Marik Bentusi said:
With a pen-and-paper character, as Yahtzee says, the possibilities are infinite. Effectively there's no frame of reference and trying to resolve one to contextualise that character is an insurmountable task, for the most part.
YMMV
The laughing, it was very much out loud.Waffle_Man said:Impossible to care? It's obvious that you haven't witnessed the awesomeness of Sir Bearington!
The only MMO I've played is Star Trek Online, and I don't feel the need to come up with a reason why my Vulcan science specialist has pink hair. In fact her bio reads something like "She enrolled in Starfleet twice by mistake, and now she's TWO SCIENTISTS".
In Skyrim on the other hand I do play something of a role. Nothing to do with my stats or appearance, just my behaviour. Sometimes when I'm killing low level NPCs I'll apologise to them, or pretend to be oblivious to what's going on, like I just decapitated someone with my flaming electrified war axe completely by accident.
I also get bored easily. When people are talking, I am walking along tables kicking their food onto the floor. I am shooting fireballs at walls to demonstrate to the town guards that stone doesn't burn. I have over 600 lockpicks and never miss the opportunity to pick up or buy more of them, just in case. I pick up everything in a store that's sitting around and not explicitly maked as "steal' instead of 'take' and then sell it back to the shopkeeper. When burglarising stores for the thieves guild I empty their strongboxes and leave behind a Deathbell flower as my signature.
In short, my character in Skyrim is a massive douche. I couldn't say for sure if I'm roleplaying or not. I reckon if I were a Dragonborn/Master Thief/Master Assassin/Archmage/Werewolf in real life I'd be a massive dick to people here, too.
In Skyrim on the other hand I do play something of a role. Nothing to do with my stats or appearance, just my behaviour. Sometimes when I'm killing low level NPCs I'll apologise to them, or pretend to be oblivious to what's going on, like I just decapitated someone with my flaming electrified war axe completely by accident.
I also get bored easily. When people are talking, I am walking along tables kicking their food onto the floor. I am shooting fireballs at walls to demonstrate to the town guards that stone doesn't burn. I have over 600 lockpicks and never miss the opportunity to pick up or buy more of them, just in case. I pick up everything in a store that's sitting around and not explicitly maked as "steal' instead of 'take' and then sell it back to the shopkeeper. When burglarising stores for the thieves guild I empty their strongboxes and leave behind a Deathbell flower as my signature.
In short, my character in Skyrim is a massive douche. I couldn't say for sure if I'm roleplaying or not. I reckon if I were a Dragonborn/Master Thief/Master Assassin/Archmage/Werewolf in real life I'd be a massive dick to people here, too.
Im sorry but what Yhatzee said is a load of rubbish. Most pnp games take place in pre existing universes with pre existing rules. Even in DnD games with a homebrew campaign setting often share loads of conventions with other DnD games.
I can describe a situation from a PnP game that could happen in real life and you would understand all the rules of that situation. A bank robbery is a bank robbery a gunfight is a gunfight. If im at a party in a PnP RPG then im expected to follow social etiquette as befits the situation and thus when I explain that one of my players decided to go nuts and blow up half the room you know thats not a normal situation for a party.
Yhatzees examples are just flawed, adding a guy in a tux on a magic carpet for no reason makes no sense. If he feels it makes a story better surely his own novel should start every sequence with "All the characters were doing it wearing black ties on a magic carpet." The logic is absurd. Can he not enjoy any novel because it was just something that a guy decided on from his mind? Are films invalid because the scriptwriters and the actors decided on what happened out of all infinite possibilities instead of asking the viewer what they wanted to do? Of course not but apparently PnP RPGs occupy a special place in storytelling of being completely uninteresting.
The worst part was when he then went on to describe the backstory to a starwars character I could not give a shit about because I know that at any point the game could force him to have to change his character background in order to make it compatible with the preprogrammed game dialogue. Since his character belongs to the game and not him I dont give a toss whatever rubbish he makes up for him especially when I know that hes going to go through the exact same experiances in the universe as thousands of other characters making his actions pointless.
Kaihlik
I can describe a situation from a PnP game that could happen in real life and you would understand all the rules of that situation. A bank robbery is a bank robbery a gunfight is a gunfight. If im at a party in a PnP RPG then im expected to follow social etiquette as befits the situation and thus when I explain that one of my players decided to go nuts and blow up half the room you know thats not a normal situation for a party.
Yhatzees examples are just flawed, adding a guy in a tux on a magic carpet for no reason makes no sense. If he feels it makes a story better surely his own novel should start every sequence with "All the characters were doing it wearing black ties on a magic carpet." The logic is absurd. Can he not enjoy any novel because it was just something that a guy decided on from his mind? Are films invalid because the scriptwriters and the actors decided on what happened out of all infinite possibilities instead of asking the viewer what they wanted to do? Of course not but apparently PnP RPGs occupy a special place in storytelling of being completely uninteresting.
The worst part was when he then went on to describe the backstory to a starwars character I could not give a shit about because I know that at any point the game could force him to have to change his character background in order to make it compatible with the preprogrammed game dialogue. Since his character belongs to the game and not him I dont give a toss whatever rubbish he makes up for him especially when I know that hes going to go through the exact same experiances in the universe as thousands of other characters making his actions pointless.
Kaihlik
Yahtzee you are so right. My favorite thing about my favorite MMORPG is the people I meet and the story i subconsciously develop for my own character. I don't join a particular guild because of how many raids they make a day. Its because I like to talk to the other actives while I play. Which brings me to grinding in MMORPGs. A lot of people disparage the idea of "grinding" but I encourage it because it gives you an opportunity to be active within a guild. If you are sick of grinding then good; go do whatever your guild mates are doing instead of being anti social. Its like staying home versus going out. Both have pros and cons but in the end we are creatures of socialization and need to be connected to each other. Sometimes its good to just get involved and be apart of other people's things.
why what is it about him you dont like?ZeroMachine said:Every now and then something comes along and reminds me as to why I extremely dislike Ol' Ben here as a person.
This is one of those things.
But at least something good came out of it:
I may just have to do that in a game at least once...Waffle_Man said:Impossible to care? It's obvious that you haven't witnessed the awesomeness of Sir Bearington!
what do you mean by that? that TOR is essentially a singleplayer RPG dressed up as an MMO?Sixcess said: