RPGs Should Ditch the Stats

[Susan Arendt]

RPGs Should Ditch the Stats

An obsession with statistics has prevented RPGs from evolving past their decades-old origins.

RPGs have enjoyed a number of vast improvements over the years - beautiful graphics, the ability to play with people all over the world - but their stubborn fixation on a character's abilities being tied to numbers prevents them from evolving as a game genre. So argues Jeff Tidball in this week's issue of The Escapist, anyway.

According to Tidball, even the most high-profile RPGs of today are, at their cores, nearly indistinguishable from their ancestors:

Consider this: Back in the day, Dungeons & Dragons gave us six primary characteristics - Strength, Intelligence, Wisdom, Dexterity, Constitution and Charisma. Each was represented by a number on a scale, but the most important statistic for determining a character's overall effectiveness was its level. Fallout 3, the game of the year in 2008, has seven primary characteristics represented by numbers on a scale, including Strength, Intelligence and Charisma. Agility stands in for Dexterity and Endurance for Constitution. Levels? Check, and now as then, they boil down a character's overall potency to a single number.

Is he right? Should we be looking for new ways to drive our RPGs? Or are those wisdom and dexterity stats a common language that allow players to move comfortably from game to game? Read the rest of Roleplaying: Evolved [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_213/6347-Roleplaying-Evolved] and let us know what you think.

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[Gxas]

I don't see exactly how else they would do this. It works doesn't it? Why change something that has worked for so long?

 

[AmrasCalmacil]

This title scared me, I like having stats, you know where you stand with them. What other systems are there though, other than a bunch of numbers?

 

[Iron Mal]

My first question would be upon getting rid of number based statistics, what would they replace them with?

 

[Random Argument Man]

Well, with stats, I know my characters strengths and weaknesses. That and it makes a difference between the characters.

 

[Amnestic]

While level does affect the overall potency of a character, the stats allow you to specialise your character in a certain way.

Going back to the Fallout 3, having stats would boost certain Skills (by 2 per stat point as I recall) as well as having a general affect on things. Agility, for instance, was needed for a number of perks as well as being one of the few ways to increase your Action Points.

Yes, levels are more 'potent' arguably, but the thing about RPGs is that you're playing your character. If the only thing distinguishing you from the next guy over is the helmet on your head and being two levels higher, it takes some of the fun out.

Plus, we don't always want to be powered by levels. Stats let us deliberately damage ourselves. Playing flawed characters is a lot of fun if you do it right and your DM (in the case of D&D) offers you ways to play with your flaws in such a way as to make them noticeable but not overly crippling via your stats.

I'm afraid I have to disagree with the writer of that article. Stats are an important part of RPGs to track character progress and express individuality, as much as levels, gear and personality.

 

[ghalkhsdkssakgh]

I don't think RPGs will ever fully ditch stats. They may decide to not make them visible to the player, but stats are an integral part of the genre.

 

[RebelRising]

He makes some good points, even though stats are sometimes good. I guess RPGs are more adaptive to different approaches than other genres, simply because the main tenets of the genre are not technical, but rather, things like storytelling, characters, and non-linear environment.

Mass Effect and Fallout 3 both did this to a degree, what with the more shooter-oriented mechanics. My guess is that a RPG world should be open to all sorts of approaches, whether its adventure-style dialogue, shooter/hack n' slash-style combat, platforming-style exploration, or any variety of multi-genre exploits, to then be based on stats, so that there are different ways for each of your characters to play the game.

 

[tologna]

well, you COULD have stat-based rpgs, and non-stat-based rpgs (though i don't know how that would varry from an action game). it could be done, and everyone would be able to get what they want.

 

[TheDuckbunny]

I dunno. Seems pretty radical to me. All people need is a little creativity in the world and characters, especially in RPG's. If you ditch the stats then you're going on to another genre of gaming, action or adventure games. People play RPG's because of how those games are. Simple as that. Innovation can be made without pulling apart the genre.

 

[Jedoro]

I kinda enjoy having stats, they let me know exactly where I stand. Hell, I'd like an RL stat sheet that I could pull up in a window every now and then. If there are less limits on character abilities, then people are playing RPG's as themselves or as a superhuman. RP's are meant to let players play someone else, and it's kinda hard to do when you don't know exactly what that character you're playing as is capable of, or when he or she is perfect when you're not.

 

[DirkGently]

I have to disagree with him, but I find it really, really weird there's a news article about an escapist article. More disagreements in the actual article comment thread!

 

[crypt-creature]

Stats are part of what makes an RPG, it's a huge part of the customization portion of a character. That's part of the point.
Take those away and you really don't have much of an RPG anymore.
A characters level doesn't mean they will really be effective, they have to point points and skills into talents that actually benefit them. Not everything does that depending on the type of character you're trying to play.

It would seem as if the writer of the article doesn't fully understand the point of an RPG.

 

[IWCAS]

If it aint broken dont fix it

 

[JohnSmith]

Well while I can't tell you to much I can say that there is an alternative, it is called XDM. Now use the power of the internet.

 

[unacomn]

Modern day RPG are indistinguishable from their ancestors? God I wish that were the case. What's actually going on is that people are sticking statistics over Doom lately. And the ones that don't are critisized for being outdated or made only for the PC gamers.

Statistics have been a part of roleplay ever since the getgo, it's a way of giving you the freedom to act as you please within your character's limitations, as oposed to following a predetermined path set up for you, like in shooters.

 

[Jaebird]

To say RPG's should not use stats, is like saying FPS's should not use guns.

He should be grateful that a computer program is doing the calculating for him; I know I am, which is why I can't play DnD for no more than two playing sessions. Besides, there are way too many other factors in RPG's one should concern themselves with to worry about stats.

 

[AfterAscon]

My first question would be upon getting rid of number based statistics, what would they replace them with?

The only way it could go is towards Peter Molyneux ultimate vision for the Fable. The numbers will still be there, but hidden, instead represented by visuals on your character.
The more you swing an axe the stronger your character gets, muscle grows.
Hide in the shadows for stealth, character skin goes pale.
Etc, etc

The vision is there, the resources to create this is a decent timeframe isn?t.