San Francisco considering banning circumcision

[Romblen]

Just do it at infancy, it prevents diseases. I've had relatives who've needed it done in their teens, and they found it to be a painful and humiliating ordeal. As for reduced sexual pleasure, that is not a set in stone fact, it's still disputed.

 

[Saelune]

I have no problems with people being grossed out by what I do in bed. Cause what they do grosses me out. And like them, they dotn have to date who they dont want to. Making circumscision illegal is more like your example than mine. Some people like uncut. I dont. Id rather there be both than making one or the other mandatory.

That's the thing, goddammit. This isn't about making it so you can't ever do it, its about ensuring you can't fucking do it to your baby who has NO CHOICE IN THE MATTER.

As someone who is 'cut', and hates the fact that he is, I can say that there is nothing more frustrating than realizing that apparently your safety wasn't foremost in everyone's mind, what was foremost was getting rid of that 'icky protective skin'

It is safest and best to do it while you are a baby though. I think most people are ignorantly overreacting, since what they imagine is "cutting off a piece of your penis". While this is true, it is not as dangerous or negative as people think. There are tons of things that happen to a baby that they have no choice of. Circumscision far from the worst of those.

 

[HyenaThePirate]

I'm all for this. All it means is that in 20 years time, I'm going to be a sexual fetish for most women, who will see my circumcized penis and go "Oy, that's different.. and different is sexy turn on to me. I wanna try that and tell my friends about it and they'll all want to see too.."

When I'm 40 years old, I'm going to be SWIMMING in 20 year old, curious and eager nookie.

Lord, please let this become a national ban asap..

 

[jedizero]

Just do it at infancy, it prevents diseases. I've had relatives who've needed it done in their teens, and they found it to be a painful and humiliating ordeal. As for reduced sexual pleasure, that is not a set in stone fact, it's still disputed.

It is safest and best to do it while you are a baby though. I think most people are ignorantly overreacting, since what they imagine is "cutting off a piece of your penis". While this is true, it is not as dangerous or negative as people think. There are tons of things that happen to a baby that they have no choice of. Circumscision far from the worst of those.

Both of you, please read both of these links.

http://norm.org/lost.html
http://www.homiegfunk.com/RIC2.htm

 

[Horkeldorf]

Subconscious pain, and trauma, NEVER GOES AWAY. Not even with shit that happened as a baby. The subconscious never lets anything go. As an adult, you can say 'I choose to do this. I accept what will happen.' As a baby when its done to you, you don't realize its been done for a long time. Then when you research, and find out *why* it was done...that's when I got so horrified at what had been done to me.

There's also the fact that the babies often don't have any anesthetic applied, an adult however can have sooooo many pain killers.

Well I was circumcised and I have no subconscious pain as far as I can tell. I'm perfectly fine with it. I was a happy baby after it so if it was traumatizing it must not have been for very long.

 

[Saelune]

Just do it at infancy, it prevents diseases. I've had relatives who've needed it done in their teens, and they found it to be a painful and humiliating ordeal. As for reduced sexual pleasure, that is not a set in stone fact, it's still disputed.

It is safest and best to do it while you are a baby though. I think most people are ignorantly overreacting, since what they imagine is "cutting off a piece of your penis". While this is true, it is not as dangerous or negative as people think. There are tons of things that happen to a baby that they have no choice of. Circumscision far from the worst of those.

Both of you, please read both of these links.

http://norm.org/lost.html
http://www.homiegfunk.com/RIC2.htm

The second one is obsolete, and the first one seems like a biased site.
Seems to me you just freaked out about the info. When I learned I was not naturally like that, I was relieved as to the alternative. You obviously differ but are taking it to an extreme.

 

[jedizero]

Well I was circumcised and I have no subconscious pain as far as I can tell. I'm perfectly fine with it. I was a happy baby after it so if it was traumatizing it must not have been for very long.

*shrug* Some people have different feelings on it, I guess.

Look, you're happy with it. Fine, but why should everyone else be the same, and be forced to follow the same fucking line of thought?

Why should everyone be happy with having a part of their body removed?

Why should we not be angry that we were mutilated just after birth? For what reason? To satisfy some fucking religious dictate? To satisfy what was 'socially acceptable' at the time?

You're free to be quite happy.

I'm free to be quite pissed.

 

[Saelune]

Just do it at infancy, it prevents diseases. I've had relatives who've needed it done in their teens, and they found it to be a painful and humiliating ordeal. As for reduced sexual pleasure, that is not a set in stone fact, it's still disputed.

It prevents disease like magic underwear. It doesn't. Its an old wives' tale from the 19-20th century.

Well, Im guessing the disease that is prevented is anything that would occur from poor maintenance of the foreskin, since you apparently have to make it a point to clean it.

 

[Optimystic]

Risking TMI, I'm going to speak as a guy who decided to get circumcised when I was 18.

For all the talk about sex being less pleasurable for those circumsized, maybe, scientifically speaking, I've fewer nerve endings, but sex is just as good as I remember it being before I got my johnson trimmed. Same with masturbation. The pleasure it is still just fine and does not feel in decline even after more than a decade of swinging around unsheathed.

Keeping it clean was never a huge chore to begin with, but it's been substantially easier since.

I don't really know that there's any great benefit to it, but it was a step towards helping me change what I wanted to about my body.

And this is fine, you know why?

Because YOU chose to do it, at age 18 when YOU were an empowered adult. The choice was not made for you by underinformed or even actively misled adults.

And to be honest, you may be happy with the results, but clearly many people are not. Just google "foreskin restoration" to see just how many unhappy men are out there.

 

[jedizero]

The second one is obsolete, and the first one seems like a biased site.
Seems to me you just freaked out about the info. When I learned I was not naturally like that, I was relieved as to the alternative. You obviously differ but are taking it to an extreme.

I'm glad to hear you were so relieved.

I'm not taking it to an extreme, I'm just trying to say that just because you're happy with it, why should everyone be circumcised at birth?

Why not let it become the choice of someone who's old enough to actually make said choice?

Instead of just being done to a baby, fresh out of the womb, who doesn't even understand whats being done to him?

 

[trigz04]

It should be a right because: 1: It is a religious practice, 2: It can keep it from getting certain diseases, and 3: It makes sex more pleasurable

Only #1 was correct, the other two have no basis in fact.

 

[sleeperhit79]

It should be a decision made by adults if they want it for themselves.

making it a decision for adults would pretty much be banning it.The one adult I know who had it done for religious reasons described it as the most horrible experience. It crippled him for a week in bed and to boot he divorced anyways...lol. Considering the benefits are arguable at best and the actual deformity that could occur I wouldn't put my child through it and do find it kinda cruel that anyone would, especially for religious reasons.

 

[jedizero]

It should be a decision made by adults if they want it for themselves.

making it a decision for adults would pretty much be banning it.The one adult I know who had it done for religious reasons described it as the most horrible experience. It crippled him for a week in bed and to boot he divorced anyways...lol. Considering the benefits are arguable at best and the actual deformity that could occur I wouldn't put my child through it and do find it kinda cruel that anyone would, especially for religious reasons.

There would be people who chose to do it, for their religious purposes/wishes.

If there are people who choose to blow themselves up to kill people, I can easily imagine someone chopping off part of their own dick.

 

[Vuljatar]

It should be a right because: 1: It is a religious practice, 2: It can keep it from getting certain diseases, and 3: It makes sex more pleasurable

1: Means nothing.

2: So can the very most basic level of personal hygiene.

3: Total bull shit.

It should of course be legal to be performed on a consenting adult, like all other body modifications, but should absolutely be illegal to be forced on extremely young children.

 

[Worgen]

it was started to make sex less pleasurable (at least thats why christians did it)

Risking TMI, I'm going to speak as a guy who decided to get circumcised when I was 18.

For all the talk about sex being less pleasurable for those circumsized, maybe, scientifically speaking, I've fewer nerve endings, but sex is just as good as I remember it being before I got my johnson trimmed. Same with masturbation. The pleasure it is still just fine and does not feel in decline even after more than a decade of swinging around unsheathed.

Keeping it clean was never a huge chore to begin with, but it's been substantially easier since.

I don't really know that there's any great benefit to it, but it was a step towards helping me change what I wanted to about my body.

---

On the issue at large and in SF, I am typically a strong proponent of individual liberty... in this case, it should be NEITHER the government NOR the parent's decision, but the child when they come of age and, understanding the procedure, desire such a modification.

I never said it always worked but thats why they started it, for women they removed the clit, for men they cut off the foreskin, the ultimate intention was to ensure that sex only happened for procreation, since they are insane

 

[ServebotFrank]

Just do it at infancy, it prevents diseases. I've had relatives who've needed it done in their teens, and they found it to be a painful and humiliating ordeal. As for reduced sexual pleasure, that is not a set in stone fact, it's still disputed.

Do you know how sensitive a baby's nervous system is when it's born? Pretty fucking high. It's really traumatic for a baby and it's BRUTAL OPERATION! Look a video up I couldn't watch it all the way it's that bad.

 

[HyenaThePirate]

Do you know how sensitive a baby's nervous system is when it's born? Pretty fucking high. It's really traumatic for a baby and it's BRUTAL OPERATION! Look a video up I couldn't watch it all the way it's that bad.

And yet, few if any of us have any remote recollection whatsoever of it happening... soooo...
Yeah, not so big a deal. That's like saying cutting the umbilical chord is a traumatic event. Nonsense.

At the end of the day however, I fall into the camp that when it comes to children and parents, children have very few "rights." It is up to their parent to decide what they feel is best for the child until it is of the mandatory age to make its own decisions. If you're sitting around assfaced because your parents had you circumcised, you've got bigger issues that aren't being addressed in your psyche.

Besides, I find it amusing how so many people have a problem with parents making a decision about circumcision for THEIR child, and express so much concern about the child's right to decide if it wants to have foreskin or not by having it's decision made without its consent by its parents... but few seem to have any problem with parents removing a child's right to choose life altogether when it comes to abortion. On that subject, all of a sudden, babies don't have any say in the matter interestingly enough.

So essentially, our society says it's okay to kill a baby in a womb if you don't want it, but should you want it, you can't circumcise it against its will.

What an assbackwards world we live in.

 

[Jonluw]

Good for them, banning inconsentual cosmetic surgery on children.

 

[ranyilliams]

If we were born with it, we were born with it for a reason. This should be the choice of the person having their own penis altered permanently.

 

[Saelune]

Just do it at infancy, it prevents diseases. I've had relatives who've needed it done in their teens, and they found it to be a painful and humiliating ordeal. As for reduced sexual pleasure, that is not a set in stone fact, it's still disputed.

It prevents disease like magic underwear. It doesn't. Its an old wives' tale from the 19-20th century.

Well, Im guessing the disease that is prevented is anything that would occur from poor maintenance of the foreskin, since you apparently have to make it a point to clean it.

If your lazy enough to not clean your foreskin, you have bigger health problems to worry about. Ever heard of the plague? Caused by people not bathing or performing hygiene? Was made a number 1 concern for everyone?

The penile cancer scare tactic is more rare than male breast cancer. You have a higher chance of getting mugged or being hit by a bus. Hell, getting mauled by a mountain lion is a higher chance than that.

I never said any of that. I also assumed the diseases would be more inconveniant than life threatening. Like some sort of mild infection.