Science Creates Glass That's Stronger Than Steel

Faladorian

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Andy Chalk said:
I have no idea what that means and neither do you
Speak for yourself.

Also, I'd like to see if they'll now be able to make helmets that fully protect the wearer's head by making a visor out of this glass. Of course, in the state it's in now I'm not sure it could stop a sniper rifle bullet; but hey they said they're still working on it so who knows?
 

The Human Torch

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McMullen said:
Andy Chalk said:
I have no idea what that means and neither do you
Classy bit of journalism there. Didn't it occur to you to try to find out what it means? All you had to say is that it's more flexible and therefore less brittle than glass, so it's less likely to break.

I see a lot of this lazy reporting on science stories here on the Escapist. An especially bad example was Friday's piece on DNA replication by what the writer referred to as "a bunch of quantum stuff which I'm just going to call 'magic'". I'm not saying the research in question was the paragon of credibility, but come on, it should be allowed to stand or fall on its merits rather than be strawmanned into something that sounds completely ridiculous. The scary thing is that a lot of people leaving comments seem to accept the writer's caricature of the research as an accurate account of what the scientists are doing.

I suppose that journalism like this, with generous support from Hollywood science, is the reason I heard a couple people on the bus the other day ranting about how scientists are just a bunch of nuts running around making stuff up, and whining about the fact that Pluto is no longer a planet just because the scientists decided to be mean to it... or something. Hell, they even said the only reason they liked Pluto in the first place is that it shared the name of a Disney character. They asked just who "that guy" thought he was, to demote Pluto.

First off, he's Niel DeGrasse Frickin' Tyson, and he can kick your butt either intellectually or physically, or both at the same time. Don't mess with him. Besides, if you looked at why Pluto was demoted, you'd see that the demoters had very good reasons for doing so. Second, science is the direct opposite of "just making stuff up". No idea in science survives for any length of time unless it can withstand the attempts of hundreds of the smartest people in the world trying for decades to tear it down, even when such ideas solve all the unanswered questions that the old ideas have failed to. See the opposition to the theories of Plate Tectonics and Quantum Mechanics for examples, or even the idea that the Earth orbits the sun and not the other way around.

And it works. Science is the reason you don't know anyone who's died of smallpox, or even had it or polio in the first place. It's given you computers and game consoles and the internet, and the games to play on them. It's given you your cars and your cell phones. Cell phones, by the way, are courtesy of quantum mechanics, for those who think modern physics no longer does anything useful. For a more recent example, the latest medical scanners use particles originally synthesized in those particle accelerators the press has made you so fearful of.

Even after all it has done for humanity, it seems that science is a very popular cultural punching bag. At worst, science classes are often in danger of being forced to teach things that are not science in order to satisfy the whims of an ancient, discredited, but still widely held belief system trying desperately to maintain its relevance. Many times, it is simply mocked in entertainment and lazily written news stories. Most times, it is completely ignored by those whom it has helped, even saved. The first man to be exonerated by DNA evidence never thought to thank the researchers who developed the technology that saved his life. He thanked God instead.

A society that disregards science will eventually fail to thrive. Baghdad was once the intellectual capital of the world, naming most of the stars in the sky and developing the mathematics that runs our software and ensures that our bridges remain standing, while Europe was in a state that Monty Python and others have represented as people pretty much wallowing around in dung while mumbling incoherently. While it wasn't really that bad, it may as well have been compared to what was happening in the Middle East. But, once the religious leaders of the time decided that it was a sin to say that Allah or anything he made was constrained by laws or patterns of behavior, and the prominence of science in Middle Eastern culture came crashing down, the area became a backwater that has remained a disgrace to its past glory to this day.

The US seems inclined to follow the Middle East's example today, as many in this country seem to feel it is unacceptable to teach children things that contradict the Bible, no matter how many decades of research say they are true. If they succeed, and the booming bioindustry and other science-based industries flourish in every developed country except for the US, and American graduates just can't seem to get hired into those jobs, I doubt they will see a link between their country's slide into economic irrelevance and their misguided priorities. I suppose they'll continue to insist that they're NUMBER ONE!!! and the bestest cuntry evar, completely unaware of the fact that they are one of the main reasons that that is not the case. It is similar to how they insist we are not related to animals and yet, through their fear-driven, extremist response to truth, provide compelling if not particularly quantitative evidence that, indeed, we are. Some more closely than others.

Just a few things that were on my mind when the writer of this article dropped a piece of straw on my back.
Fantastic rant, so I am quoting it for all those who missed it on the first page. And it sums up neatly my thoughts on the scientific posts here, too many attempts at being cutesy. Treat your source material with the respect it deserves.
 

BabySinclair

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Windows are finally an option on spacecraft, not counting the plasma windows that we've already worked out (mind you we've yet to make a big plasma window). Next test is putting it up against a vacuum and seeing the effects. I want to be able to have a full observatory in space before I die.
 

acrh2

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BabySinclair said:
Windows are finally an option on spacecraft, not counting the plasma windows that we've already worked out (mind you we've yet to make a big plasma window). Next test is putting it up against a vacuum and seeing the effects. I want to be able to have a full observatory in space before I die.
The level of ignorance in a single paragraph is astounding:
1) Windows have ALWAYS been an option in spacecraft. Vostok 1, the first manned spacecraft, had a window.
2) Plasma windows are anything but windows in the normal sense of the word.
3) They have been launching space observatories since the sixties.

I vote for this man to be expelled from the club.
 

BabySinclair

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acrh2 said:
BabySinclair said:
Windows are finally an option on spacecraft, not counting the plasma windows that we've already worked out (mind you we've yet to make a big plasma window). Next test is putting it up against a vacuum and seeing the effects. I want to be able to have a full observatory in space before I die.
The level of ignorance in a single paragraph is astounding:
1) Windows have ALWAYS been an option in spacecraft. Vostok 1, the first manned spacecraft, had a window.
2) Plasma windows are anything but windows in the normal sense of the word.
3) They have been launching space observatories since the sixties.

I vote for this man to be expelled from the club.
Your own ignorance is far from laudable.

1) Windows exist by and large as tiny portholes or segmented planes, glass has the problem of cracking under the pressure exerted by zero atmosphere which means that they must remain small to maintain strength
2)Windows are by definition an opening that is used for the admission of light and air and is capable of being opened or shut. Since they can be closed or opened by turning it on or off, it applies, please don't use a narrow minded view
3) None allow anything close to what you see in Science Fiction in which a person can simply look without need for telescopes or cameras in the form of a glass dome that allows panoramic viewing

Please keep your self-perceived hilarity to yourself lest you make the joke rest on you
 

FROGGEman2

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McMullen said:
tl;dr, but I got he gist. IF we're looking at the content of the writing- he cited a source. Most of his audience are not interested in the details of the science, and he palms it of in a humorous fashion. What are you complaining about here? Would it have been better if he just said "I won't go into the details?"

This isn't lazy journalism, but it's journalism at it should be.

OT: Excited for what this could mean for deep-sea exploration. Hooray the ocean!

~EDIT~

Naw, I missed the flame war. Oh well.
 

caselj01

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I have a few questions folks.
Is "shear band" an american way of saying "shear plane"?
Does "high bulk-to-shear modulus ratio" mean that the bulk modulus is high compared to the shear modulus or is it the other way around?
 

SilentHunter7

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McMullen said:
Um...okay? What I'm gathering from that post is that because the author made a lighthearted joke about how advanced some of our discoveries are becoming, he's a science-hating creationist.

How in the hell do you make that connection?
 

direkiller

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BabySinclair said:
Windows are finally an option on spacecraft, not counting the plasma windows that we've already worked out (mind you we've yet to make a big plasma window). Next test is putting it up against a vacuum and seeing the effects. I want to be able to have a full observatory in space before I die.
this glass will just bubble like balloon till it breaks. All the things there talking about are after the plastic limit (meaning the object has deformed and cannot go back to its original shape but did not break). They succeeding in makeing glass that takes more energy to break after it has deformed then steel,the definition of toughness and for some steel this is almost non existent. so they haven't so much made a super material as manipulated the definition of the word strong to there own needs.

To put it in perspective its basically saying silly putty is stronger then cast iron because if you hit it with a hammer the cast iron shatter where the silly puddy just deforms.
 

Andy Chalk

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Nov 12, 2002
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obscurumlux01 said:
Palladium is traded on the markets as a rare metal. It goes Copper, Silver, Gold, Platinum, Palladium in order of price/rarity.
Sorry Ace, but that's not even close. It's platinum, palladium, irridium and Element Zero. Maybe you should've googled it after all, eh?
 

rsvp42

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acrh2 said:
Did no one pick up, including the author of the news piece, that this "glass" is not transparent?

From the original news article linked from this news piece, it appears that the word "glass" is used in its scientific form (amorphous material), not in its every day use (I can see through it).
Yeah, people this material is not transparent glass in the sense we're used to. It's a form of amorphous metal commonly referred to as a "metallic glass." It still has a lot of uses, but windows are not one of them.
 

ThaBenMan

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Mar 6, 2008
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Son, I am dissapoint that you made a Star Trek reference. Clearly, what we have here is transparasteel from Star Wars.
 

Vulpis

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Oy. I'm beginning to see why some of the people I know dislike Escapist with a passion, when it moves me to a 'This shall not pass (without comment)!' reaction.

Let's see...
On glass--as some people have pointed out (and been pretty much ignored), the glass refered to in this article is being called that by the scientific definition, not the more commonplace term that refers to transparent silicon-dioxide glass. Glass refers to a material with particular properties and, surprising to some, transparency or translucency is *not* a mandatory property. A fine example of this is Obsidian, a volcanic glass which is certainly opaque.

On spacecraft windows--funny, IIRC the space shuttle has the same size and style of windows as the average jetliner; it's earlier craft like the Mercury and Gemini capsules that had the tiny 'porthole' windows, primarily because it wasn't known how stringent the requirements needed to be. If you notice, the windows on the Apollo Lander are a bit larger, though not as large as the Shuttle ones. The requirements for spacecraft windows aren't that major, really--they have to withstand a single atmosphere's worth of pressure pushing out on them, and deal with launch stresses and high-speed impacts of small particles from the outside. Deep-sea vehicle windows are a whole different matter--they have to withstand extremely high external pressures while maintaining a 1-atmosphere pressure on the inside. Fortunately, they don't have impacts to deal with that much.

On Mr. Chalk and 'nerds'--this is the part that pushed me to sign up and post...and caused the view I mentioned at the outset.

Andy Chalk said:
I'm just going to reiterate what Spcychkwinatwhatever said above: this is a gaming-slash-nerd site. Here, when someone says "glass that's stronger than steel," we think, "Hello, computer?" If you do too, then you're in the right place.

The rest of you might want to reconsider your priorities.
Andy Chalk said:
It was a joke, son.

The situation breaks down very simply. Sometimes we like to share the interesting stuff we stumble across during the course of our day, but as befits the nature of the site, we usually frame such things in the "nerd context." That means that when we see a story about steel-like glass, we're less inclined to talk about the hard science behind it than about traveling back in time to load some whales onto a Klingon cruiser. This is what we do, and it's what we've always done.

For those more interested in the science, the link to the original article on the Berkeley Lab is provided. People who saw the title and immediately thought, "A keyboard? How quaint" are already right where they should be.
While I can appreciate your view on how to frame this for a gaming site, if you honestly think you were framing this in a 'nerd context', then I suggest you should be the one to reconsider your *own* priorities, not to mention your line of work, since you pretty obviously haven't the foggiest clue of what a 'nerd' actually is.

Simply put, the hallmark of a 'nerd' is an in-depth knowledge of a particular area often to the exclusion of skills outside of that area--most notably social skills, which is why the nerd image exists in the first place. This lack of social skills is why nerds are looked down upon, particularly by non-nerds who consider their area of knowledge trivial or inconsequential (there is some measure of this even from nerds of a different area of expertise, though less so than from non-nerds due to understanding the drive for knowledge). Not all areas of expertise are practical, of course--some of them involve a disconnect with the world as it's currently known (which contributes to the social problem mentioned before). Then again, you have those who take their areas of expertise and *find* practical use for it outside of simply increasing their knowledge in their area, and you have the ones who cross-polinate into multiple areas of expertise. You have the gaming nerds...and then you have the game programming nerds, the programming nerds, the psychology nerds, the behaviorist nerds...who use what they know as and of the gaming nerds in their fields. You have the Star Wars nerds, the Star Trek nerds, the Dune nerds, the Tron nerds...and then you have their grandaddy the Hard Science-Fiction nerds, and then the ur-nerds of them all, the *Science* Nerd--the people who take all these fictional elements and work to see how much of it they can turn into reality. (I always feel that's something that 'Revenge of the Nerds' missed out on--the end message shouldn't have been 'Feel picked on? Band together!', it should have been 'Nerds designed the materials in the clothes you wear, formulated the make-up on your faces, the drugs that keep you healthy or improve your performance, and designed those cars you drive. In short, Nerds *own* you.'.)

If you'd said something along the lines of 'As a gaming nerd, I don't know what this means', that would have been one thing--after all, a gaming nerd wouldn't know the details of materials science, any more than you'd expect a materials science nerd to know the Konami Code (unless they were a gaming nerd as well as a science nerd). But the way you projected your own ignorance onto the rest of us, and then make it worse by claiming it was meant to be in a 'nerd context' (not a *gaming* nerd context, notably)? *This* nerd feels mightily insulted, and judging by some of the comments from those who do have a interest in materials science in addition to gaming, I'm not the only one.
 

Flamezdudes

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Andy Chalk said:
I'm just going to reiterate what Spcychkwinatwhatever said above: this is a gaming-slash-nerd site. Here, when someone says "glass that's stronger than steel," we think, "Hello, computer?" If you do too, then you're in the right place.

The rest of you might want to reconsider your priorities.
I am so very confused. What's this suppose to mean?