SCOTUS Overturns Ban on Same-Sex Marriage

[NeutralDrow]

Basically: At my university, I have several (not bigoted) professors who expressed the legitimate concern that gay marriage could lead to polygamy. Without going into to detail, I can definitely see their point.

The difference is that there are legitimate reasons to be specifically wary of polygamy, whereas the only non-moralist concerns about homosexual marriage are indistinguishable from marriage as a whole. They're not connected in any way (except perhaps antagonistically), so there's no good reason to assume one would lead to the other. There's good reading in this, excerpt below.

I don?t doubt that some PIB relationships can realize genuine human goods. Polygamy is the most plausible candidate: It is quite common historically, and there may well have been circumstances (for example, a shortage of men due to war or other dangers) that made it work well in particular societies. But that?s only half the story. The other half requires asking whether, despite these goods, there are overriding reasons for discouraging or condemning polygamy today. Polygamous societies are almost always polygynous, where one husband has multiple wives. (Polyandry ? one wife with multiple husbands ? is, by contrast, quite rare.) The usual result is a sexist and classist society where high-status males acquire multiple wives while low-status males become virtually unmarriageable. Thus, from a social-policy point of view, there are reasons to be wary of polygamy. Perhaps those reasons could be overcome by further argument, but the central point remains: Arguments about the morally appropriate number of sexual partners are logically distinct from arguments about the morally appropriate gender of sexual partners.

 

[thethird0611]

Honestly, its probably because of the conversation that follows it. If you look back through the pages, there is quite a lot of post that spew nothing but hate at anyone that doesnt agree with the decision, and MANY of the post should get a warning for what they said (but we know the mods, its ok to insult THOSE people).

I mean hell, people want discussion between different opinions, but look at the hate toward anything non-liberal/religious in R&P, and you wonder why there are some people who dont want this topics posted about.

True, it is much like how feminism threads always seem to devolve into pointless bickering where nothing is accomplished other than people getting their jimmies rustled...

I get why these topics are volatile for many people, but that shouldn't be a reason to be silent about them, being civil with news like this isn't hard.

Honestly, I do wish these topics could be civil, where people dont try to passively or outright insult the other viewpoint. Ive seriously been wathcing this topic all day, but I havent posted anything about it because I would just get insulted or 'looked down upon'. Hell, I can give you the reason to, im religious and lean Republican. So you can kinda guess how this topic would go for me.

Honestly, I believe if there was some extra modding over the 'passive aggressive' stuff, there would be better conversation. I asked a mod once about a guy who insulted me, and they said, "Sorry, he didnt say it directly enough at you to be banable."

But yeah...

EDIT: Also, if I have the annoying 'The Sub' add in the way of me typing, so sorry for any errors.

 

[Dr. Cakey]

Don't lump everyone into 2 groups. I'd call myself a liberal. But this is one of the 2 things I disagree with them and have to side with the Republicans on.

That doesn't change the fact that the group screaming for personal freedom is the one saying except where gays are involved. and women. and blacks. and mexicans."

Tell me, is this your stance? You seem quick to defend them.

No. The views of the Republicans towards women (especially towards abortion), and minorities is bullshit and why I have never voted for any running for a seat in Washington and only vote for them on local elections when forced due to them running unopposed.
However gay marriage needs to be banned on a federal level. Hell I'd also like to criminalize gay and lesbian acts however this is very very damn unlikely (unless Iran somehow conquers us lol) so I'll hope nay demand for what is actually possible and right. As I said I'm a liberal on all but 2 issues. Gay marriage being one of them obviously

It's quite okay for you to disagree with anything gay marriage related.
But when you say you want to criminalize same-sex activities, essentially what people do behind close doors, that is their business and not really anyone else's, you are no longer being conservative. You're being unlawful.

I did also concede it was impossible it would ever get passed in this country. So I'll be happy to just have gay marriage banned on a federal level.

Do you mind if I ask why you think homosexuality should be illegal? It seems like a pretty extreme view for anyone to hold in this day and age.

Personal. But needless to say it has a lot to do with why I hate the Boy Scouts of America and would like nothing better than to see them bankrupt. Use your imagination.

Yeesh. My imagination turns up some pretty sick stuff. Even the worst of it, mind you, isn't really justification. The worst I can imagine still puts the theoretical victim in the same position as a a rape victim demanding heterosexuality be banned because he or she was raped by someone of the opposite gender. You're being unfair to the overwhelming majority of that sexuality.

I assumed he just didn't like helping old ladies cross the street or whatever it is the Boy Scouts do, but that didn't make much sense to me. Your thing makes more sense. Okay, maybe "sense" isn't quite the right word...

CAPTCHA: Has your doctor prescribed allergy medication?

...what happened to all those eerily on-topic captchas?

 

[Something Amyss]

If you look back through the pages, there is quite a lot of post that spew nothing but hate at anyone that doesnt agree with the decision

Yeah, a guy who refers to homosexuals as appalling and who thinks homosexuality should be criminalised is probably afraid of having his feelings hurt by people with hurtful opinions.

 

[Remus]

When it come to marriage, sooner or later it always ends-up being the same sex.

Robin Williams, like most of the last generation's comics, has always been well ahead of his time.
Come on guys, DADT first, DOMA second, lets make it a home run and declare The Patriot Act unconstitutional.

 

[BoredRolePlayer]

Unfortunately, they also gutted the Voter Rights Act, so states can be racist with far less difficulty.

Captcha: face the music
There will always be bigotry in the US.

Noooo, they said that the basis upon which the Voters Rights Act judged certain states and municipalities was antiquated and wrong.

I mean, what you don't understand is that the way this Act essentially worked was that certain regions of the deep South had to jump through ridiculous beauracratic hoops to pass voting legislation while the rest of the nation was free to pass whatever they damn well please (Such as voter ID laws).

You CANNOT tell me you believe that discrimination should only be discouraged in a few select areas within the US. Wouldn't you prefer if discrimination was discouraged across the US? What the Supreme Court essentially said was, "Start applying anti-discrimination laws in all states on an equal basis or STFU." Which I agree with.

Apparently you'd prefer to be bigoted against mythical, racist white people in the south, rather than believe racist people generally tend to live throughout every country (not just the US and not just because of skin color).

The Voters Rights Act being declared unconstitutional is a good thing because it will force Congress to come up with a more appropriate act which will promote greater equality than the previous, antiquated system allowed, which Justice Roberts explains was his reasoning in declaring it unconstitutional.

To be honest, racism and sexism is grander in the south then the north (not saying it's not in the north). And the reason those states were forced to jump through extra hoops was because in the past they made minority people jump through extra hoops. Pole Text, literacy tests, Voter ID's, were some of the things used to control who gets to vote. Now we are trying to pass Voter ID (which Texas is pushing through), can't vote same day you were registered, no early voting, redistricting making a heavy minority section have to process more people (which was a issue in my home town and is being fought), if your a out of state college student you can't vote for national elections. Yeah those laws target certain groups, and they keep trying to pass those same laws which is why they are always under a tight boot.

 

[thethird0611]

Honestly, its probably because of the conversation that follows it. If you look back through the pages, there is quite a lot of post that spew nothing but hate at anyone that doesnt agree with the decision, and MANY of the post should get a warning for what they said (but we know the mods, its ok to insult THOSE people).

I mean hell, people want discussion between different opinions, but look at the hate toward anything non-liberal/religious in R&P, and you wonder why there are some people who dont want this topics posted about.

True, it is much like how feminism threads always seem to devolve into pointless bickering where nothing is accomplished other than people getting their jimmies rustled...

I get why these topics are volatile for many people, but that shouldn't be a reason to be silent about them, being civil with news like this isn't hard.

Im just gonna quote you real quick to show you JUST how this topic goes. Im also going to report this post and he probably wont get any mod wrath.

If you look back through the pages, there is quite a lot of post that spew nothing but hate at anyone that doesnt agree with the decision

Yeah, a guy who refers to homosexuals as appalling and who thinks homosexuality should be criminalised is probably afraid of having his feelings hurt by people with hurtful opinions.

So Tizzy, this is why we shouldnt have more news that is away from gaming.

 

[Something Amyss]

True, it is much like how feminism threads always seem to devolve into pointless bickering where nothing is accomplished other than people getting their jimmies rustled...

To be fair, people ***** when they show up in the news, too. It would probably be more hostile in here if they had reported on Anita Sarkeesian.

Yeah, but again, just because it isn't game related, doesn't mean it doesn't belong here, we have so many news stories that aren't about gaming at all but those are considered fine. But like you said, if it is something they disagree with, the Escapist is to blame.

And I agree. People should probably not try and dictate what the Escapist reports on.

Or at least not do it so selectively.

However those previous threads were all started by users for debate reasons.

But you're not really debating it. You're just saying "I'm against it because REASONS!" and then arguing why you don't want to say you're against it. That borders on baiting people right there, no matter how noble your intents might be.

 

[seditary]

However gay marriage needs to be banned on a federal level. Hell I'd also like to criminalize gay and lesbian acts however this is very very damn unlikely (unless Iran somehow conquers us lol) so I'll hope nay demand for what is actually possible and right. As I said I'm a liberal on all but 2 issues. Gay marriage being one of them obviously

And I'd love to move to Canada.

Hey, wait a minute.

Are you trolling?

 

[Something Amyss]

Im also going to report this post and he probably wont get any mod wrath.

So...What is so horrible about my post? I'm pointing out that the guy in question, the one Tizzy brought up in the first place, that started your rebuttal is a dude who has talked about how he wants to see people persecuted for being gay. Are you really that offended that I don't think someone who has called gays names and called for criminal laws against them should be defended?

Because if so, I really have to wonder why.

Hell, I even tried to find out exactly why he felt that way, despite how easy it would be for me to yell at the dude for thinking I should go to jail. That's right, I'm one of those people he's actively condemning.

You know who probably won't get any mod wrath as well, though?

Hell I'd also like to criminalize gay and lesbian acts however this is very very damn unlikely (unless Iran somehow conquers us lol) so I'll hope nay demand for what is actually possible and right. As I said I'm a liberal on all but 2 issues. Gay marriage being one of them obviously

I really would like to think that you aren't defending that, but it sounds like you're doing just that.

 

[Syzygy23]

Good job America.

Now you can join the rest of the First World

I still can't quite grasp how this is even an issue, do people really have nothing better to do than concern themselves about which gender other people find attractive?

We're really just waiting for all the crotchety, racist, backwards thinking old people who run our country to die at this point. The more their numbers dwindle, the more progressive we get. C'est la vie!

However gay marriage needs to be banned on a federal level. Hell I'd also like to criminalize gay and lesbian acts however this is very very damn unlikely (unless Iran somehow conquers us lol) so I'll hope nay demand for what is actually possible and right. As I said I'm a liberal on all but 2 issues. Gay marriage being one of them obviously

And I'd love to move to Canada.

Hey, wait a minute.

Are you trolling?

Yes I know gay marriage is legal in Canada. However it is only 1 of a few things I disagree with there government on as compared to the mountain of shit that makes up the US political system and policies. And the political system and policies of the US is only a portion of why I hate this country. I have been to Canada (Quebec specifically) and have relatives there. I would love to live there.
Hell I'd want to live in dozens of countries instead of the US. (northeast India would be high on my list) However any sane country would not allow me to immigrate to them. They all rightfully so towards me have the policy of "you can visit but not stay".

You actively want to punish gay people AND you hate the USA?

I can't think of a single first world country that wants you as a citizen if that's how you feel.

 

[Syzygy23]

(accidental double post, deleted)

 

[Diddy_Mao]

This has just been a cracker jack couple of days for me while speaking with my relatives in Texas.

Between this, the Abortion law overturn and that whole Paula Deen nonsense I'm pretty sure one of them is actually going to explode.

As you can imagine I try to avoid talking to the Sackville Baggins' as much as possible.

 

[Something Amyss]

Between this, the Abortion law overturn and that whole Paula Deen nonsense I'm pretty sure one of them is actually going to explode.

Do they believe rape kits are a form of abortion?

More on topic, if they explode, put it on YouTube. For science!

(edit1: because it's spontaneous combustion, not because they disagree with me)

Edit2:

My family is very conservative and largely from a very conservative portion of Maine. I learned to avoid politic chat with them, but years ago I had to hear them explode that the "damn gays" were "getting everything they wanted" because Maine didn't outright ban gay marriage. Keep in mind this was well before they legalised it, so you couldn't actually marry a same-sex partner. They just refused to ban it completely.

They're not from a Republican bastion like Texas, but I can feel your pain there.

 

[razer17]

I was merely reminding Bara no Hime and others on this site not to assume everyone who us against gay marriage is a Conservative loon.

I have absolutely no interest in defending Bara No Hime, but that's not what she was talking about and that's what I clarified. Again, you have NO reason to get defensive if it doesn't apply to you, and you claim it doesn't.

I like how you ignored the part where I said I find the racial profiling of the likes of Arpaio and Arizona politiicians appalling.

I merely addressed the more disturbing portion of your contradictory message. I like how you ignored most of my statements and directly avoided a straight question.

No pun intended.

I also love your very, very, very selective anti-prejudice stance. As much as I dislike the Republican stance on blacks, don't cast stones from a glass house, dude.

Personal.

If you're not going to actually elaborate, then maybe you shouldn't rant in the first place.

Judging by his post about the boy scouts, I believe he might be making the point that gay men are paedohpiles? He's just not willing to come out and say it.

How have I thrown in with them? Because I agree with those idiots on 2 topics? I have never voted for a Republican when given a choice (not running unopposed). I was merely reminding Bara no Hime and others on this site not to assume everyone who us against gay marriage is a Conservative loon. This site has a bad habit of labeling anyone they do not agree with politically as something that person may not be. And seeing as I had already posted earlier in the thread I wanted to make it known I am a liberal and not to label me as one of the idiots right when I'm not.

I like how you ignored the part where I said I find the racial profiling of the likes of Arpaio and Arizona politiicians appalling.

If you believe gay activities should be made illegal, you're worse than just a conservative loon. Whether you agree with the rest of their policies or not.

 

[snakeinthereeds]

The people who get annoyed by these topics getting posted on Escapist mostly seem to be either the ones who have strong oppinions that get them into heated arguments about the topic in question or ones who are tired of anything resembling flame wars in general.

Getting some solid arguments that actually support your oppinion (Can't? You might want to revise your oppinion.) and growing a tougher hide to survive the slapfights that might ensue, or just avoiding the thread if you think you're going to get hit by a stray clump of passive-aggressiveness that might be too much to handle for you, might make your life less miserable, you know?
Example: Putting homosexuality next to pedophillia is putting consensual sex next to rape. Your "argument" is invalid.

OT: Definitely a step in the right direction, however small it might be. It's interesting how concerned people get about what other people of consenting age and intelligence want to do with their lives.