Skyrim: Cabbage Rocket

Krantos

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Oh, look. Crit Miss is acting hyperbolic to generate traffic again.

...and I posted... well, played, crit miss, well played.


Regardless, I love Skyrim, so screw you.
 

EyeReaper

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Aug 17, 2011
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Wait, wait, wait. You're saying that a game should have to stand up on its own merits? Blasphemy!

But in seriousness, I do agree. Judging Skyrim (or any game) by it's fan-created content would be like basing your opinion on My Little Pony on a couple of fanfics you read, or liking or disliking Sonic the Hedgehog based on what you see of him on Deviantart.

Also, a little off topic, but is captcha asking for anyone else's email? should I be wary?
 

Sir Shockwave

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I felt the same way with the lists The Escapist itself has been putting out lately, and am very surprised you guys were allowed to put this up, which is itself a criticism (guess what got top spot of the "Top 25 RPG's of the last 25 years" list?). I mean really, Skyrim? Here's a shortlist of RPG's better than Skyrim:

* Baldur's Gate, and possibly Baldur's Gate II
* Deus Ex. The original Deus Ex anyway, though there's nothing wrong with HR.
* The Geneforge series
* Pretty much any of the Mass Effect series, though the first two especially*
* System Shock 2
* Neverwinter Nights
* Diablo

The list goes on. It's about as nonsensical as - Iunno - putting goddamned Freespace 2 in 5th place. Unlike that one however, it just speaks of so much wrong on so many levels.

*Yes, I know the Story didn't go the intended direction, thus making ME2 almost entirely pointless. They still hold up as games though (which one does is a flamewar for another day).
 

Ishal

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Say what I will about Bethesda? Alright.

I'll say they're still masters of creating amazing worlds to explore. Skyrim is one such place. Now, putting in coherent stories, connecting the stuff together, and adding weight to decisions, yeah... they've been struggling with that. Still I'd call Skyrim a net positive. I've sunk so much time into that game it's not even funny.

As for the bugs, yeah, they're bad. But the vast majority of them are situational that crop up here and there. I'd say Skyrim has the issue of lots of small bugs, whereas a game like Arkham:Origins, or whatever the newest Batman game is called, has large game breaking bugs. Bugs that repeatedly happen in the same place, obstructing progress. Bugs that corrupt save files so you can't reload. Bugs that can even effect your console, if you're playing on that.

Doesn't excuse Bethesda, but I'd still rather play their game than 2/3 of what's on that list.
 

Artemicion

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Dec 7, 2009
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Gasbandit said:
It's just cool to hate on things that were super popular 2 years ago.
This is a good summary for a lot of the hate that gets thrown at games.


As for Skyrim itself? I'm not saying it's a great RPG that deserves to top lists, but you could do a lot worse [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wars:_Knights_of_the_Old_Republic_II_%E2%80%93_The_Sith_Lords]. Like, way worse [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpha_Protocol]. On the spectrum of RPGs, Skyrim still rates higher than most.
 

loc978

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The cars thing is a good analogy, actually... but I take it the other way. Big-budget games are rather like new cars. Thanks to mass-market appeal, every goddamn one of 'em is shit without mods.
 

WhiteTigerShiro

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wAriot said:
I said it before and I'll say it again: Totalbiscuit's definition of Skyrim is 100% perfect. "Skyrim is like a two-feet-deep ocean". There are tons of things to do and see, but none of them have any depth or complexity.

And mods are just a big spade to make that ocean a bit deeper in some areas.
Ha! That is perfect! When did he say that?
 

Skeleon

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Oi, I just recently started playing Skyrim and I enjoy it after having invested way more than 2 hours. And, no, not because of mods. But because of all the stuff that you can search for, all the things you can do. Bethesda kind of sucks when it comes to main story lines as I noticed in Fallout 3 and again now in Skyrim, but considering the worlds they craft I can't really find it in myself to care too much.
 
Aug 31, 2012
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I played Skyrim for the first time about a month ago, having recently bought a new PC, and while it wasn't bad it just didn't interest me enough to keep on playing past an hour or 2.

The world was really uninteresting to me, maybe it was because it was all a rather dark brown and white and partly that the Norse theme didn't really resonate with me. It had another "you are the chosen one" storyline, I really can't stand those. Menus were shit and for some reason I couldn't get the script extender to work so the UI mod didn't function properly. Combat felt worse than Oblivion, somehow. Magic was an improvement though.

Bethesda FPRPGs usually sell me on the world, exploring it is fun, but this time it wasn't and the story and gameplay weren't good enough to keep me going without it. After I completed the Elf embassy mission my companion disappeared and I just couldn't be bothered playing from my last save again. Turn off, uninstall.
 

WhiteTigerShiro

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Doom972 said:
Mods can be considered a game's feature if the game was made with mods in mind, which has been the case for every Elder Scrolls game since Morrowind. Also, I think Skyrim holds pretty well even without the mods - all I needed were some graphics/UI improvements and the Unofficial Patch. Also Lightsabers.
I like how even your attempt at defending the base game comes with the caveat of needing a couple of mods. At any rate, that's a slippery slope to take. Granted that Bethesda creates their games knowing full-well that people are going to add mods to the games, but that doesn't excuse them from creating a solid experience for the people who prefer not to mod, or like to do a "fresh" run of the game before they mod it out the ass, or people who literally can't mod (consoles, for example). Simply put, it shouldn't be my job to figure out why their game sucks and then track down a fix that someone else made for them.

Then there's just the fact that the statement has "cop-out" written all over it. So if a mod can be considered a part of a game's features so-long as it was created with mods in mind, then what about DLC? If a developer created a game with a specific DLC in mind, and the base game just feels lacking without it, is it fair to list that game on a Top 10 list "because the DLC totally fixes it"? And if your answer is "No", then why are mods so different? And since I already know you'll say money, let's just say that this game plus the DLC is still cheaper than Skyrim's base game (for a roughly-equivalent game).
 

Malbourne

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I do kinda wish Skyrim had more focus, but that's because I like having an engrossing story to tack my character onto. Besides that, it had fun progression, good scenery, and felt more like a world to explore than most games I've played. I wouldn't be broken up if it didn't make the top of lists, though. The strange thing is, from what I've read the modding hasn't been too much of a factor in Skyrim's rankings, but I haven't read that many lists anyway. I wasn't aware it was a facet that got that much critical love.
 

WhiteTigerShiro

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Grape_Nuts said:
Skyrim IS awesome with mods, and unlike modding a car, it costs $0 to elevate the game to new heights of awesomeness. As for "best X of all time" lists, they're utterly worthless. I've never even heard of Godhand, so I'm just going to attribute that to neurotic erin being neurotic.
It's more like hipster Erin being hipster[footnote]I tried looking-up Neurotic, but it's definitions didn't really seem to fit with the situation.[/footnote]. Godhand was one of those under-appreciated games that was absolutely adored by its fanbase, but that got next to no publicity (see: "I've never even heard of Godhand"), so it ultimately didn't sell that great. Since most gamers probably only heard of the game when they saw it sitting on the shelves, they generally assumed that there was probably good reason that they never heard of it (which to be fair, is usually a safe assumption). The end result is a good game that no one has heard of.
 

Muspelheim

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Two hours certainly beats a comic about two years late, though. :3

Although I suppose the anti-hype train always got a few extra departures.
 

croc3629

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Best RPG? Oh never, but I did have my fun. It is perfectly reasonable to be able to enjoy the game, even vanilla(though I certainly got more out of it once I modded it).

You know what the thing is though? The Elder Scrolls games and the modern Fallouts are the closest to the perfect TYPE of game that I want to play.

Just an open world rpg with a deep, involving story, world full of actual characters and atmosphere and interesting combat mechanics that allow you to combine your built up strengths into a persona of choice, from the pacifistic healer to the wandering barbarian. Choices with consequence, multiple paths, immersion, actual companions with full personalities and character arcs!

Bethesda is sitting on my personal holy grail, and while I enjoyed Skyrim, it is Obsidian who has come closest to my dream with Fallout: New Vegas. And even then, why do these games have to give up the depth of choice of the old isometric games? I would good money for something with the depth of Divinity: Original Sin in Tamriel, and Bethesda has all the tools they need to do it already. That game has everything I could ask for in an RPG, except I do not like turn-based combat. I have enjoyed really good games in spite of turn-based combat, but it has never been my favourite design choice.

Heck, the modding community has done the most they can to try and fix the game mechanically, and there are some pretty basic ideas implemented which makes me wonder if anybody at Bethesda was actually considering the game's design as a whole when they were adding in the new mechanics. I mean, one of the most obvious things alone would be a perk tree for the damn Thu'um! Tying health upgrades to physical Strength! Stamina upgrades to movement speed and acrobatics! Not being able to be part of every guild at the same time! And actual quests! Even when limited in scope, some of the modded ones were more entertaining and thoughtful than a lot of the ones Bethesda put in vanilla Skyrim. If I don't want to do a Daedric lord's bidding, give me a choice besides just ignoring the quest!

I have modded Skyrim though, and I have had my fun, but I do wish a bit more thought would be put into the next Elder Scrolls game, and more importantly, the next Fallout game.
 

Mike Fang

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"If you put Skyrim in your top list of RPGs, you are literally a monster."

I've never played Skyrim, or even an Elder Scrolls game, and I think that's a fucking stupid thing to say. Why? Because while I'm sure Skyrim in reality doesn't meet either the pre-release hype it got or the fan hype many still give it, as long as the final version is bug free and technically competent, things like story quality, how good the gameplay is, and so forth is largely a matter of personal preference and opinion. There's no good reason to act like there's something wrong with praising a game that at least meets the standards expected of professionals and the gaming industry.

(P.S. I confess I've argued people's opinions before, but I've made an effort to not suggest opinions on things as innocuous as a piece of fiction says anything bad about them. I have, however, suggested certain trends in entertainment and supporting them could be a bad thing, though.)
 

Scorpid

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Me too I like Skyrim. I mean there is no other game I can think of that is like the Elder Scrolls games that aren't complete piles of poo like two worlds. Maybe Witcher 2 but I wouldn't count that. Though Witcher 3 they want to make it open world so maybe that.