Maybe its because they keep the interiors out of the main world, I think (I assume this because of the loadings when using doors, I cant really confirm on it)Scrustle said:
It would be a cool feature, and now that I think of it Fable had it lol
Skyrim: Why can't I bust this door down?
- Thread starter Lupus80
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It would be a cool feature, and now that I think of it Fable had it lol
you successfully bash the door in the game says grats and loads the next area while you get some slow mo door smashy scene?
then you get mauled by every npc in the place when you enter since breaking a door down is not exactly stealthy.
more choices were good look at fallout 1 and 2 how many different ways those games could be played, hell even how the dialogue shifted based on your int, village idiot to stephen hawking.
now days since games have to be voice acted that takes out the oh so simple branching text trees, games cannot do things so varied and fancy.
stripping out game mechanics is either lazy, or the engine cannot handle it period. since mods let you bash stuff and cast open lock spells then i chalk it up to laziness, maybe just not wanting to bother to add and extra flag or two to doors with values like str req to bash, or have flags that set bashable and unbashable doors.
then you get mauled by every npc in the place when you enter since breaking a door down is not exactly stealthy.
more choices were good look at fallout 1 and 2 how many different ways those games could be played, hell even how the dialogue shifted based on your int, village idiot to stephen hawking.
now days since games have to be voice acted that takes out the oh so simple branching text trees, games cannot do things so varied and fancy.
stripping out game mechanics is either lazy, or the engine cannot handle it period. since mods let you bash stuff and cast open lock spells then i chalk it up to laziness, maybe just not wanting to bother to add and extra flag or two to doors with values like str req to bash, or have flags that set bashable and unbashable doors.
You're probably right, although I don't think it would be impossible to still have the feature in. They could just replace the model for the door with one that looks like it's smashed up a bit, like it's had the lock ripped apart. I think they could do something like that and still not have to render what's on the other side of the door. It doesn't have to be completely disintegrated.josemlopes said:
I started with Morrowind and I'm surprised to learn you could bash a door down in Daggerfall. I miss the Open Locks spell but mostly I miss the trapped doors and chests. Sure they have pressure plates and stuff now but I still want the game to try harder to kill me.
You clearly played Morrowind and Oblivion. Was there ever any point in taking lockpicking in those games?Lupus80 said:
When magic can do everything you could possibly need to do, there's no point doing anything else. By making it so that magic cannot do everything, non-magic skill can now be worthwhile.
I really liked the lockpicking mini-game and how delicate you have to be with the hardest of locks.
Picks just instantly breaking though, that isn't at all realistic.
I would like the opportunity of "bugger this" if you have a two handed weapon. They take out the mighty axe or what not, and bash it down over 5-15 seconds. Which alerts everyone, but you get through.
Picks just instantly breaking though, that isn't at all realistic.
I would like the opportunity of "bugger this" if you have a two handed weapon. They take out the mighty axe or what not, and bash it down over 5-15 seconds. Which alerts everyone, but you get through.
This, it made the art of being a thief/battlemage/assassin/etc. so much more appealing than it is now! One of my favorite things to do in Daggerfall would be to get my jump as high as I could and stay on the roof of the buildings as I pick off guards... Made it even more fun when you had a high archery and really high sneak.nikki191 said:
I really don't get why they nerfed the options for breaking and entering... It fulfilled so many real life "heist" style fantasies with all the options... :-\
In those games, yes there was. In Morrowind specifically I'd always take the Tower Key so that I could gain access early off, from there it was then upping lockpicking as fast as you can to gain access to later game areas earlier off. I do see your point with the magic vs skill and the worthwhile argument, but even still if you were not a magic user you had one less option, and if you actually were trying to play as a thief or stealth character you only really had the ability of Tower Key or picking locks.evilthecat said:
I don't think that would make lockpicking completely useless. By bashing down a door, you're sacrificing subtlety (well obviously) and if you're playing as a stealth character, you sure as heck don't want that. Plus you can't just smash a locked chest, at least not without destroying what's inside.Twilight_guy said:
lol That reminds me of the very first time I played inFamous and a glitch caused me to die when I tried to beat up a dumpster. It made sense though considering Cole smashed his head against it. It would have been awesome if it wasn't just a freak thing I'd encountered and the designers had deliberately made that particular act of idiocy result in death.Garrett said:I prefer to not be able to bust the doors open than to be killed by said doors.
First time playing Fallout (or Fallout 2, don't remember), first city I came across, there are these locked doors (I'm pretty sure they are unopenable without a key). I'm trying to lockpick them and trying, and trying, and trying, I finally epic failed and broken the lock. I got pissed, put some brass knuckles and punched the door. I was knocked back, knocked unconcious and lost 12 hp.
The idea is that each archetype is supposed to have its strengths and weaknesses, they are trying to get rid of the view of the traditional three classes of the warrior, mage and thief. They want you to create you're own hybrid.
The issue is that the door bustin' ability would be factored into either your weapon skill or your health or stamina or whatever. All of these are skills that the thief would level up anyway as they progress, this makes the lockpicking skill redundant outside of hardcore RP circles.
Although the lack of the open lock spell is disappointing, typically I thought that the thief would pick the lock, the mage would magic the door open and the warrior would kill baddies for the key.
The issue is that there is so much overlap that it makes the harder/tedious option of lockpicking redundant.
The issue is that the door bustin' ability would be factored into either your weapon skill or your health or stamina or whatever. All of these are skills that the thief would level up anyway as they progress, this makes the lockpicking skill redundant outside of hardcore RP circles.
Although the lack of the open lock spell is disappointing, typically I thought that the thief would pick the lock, the mage would magic the door open and the warrior would kill baddies for the key.
The issue is that there is so much overlap that it makes the harder/tedious option of lockpicking redundant.
You on the computer? If so,there's a mod that allows you to bash open locks with one or two-handed weapons,with weapon skill requirements for harder locks. A Master lock needs level 60 Two-Handed,for example. It's on the Workshop and Nexus. If you're on a console,then I guess you're SoL.
I always liked the approach KOTOR took to opening chests. You can either pick it to get all the items or smash it open with a lightsaber or vibroblade but with a high chance of destroying some of the items in the chest. It placed value on the lockpicking skill, but gave all play styles the opportunity to gain access to locked away loot albeit with a penalty attached.
With Skyrim I agree you should be able to smash down at least wooden doors. If weapon deterioration was still applicable I'd say that maybe if you smash a door open with your weapon it loses 50% of it's strength or something, so that lockpicking still has some value. I think you need some sort of penalty for instantly breaking open a door or chest instead of investing in lockpicks. Open-lock spells should really exist in vanilla Skyrim. They should have just made them high level (expert maybe master) spells for mages.
With Skyrim I agree you should be able to smash down at least wooden doors. If weapon deterioration was still applicable I'd say that maybe if you smash a door open with your weapon it loses 50% of it's strength or something, so that lockpicking still has some value. I think you need some sort of penalty for instantly breaking open a door or chest instead of investing in lockpicks. Open-lock spells should really exist in vanilla Skyrim. They should have just made them high level (expert maybe master) spells for mages.
Okay. Unfortunately, you're not on the dev team. You weren't there when they were discussing mechanics and deciding how to set things up. You don't know which possible solutions they had or didn't have and why they used them or not. It's easy for an outsider to say "Well X is dumb, why didn't you do Y", but its different when you're on the inside. They could have made their decisions for very good reason or their logic could have been different from yours. In short, even if you don't think it was an issue it might have been for them and there is a chance that its more complex then just noting that they didn't do something.FootloosePhoenix said:
There are those that argue that having the ability to break down/open doors and chests would break the gameplay, and make lockpicking and spellcasting useless, but it is a matter of balancing pros and cons.
You could easily make it so that if you get your barbarian on and start smashing a door, there is a good chance you would alert enemies nearby. You could also damage your weapon, or activate any hidden traps (that would normally be deactivated with lockpicking or a spell). Also, taking a cue from KOTOR 2, smashing open chests could mean some of the items inside would be smashed and useless.
In terms of the Elder Scrolls series, which has a leveling up system tied to your skill use, you can simply make it that using brute force doesn't put up any relevant skills (although linking it with Two-Weapons is a clever idea). Thus if you go around breaking things open all the time it won't help you for leveling up.
You could easily make it so that if you get your barbarian on and start smashing a door, there is a good chance you would alert enemies nearby. You could also damage your weapon, or activate any hidden traps (that would normally be deactivated with lockpicking or a spell). Also, taking a cue from KOTOR 2, smashing open chests could mean some of the items inside would be smashed and useless.
In terms of the Elder Scrolls series, which has a leveling up system tied to your skill use, you can simply make it that using brute force doesn't put up any relevant skills (although linking it with Two-Weapons is a clever idea). Thus if you go around breaking things open all the time it won't help you for leveling up.
I actually kind of like the fact that you can interact with traps, with the possibility of see their mechanisms and such, to disarm them. It is a lot more cool than the typical "invisible traps" of old RPGs. Sure sometimes the traps might be a bit too noticable at times, but I love it when you can use them against enemies.Mariakko said:
I feel like the whole Elder Scrolls series is becoming just a very shallow RPG in general. Don't get me wrong, the games are fun, and thats what matters most, but if im looking for an RPG with plenty of choices, ways around obstacles, and character specialization, then the Skyrim is a bad choice. I hope for the next Elder Scrolls game, they bring back more of those deeper mechanics from the old games, especially since I really couldn't see them simplifying the game down anymore at this point.
Actually, I think that'd be two rolls: one for Use Rope, the other being a generic Dex check (maybe a Tumble/Balance check? idk.)Zantos said:
OT: The whole "not being able to Shout doors in" really bugged me, but I can see why they did it. If you can shout doors open, you'd in theory be able to bust through the barred doors blocking off all the loot in dungeons, completely circumventing the challenge that is supposed to stand between you and the loot. Of course, they could just do away with the circular paths and make you trek back through the dungeon to get out.
