"Snooty" Shooter Critics Anger Rage Dev

[draythefingerless]

Some of us are just absolutely SICK of the shooter dominated industry.

We're tired of all our old games getting turned into shooters.

We're tired of our old favorite genre's slowly vanishing.

You know what?

Apple pie is GREAT.

However I don't want to eat apple pie every day, and i'm sick of seeing more apple pie dominating the shelf space every time I want to eat pie. And slowly, that shelf portion devoted to non-apple pie is getting smaller, and I haven't seen a blueberry pie in ages.

make your own pie at home. unless you suck at cooking... then you can do what everyone does. use UT3 to make mods ^^

FPS is a simple mechanic people. it means first person shooter. thats all it is. aside from that, youll find a lot of variety within that mechanic. you got your RPG esque games like fallout n borderlands, you got your story driven ones, like bioshock. you got your military ones, you got your sci fi ones, you got your horror ones. you people need to learn not to look at it from such a small perspective. fuck, portal is one of the greatest games ever made(fuck you if you dont like it, try using your objective perspective for once and see what it did) and its an FPS.

 

[kebab4you]

stealth

I like id's old stuff better than their new stuff.

Same, back then they did innovate a whole lot, until they booted off John Romero...

I don't agree much with John Carmack and I can't remember him making a game worth playing since the nineties.

Well they have only made one games in the 21th century^^

 

[DazBurger]

I draw your attention to the following:

"That's still a proven formula that people like, and it's a mistake to [discount that]. As long as people are buying it, it means they're enjoying it," he said. "If they buy the next Call of Duty, it's because they loved the last one and they want more of it."

Replace Call of Duty with Transformers in that quote.

A lot of people enjoy the transformer-film.
Im willing to bet that the majority enjoyed them... Otherwise they wouldn't make any money.

And it makes perfect sense! Some people are just to up-tight to realize that they are in the minority.

 

[RA92]

FPS is a simple mechanic people. it means first person shooter. thats all it is. aside from that, youll find a lot of variety within that mechanic. you got your RPG esque games like fallout n borderlands, you got your story driven ones, like bioshock. you got your military ones, you got your sci fi ones, you got your horror ones. you people need to learn not to look at it from such a small perspective. fuck, portal is one of the greatest games ever made(fuck you if you dont like it, try using your objective perspective for once and see what it did) and its an FPS.

Agreed, there are good, unique, FPS titles - Portal, Amnesia, STALKER, Metro 2033, Mirror's Edge, Fallout: New Vegas (face it, no one plays it in third person camera), Carrier Command (shut up, it'll be good)... it's a criminal offense that they're so underrepresented in the FPS argument whenever an argument over this genre comes up.

Just because CoD sells a bajillion copies it doesn't mean military shooters are the only thing it has to offer. I'm going to say the same thing to big publishers who constantly try to go after CoD's sales.

I think we need to redefine this genre from First Person Shooter to simply First Person Perspective.

 

[ultimateownage]

He practically invented FPS's as we know it.

So did John Romero. He's still an idiot.

O.T. What Woodsey and General Knowledge said. This logic is just as faulty as the one he is against. There's nothing wrong with people wanting change and innovation. There's quite a lot wrong with not changing because 'Well that's making us money' and just assuming it doesn't need changing.

 

[Hungry Donner]

As a commentary on specific games I agree completely, there is nothing wrong with having games, movies, books, etc. that are simply meant to be entertaining. I read a lot of fiction and non-fiction which is thought-provoking and multi-layered, and I also have a large number of Preston-Child techno-thrillers; sometimes you need a break for the deep stuff.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

I was arguing against him, although I'll agree with him that the game's not very good. But yeah, the concept was intriguing and could certainly have been something.

You're slipping, there were at least 3 places in the above text where you could have expounded on your loathing of Obsidian and everything they've ever done and how you one day hope to hit Fergus Urqhart with your car.

 

[Woodsey]

I was arguing against him, although I'll agree with him that the game's not very good. But yeah, the concept was intriguing and could certainly have been something.

You're slipping, there were at least 3 places in the above text where you could have expounded on your loathing of Obsidian and everything they've ever done and how you one day hope to hit Fergus Urqhart with your car.

They have regained some favour after I quite enjoyed New Vegas. Other than that, I still think they should only be allowed to spitball ideas before handing them to another dev.

 

[Nimzabaat]

Game critics are becoming like movie critics; completely irrelevant to the consumers. I saw someone claim that Children of Eden was a "wondrous experience" or something like that. I saw demo footage of that game and as a gamer went "lame, next". I also asked "does this look good to anyone" and received crickets no response. There is a reason why the mainstream is the mainstream.

 

[Rooster Cogburn]

I think this is a waste of all our time. He obviously didn't put more than a moment's thought into this topic, and it's not clear exactly what he's trying to say. I do find myself wondering what exactly triggered this reaction (and it does seem like a reaction).

By this idiots logic, the Transformers movies are really bloody good.

Just seems like an easy way to dismiss negative feedback to me.

They are good movies.

They're not good artistic movies. They're very good blockbuster movies.

I don't like them, you don't like them. But they did exactly what they were supposed to do. Provide simple entertainment for the masses and lots of cash for the producers. It succeeded. It did good. It's a good movie. Just not the type of movie you're looking for.

It may have put asses in seats, but that doesn't mean it's a "good" or quality film. It may have achieved the goal set for it by it's creators, but that doesn't mean it isn't horrifying to behold. It's not a good movie, and definitely not based on that criteria.

I draw your attention to the following:

"That's still a proven formula that people like, and it's a mistake to [discount that]. As long as people are buying it, it means they're enjoying it," he said. "If they buy the next Call of Duty, it's because they loved the last one and they want more of it."

Replace Call of Duty with Transformers in that quote.

A lot of people enjoy the transformer-film.
Im willing to bet that the majority enjoyed them... Otherwise they wouldn't make any money.

And it makes perfect sense! Some people are just to up-tight to realize that they are in the minority.

What do I care if I'm in the minority? Transformers is still shit, no matter how many people like it.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

I was arguing against him, although I'll agree with him that the game's not very good. But yeah, the concept was intriguing and could certainly have been something.

You're slipping, there were at least 3 places in the above text where you could have expounded on your loathing of Obsidian and everything they've ever done and how you one day hope to hit Fergus Urqhart with your car.

They have regained some favour after I quite enjoyed New Vegas. Other than that, I still think they should only be allowed to spitball ideas before handing them to another dev.

I've enjoyed pretty much every game they've released except for one and consider most of them to be flawed gems.


OT: Want to know what the future of gaming would be without people like John Carmack? Imagine a human face hiding behind a chest high wall, for eternity.

 

[Laser Priest]

You can only enjoy something for so long.

If you are just served a slightly altered potato meal day after day, you're likely going to get sick of it soon, no matter how much you like potatoes.

Call of Duty is that potato.

 

[Hagi]

I think this is a waste of all our time. He obviously didn't put more than a moment's thought into this topic, and it's not clear exactly what he's trying to say. I do find myself wondering what exactly triggered this reaction (and it does seem like a reaction).

It may have put asses in seats, but that doesn't mean it's a "good" or quality film. It may have achieved the goal set for it by it's creators, but that doesn't mean it isn't horrifying to behold. It's not a good movie, and definitely not based on that criteria.

What do I care if I'm in the minority? Transformers is still shit, no matter how many people like it.

Because clearly you're the universal judge of quality. Subjectivity is for other people. You only make objective statements. You don't have an opinion, you have facts.

Hell, we should just make you president of the world already. Clearly you know better then everyone else. /sarcasm

No matter how arrogant you get, you don't get to decide what's good and what's not. A majority of people enjoyed the transformers. They saw something good in it. You're just too blind to see that something.

And no, I did not like the movies. But I still have enough respect for other people to not call their subjective opinions wrong. And I'm not so arrogant as to still call something bad when I'm incapable of seeing what's good about it but thousands of people do, instead I'm humble enough to admit that I might just be missing something and be at peace with that.

 

[Outright Villainy]

I'm certainly not going to dismiss a game out of popularity. I really liked Cod 4 after all. But a failure to innovate does cause stagnation, just as it does in any other medium. At this stage I've been completely burnt out on military shooters. I recently played Crysis 2, a well designed, highly polished shooter, which was far more open than the usual wave of Cod clones. And I still didn't enjoy it half as much as Mirror's Edge.

It wasn't on the principle that it was new, it was the fact that the freshness made me enjoy it more. I'm not basing it on an idealist philosophy where I like it because I should, new shit is just more fun.

 

[Booze Zombie]

It's funny, because from what I've seen this game does a lot of stuff differently to CoD and the more multiplayer focused contemporary shooting games. Especially the inclusion of crafting, an inventory and various genres being worked in there.

 

[Nokterne]

I'd actually rather shooters be tuned and polished to perfection than be innovative. Innovative always seems to translate to adding a whole bunch of gimmicky shit to your game.

 

[ltbigjohn]

i think he is trying to keep him and his friends employed, also i think he is trying to legitimize their laziness (but that could just be me). though i feel that the most important part of games is for them to be fun it pains me that games with such little innovation and with people that have small ideas get big money when i would much rather someone with really crazy exotic ideas would get that cash. I love my battlefield but they have made so many games that amount to the same thing i would go nuts if they made a first-person multiplayer where you... i don't know play as a crazy protohuman in a prehistoric landscape where in you must find various components of tools as you go along to make your weapons and hunt other proto-humans with different physical and mental abilities.

it's fine if you make first person anything but do something different than person behind gun and for the love of god give it another setting than something involving nato countries roughly between 1938 and 2011. eternal darkness explored the time of the american colonies, world war 1 and ancient cultures as well as a fire fighter in the gulf war why can't call of duty or battle field do something like these? has "duty" and "battlefields" only existed for 70ish years?

this might not be his problem specifically but there is a greater idea bucket out there that can use the same engines, graphics, control schemes, and over all hard ware but would be more interesting.

 

[Still Life]

Snip*

Anyone with general knowledge will acknowledge that COD is a solid game outside of its rabid popularity. You don't have to like it, but it doesn't change the fact that the game runs consistently and smoothly for the vast majority of gamers.

Of course, it's hip to bash anything popular these days and especially on these forums. Carmack makes a very valid point and acknowledges that innovation is great, but not always required for a fun gaming experience.

Though, you called him an 'idiot' which automatically renders your opinion void of credibility, stooping to unwarranted ad hominem. You can do better than that.

 

[Deathninja19]

It's not about the lack of innovation it's about the over-saturation.

There's just too many AAA FPSs out there, at least give us a third person shooter if you have to include guns just for some variety at least.

 

[DazBurger]

I draw your attention to the following:

"That's still a proven formula that people like, and it's a mistake to [discount that]. As long as people are buying it, it means they're enjoying it," he said. "If they buy the next Call of Duty, it's because they loved the last one and they want more of it."

Replace Call of Duty with Transformers in that quote.

A lot of people enjoy the transformer-film.
Im willing to bet that the majority enjoyed them... Otherwise they wouldn't make any money.

And it makes perfect sense! Some people are just to up-tight to realize that they are in the minority.

What do I care if I'm in the minority? Transformers is still shit, no matter how many people like it.

No, Transformers is a movie, not excrements.
And again, you may not like it, but that's your opinion, which you are entitled to.. Just don't force it onto others.