So that Witcher 3, eh?

[Casual Shinji]

For the record, I have no problem with DD. I even have it installed from PS+ and have been meaning to get to it, but the way Phoenix talks it up while bashing every game I love just makes me more and more reluctant to give it a shot.

You should though. It's certainly a diamond in the rough and it falters on various aspects, but what it does right it does better than most other games.

But the two games are very incomparable when it comes to combat. The Witcher 3 goes for a grounded swordsman type combat which works for a realistic setting, while the combat in Dragon's Dogma has a way more athletic flourish to it.

 

[Phoenixmgs_v1legacy]

-I already played Dragon's Dogma. Is it really too much to ask that other games in a genre take note of a game in their own genre doing something exceptionally well? You actually felt like you were fighting griffons, dragons, etc. in DD for the first time ever in gaming. I thought this is "next-gen", not worst than last-gen.

You see, I loved Dragon's Dogma but, whilst the combat was undoubtedly fluid and fun, it felt "arcadey". It lacked weight, it lacked purpose and I actually prefered The Witcher's 2 combat over DD for the overall feel in relation to the game.

DD felt like an arcade RPG, with combat to suit. Whereas TW2 felt like I had to plan ahead more, and be more thoughtful and precise with my decisions and actions in combat.

It's all down to tastes really, but I don't think DD style combat would suit a Witcher game. For me half of the essance of being a Witcher is knowledge, and preparing and co-ordinating yourself for and in fights with that knowledge. Kind of like how a carpenter makes sure he's the right tools and right approach for the job. It still has to be fun mind, but a DD approach to Witcher combat would just seem "off" IMO.

I'll be honest and say that, if it was myself designing the game, I'd have monsters that are impossible to kill without the right preperation and items (e.g. a certain potion to coat your sword or the monster doesn't take any damage. No matter how powerful you are or your level.

I think a DD approach could work great for a Witcher game, and I'm not saying Witcher should feel like DD's combat. What I loved about DD's combat was that you just didn't hack at a monster's chin until its health bar completely depleted like a Souls game. In DD, you would take down monsters in a way that made sense. In the Witcher griffon fight, you just hack at it until it's dead. A Witcher game could expand on DD in the sense that you need a potion to say get through a monster's thick hide to then be able to do damage with just your sword. I'd love for there to be like 2-3 strategies for taking out monsters (at least the bigger ones) and that you'd have to be prepared or you just can't win.

There are invincibility frames (or rather, frames with reduced damage) if you time it right and there's a specific skill in the skill tree for decreasing damage taken during dodging. My main gripe with the combat is the fact that every key press "locks in", making it impossible to take a new action until the first one completes, so if I hit attack by mistake I can't cancel the attack to roll out of the way or use a sign or whatever, which can get really punishing in tougher fights.

That skill, when maxed out, reduces 100% of damage while rolling, it basically makes your roll one giant invincibility button. It's pretty much a must have for more aggressive melee builds. You would think it would be the default state, but it would probably overpower non-melee builds as the invincibility window is huge with that skill maxed out.

That sounds really broken. I'm just asking for several frames of invincibility, not the whole freaking roll.

I am not doing this again. If you dont like the game this much, then why dont you just go replay Dragon's Dogma with it's weightless arcade combat and shitty Capcom writing? Clearly you seem to enjoy that more than any of the Witcher games for whatever god forsaken reason.

EDIT: For the record, I have no problem with DD. I even have it installed from PS+ and have been meaning to get to it, but the way Phoenix talks it up while bashing every game I love just makes me more and more reluctant to give it a shot.

Like 99% of games have shitty writing, I just go in assuming every game has shitty writing and anything decent will then be a surprise. Writing quality is the worst aspect of the gaming medium; when I want good writing, I go to a different medium. RPGs don't even need combat yet 99.9% of them heavily focus on combat for some reason. I'd like RPGs to have much less to even no combat so combat doesn't make or break the game because the writing should. But when you spend the majority of your game time doing X, X better be fucking good. DD is great because, unlike Dark Souls, you don't kill huge beasts just hacking at their chins until their health bar is depleted. How is it not awesome to be riding on a dragon's head while your mage summons a tornado? DD's writing sure is shit but there's not much story or dialogue and maybe only 1% of game time is spent listening to that shit.

 

[Adam Jensen_v1legacy]

That doesn't explain all those regular mooks wanting to pick a fight with you though, knowing full well what you are. I'm beginning to notice that a lot of quest based fights with soldiers or bandits starts with them bolstering how there's only one of you and a larger amount of them. If Witchers are this infamous and thought of as monsters, don't these guys know I have skirmishes like this for breakfast? You'd think they wouldn't wanna fuck with me on general principal. I don't know, it is the Middle Ages -- maybe these people really are that stupid.

No huge criticism, just a funny observation.

You assume that all people are reasonable. But they're not. People are incredibly stupid even today. There are idiots that don't shy away from trying to fight a professional boxer or MMA fighter or a Navy Seal. You'd think those people would know that some of them could kill them with one hand. Nope. Don't know, don't care. Testosterone and confidence mixed with ungodly stupidity is everywhere. Most of us here are clever geeks and we're simply not fully aware of how stupid people really are. Even I often make assumptions based on the idea that people would react reasonably to a situation, yet they hardly ever do.

 

[Casual Shinji]

You assume that all people are reasonable. But they're not. People are incredibly stupid even today. There are idiots that don't shy away from trying to fight a professional boxer or MMA fighter or a Navy Seal. You'd think those people would know that some of them could kill them with one hand. Nope. Don't know, don't care. Testosterone and confidence mixed with ungodly stupidity is everywhere. Most of us here are clever geeks and we're simply not fully aware of how stupid people really are. Even I often make assumptions based on the idea that people would react reasonably to a situation, yet they hardly ever do.

Yeah sure, but you'd think atleast a few mooks when confronted by a gnarly looking white-haired dude with glowing cat eyes and two swords strapped to his back would be like 'You know what... nope.'

 

[BloatedGuppy]

Yeah sure, but you'd think atleast a few mooks when confronted by a gnarly looking white-haired dude with glowing cat eyes and two swords strapped to his back would be like 'You know what... nope.'

I'd like it if mooks ran away after you bi-sected one or two of their companions. Much like they do in Shadows of Mordor.

Is a mild nitpick though.

 

[Casual Shinji]

Yeah sure, but you'd think atleast a few mooks when confronted by a gnarly looking white-haired dude with glowing cat eyes and two swords strapped to his back would be like 'You know what... nope.'

I'd like it if mooks ran away after you bi-sected one or two of their companions. Much like they do in Shadows of Mordor.

Is a mild nitpick though.

Yeah, but then you'd probably get annoyed what with your XP running for the hills. And then you'd feel like a dick for chasing down and killing helpless mooks just to get a few extra points of experience. Atleast that's how I imagine it'd go for me.

 

[Adam Jensen_v1legacy]

You assume that all people are reasonable. But they're not. People are incredibly stupid even today. There are idiots that don't shy away from trying to fight a professional boxer or MMA fighter or a Navy Seal. You'd think those people would know that some of them could kill them with one hand. Nope. Don't know, don't care. Testosterone and confidence mixed with ungodly stupidity is everywhere. Most of us here are clever geeks and we're simply not fully aware of how stupid people really are. Even I often make assumptions based on the idea that people would react reasonably to a situation, yet they hardly ever do.

Yeah sure, but you'd think atleast a few mooks when confronted by a gnarly looking white-haired dude with glowing cat eyes and two swords strapped to his back would be like 'You know what... nope.'

Some do. I ran across a couple of guys who tried "tax" Geralt for crossing the bridge. When Geralt educated them about who he was they backed off.

 

[Phoenixmgs_v1legacy]

snip.

The feeling of being ignored is terrible

Well, the average level of writing and depth of ALL media right now is shit. So my standards for games are the same as those of Literature

Also, guys, as I said. You wont reach a "victory" here. Too subjective.

You win if you accept STALKER as your lord and saviour though.

Writing has gotten better IMO. Almost all of my favorite TV shows are from 2000 and later. There's probably still the same % of crap as 90% of everything is crap but that 10% has more quantity than before. Video games barely have any competent writers let alone good ones coupled with that fact the almost all games are much more dependent on gameplay and the fact of how games are developed; levels first then have the writer try to link it all together somehow. Video games are way way worse in terms of writing compared to other mediums.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

Video games are way way worse in terms of writing compared to other mediums.

Of course they are. Video games have to allow for player input. Whenever the developers seize control of the narrative from the player sufficiently to tell moments of proper story with characterization/pacing/thematic heft, they usually get blasted by the gaming community for having shit interactivity and "not really being a game".

You can't do a 1:1 comparison of games to film, or television, or novels. They're not a passive medium. Closest comparable would be those old "Choose Your Own Adventure" books.

 

[Silverbeard]

Hell, I can sum up everything you really need to know in a couple of sentances: Geralt is hired to look for his surrogate daughter, who is Super Special and being hunted by damn near everyone who knows she exists. Meanwhile the Nilfguardians (aka 'The Black Ones', aka 'The Kinda Evil Empire') are waging war on the Northern Kingdoms (aka 'The Reds', think pre-unification Germanic states) and shit is getting messy.

One quick addition to your couple on sentences: The surrogate daughter is heir to the throne of Nilfgaard and thus has significant political value to those in the know about such things. And is also being chased by intergalactic slavers who can warp anywhere they wish and freeze the earth whenever they feel like it.

 

[Post Tenebrae Morte]

I hate it when people say that video games are worse in storytelling and writing than other mediums. There is so much that can be conveyed through visual actions rather than words or needing an explicit explnanation. Look at the legacy of Kain series: expertly written, wonderfully acted, and fun to play. Not to mention, a lot of japanese games have come around with great stories, like final fantasy 6 or tales of the abyss. Games are more than capable of telling a superb story that is well written.

 

[Post Tenebrae Morte]

I'd like to hear your thoughts on the legacy of Kain series marxie, if you ever have the time. I think you'd enjoy it.