Sony Wins Restraining Order Against Geohot

[samsonguy920]

With that judge tip-toeing around jurisdiction issues, I would have to think Hotz has had plenty of time to disappear anything that makes him even remotely culpable to any civil suit made by Sony.

I have a feeling this is going to be a no-win for Sony.

What sucks is after all of this or even before it is done, Sony is going to get all whiny and pissy and then screw everyone over with something over the top draconian to brick every PS3.
PlayStation 3 owners, disconnect your cables now before Sony acts. You'll be lucky to play Zork or Hangman on a system.

 

[Knight Templar]

Thats just bazzar.
Honestly, how can he get something back from the internet?

Sorry to grammar Nazi you, but its "bizzare", and second, I dont think they want anything back they are just trying to make his life hell.

Oh thanks. I've been playing Echo Bazaar lately so I just have it on the mind.

 

[samsonguy920]

So Sony is going after a guy who cracked their security? Shit they should ask him how he did it and develop something better off that, not go after him with a lawsuit.

That's part of the plea bargain.

Seriously, if more of the hackers were hired to work for Sony or MS, I believe that the system hacking would be a lot more difficult. That and the want to hack might also be eliminated (out of the box Linux ready PS3 anyone?).

Plea bargains don't apply to civil cases. Settlements might happen but I doubt either Sony or Hotz are up for any sort of compromise.

 

[Agiel7]

The thing I take issue with Geobot is releasing his jail-break to the public, then trying to wash his hands of any backlash by putting people on the honor system for not using it for purposes of piracy. That's like Razor1911 releasing cracks and expecting that 99% of the people downloading them are using the pirated games as demos and will eventually buy the full game.

As for jail-breaking the PS3, I'm totally ambivalent, as I'm a PC gamer to the core. I say if you want a completely open platform and don't have to deal with stuff like this, man up and get an affordable AMD quad-core and $150 mid-range GPU (you can get RAM for peanuts these days). We're almost past the age where computer hardware is restrictively expensive.

 

[Geekmaster]

Let's hope that Geo will learn that you can't just do whatever you want, consequences be damned, even if you remember to announce that you're certainly against any negative results your work may have.

 

[Xaryn Mar]

The thing I take issue with Geobot is releasing his jail-break to the public, then trying to wash his hands of any backlash by putting people on the honor system for not using it for purposes of piracy. That's like Razor1911 releasing cracks and expecting that 99% of the people downloading them are using the pirated games as demos and will eventually buy the full game.

Releasing it in the same way as research data is released? He could argue that he has released it as the result of research to be peer-reviewed although I doubt it will hold in court. A shame he wasn't employed by a university that specialise in digital research.

 

[HyenaThePirate]

On one hand, I can understand Sony's concern, and it is valid. Lets face it, even the most "honest" of people will take advantage to get something for "free" if the opportunity lands in their lap. You make it available, and a crap load of people are going to steal like stealing is some sort of holy duty.

On the other hand, I'm about sick of these sorts of draconian methods that businesses employ, bringing down their full weight and power on a person with NO chance of fighting back, and winning court cases solely on the fact that they have more money to throw around.

Because from what I can understand, that is what it seems things came down to. The judge didn't sound like their ruling was exactly "unbiased." Rather they sounded like "well I can't really agree with this, but I'm going to side with Sony because they have better lawyers and I'll just make up something to help it sound good."

I personally believe however that whatever product I PURCHASE with MY money is MINE. IF I want to modify the PS3 to flush my toilet when I poop, that's my prerogative. In all honesty, they should be more concerned with fixing the issues they do have or investing in better quality developers. Faffing around with some anti-hero isn't going to increase sales. How about lowering your freaking prices? Uncharted 1 should NOT still be sitting at damn near $40 used.
Ever since its launch, I've had a parade of little issues with Sony starting to stack up, and I'm pretty much adding my voice to those who wont be buying Sony again until Sony decides that improving its product's QUALITY before worrying about some minority of looters whose detriment is hard to quantify let alone prove with any hard evidence in numbers. Maybe a game didn't sell because it sucked, not because people pirated it.

 

[Weaver]

This is why old hackers used aliases online.

Anyways, I just detest the DMCA in general. If we applied DMCA logic to real life, it would be against the law to break into your own car if you locked the keys in it.

 

[Agiel7]

The thing I take issue with Geobot is releasing his jail-break to the public, then trying to wash his hands of any backlash by putting people on the honor system for not using it for purposes of piracy. That's like Razor1911 releasing cracks and expecting that 99% of the people downloading them are using the pirated games as demos and will eventually buy the full game.

Releasing it in the same way as research data is released? He could argue that he has released it as the result of research to be peer-reviewed although I doubt it will hold in court. A shame he wasn't employed by a university that specialise in digital research.

Part of my reasoning is that I fail to see what exactly there is to be gained from a jail-break like this; what is it that a PS3 does that's functionally superior to a computer, iPhone, Blackberry, or a particularly capable Internet-accessible phone? Apart from playing the games specifically developed for the PS3, natch.

The thing is that video game consoles are ostensibly a form of DRM metabolized into a form gamers at large accept over the truly draconian stuff on the PC like Ubisoft's DRM. You can make a much better case for the iPhone or an iPod Touch since they carry advantages over a desktop or even a full-on laptop/netbook. As for a video game console on the other hand, it's understandable that people are going to be much more cynical about what something like Geohot's hack means.

Consider that there's got to be a limit to what we do with something like game console, as ownership of data remains a fairly nebulous concept. For example, for all the virtues of free speech has, we draw the line at kiddie porn. And even if putting armed thugs in sweat shops and considering the workers as slaves makes total economic sense, even Milton Friedman wouldn't be 100% behind that.

 

[JDKJ]

With that judge tip-toeing around jurisdiction issues, I would have to think Hotz has had plenty of time to disappear anything that makes him even remotely culpable to any civil suit made by Sony.

I have a feeling this is going to be a no-win for Sony.

What sucks is after all of this or even before it is done, Sony is going to get all whiny and pissy and then screw everyone over with something over the top draconian to brick every PS3.
PlayStation 3 owners, disconnect your cables now before Sony acts. You'll be lucky to play Zork or Hangman on a system.

If he did wave his magic wand and make stuff disappear, he -- and his attorneys, if they were party -- could regret performing that magic act. There are rules against destroying relevant evidence once you've been sued or have knowledge that a suit is imminent. Besides, nothing's ever really irretrievably disappeared from a hard drive. Give a hard drive to any decent forensic technician and they can often make reappear that which had disappeared. If any disappearing act is discovered and brought to the attention of the Court along with a request for sanctions, it could result in an automatic win for the plaintiff. Courts don't take kindly to litigants who destroy evidence.

 

[JDKJ]

Geohot was hacking OtherOS to get access to the RSX, which Sony should have provided from the start (rather than blocking it out in 2.10), so Sony removes OtherOS, which screws over people who explicitly bought the PS3 for that feature. He then hacks it again to put OtherOS back.

That's total misuse of the DMCA, but it's not as if it's ever been used properly anyway.

Are you saying that because Sony removed the OtherOS feature from the PS3, that Hotz is justified in hacking it so he can reinstate the OtherOS feature? Is that some kinda "an eye for an eye" argument? If Sony removed a feature that purchasers relied on in making their purchase, then the remedy is to give Sony back its product, have them return the purchase price, and otherwise hold them accountable for false advertising or deceptive trade practice or something of the like. But there's no moral, ethical, or legal basis to violate the law and create your own remedy by hacking the product. That's just two wrongs (which never make a right).

 

[Cid Silverwing]

So Sony is going after a guy who cracked their security? Shit they should ask him how he did it and develop something better off that, not go after him with a lawsuit.

Shows how stupidly selfish corporate are these days.

 

[UberNoodle]

If only SOny would be honest about this. The same goes for Nintendo and Microsoft. The same goes for the MPAA who sue the makers of region free media players.

YOU ARE REALLY SUING FOR 'LOSS OF A CONTROL OVER A MARKET'. Can one sue for that? Well they can, if they manipulate clauses in copyright acts to change the focus from what the modifications in question ARE USED FOR to how they are MADE. Ok, so THEN they sue for the breach in copyright required to MAKE the modification, ie, the illigitimate use of keys and code.

But this is rubbish. These companies and organisations lobbied ... er ... I mean 'bribed', the US government for years to put such language into acts like DMCA. They made it look 'fair' by even claiming to make available, 'managed copies' in the DVD age. Um ... where were they? According to the DMCA, any technology that cracks content protection and even region protection codes is in violation because of the reason stated above.

It is sickening that such things be distorted as copyright infringment, put up there with ACTUAL examples of piracy. How can consumers be a criminalised in such a way?

 

[ECHO 062]

"it was appropriate to try the case in California, since Hotz lives in New Jersey and committed his alleged crime in that state. "Serious questions have been raised here today," Judge Susan Illston said at the time.
Those questions appear to be answered, at least for the moment. In a ruling made yesterday, the Judge declared that her court "may exercise specific jurisdiction over Hotz because he purposefully directed his activities at the forum state."

Am I missing something here? How is it that he can be tried in a State were he does not live, and where Sony (presumably, being a Japanese company) is not based? Surely that's not right? I don't get it. Surely he should be tried in the state where he lives, as if he hasn't broken any laws there, he hasn't done anything illegal?

 

[geekcj]

they took his toys....BASTARDS. They must be afraid he is going to hack the ngp before its release

 

[Void Droid]

What he did should have been perfectly legal. He owned the machine he modified.

If he did do it for himself then I doubt Sony would really care but he overstepped the line when he shared how it was done with others, when he went online and bragged about doing it, otherwise Sony would not even know about it, he got cocky and now he's in trouble for it.

If I sell someone a gun that I shouldn't have had access to in the first place and that person goes and shoots someone then while I didn't actually pull the trigger I still give that person a way to do harm. Common sense costs nothing.

 

[SurfKansas]

The only reason to jailbreak/root is to steal shit.

Really? The ONLY reason. Like, you have talked to every single person who has ever jail-broken a locked platform, and that's the only reason any of them have? Your powers of clairvoyance astound me.

 

[dsmops2003]

Lets hope he encrypted his data better than Sony did.

 

[utopaline]

What I really love is how Sony will complain that this hack is taking away from software sales and is the reason they are doing so poorly. Yet this has only happened recently and the PS3 has not been selling a lot of software. Hell the 360 has been hacked for years and they are still going strong.

Uto

 

[JDKJ]

"it was appropriate to try the case in California, since Hotz lives in New Jersey and committed his alleged crime in that state. "Serious questions have been raised here today," Judge Susan Illston said at the time.
Those questions appear to be answered, at least for the moment. In a ruling made yesterday, the Judge declared that her court "may exercise specific jurisdiction over Hotz because he purposefully directed his activities at the forum state."

Am I missing something here? How is it that he can be tried in a State were he does not live, and where Sony (presumably, being a Japanese company) is not based? Surely that's not right? I don't get it. Surely he should be tried in the state where he lives, as if he hasn't broken any laws there, he hasn't done anything illegal?

Sony Corporation (Japan) does business in the U.S. through a wholly-owned subsidiary, Sony Corporation America, a business registered under U.S. law and based in New York City . Sony Corporation America handles its PlayStation business through its wholly-owned subsidiary, Sony Computer Entertainment America (SCEA), a business registered under U.S. law and based in San Mateo County, California. It is SCEA, an American company, that's filed the suit against Hotz. Hotz, while a resident of New Jersey, allegedly engaged in conduct that caused SCEA injury in San Mateo County (and, arguably, all other places where Hotz published the circumvention information). Therefore, the Court has personal jurisdiction over Hotz in San Mateo County where SCEA filed its suit ((and, arguably, a court in any other place where Hotz published the circumvention information would also have personal jurisdiction). Voilà.

Any jurisdiction in which Hotz's allegedly injurious conduct occurred will have personal jurisdiction over him (and, when the injurious conduct is by way of posting stuff to the internet, that's all 50 States).