Spanish Judges Liken File Sharing to Lending Books

[Reverend Del]

While I see the sense in the judges ruling I also see sense in those that oppose it. However here's my opinion whether you want it or not.

The act of copying something you own and putting it on the internet is a crime by law. But if someone cloned their Aston Martin DB9 and offered it to you, would you say no?

The whole issue of piracy is related to capitalism, which western society agrees is the best solution for getting rich and feeding our collective greed. Not necessarily the best solution for having the best stuff made and certainly not the best solution to ensure that folks have equal access to basic medicines and foodstuffs, but hey folks get rich so it all works out. What if everything were free? And folks could make games because that's what they wanted to do? Would we complain that folks were copying their output then? No, of course we wouldn't.

But of course, everything isn't free. From the ground up everything costs something, so those that create deserve a cut of that payment, after all they need to eat too, right? But do these big game publishers need all that money? Do they need to live in large houses with expensive cars and even more expensive wives? Of course they don't. It's not a case of striving to be better either. It's a case of striving to have more than everyone else. It's greed. Plain and simple.

I don't condone the rampant piracy of new things in the society we live in now. I don't agree that it is stealing however. This ruling places the blame not on those that own the site, but on those that cloned the originals, and that is correct. No point shooting the messenger. Because someone else will only become said messenger. They need to stop the root cause, prevention not cure.

 

[MasterSplinter]

I'm truly surprised to be seeing so much positive reactions to this thing. I thought this place was full of anti-piracy people, given the kind of way most of you at the escapist forums speak (murderous rage driven insanity!!!(yes, with three exclamation signs)) when a game piracy news is out.

Surely it's more like multiplying books and handing them out? When you lend a book, you no longer have it until it's given back to you. File sharing is like reaching into a magic hat and pulling out infinite supplies of the same thing.

I agree. Friken hipsters judges want to make up reasons to believe it's ok to have that pirated Shakira CD hidden between the thick law books in their office.

But in all seriousness i think this is BS and it's still piracy.
Weather piracy is ok or not is not the topic at hand and i don't express opinions on it.

 

[TsunamiWombat]

Me Gusta. Viva la Spain, Viva la Juez!

 

[squid5580]

I hope some big wigs in the industries followed this case. And I hope they decide to end piracy since obviously they aren't going to find any legal help whatsoever. Just shut her down. Oh that big game you have been waiting for is set to be released next month? Haha not anymore. Maybe that would put an end to this piracy doesn't hurt anyone nonsense when it starts hurting all of us.

I don't like to insult people, so I won't, but I feel like I would be doing you a disservice if I didn't let you know that this post makes no sense.

First of all, no "bigwig" wants piracy, you've heard of DRM right? (you can't really use this site without hearing about it constantly) that's them trying to end it.

Secondly, if they prevented piracy by not releasing games anymore, how would that be beneficial to them? They'd be saying "HAHA! No more piracy....wait...FUCK! WE HAVE NO SOURCE OF INCOME ANYMORE!!!"

Your solution is akin to ending AIDS by blowing up the Earth, sure it ends it, but it destroys everything that made it relevant, and caused a much more massive problem than it solved.

I am well aware of how that would play out. I know that you would be cutting of the leg in hopes of saving the toe. I also know it would never happen. I just find it somewhat depressing that this is the only hope they have left of ending piracy. And frankly incorporating ridiculous DRMs is not doing them much more good than just closing the doors down. Just look what it has done to Ubisoft's reputation.

Or they could just live with the fact that some Piracy is going to happen, and stop making DRM that DRIVES PEOPLE TO PIRACY! Thus raising their profits by cutting out an expensive piece of development while simultaneously lowering piracy rates.

Why should they have to live with it? Why are they not being afforded any legal protection? Why is everyone else safe but games are thrown to the wolves and it is ok?

 

[The Grim Ace]

I'm happy I speak Spanish, since, it's time I move to sunny Valencia.

 

[JWAN]

hmmmm.... except you get the book back if your lending it... you dont distribute it to the masses for free

 

[JWAN]

FUCK YEAH!! Finally someone standing up for what's right, about god damn time! Someone tell me where these guys live, I want to go repaint their houses, inside and out, in any color they want, all on my own dime.

sooo... let me get this: whats right is whenever someone create something that can be converted to digital media, he should be denied any reward for his/her effort?

how do you expect developers to create games/digital tools/etc anymore if this is the way the world will become?

the general idea of piracy is ok: information you dont have access to (because of either lack of money/geological boundaries/lack of time) becomes accessable, in a lesser state than the original material. fine. but what if all pirated information becomes top quality? we would reach a halt in technological development. just look at the blow pc-gaming have suffered, with all the DMRs.

the problem is that when piracy becomes so accessible its easier to DL a movie than actually go down to the shop and pick it up FOR FREE, weve reached a point were society will start to enter a depression. im all for being able to download stuff, but what you download should either be:
-of worse quality than the product you pay for
-be a real hassle getting a hold on

as long as at least one of these apply, piracy wont be a HUGE problem. the moment we reach a point where none of these applies, we should start banning piracy, big time. and were closing in fast on that point...

Get it out of your god damn head right now that piracy = loss of sale, cause that's a lie, most pirates either A)don't have the money to buy the game, or the game is a known piece of shite they intend to give to their child (any of those 20 dollar princess type games for the DS) or B) only intend to test teh game for a time before deciding if it is crap or good enough to buy. I'm a pirate, and I only pirate DS games, but I also talk about the games I play on forums and stuff so as to advertise the games I felt were good enough to talk about, shit will be left in the dust and good games will be spoken of, I talked to several people about the game Dementium 2 and at least five people I mentioned it to shown a real interest in playing it, they not being pirates themselves would have to buy the game, therefore I generated a potential 5 sales to people who had never eve heard of it. Piracy could be a really good thing. Also pokemon platinum has been downloaded at least 400,000 times on this one site I go to, but it has sold millions world wide, do you really think that the 400,000 really affected the total outcome? How many kids probably bought the game release day anyways even though they could have gotten it for free hours later? Fact, gaming industries are lying assholes who want you to think that piracy is going to ruin them, also fact, they are trying to pay their own incredibly huge wages while producing products that are normally sub par at best.
Also what if I miss one of those shows on like fox that they only play once and then you have to wait for reruns in about two years, is piracy so bad then?

If one person buys the game for $50 and distributes it for free to 10 people how much money is earned?

 

[aegios187]

I am pretty surprised at all the applauding of this decision. Piracy is not a victimless crime, it's not just large corporations with intellectual property, patents, etc. Small businesses and individuals also can be impacted. In this instance, it's going to be niche software makers, indie developers etc that get hurt the most.

Just because you weren't going to buy it or believe that it's not good enough to pay for doesn't give you any sort of right to obtain it or distribute it without due compensation to the creator. I don't see how you can justify it otherwise.

 

[esperandote]

I disagree, with books and any other physical media there's a limit on how much you can lend stuff, once at a time and for a defined period of time until you lose the item.

On the other hand, whoever that hasn't pirated stuff throw the first rock.

 

[Billion Backs]

I truly respect anyone who stands by these words.

I doubt it will matter too much, but still, a legal precedent is a legal precedent.

 

[JWAN]

FUCK YEAH!! Finally someone standing up for what's right, about god damn time! Someone tell me where these guys live, I want to go repaint their houses, inside and out, in any color they want, all on my own dime.

sooo... let me get this: whats right is whenever someone create something that can be converted to digital media, he should be denied any reward for his/her effort?

how do you expect developers to create games/digital tools/etc anymore if this is the way the world will become?

the general idea of piracy is ok: information you dont have access to (because of either lack of money/geological boundaries/lack of time) becomes accessable, in a lesser state than the original material. fine. but what if all pirated information becomes top quality? we would reach a halt in technological development. just look at the blow pc-gaming have suffered, with all the DMRs.

the problem is that when piracy becomes so accessible its easier to DL a movie than actually go down to the shop and pick it up FOR FREE, weve reached a point were society will start to enter a depression. im all for being able to download stuff, but what you download should either be:
-of worse quality than the product you pay for
-be a real hassle getting a hold on

as long as at least one of these apply, piracy wont be a HUGE problem. the moment we reach a point where none of these applies, we should start banning piracy, big time. and were closing in fast on that point...

Get it out of your god damn head right now that piracy = loss of sale, cause that's a lie, most pirates either A)don't have the money to buy the game, or the game is a known piece of shite they intend to give to their child (any of those 20 dollar princess type games for the DS) or B) only intend to test teh game for a time before deciding if it is crap or good enough to buy. I'm a pirate, and I only pirate DS games, but I also talk about the games I play on forums and stuff so as to advertise the games I felt were good enough to talk about, shit will be left in the dust and good games will be spoken of, I talked to several people about the game Dementium 2 and at least five people I mentioned it to shown a real interest in playing it, they not being pirates themselves would have to buy the game, therefore I generated a potential 5 sales to people who had never eve heard of it. Piracy could be a really good thing. Also pokemon platinum has been downloaded at least 400,000 times on this one site I go to, but it has sold millions world wide, do you really think that the 400,000 really affected the total outcome? How many kids probably bought the game release day anyways even though they could have gotten it for free hours later? Fact, gaming industries are lying assholes who want you to think that piracy is going to ruin them, also fact, they are trying to pay their own incredibly huge wages while producing products that are normally sub par at best.
Also what if I miss one of those shows on like fox that they only play once and then you have to wait for reruns in about two years, is piracy so bad then?

If one person buys the game for $50 and distributes it for free to 10 people how much money is earned?

If the 10 people recommend it to 5 friends a piece who are not pirates and who like to buy the same type of games they do for $50 each, how much more money has been made? See my logic?

No, because your hoping that the twats who illegally downloaded it arent going to just pass it to their "friends" themselves and make there "friends" buy the game.

 

[JWAN]

FUCK YEAH!! Finally someone standing up for what's right, about god damn time! Someone tell me where these guys live, I want to go repaint their houses, inside and out, in any color they want, all on my own dime.

sooo... let me get this: whats right is whenever someone create something that can be converted to digital media, he should be denied any reward for his/her effort?

how do you expect developers to create games/digital tools/etc anymore if this is the way the world will become?

the general idea of piracy is ok: information you dont have access to (because of either lack of money/geological boundaries/lack of time) becomes accessable, in a lesser state than the original material. fine. but what if all pirated information becomes top quality? we would reach a halt in technological development. just look at the blow pc-gaming have suffered, with all the DMRs.

the problem is that when piracy becomes so accessible its easier to DL a movie than actually go down to the shop and pick it up FOR FREE, weve reached a point were society will start to enter a depression. im all for being able to download stuff, but what you download should either be:
-of worse quality than the product you pay for
-be a real hassle getting a hold on

as long as at least one of these apply, piracy wont be a HUGE problem. the moment we reach a point where none of these applies, we should start banning piracy, big time. and were closing in fast on that point...

Get it out of your god damn head right now that piracy = loss of sale, cause that's a lie, most pirates either A)don't have the money to buy the game, or the game is a known piece of shite they intend to give to their child (any of those 20 dollar princess type games for the DS) or B) only intend to test teh game for a time before deciding if it is crap or good enough to buy. I'm a pirate, and I only pirate DS games, but I also talk about the games I play on forums and stuff so as to advertise the games I felt were good enough to talk about, shit will be left in the dust and good games will be spoken of, I talked to several people about the game Dementium 2 and at least five people I mentioned it to shown a real interest in playing it, they not being pirates themselves would have to buy the game, therefore I generated a potential 5 sales to people who had never eve heard of it. Piracy could be a really good thing. Also pokemon platinum has been downloaded at least 400,000 times on this one site I go to, but it has sold millions world wide, do you really think that the 400,000 really affected the total outcome? How many kids probably bought the game release day anyways even though they could have gotten it for free hours later? Fact, gaming industries are lying assholes who want you to think that piracy is going to ruin them, also fact, they are trying to pay their own incredibly huge wages while producing products that are normally sub par at best.
Also what if I miss one of those shows on like fox that they only play once and then you have to wait for reruns in about two years, is piracy so bad then?

If one person buys the game for $50 and distributes it for free to 10 people how much money is earned?

If the 10 people recommend it to 5 friends a piece who are not pirates and who like to buy the same type of games they do for $50 each, how much more money has been made? See my logic?

No, because your hoping that the twats who illegally downloaded it arent going to just pass it to their "friends" themselves and make there "friends" buy the game.

and I'm calling done, I'm done with this thread, attempting to convince you people that anti piracy is stupid and many copy right laws along with it is like attempting to convince people that lolicon hentai isn't pedophillia, you've been fucked with by the media into thinking whatever they want you to think and you can enjoy baaaaaing you single minded BS without free thinking opposers like me saying much any more, it doesn't matter, what you think, and what they do, people will pirate, and that's all there is to it, discussion is pointless. farewell.

Victory for the non pirates.

If you dont pay $$$ then no money is earned. Its like having someone break into a warehouse and stealing stuff then telling people about how great that stuff is and how easy it is to steal and expecting the person(s) to pay. Stealing is stealing.

 

[JWAN]

I disagree, with books and any other physical media there's a limit on how much you can lend stuff, once at a time and for a defined period of time until you lose the item.

On the other hand, whoever that hasn't pirated stuff throw the first rock.

^this, there's a difference between letting a few friends friends borrow a book and printing off copies and distributing it for free.

 

[Kanodin0]

Why should they have to live with it? Why are they not being afforded any legal protection? Why is everyone else safe but games are thrown to the wolves and it is ok?

I believe it's the same problem the music industry faces actually. It's a matter of enforcement being unfeasible. There are hundreds of thousands of small time pirates out there, and the police simply don't have time to go after them for a petty crime with so many more pressing matters at hand. That leaves the option of going after the cracking groups themselves, but they tend to be highly secretive, disjointed from one another, and skilled at hiding their identity online. Thus they have recently tried going after the owners of the torrenting sites as a last resort, like in this case, but those people are not technically breaking the law themselves.

One could make the argument that they are accomplices, but to do that you would have to have someone else to prosecute who they are the accomplice of and that leads us back to the other problems.

 

[GoodApprentice]

You have all been put on probation!

 

[joshthor]

I personally agree that the sites founders should not be punished. however, i do not liken piracy to book or movie sharing. with sharing, there is one copy that can only be used by one person at a time. but with file sharing, that one copy gets split into millions of copies that anyone can use at any time.

overall though i agree with the ruling. companies, expecially music and movie companies, have to figure out a new way to get people to pay for thier stuff. be it cheaper prices, subscription plans, or whatnot.