Steam Gets Civilized

Anibalbox

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Nov 23, 2009
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I think that some kind of security is going to be included in the game. So, if that security is a program which also brings some interesting stuff in it (as opposed to only controlling you), i think the choice is pretty simple. Of course, it could not contain any kind of security, but let's face it, we are not in wonderland...

I live in Argentina and I had never bought a single original game (CD)in my entire gaming life (except for nintendo's family game, Super Nintendo, and Sega Genesis, which used cartridges), and I have had PS, PS2, and PC for the past 10 years. Steam was so cheap and so convenient for playing online, that I have already got 5 games since mid-2009, after i got the Orange Box 30 bucks deal.

So, Valve has made quite a deal by reaching out to some other market segment. At least i give them credit for that. In addition, the new Steam is awsome. That coming from a person who is reluctant to change...
 

Morgan3rd

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Mar 16, 2010
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I am of the opinion that for as long as Valve stays privately owned, and the current management is in charge (Gabe Newell and crew), Valve is going to remain fairly ethical. And in 10-15 years I doubt I'll have that much time to game anyways.
 

zakski

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Mar 24, 2009
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The problem is not with steam itself, but steamworks, the idea of buying a brick and mortar game, then having to connect to the internet to download it, instead of installing from the disc is silly.
 

DeASplode

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Nov 26, 2009
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For the moment Steam is my preffered option as a DRM. I usually pick up games from the store because of their sales. As well as "stocking" games that have long left shop shelves.

Since the new UI update, Steam has been alot more stable for me.

There are some gripes I can understand like installing a game via disk and then having Steam download a large patch which usually doesn't allow you to play the game until it is fully patched.
But I've been using Steam for about 6 years now. So I guess I'm just used to it.
 

Gunner 51

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Jun 21, 2009
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Straying Bullet said:
Well, I already owned an EA account so for me, it didn't really bothered me concerning to log in. However, afterwards I can access all my DLC whilst being offline. Assassins Creed 2, no trouble whilst being offline.

However, I stay clear from Activision, haven't bought a product in YEARS from them. Microsoft Gaming Studios has my faith in them still. Mass Effect and Dragon Age are my recent EA purchases. I just make sure my 360 won't suffer from DRM crap before I buy the game.

I just hope DRM doesn't get implented into consoles like it has done on the PC's.
I don't think DRM will be as bad on the consoles as it is on PCs for a while yet. It's a lot harder to pirate console based stuff than it is on the PC, plus I get the impression every time you connect to Live, someone on their end is checking what version of the game you use and if it's legitimate or not. (But I could be wrong on this.)

Though much like you, I tend to avoid Activision where I can help it. Though I did lapse on Modern Warfare 2. (Shame on me.)
 

laserwulf

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Dec 30, 2007
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How about us soldiers who are over in Iraq/Afghanistan/etc.? I had nothing -but- disposable income for a couple years, access to amazon.com, but nowhere to get my personal laptop online. Any game the requires online activation is useless to deployed soldiers, and online retailers do not always indicate when a game requires it. Just because you personally aren't affected by a limitation doesn't mean that it's irrelevant.

I wish more developers took the path of Epic when UT3 came out on Steam. I had already bought a physical copy (I was young & foolish), and was able to enter in my CD key into Steam. Now I can pull out the disk OR fire up Steam if I feel like reinstalling UT3.

Giving customers the option of Steam/not just makes sense if there are going to be physical disks in the first place, and moreso for games like Civ where not everyone will play multiplayer.
 

Th37thTrump3t

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Nov 12, 2009
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Meh... I like Steam. It's a way to keep track of my games without having billions of icons on my desktop (which to me is extremely annoying). I also like this DRM system better than most other games (you can always play in OFFLINE MODE!!!). So I guess to all those whiny little Steam haters out there GTF over it!!!
 

Cartographer

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Jun 1, 2009
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halo3rulzer said:
Meh... I like Steam. It's a way to keep track of my games without having billions of icons on my desktop (which to me is extremely annoying). I also like this DRM system better than most other games (you can always play in OFFLINE MODE!!!). So I guess to all those whiny little Steam haters out there GTF over it!!!
I guess, as a substitute for any sort of computer literacy, Steam organising your games for you (a task Windows does anyway, but should you wish it, can be accomplished in seconds all by yourself) could be seen as a plus.

Offline mode still means you have Steam on your system though, and it is still spyware in that it tracks you gaming habits, system info etc. and sends it on to someone else without your knowing.

Also, nice attempt at an ad hominem attack on anyone who doesn't like Steam (though FYI multiple exclamation marks do not add any extra emphasis to your point, they just make it look like you know nothing about punctuation).
 

Mistwraithe

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Mar 23, 2008
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piscian said:
I've never once in 5 years experienced any steam bugs that required more than a reinstall at worse.
We might have a different definition of "problems" if you don't require having to reinstall Steam as a problem. It is true that if you set the bar low enough then Steam is absolutely trouble free... but that requires setting the bar well below floor level!

Frankly Steam is fine for some games where there are a clear benefits to outweigh the hassle. However I really question what that clear benefit is for something like Civ 5.
 

Phanixis

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May 6, 2010
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I to dislike Steam. This might be because the only Steam games I own I purchased retail, and I have had little interest in making use of Steam's other features. Thus, Steam has proved nothing more than a nuisance, and additional program I have to fuss around with to get the games I purchased to work properly. These are the grievances I have against Steam.

1.)It takes control away from the end user - I like to run my computer I my own terms. I want to decide where my programs are installed, what features they are installed if, if they are patched(and then I liked to patch from downloaded .zip and .exe stored on my hard disk), how it runs, etc. and I definitely don't want to log into the publisher's server to verify if I am using their product properly. Steam decides were the program will be installed, and must be active in the background for the program to run. And although their are workarounds, initially its going to try to log onto the internet and patch everything whenever I try to run my Steam games.

2.)You can only install games to one drive - Maybe this isn't true, but I never found a work around for this problem. I have multiple hard drives and hard drive partitions. Should the partition Steam was installed on be full, I can't install Steam programs to another hard drive with empty space. I either need to uninstall Steam, along with every Steam program currently installed, and then reinstall everything to a different drive, or uninstall some other programs sharing the partition with Steam, and reintall them if I want to use them. This is a unnecessary annoyance.

3.)Installing from a DVD is faster and more reliable that the internet - Not much to say here, other than not all internet connections are fast, and downloads can be easily interrupted or timed out.

4.)It takes time to log onto Steam and Install Updates - I have shared other users frustrations as Steam has occasionally taken considerable time to authenticate and load. The client then has to patch. If the program hasn't been used in a while, this takes time. The all loaded Steam programs will patch, unless this has been disabled. Probably not a deal breaker, but again an annoyance.

5.)Steam Breaks - This is true with virtually all software. Unlike Consoles, there are a virtually endless variety of PCs. PCs have an endless number hardware configurations, using different motherboards, processors, memory, hard disk, video cards, ethernet adapters, which are developed by hundreds of independent manufacturers. Then their are numerous operating systems that can be installed on the PC, along with dozens of different drivers of varying origin and version for the hardware components. On top of that you will have background services such and virus scanners that influence how the PC will act with other programs. So while some may absolutely no problems with the service, expect a lot of people to devote considerable time to corrected Steam specific technical issues, and yet others to have a nightmarish time getting the program to work. I have had all sorts of technical problems with Steam, although I was eventually able to fix it by uninstalling, cleaning the registry, reinstalling and then patching. Still, it took several hours to troubleshoot(including trying to get Steam to patch to only watch the installer hang), hours which I could be devoted to playing a game, or ranting about stuff on internet forums.

6.)It serves little or no benefit when only used to install retail software - This is were the hate comes down to. The above problems may be tolerable when you are using other features, but if all you wanted to do was play a game you just purchased in a store, its just this vestigial that serves no other purpose than get in the way of playing a game. As such, it will be appreciated about is much as an intentionally design bug to players who using it only for its DRM functions(or rather, who are FORCED to use it for its DRM functions).

7.)Its not exactly advertised on retail boxes - This compounds the other problems. The "needs Steam to play" requirement will be located in the fine print in the corner of the box, so buyer beware. Individuals purchasing a retail copy hoping to just pop and DVD in the drive and install will be unpleasantly surprised when it instead tries to install Steam if they glossed over the system requirements. Would of been nice of valve to make this little fact a bit more prominent on the box.

That is enough ranting for today.
 

Ayjona

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Jul 14, 2008
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I've missed out on most of the drama (which is strange, considering Civ V is one of the few games I've ever hyped about and looked forward to, even more so than with Civ IV ;-) ), so perhaps you fellow escapists can help me out with this query: Will Civ V not be sold in a retail box at all? (I'll most probably buy it via Steam anyways, since I've always preferred online distribution, bu no retail Civ V does sound like something that might aggravate some fans).
 

Blackbird71

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May 22, 2009
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Fenixius said:
Blackbird71 said:
...and I sleep well knowing that I truly own all of my games.
So you own literally zero games which have any kind of online DRM? No games with Securom, no games with UPlay, no games with Games For Windows Live, no games with Starforce, no games with ANY online check of any kind?
Correct.

If that's the case, congratulations to you, sir, but I'd then contend that you're not the sort of person who plays popular or big-name videogames. Which is fine, but doesn't really work for most people on this website.
Correct again, for the most part. I do occasionally play a "big-name" game (although it has been a while), but I'm not the sort who feels I have to play every "big-name" out there just because it is a "big-name." I am very selective about the games I play, as my time and funds are limited. Honestly, most of the "big-name videogames" are so much hyped-up crap, that they are easy to avoid. There are occasional gems, and when possible, I pick these up, but as online activation systems become increasingly wisespread, I find myself with fewer and fewer options among the big titles. However, if missing out on a popular title is the price for peace of mind and maintaining my ownership rights, so be it. I still find myself with more games to play than I have time to play them, so as far as I'm concerned, I haven't lost a thing. If that ever changes, I may have to find another hobby, but hopefully consumer rights legislation will be updated to handle these issues before it gets that far out of hand.
 

Delusibeta

Reachin' out...
Mar 7, 2010
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Ayjona said:
I've missed out on most of the drama (which is strange, considering Civ V is one of the few games I've ever hyped about and looked forward to, even more so than with Civ IV ;-) ), so perhaps you fellow escapists can help me out with this query: Will Civ V not be sold in a retail box at all? (I'll most probably buy it via Steam anyways, since I've always preferred online distribution, bu no retail Civ V does sound like something that might aggravate some fans).
That seems to be the most popular misconception doing the rounds with the news. There will be a retail box for Civ V. The disc in the box will require you to install Steam in order to play the game. Like pretty much every Steamworks retail game ever[footnote]well, except for UT3. But then again Steamworks was only implemented a couple of years after launch.[/footnote]. It will also demand an internet connection to install (like every other Steamworks retail game).

To muddy the waters, Steam is selling an "exclusive Limited Edition" which contains the Babylonian civ, and if you pre-order from Steam you get a bonus map. It's likely both will be sold for £1.50 a pop DLC six months down the line.
 

Cartographer

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Jun 1, 2009
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Delusibeta said:
Ayjona said:
I've missed out on most of the drama (which is strange, considering Civ V is one of the few games I've ever hyped about and looked forward to, even more so than with Civ IV ;-) ), so perhaps you fellow escapists can help me out with this query: Will Civ V not be sold in a retail box at all? (I'll most probably buy it via Steam anyways, since I've always preferred online distribution, bu no retail Civ V does sound like something that might aggravate some fans).
That seems to be the most popular misconception doing the rounds with the news. There will be a retail box for Civ V. The disc in the box will require you to install Steam in order to play the game. Like pretty much every Steamworks retail game ever. It will also demand an internet connection to install (like every other Steamworks retail game).

To muddy the waters, Steam is selling an "exclusive Limited Edition" which contains the Babylonian civ, and if you pre-order from Steam you get a bonus map. It's likely both will be sold for £1.50 a pop DLC six months down the line.
Just one further clarification, given that it is Steamworks, it's quite possible that upon inserting the disc, it'll install Steam then download the game rather than install if from the disc.

Oh, and don't get Civ fans started on the £10 extra for one leader (when you get the basic 18 for £30) and a map/scenario (presumably, the soundtrack will be in the game files somewhere, so can be easily copied out, you "own" a copy already).
 

Vigormortis

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Nov 21, 2007
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Mistwraithe said:
Vigormortis said:
snip
A couple of counter-points here.

First, you say you've not purchased anything on Steam for quite some time. It's hard for one to validate a point of view no something when they haven't technically used it lately.

Second, I've heard Valve state that, t'were they to ever go out of business, they would provide full downloads for all of their games to every player. After, of course, letting everyone know they were going to have to close down the content servers.

The other thing to consider is, does it really matter if you can't access your old games years later? Think about it. How many "old" games still work on your current PC, without having to create dual-boot options or saving an older machine with dated hardware? Besides, I'd rather have an old game on Steam where it's more likely I'll be able to get an automatic, free update that'll make the game compatible with newer hardware or OS's.

Third, while some games are digital only, most games you can get on Steam you can get on disc in a store.

I agree that Steam was buggy as hell when it first launched, and stayed buggy for years. However, it has since matured into the definitive digital-distribution system that every other should emulate. Is it perfect? No, of course not. Do bugs pop up from time to time? Sure. Happens to all software. But the true test of a developer is how quickly they can respond to and fix said bugs. Valve's response time has become extremely fast in recent years. There was a huge bug recently to the new UI. Within 24 hours Valve found the problem, programmed a huge patch, and released it to the masses.

It's not a perfect system, but it's benefits FAR outweigh it's drawbacks.
 

SimuLord

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Aug 20, 2008
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Steamworks has proven to be a boon to any game that's contained it. I was a longtime Steam holdout---didn't see what it could offer me because I only play singleplayer and I'm not keen on DRM.

Then I bit the bullet when I bought Empire: Total War. And I fell in love. Even converted a fair chunk of my old games to Steam at $5 or $10 a pop just so I wouldn't have to lug the discs around when I traveled with my laptop.

I'm with Seamus about not wanting to see a company grab a virtual monopoly in anything, but Gabe Newell was a Microsoft guy. He knows a thing or two about reading the market and using that market's needs and perceptions to create a monopolistic brand. He also knows the hazard of giving your enemy an opening---he watched the Vista and IE7 debacles giving market openings to Apple and Mozilla, I'm sure.