Super Smash Creator Thinks Melee Was Too Hard

[Sach]

I'm not the only one who thought one on one at Final Destination with no items was the most fun, right?

Yeah, you pretty much are. It's boring.

No you're not. Don't listen to him/her.

It's boring. I loved Brawl because of the Super Smashes. It caused massive 4 man wrecking sprees whenever it appeared, and that was just fighting to see who would get it. And every smash in the game was avoidable, so it wasn't as cheap as some would make it.

The people who hate items on wacky maps are the people who are up 5 lives to 1 when their opponent got a few pokeballs, fought back, and won. Then they showed their "skill" by eliminating the factor they think cost them the game.

We're obviously playing the game for two different reasons. You may prefer the random chaos but my friends and I enjoy a fair challenge. I'm not judging, the game suits both kinds. I'm just saying that we find different things things entertaining.

 

[DustyDrB]

People play with no items, restricting characters, and Final Destination only? Yeesh. Why are you even playing Brawl? Just go and find some other more generic fighter. I'll be over here having fun. Hammer time.

The only thing I don't like about Brawl is that you have to unlock characters. People didn't get the game to play Subspace Emissary.

 

[samaugsch]

I'm not the only one who thought one on one at Final Destination with no items was the most fun, right?

Yeah, you pretty much are. It's boring.

No you're not. Don't listen to him/her.

It's boring. I loved Brawl because of the Super Smashes. It caused massive 4 man wrecking sprees whenever it appeared, and that was just fighting to see who would get it. And every smash in the game was avoidable, so it wasn't as cheap as some would make it.

The people who hate items on wacky maps are the people who are up 5 lives to 1 when their opponent got a few pokeballs, fought back, and won. Then they showed their "skill" by eliminating the factor they think cost them the game.

Actually, there were several unavoidable final smashes. Most of the time, it depends on the stage. However, Captain Olimar's smash is almost completely unavoidable (you can avoid the ship he sends crashing back down, but not the beasts that show up when he flies away)

 

[Inconspicuous Trenchcoat]

Reminds me of a funny story. I participated in a small-stakes ($5 entry, winners split the pot) 2v2 Melee tourney with some friends. In the final match, it was only one opponent and me with 300% + health. I managed to take him out, winning the game for my teammate and I. We won $20 each? hehe.

Next year, we had another tournament and they banned everything I used to win. Mainly mid-air dodges, excessive roll dodges (none of use knew of or could wave-dash yet), items and excessive combo-ing?? (Whatever that meant). Because they'd taken away the tools I used to whomp them, I only entered the 1v1 (we did 2v2 and 1v1 tourneys this time) and lost in the semi-finals. Yes, the tournament organizers were the two people we beat last year. Middle schoolers are so petty .

 

[NeutralDrow]

Have to admit, I don't entirely agree with Sakurai that Melee was inaccessible at all...but frankly, I don't care. If that line of reasoning is what led him in Brawl, then clearly it wasn't all that bad. I do vastly prefer Brawl to Melee. Didn't even realize how much before trying Melee again (I'm sorry, I like the floatier physics, lower hitstun, and easier recoveries).

Or even Brawl Minus. The vastly enhanced character capabilities is kickass, but it also occasionally reminds me of how much I hate massive hitstun. Nothing like being gentlely launched off the stage at 80%, not be able to recover for four seconds, and stage-fault at insultingly low speed.

Pokemon Stadium, only pokeballs, highest frequency occurence was my favourite combo, but I was more than happy to play pretty much any map.

I still like doing that...just replace Pokemon Stadium with Spear Pillar, depending on game. And throw in assist trophies for maximum chaos.

Actually, if there's one complaint I have, it's that they didn't bring back Poke Floats. I would gladly trade Yoshi's Island or Corneria for that. Speaking of...

Except the Donkey Kong ones. Screw you DK!

Oh, come on, Jungle Japes is great! The platform configuration is fun to play around, and all the water physics means is that falling is no longer instant death...barring a klaptrap, of course.

75M can die in a fire. I like the idea, but it's too friggin' hard to navigate. Even Mario Bros. is better; that's also hard to get around, but the potential for very short, very ugly fights grew on me.

In other words, the game was never intended to be played with all items turned off on one of the boring flat maps like Final Destination. You know who you are, tournament players. You know who you are.

Preach it!

Admittedly, I do hang out with a somewhat better crowd; they're also okay with Battlefield, Yoshi's Story, and Smashville. And Pictochat, strangely. Still, it's only when there's just a few people that I can convince them to do more interesting stages like Pirate Ship, or Frigate Orpeon, or even Castle Siege.

 

[samaugsch]

I'm not the only one who thought one on one at Final Destination with no items was the most fun, right?

Yeah, you pretty much are. It's boring.

No you're not. Don't listen to him/her.

It's boring. I loved Brawl because of the Super Smashes. It caused massive 4 man wrecking sprees whenever it appeared, and that was just fighting to see who would get it. And every smash in the game was avoidable, so it wasn't as cheap as some would make it.

The people who hate items on wacky maps are the people who are up 5 lives to 1 when their opponent got a few pokeballs, fought back, and won. Then they showed their "skill" by eliminating the factor they think cost them the game.

Actually, there were several unavoidable final smashes. Most of the time, it depends on the stage. However, Captain Olimar's smash is almost completely unavoidable (you can avoid the ship he sends crashing back down, but not the beasts that show up when he flies away)

By using a double jump when he takes off, and using your mid-air attack to hover (some characters better than others) you can avoid the mass amount of damage. You'll get hit a little, but only between 5-12 percent, depending on who you play. The only real damage from that Smash is when the ship comes down, since that will insta-kill who ever is right there, but the hit box is small.

True, and if you used a character like Kirby or Jigglypuff, you could avoid damage completely.

 

[chozo_hybrid]

Why not just add some harder modes and that way everyone wins in the next one?

It had them, 5? difficulty modes, ranging from very easy to very hard, and that was single player. In multilayer there were 9 lvls of AI and they could occupy any empty player slot, you could even pick their character or leave them as random. I really don't know what this guy is going on about, you can't "tune" the difficulty of other players, just the AI, and on the lowest level they would probably attack once every 5 seconds and then walk around like an idiot. I can't imagine making the AI easier than that without making them completely passive.

I knew all that, but mean like a menu selection that has like an obvious HARDCORE mode or something. Because having to fiddle with options is something a lot o people I know can't be bothered with.

Heck of a triple post, what the heck?

 

[GamingAwesome1]

I actualy went to a tournament at my local library for Melee, most boring 2 hours of my life. No items, just final destination, and we could only play as Mario, Link, Samus or Fox.....

I'd like to apologize beforehand, but this needs posting:
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As for the OP, I disagree. Yeah it was pretty complex, but you could still easily pick it up and play.

Eh, if you're trying to play Smash. Bros in a competitive fashion (which I would argue is a bad idea anyway this is not the best fighter for competetive play) then I don't see why you wouldn't turn items off. Items that spawn in completely random locations that can arbitrarily screw you over is indeed not something that should be used for competitive play. It's the same reason random crits are off in competitive TF2.

Characters though? Or maps?

The maps eviromental damage features are constant and is the same thing as say.... taking advantage of a power-up spawn in Quake or something.

As for characters, I would outlaw certain glitches (like that perma-invisble Meta-Knight crap) but beyond that, tiers are bullsh*t. I will never understand tourneys that outlaw characters from LOWER tiers, if it's suppossedly "lower tier" than why won't you let me play as him/her! It's not like it's an advantage in your eyes.

 

[notascleverasithinkiam]

I much prefer Melee to Brawl, the faster pace just feels better. That, and I think a lot of the Brawl items feel overpowered (don't get me started on the Final Smash, always turn it off)and that stupid trip mechanic is terrible. Sure, Melee had tough challenges, but that was kinda the point. Anyway, you could easily just play the main melee with easy bots until you got better. As others have mentioned above, it was simple to learn, hard to master, and that is a rare and beautiful thing. Besides, I loved the more individual challenges in Melee, expecially the target smash, which was different for each character and usually required use of most if not all of their abilites.

Besides, I think SSB is already considerably simpler than many other fighting games where each character has umpteen combos; SSB gives you normal, specials, and direction and lets you go nuts. That's why I love it.

 

[-Dragmire-]

I always find it funny how melee is priced at 59$ and brawl is priced at 58$. Nintendo just doesn't know how to lower prices... even old ones

 

[Stuntkid]

sorry, double post

 

[Stuntkid]

Is that why Brawl had tripping? >.>

Ok correct me if I'm wrong but did'nt Brawl have a faster pace then Melee? Or have years of playing as the same character just made me notice the fine tuning in regards to character balencing. Kirby seemed a lot faster in Brawl from what I remember even if his dash attack did get nerfed a bit.

I was more annoyed at Mr Game & Watch getting nerfed severely but yeah I agree with you, I think it might be abit of both, characters moving quicker but also due to the fact we've been playing for years we seem to pick up on this sort of thing.
It would be awesome to see another entry in the Smash Bros. series but I guess we'll just have to wait and see

nope, try again. G&W was SEVERELY buffed in brawl. His moves are more damageing and some attacks (like Dsmash) now has zero lag and has great knockback (you don't even have to sweetspot it now. His Bair is much more frightening too... alright I'll cool down. Yes, I'm a tornament player and (in brawl) G&W is my main. I know this is your opinion v. my opinion, and trust me, he's a more powerful character scematics-wise. His moves have more knockback and have more damage %.

He can be too cheap sometimes (hints at scarred past X( )

Oh, and for the record: FUCK FOX >

 

[TheGreatKlaid]

Two things. One, I loved Melee compared to Brawl maybe this is why? Always, felt like I was accomplishing more the better I got at it. Second, tournament people are silly. Me and my friend will occasionally go random characters, Final Destination/Battlefield, all items just to find out which is better. Also, the tier rankings are bull I can kill anyone with Yoshi even Metaknight or Pit. Or whoever the top tiers were in Melee. So awesome with Yoshi...