The Bad Ideas Guy

The Wooster

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The Bad Ideas Guy

...And Capcom is pretty much entirely staffed by these guys.

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Barbas

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Eh, too easy to link that JonTron sketch. Somebody else can do it.

Capcom and Sonic Team are way up there when it comes to producing some pretty whacked-out crap.

[small][sub][sub]"Wait a minute, Ray...wot 'ave we done? :c[/sub][/sub][/small]
 

Matthi205

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The smart pistol is not as bad as you'd think it is. It's great for clearing out grunts and spectres, but it's pretty hard to actually do anything against players with. And I certainly found the Carbine easier to use... hell, I even scored more kills when I was using the designated marksman rifle. And what with people moving about the place like paranoid flies on speed, my best guess is that the smart pistol ain't that great.
 

The_Darkness

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So... who's the gritty reboot Iron Man-lookalike supposed to be? Or is that just "Arbitrary Gritty Reboot No. 212"?

Also, the Smart Pistol sounds like a decent weapon for people less used to shooters, since as Matthi205 said, it's less easy to use it against players (what with a lock-on, charge-up time) but works well against the AI grunts. It's a way of letting newer players get a hook into the game without immediately getting wiped out by everyone else. Which is good, isn't it?
 

Makabriel

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Yeah, in my whole 30 or 40 games so far I don't think I could count on one hand how many times I've seen the smart gun as a source of my death.. Gimmicky but not a game changer.
 

The Wooster

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...I haven't played Titanfall, nor do I plan to, but as far as I can see, it's a faster paced CoD where weapons like the smartgun fit in. If you want more "unfair" weapons, just take a look at the Unreal Tournament or Quake games, where your sniper rifles and railguns were instant hit on crosshairs no matter how you moved. Sure, they don't aim for you, but with a bit of practice, it's far more devastating.

It's also a sign of "smart" design, like Extra Credits pointed out with the noob tube. Easy to use, but there's no point in mastering it and there are far better weapons to learn how to use than just sticking with a low ammo count weapon that you can't really control. That's likely the reason that you can start out with the smart gun and have to unlock the magnum type revovler.

While it certainly does feel like there's this one person at every firm that somehow gets their stupid idea in the door, I think it's rarely a case of ineptitude and more of misunderstanding the choice or a compromise of some sort.
 

Synthetica

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Matthi205 said:
The smart pistol is not as bad as you'd think it is. It's great for clearing out grunts and spectres, but it's pretty hard to actually do anything against players with. And I certainly found the Carbine easier to use... hell, I even scored more kills when I was using the designated marksman rifle. And what with people moving about the place like paranoid flies on speed, my best guess is that the smart pistol ain't that great.
Yeah. It was better in the beta, it targeted slightly faster (I think, or that's just me). But now, it's not really that great anymore.
 

AnthrSolidSnake

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I thought I hated the smart pistol too. However, upon using it myself, that thing is a pain in the ass to use. You better not plan on getting anywhere NEAR the line of site of your enemy before you get a full lock on, or else they will cream you before then. It doesn't even aim well as a standard pistol. Most people who kill you with it already had the drop on you, so it's mostly your fault if you die to it.
 

otakon17

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The_Darkness said:
So... who's the gritty reboot Iron Man-lookalike supposed to be? Or is that just "Arbitrary Gritty Reboot No. 212"?

Also, the Smart Pistol sounds like a decent weapon for people less used to shooters, since as Matthi205 said, it's less easy to use it against players (what with a lock-on, charge-up time) but works well against the AI grunts. It's a way of letting newer players get a hook into the game without immediately getting wiped out by everyone else. Which is good, isn't it?
Nope, Bomberman for the Xbox 360, I shit you not.



Look at that monstrosity! Did they really think that fans of the game were gonna go for that...thing?

OT: The Smart Pistol from what I've seen of it has limited range and ammunition and has a lock-on time so it's not really a bullshit weapon. However, Seekers from Dark Souls are pretty overpowered from what I've seen.
 

rofltehcat

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If any major gaming studio is still missing their bad ideas guy and wants to have one because everyone else already has one or several (as this is normally how such things seem to work),
they should feel free to send me offers. I'll supply them with bad ideas at very reasonable rates.

About smart pistols: I don't play Titanfall but what I have heard of the topic (which is far too much) it sounds like it comes down to one perk that decreases the lock-on time. With it, it seems to be annoying and without the perk it seems to be fine/meh. I also hear people might not have figured out yet how to properly avoid the lock-on.
So can people shut up about it now so I can get to not playing and hearing about Titanfall? :(
 

JUMBO PALACE

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Ehh I'm going to go ahead and be the black sheep and say that I agree with the comic in that the smart pistol was a terrible idea. It's like playing on easy mode, and it's frustrating to get killed by someone who was just lucky enough to end up / spawn behind you and get an insta-kill without you even getting a chance to maybe turn and fire back.
 

The_Darkness

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otakon17 said:
The_Darkness said:
So... who's the gritty reboot Iron Man-lookalike supposed to be? Or is that just "Arbitrary Gritty Reboot No. 212"?
Nope, Bomberman for the Xbox 360, I shit you not.


Look at that monstrosity! Did they really think that fans of the game were gonna go for that...thing?
I... Oh.

Oh.

You have got to be kidding- *Checks* -but you're not...

Who in the world thought that was a good idea? What happened to the pink and blue Bomberman that we know and love?!
 

RJ 17

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The Juggernaut perk wasn't that bad. At least if you ran with Stopping Power (which I almost always did) it wasn't. :p

But yeah, auto-aiming weapons are never a good idea. I like the list of names they went through before they settled on Smart Pistol.
 

Armadox

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The_Darkness said:
So... who's the gritty reboot Iron Man-lookalike supposed to be? Or is that just "Arbitrary Gritty Reboot No. 212"?

Also, the Smart Pistol sounds like a decent weapon for people less used to shooters, since as Matthi205 said, it's less easy to use it against players (what with a lock-on, charge-up time) but works well against the AI grunts. It's a way of letting newer players get a hook into the game without immediately getting wiped out by everyone else. Which is good, isn't it?
The iron-man look alike is the reboot failure Bomberman: Act Zero. It was X-box's realistic gritty reboot of the bomberman series that was terrible.

edit: Nevermind, someone else already mentioned it. Should have refreshed before posting. Ha
 

Brian Tams

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otakon17 said:
The_Darkness said:
So... who's the gritty reboot Iron Man-lookalike supposed to be? Or is that just "Arbitrary Gritty Reboot No. 212"?

Also, the Smart Pistol sounds like a decent weapon for people less used to shooters, since as Matthi205 said, it's less easy to use it against players (what with a lock-on, charge-up time) but works well against the AI grunts. It's a way of letting newer players get a hook into the game without immediately getting wiped out by everyone else. Which is good, isn't it?
Nope, Bomberman for the Xbox 360, I shit you not.


Look at that monstrosity! Did they really think that fans of the game were gonna go for that...thing?

OT: The Smart Pistol from what I've seen of it has limited range and ammunition and has a lock-on time so it's not really a bullshit weapon. However, Seekers from Dark Souls are pretty overpowered from what I've seen.
That image just made me extremely angry. Bomberman was a huge part of my childhood, and this... this monstrosity is not him. Fuck Konami. I'm glad that game got beaten to death by reviewers back in 2006.
 

gigastar

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otakon17 said:
OT: The Smart Pistol from what I've seen of it has limited range and ammunition and has a lock-on time so it's not really a bullshit weapon. However, Seekers from Dark Souls are pretty overpowered from what I've seen.
You had to say it, i shall now post a video.


That aside though, if you use full Havels with his shield you can block basically everything with little to no damage getting through. The only real danger is getting backstabbed or riposted.
 

Doclector

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Like the person who decided that a big part of skyrim's main quest should involve talking to the greybeards.

First time? it isn't too bad. But considering this is the kind of game someone would do multiple run throughs of, trying different builds...

It is HELLISH to sit through their dull bullshit for the tenth time.
 

wAriot

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I always find it funny that people use some kind of "reverse defense" to justify the Smart Pistol. "But it's not any good at all so it's not a problem! In fact, it's so bad no one should use it!"

What's the point of having it in the game, then?

The_Darkness said:
It's a way of letting newer players get a hook into the game without immediately getting wiped out by everyone else. Which is good, isn't it?
How can a terrible weapon that pretty much won't kill any player, good for "letting newer players get a hook into the game"? Also, no, I don't think casualizing your game for an inexperienced fanbase is good. They are the ones who should learn and get good at playing it, not the other way around.
 

Eclipse Dragon

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otakon17 said:
Nope, Bomberman for the Xbox 360, I shit you not.


Look at that monstrosity! Did they really think that fans of the game were gonna go for that...thing?
That is the same as...



Oh my childhood...

Edit: Now that I think about it, I faintly remember this game, my brain might have repressed the memory.

OT: I think it was Unskippable that said the Sonic team secretly wants to make games that aren't Sonic games, but are forced to shoehorn the hedgehog in.
 

ForumSafari

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Smilomaniac said:
If you want more "unfair" weapons, just take a look at the Unreal Tournament or Quake games, where your sniper rifles and railguns were instant hit on crosshairs no matter how you moved. Sure, they don't aim for you, but with a bit of practice, it's far more devastating.
Yeah, it's a hugely different dynamic playing a game like that, if you look at the way people play a game like COD and compare it to Quake 3 players like Fatal1ty then you realise stuff that's broken in one game is barely usable in the other.

Of course the other prime example of a broken weapon is the Farsight from Perfect Dark, which is pretty much objectively broken in any game it could appear in.
 

VanQ

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Does the guy in the second panel look kinda like John Romero to anyone else? Or are the scars still causing me to see his face whenever I hear about bad design and guns in the same sentence?

[sub]Are the tumblr comics over? I want more tumblr comics.[/sub]
 

The_Darkness

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wAriot said:
The_Darkness said:
It's a way of letting newer players get a hook into the game without immediately getting wiped out by everyone else. Which is good, isn't it?
How can a terrible weapon that pretty much won't kill any player, good for "letting newer players get a hook into the game"? Also, no, I don't think casualizing your game for an inexperienced fanbase is good. They are the ones who should learn and get good at playing it, not the other way around.
Be aware that you are talking to someone that has never played COD, and has relatively little experience at playing any online multiplayer. I have played FPSes - mostly Halo and L4D - but only as a Single Player experience. PVP is an entirely different beast.

I am also someone that is intending to pick Titanfall up when it comes out on X360. And I genuinely like the sound of the Smart Pistol.

How exactly do you expect me to 'learn and get good at playing it'? If I go up against experienced players, I am guaranteed to die. Usually very quickly. That doesn't get me any experience whatsoever, and I will stay 'not-good'. 'Get good' is not useful advice, thank-you.

On the other hand, if I use the Smart Pistol, I can focus on learning how to move around the map - which is important in any multiplayer FPS, and especially important in Titanfall. I can target the AI grunts, which will give me a chance at staying in the game long enough to actually learn something. And it will allow me to actually contribute in team battles - even if I'm only doing so by exclusively targeting the enemy AI.

As has been pointed out, weapons other than the Smart Pistol are actually more deadly in the hands of an experienced player - which gives me an incentive to learn how to use them once I have actually found my feet in the game. Once I'm decent at handling the less gimicky weapons against the AI, I'll probably be at a stage where I can begin to try my luck against other players.

This isn't 'casualizing' the game for an 'inexperienced fanbase'. This is providing them with a way to play that doesn't feel like running into a brick wall over and over and over again until your nose bleeds and you give up on playing the game.
 

Makabriel

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gigastar said:
otakon17 said:
OT: The Smart Pistol from what I've seen of it has limited range and ammunition and has a lock-on time so it's not really a bullshit weapon. However, Seekers from Dark Souls are pretty overpowered from what I've seen.
You had to say it, i shall now post a video.


That aside though, if you use full Havels with his shield you can block basically everything with little to no damage getting through. The only real danger is getting backstabbed or riposted.
Sorry, I laughed too hard at the shrugging on each kill. That was pretty awesome.
 

wAriot

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The_Darkness said:
How exactly do you expect me to 'learn and get good at playing it'? If I go up against experienced players, I am guaranteed to die. Usually very quickly. That doesn't get me any experience whatsoever, and I will stay 'not-good'.
You won't be going against experienced players constantly. Usually 90% of the players in a match will be of low levels. Most likely not much more experienced than you.

If I use the Smart Pistol, I can focus on learning how to move around the map (important in any multiplayer FPS, and especially important in Titanfall). I can target the AI grunts, which will give me a chance at staying in the game long enough to actually learn something. And it will allow me to actually contribute in team battles - even if I'm only doing so by exclusively targeting the enemy AI.
And you would learn faster using a normal weapon. Seriously, the Smart Pistol isn't even good for killing grunts. You would kill as many grunts with it as with a normal rifle. On the other hand, however, you get used to not having to aim, therefore making you WORSE.

As has been pointed out, weapons other than the Smart Pistol are actually more deadly in the hands of an experienced player - which gives me an incentive to learn how to use them once I have actually found my feet in the game. Once I'm decent at handling the less gimicky weapons against the AI, I'll probably be at a stage where I can begin to try my luck against other players.
If you already played other FPSs, you should have any problem, unless you forgot everything about them. The grunt AI is way worse (probably on purpose); and again, most of the players won't be part of MLG. And it's not like it takes THAT long to learn how to play a friggin FPS. So no, the Smart Pistol won't help you a little bit in this matter. If you are bad, it won't make you better. If you are good, it WILL make you worse.

This isn't 'casualizing' the game for an 'inexperienced fanbase'. This is providing them with a way to play that doesn't feel like running into a brick wall over and over and over again until your nose bleeds and you give up on playing the game.
Sorry if I laugh, but this is fucking ridiculous. Multiplayer FPSs have existed for decades, and not even once was a "Smart Pistol" needed (at least not for learning how to play - aim assist in consoles is another matter altogether). Everyone learned with normal weapons, no one complained. It didn't feel like "running into a brick wall", at all.
So unless the newbie gamers that will be playing Titanfall are completely stupid(and I prefer to think they aren't), they would be fine without it.
 

Souplex

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I don't know CoD that well, but if I remember right, the Juggernaut perk is the one that allows you to be durable enough to survive more than a single burst.
Which fixes one of CoD's main problems.
 

DrOswald

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wAriot said:
The_Darkness said:
How exactly do you expect me to 'learn and get good at playing it'? If I go up against experienced players, I am guaranteed to die. Usually very quickly. That doesn't get me any experience whatsoever, and I will stay 'not-good'.
You won't be going against experienced players constantly. Usually 90% of the players in a match will be of low levels. Most likely not much more experienced than you.

If I use the Smart Pistol, I can focus on learning how to move around the map (important in any multiplayer FPS, and especially important in Titanfall). I can target the AI grunts, which will give me a chance at staying in the game long enough to actually learn something. And it will allow me to actually contribute in team battles - even if I'm only doing so by exclusively targeting the enemy AI.
And you would learn faster using a normal weapon. Seriously, the Smart Pistol isn't even good for killing grunts. You would kill as many grunts with it as with a normal rifle. On the other hand, however, you get used to not having to aim, therefore making you WORSE.

As has been pointed out, weapons other than the Smart Pistol are actually more deadly in the hands of an experienced player - which gives me an incentive to learn how to use them once I have actually found my feet in the game. Once I'm decent at handling the less gimicky weapons against the AI, I'll probably be at a stage where I can begin to try my luck against other players.
If you already played other FPSs, you should have any problem, unless you forgot everything about them. The grunt AI is way worse (probably on purpose); and again, most of the players won't be part of MLG. And it's not like it takes THAT long to learn how to play a friggin FPS. So no, the Smart Pistol won't help you a little bit in this matter. If you are bad, it won't make you better. If you are good, it WILL make you worse.

This isn't 'casualizing' the game for an 'inexperienced fanbase'. This is providing them with a way to play that doesn't feel like running into a brick wall over and over and over again until your nose bleeds and you give up on playing the game.
Sorry if I laugh, but this is fucking ridiculous. Multiplayer FPSs have existed for decades, and not even once was a "Smart Pistol" needed (at least not for learning how to play - aim assist in consoles is another matter altogether). Everyone learned with normal weapons, no one complained. It didn't feel like "running into a brick wall", at all.
So unless the newbie gamers that will be playing Titanfall are completely stupid(and I prefer to think they aren't), they would be fine without it.
Multiplayer FPS's have existed for decades, and they have always had smart pistols. At least the good ones. Now, they didn't take the form of a pistol that locks onto the head of your opponent (that's a new one too my knowledge,) but there has always been that newbie friendly weapon that lets new or unskilled players contribute without being an actually great weapon. For example, COD had the noob tube. Not actually a great weapon, but easy to use and thus allowed newer players to contribute. You didn't really have to aim it to be successful. Just point in the general direction of the opponent and fire.

Noob weapons like this can be traced all the way back to the original Counter Strike. It is a well established design principle of Multiplayer FPS's. The exact form of noob weapons depend on the needs of the game but the point is always the same: a weapon that lets new players contribute without actually being good in order to smooth out the difficulty curve.

The reason why Titanfall's noob weapon takes the form of an auto locking pistol is that the game is based on both vertical and horizontal movement - hitting a flying target with a grenade is super hard. Thus the smart pistol. You don't really have to aim it, just point it in the general direction and fire. And yet it is undeniable an inferior weapon.
 

tdylan

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The_Darkness said:
So... who's the gritty reboot Iron Man-lookalike supposed to be? Or is that just "Arbitrary Gritty Reboot No. 212"?

Also, the Smart Pistol sounds like a decent weapon for people less used to shooters, since as Matthi205 said, it's less easy to use it against players (what with a lock-on, charge-up time) but works well against the AI grunts. It's a way of letting newer players get a hook into the game without immediately getting wiped out by everyone else. Which is good, isn't it?
That was the point of the Sawed-Off shotgun in Gears of War 3. To give new-comers a chance against gnasher "pros." The Gnasher community raged with a hard-on that I usually reserve for pornstars on a cocktail of viagra and cocaine. The sawed off was nerfed into uselessness. Titanfall doesn't have a pre-existing fanbase of "gnasher lovers," so the smart pistol may get a pass. Time will tell.
 

Eldritch Warlord

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wAriot said:
I always find it funny that people use some kind of "reverse defense" to justify the Smart Pistol. "But it's not any good at all so it's not a problem! In fact, it's so bad no one should use it!"

What's the point of having it in the game, then?
Smart pistol isn't terrible unless you use it like an SMG or carbine. It's almost completely useless in a "fair" fight with a pilot but if you avoid their attention long enough to get a full lock you can kill them instantly. The smart locking can also help you spot enemies. Plus it's very satisfying to watch a bunch of minions simultaneously drop dead.
 

wAriot

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DrOswald said:
Multiplayer FPS's have existed for decades, and they have always had smart pistols. At least the good ones. Now, they didn't take the form of a pistol that locks onto the head of your opponent (that's a new one too my knowledge,) but there has always been that newbie friendly weapon that lets new or unskilled players contribute without being an actually great weapon. For example, COD had the noob tube. Not actually a great weapon, but easy to use and thus allowed newer players to contribute. You didn't really have to aim it to be successful. Just point in the general direction of the opponent and fire.
Right and wrong. Yes, the grenade launcher was a noob weapon (hence "noob tube"), because it is easy to get kills with it. But it wasn't designed like that. Most people despised the noob tube and its users. If the game had dedicated servers, most would forbid it, or would ban you for using it. On the other hand, the Smart Pistol is clearly designed to be easy to use (and I emphasize easy to use, not easy to kill with), but you won't get kills with it, or at least not many.

Noob weapons like this can be traced all the way back to the original Counter Strike. It is a well established design principle of Multiplayer FPS's. The exact form of noob weapons depend on the needs of the game but the point is always the same: a weapon that lets new players contribute without actually being good in order to smooth out the difficulty curve.
And again: those weapons weren't designed for new players. Those weapons were just broken. There was no designer or developer that said "hey, you know what? Let's make a weapon that lets new players kill easily". You know why? Because that's fucking stupid. And also again: most broken weapons are usually banned, if the game allows it.

The reason why Titanfall's noob weapon takes the form of an auto locking pistol is that the game is based on both vertical and horizontal movement - hitting a flying target with a grenade is super hard. Thus the smart pistol.
I'm not sure what kind of point are you trying to make here. They could make "smart grenades" that fly to the enemy (like in Borderlands). Now THAT would be a broken weapon.

You don't really have to aim it, just point it in the general direction and fire. And yet it is undeniable an inferior weapon.
Exactly. And therefore there is no point for it. Yes, you don't have to aim. No, you won't kill anyone. Why the hell would you use it? Just learn how to properly use a rifle.
 

Darth_Payn

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The Wooster said:
The Bad Ideas Guy

...And Capcom is pretty much entirely staffed by these guys.

Read Full Article
That would explain Resident Evil 6, then. Hiyoooooooh!
Having not played Titanfall (yet), all this defending of the Smart Pistol in the comments has me thinking Grey winds up on the wrong end of that thing way too often.
The_Darkness said:
otakon17 said:
The_Darkness said:
So... who's the gritty reboot Iron Man-lookalike supposed to be? Or is that just "Arbitrary Gritty Reboot No. 212"?
Nope, Bomberman for the Xbox 360, I shit you not.

Who THE FUCK thought THAT was a brilliant idea?! I thought I successfully repressed that in my memory, but it just came back! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

Look at that monstrosity! Did they really think that fans of the game were gonna go for that...thing?
I... Oh.

Oh.

You have got to be kidding- *Checks* -but you're not...

Who in the world thought that was a good idea? What happened to the pink and blue Bomberman that we know and love?!
 

The Wooster

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So even in Sonic Team some Americans make the bad decisions and bully the asians into making bad games?
Thats...kinda racist?

---
Update:
Okay, I am an idiot. Sega Studio USA made Shadow.
 

DrOswald

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wAriot said:
DrOswald said:
Multiplayer FPS's have existed for decades, and they have always had smart pistols. At least the good ones. Now, they didn't take the form of a pistol that locks onto the head of your opponent (that's a new one too my knowledge,) but there has always been that newbie friendly weapon that lets new or unskilled players contribute without being an actually great weapon. For example, COD had the noob tube. Not actually a great weapon, but easy to use and thus allowed newer players to contribute. You didn't really have to aim it to be successful. Just point in the general direction of the opponent and fire.
Right and wrong. Yes, the grenade launcher was a noob weapon (hence "noob tube"), because it is easy to get kills with it. But it wasn't designed like that. Most people despised the noob tube and its users. If the game had dedicated servers, most would forbid it, or would ban you for using it. On the other hand, the Smart Pistol is clearly designed to be easy to use (and I emphasize easy to use, not easy to kill with), but you won't get kills with it, or at least not many.

Noob weapons like this can be traced all the way back to the original Counter Strike. It is a well established design principle of Multiplayer FPS's. The exact form of noob weapons depend on the needs of the game but the point is always the same: a weapon that lets new players contribute without actually being good in order to smooth out the difficulty curve.
And again: those weapons weren't designed for new players. Those weapons were just broken. There was no designer or developer that said "hey, you know what? Let's make a weapon that lets new players kill easily". You know why? Because that's fucking stupid. And also again: most broken weapons are usually banned, if the game allows it.
Actually, many of these weapons are specifically designed for this purpose. And the reason they are often banned on dedicated servers is because dedicated servers are usually made by hardcore players for hardcore players who get really pissy about a weapon that eliminates a significant portion of skill from the game even if they are not good. And rightly so - a noob weapon has no place in a match between veterans. However, that does not mean the weapon is broken or the developers made a mistake.

The noob tube was specifically designed for this purpose. This is why the weapon keeps on getting in the games despite the hardcore players always saying it is a broken weapon. It is not an accident it keeps on getting put in there in its "broken" form.

The reason why Titanfall's noob weapon takes the form of an auto locking pistol is that the game is based on both vertical and horizontal movement - hitting a flying target with a grenade is super hard. Thus the smart pistol.
I'm not sure what kind of point are you trying to make here. They could make "smart grenades" that fly to the enemy (like in Borderlands). Now THAT would be a broken weapon.
The point was that most noob weapons are AOE weapons because that makes it easier to hit your opponent. The smart pistol is no different from these other noob weapons because it does the same thing - makes it easier to hit your opponent - by a different route.

You don't really have to aim it, just point it in the general direction and fire. And yet it is undeniable an inferior weapon.
Exactly. And therefore there is no point for it. Yes, you don't have to aim. No, you won't kill anyone. Why the hell would you use it? Just learn how to properly use a rifle.
No, the pistol has a very important point. When a person first picks up a FPS they need to learn a ton of things. How to move, how to dodge, how to sneak up on people, how to aim. Titanfall adds more variables: how to use the titan, how to scale walls, when and how to kill NPC's to maximize your effectiveness.

The smart pistol does a very important thing: it teaches people how to move during combat. It teaches them to dodge. In an FPS who wins in a firefight depends on two things: precision aiming and effective dodging. Learning both at once can be difficult. The smart pistol eliminates the need for precision aiming allowing the new player to focus entirely on dodging, along with giving a clear indicator of partial success - if they got two lock ons they know they were very close. Their dodging that time was pretty good, but not quite good enough. If they only got one they know that what they tried was a bad idea. The smart pistol teaches and reinforces good movement.

Once dodging becomes second nature they can move onto a more effective weapon that also requires precision aiming. It means they only have to learn one skill at a time. That is why the weapon has value.

Finally, the person is practically guaranteed some measure of success. If they manage to sneak up on a guy they they will almost certainly get a kill, for example. Had a new player been using a normal weapon they will likely be unable to aim well and will miss that rare opportunity. With the smart pistol a player will likely get at least one kill a game (and they will get plenty of NPC kills.) This taste of success keeps new players from being frustrated and reassures them that they are getting better.
 

Me55enger

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The Smart Pistol, for when you really, y'know, just can't be fucked.

Not game breaking, not game changing, hell, not even that massive a problem. It's just being forced to sit through a kill-cam where some dickbag M'gee appears from the aether behind me and just stares at me for a few seconds whilst his pistol decides which jicy bits it want's to penetrate today.

Where's the effort?
 

Epicspoon

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May 25, 2010
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Shadow the Hedgehog got his own game and was given guns in it because fans asked for it. This punchline is invalid.
 

DaViller

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DrOswald said:
Actually, many of these weapons are specifically designed for this purpose.
The smart pistol does a very important thing: it teaches people how to move during combat. It teaches them to dodge. In an FPS who wins in a firefight depends on two things: precision aiming and effective dodging.
Common man, cod type fps pretty much just require you to run forward, point your gun into the general vicinity of the enemy and hold down the fire button. Where not talking some oldschool stuff like unreal or quake here where you actually had to dodge incoming projectiles.

On the subject of "noob weapons":

A weapon that is only usefull if your bad is a useless addition. A weapon of choice should be a decision based on personal style and strategy (like your preferred fighter in street figher, or race in starcraft). Every weapon should be a viable tool just in a different way(of course balancing also plays a part in this some weapons will always be better then others), not a pair of training wheels that is only usefull if you can´t drive for 2 meters before falling over.

Well thats at least my idea of how it should be in a good shooter.
 

Cerebrawl

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This just reminded me of that hedgefund "pay money to make mario jump higher" guy.

This guy, Seth Fischer:
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/132527-Pay-99-Cents-To-Make-Mario-Jump-Higher-Hedge-Fund-Urges

Ugh *shudder*

These are the sort of people we definitely don't want making any sort of decisions in gaming.

Of course companies like EA is full of those kinds of people.

Microsoft seems to have it as a corporate policy/culture, except their schtick is all about taking control away from the user. It's been going on for a couple of decades at least. There's an old leaked document(the "Halloween memo") about how "for microsoft to win, the customer must lose". This from when they were FUDing the new and emerging Linux and Open Source movement(in 1998 IIRC).
 

karkashan

Corrin Married Xander
May 4, 2009
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Doclector said:
Like the person who decided that a big part of skyrim's main quest should involve talking to the greybeards.

First time? it isn't too bad. But considering this is the kind of game someone would do multiple run throughs of, trying different builds...

It is HELLISH to sit through their dull bullshit for the tenth time.
I've had friends ask me why I constantly kill Paarthurnax every playthrough.

That is the reason, right there.

OT: The people at bioware who designed Dragon Age 2 with a controller setup in mind, then decided all PC players would want that crappy setup we ended up with instead. Wouldn't mind giving them a piece of my mind.
 

Doclector

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karkashan said:
Doclector said:
Like the person who decided that a big part of skyrim's main quest should involve talking to the greybeards.

First time? it isn't too bad. But considering this is the kind of game someone would do multiple run throughs of, trying different builds...

It is HELLISH to sit through their dull bullshit for the tenth time.
I've had friends ask me why I constantly kill Paarthurnax every playthrough.

That is the reason, right there.

OT: The people at bioware who designed Dragon Age 2 with a controller setup in mind, then decided all PC players would want that crappy setup we ended up with instead.
Actually, I do like paarthurnax. His dialogue is pretty cool, and the first time I found him, I was genuinely surprised.

But the Greybeards...they're just boring pricks. Not only is most of their early game nonsense a glorified tutorial on shouts, but they have all this massive power and not only do they not do anything about the war, the dragons, and all that, but they try to convince you not to do anything either. Shit, they're the last goddamn people in skyrim who should be doing the whole defeatist "There's no hope, this is the way things must be" thing. The goddamn town guards are more ready to fight for skyrim, and they're barely well armed enough to take on a few forsworn!
 

Hazy

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Silent Hill had one glaring one. Luckily he left.


"And don't come back"​
 

karkashan

Corrin Married Xander
May 4, 2009
147
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0
Doclector said:
karkashan said:
Doclector said:
Like the person who decided that a big part of skyrim's main quest should involve talking to the greybeards.

First time? it isn't too bad. But considering this is the kind of game someone would do multiple run throughs of, trying different builds...

It is HELLISH to sit through their dull bullshit for the tenth time.
I've had friends ask me why I constantly kill Paarthurnax every playthrough.

That is the reason, right there.

OT: The people at bioware who designed Dragon Age 2 with a controller setup in mind, then decided all PC players would want that crappy setup we ended up with instead.
Actually, I do like paarthurnax. His dialogue is pretty cool, and the first time I found him, I was genuinely surprised.

But the Greybeards...they're just boring pricks. Not only is most of their early game nonsense a glorified tutorial on shouts, but they have all this massive power and not only do they not do anything about the war, the dragons, and all that, but they try to convince you not to do anything either. Shit, they're the last goddamn people in skyrim who should be doing the whole defeatist "There's no hope, this is the way things must be" thing. The goddamn town guards are more ready to fight for skyrim, and they're barely well armed enough to take on a few forsworn!
I like him as well, he just gets the old "guilty by association" thing going for him that just pushes things just a little bit on the "I wanna loot his corpse" side of things with me.
 

teebeeohh

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wAriot said:
Exactly. And therefore there is no point for it. Yes, you don't have to aim. No, you won't kill anyone. Why the hell would you use it? Just learn how to properly use a rifle.
the learning curve for hitting moving targets that can just fly off is very steep. you have to consider that there are people who can't aim for shit but still like to play shooters, if you don't give those guys a way that allows them to contribute to the fight they will stop playing before you get they hooked enough that they are willing to learn how to use a rifle properly.
the smart pistol will do just that, it allows you easy and fast grunt farm (assuming your aim is shit and you spend half a mag taking down a grunt) and gets you kills and flying enemies you would never hit on your own. and early on you will get more kills with a smart pistol than you would with a rifle, simply because the pistol does not allow you enemy the time to lift off and fly away at an awkward angle where you have no chance of hitting him. i watched my roommate play who is such a noob and he had a blast just staying alive, killing grunts and the odd camper till he got his titan.

i actually still have that thing in my loudout because until i unlock the lmg the revolver is my weapon of choice anyway and the smart pistol is great for shooting grenades. i am actually fine with the weapon, most people complain about how unfair it is if you killed by someone who snuck up on you from behind but in that situation the same guy would have killed you with a shotgun, burst rifle or pretty much anything anyway.
 

Itsthefuzz

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I feel like I was only killed by the Smart Pistol when I wasn't paying any attention or was attacked from behind. Which then, any other weapon would have done just as well. It's great for framing creeps, and it's a fairy nice weapon for new players. Anyone insisting it's overpowered in a pilot vs pilot scenario probably just needs to work on their own aim a bit.
 

Ldude893

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otakon17 said:
The_Darkness said:
So... who's the gritty reboot Iron Man-lookalike supposed to be? Or is that just "Arbitrary Gritty Reboot No. 212"?

Also, the Smart Pistol sounds like a decent weapon for people less used to shooters, since as Matthi205 said, it's less easy to use it against players (what with a lock-on, charge-up time) but works well against the AI grunts. It's a way of letting newer players get a hook into the game without immediately getting wiped out by everyone else. Which is good, isn't it?
Nope, Bomberman for the Xbox 360, I shit you not.



Look at that monstrosity! Did they really think that fans of the game were gonna go for that...thing?

OT: The Smart Pistol from what I've seen of it has limited range and ammunition and has a lock-on time so it's not really a bullshit weapon. However, Seekers from Dark Souls are pretty overpowered from what I've seen.
I was hanging my jaw open for a full minute the moment I saw this.

What the hell, industry? You actually thought this would make you money?
 

AlbinoBunny

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People claiming the Smart pistol is 'bad' are kind of missing it's strengths.

The Smart Pistol is phenomenal at allowing mobility and fast farming. It's how I pushed out a 95 point round on attrition. By using wall jumps and chain farming my way through players and grunts.

It's fantastic design because it fills the 'crutch' weapon role that most shooters have (that being a weapon which has a low skill floor to use but has a trait which makes it undesirable for skilled players. The Liberty Launcher is the text book definition of this) but also has strengths and weaknesses that allow it to stand on its own as a weapon.
 

Abomination

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Not being able to skip cutscenes is my biggest gripe with almost any game.

It's what has actually turned me off TellTales games. Sometimes I want to try a different save but I don't want to have to wait through the exact same scene again and again to get it.

If I have no control I need to be able to give myself immediate control.
 

Revolutionary

Pub Club Am Broken
May 30, 2009
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I haven't played titanfall since beta, but when I played it the smart pistol was really well balanced, it was only effective against the grunts, I made sure I had a manual pistol for when I encountered other pilots.
 

[REDACTED]

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I haven't played Titanfall, but from what I'm hearing about the Smart Pistol, it sounds like this video could go a long way towards explaining its inclusion in the game:

To the person who's able to see this message because they quoted this comment: you're awesome.[/youtube]

Edit: So, it turns out that the entire thread is full of people saying the exact same thing. Isn't reading fun?
 

DementedSheep

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otakon17 said:
The_Darkness said:
So... who's the gritty reboot Iron Man-lookalike supposed to be? Or is that just "Arbitrary Gritty Reboot No. 212"?

Also, the Smart Pistol sounds like a decent weapon for people less used to shooters, since as Matthi205 said, it's less easy to use it against players (what with a lock-on, charge-up time) but works well against the AI grunts. It's a way of letting newer players get a hook into the game without immediately getting wiped out by everyone else. Which is good, isn't it?
Nope, Bomberman for the Xbox 360, I shit you not.



Look at that monstrosity! Did they really think that fans of the game were gonna go for that...thing?

OT: The Smart Pistol from what I've seen of it has limited range and ammunition and has a lock-on time so it's not really a bullshit weapon. However, Seekers from Dark Souls are pretty overpowered from what I've seen.
This is real? Wow...just wow.

The pursuers were damn overpowered although darksouls didn't really seem to be balanced all that well. My admittedly limited experience with pvp was mostly just finding new inventive ways to mess with people and be messed with.

GW2 did the unskippable cut scene thing for no apparent reason recently. Maybe because they didn't want you to miss that Jory and Kas were in a relationship now? I don't know. I would thought if any of the cutscenes would be unskippable it would be the dragon waking up revealing what the main villain for the past season has been doing all this time but no...that one you can skip. It didn't help that the two you can't skip are long, the fight after it is very short and has a achievement for doing a certain thing that is likely to take multiple tries.
 

immortalfrieza

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You know, I simply do not understand all the hate Shadow the Hedgehog gets, it is an excellent game in just about every way, and the ways it's not are the same ones that 3D Sonic games have had since Adventure (bad camera and controls, which is another way of saying that I'm not an instant expert therefore the game is bad.) It's also one of the most innovate games in the franchise. It has a strong story with multiple branching paths that unlike most games with such is actually different, a much more interesting protagonist with more character development in his first 5 minutes than Sonic has had in his entire existence, great sound and music all around, and fun gameplay. Shadow uses guns? So what? It's not like they haven't had gun wielding protagonists in the series before.
 

rasputin0009

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I find I just aim the smart pistol like a regular gun when I'm against pilots, and do the aim lock for grunts. The biggest help it gives me is that it helps me recognize where enemies are by pointing them out. That's my handicap in shooters: it takes me forever to recognize an enemy from the background.
 

Two-A

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The_Darkness said:
otakon17 said:
The_Darkness said:
So... who's the gritty reboot Iron Man-lookalike supposed to be? Or is that just "Arbitrary Gritty Reboot No. 212"?
Nope, Bomberman for the Xbox 360, I shit you not.

Who THE FUCK thought THAT was a brilliant idea?! I thought I successfully repressed that in my memory, but it just came back! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

Look at that monstrosity! Did they really think that fans of the game were gonna go for that...thing?
I... Oh.

Oh.

You have got to be kidding- *Checks* -but you're not...

Who in the world thought that was a good idea? What happened to the pink and blue Bomberman that we know and love?!
[/quote]

He got sick of that crap and moved to the portables.

I have heard the multiplayer is somewhat fun, at least.
 

Vegosiux

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I am very disappointed. It was a perfect setup, yet nobody ended up being thrown out the window :(

Then again, you'd need someone with a good idea for that I suppose.
 

gamegod25

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otakon17 said:
The_Darkness said:
So... who's the gritty reboot Iron Man-lookalike supposed to be? Or is that just "Arbitrary Gritty Reboot No. 212"?

Also, the Smart Pistol sounds like a decent weapon for people less used to shooters, since as Matthi205 said, it's less easy to use it against players (what with a lock-on, charge-up time) but works well against the AI grunts. It's a way of letting newer players get a hook into the game without immediately getting wiped out by everyone else. Which is good, isn't it?
Nope, Bomberman for the Xbox 360, I shit you not.



Look at that monstrosity! Did they really think that fans of the game were gonna go for that...thing?

OT: The Smart Pistol from what I've seen of it has limited range and ammunition and has a lock-on time so it's not really a bullshit weapon. However, Seekers from Dark Souls are pretty overpowered from what I've seen.
lol yeah its like the retarded love child of Iron Man and Spawn XD
 

Not G. Ivingname

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The_Darkness said:
otakon17 said:
The_Darkness said:
So... who's the gritty reboot Iron Man-lookalike supposed to be? Or is that just "Arbitrary Gritty Reboot No. 212"?
Nope, Bomberman for the Xbox 360, I shit you not.


Look at that monstrosity! Did they really think that fans of the game were gonna go for that...thing?
I... Oh.

Oh.

You have got to be kidding- *Checks* -but you're not...

Who in the world thought that was a good idea? What happened to the pink and blue Bomberman that we know and love?!
It get's worse.

SO MUCH WORSE.

1. They included a "First Person mode." Thankfully, they were not dumb enough to put an actual first person mode in a bomberman game, they did put in this really awkward third person mode that allows you to clearly see maybe a fifth of the stage, and will get you killed, a lot.

2. Half the time, you win because the enemy blew themselves up.

3. NO LOCAL MULTI-PLAYER. The only way to play is over Xbox live, and if the servers for this game are still running (let alone if anyone actually is playing it), I will laugh so hard.

4. To win, you have to beat 99 levels. In a row. No saving, no continues, they don't even give you codes. Besides maybe pausing (and having you Xbox over heat) you have to beat the game in ONE sitting.
 

chikusho

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The smart pistol is pretty awesome actually. It really is a game changer considering how you have to approach different combat situations when you have it equipped.
You know you will be instantly destroyed if you go head to head with another pilot, so instead you have to keep out of sight and try to get the drop on people. If you get a full lock you kill them with one shot, whereas if you miss with another main weapon, you'll probably alert the pilot to your position and risk getting shot up instead. Given the speed of the game, the smart pistol really has its place in the arsenal.
 

TheSYLOH

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Not G. Ivingname said:
The_Darkness said:
otakon17 said:
The_Darkness said:
So... who's the gritty reboot Iron Man-lookalike supposed to be? Or is that just "Arbitrary Gritty Reboot No. 212"?
Nope, Bomberman for the Xbox 360, I shit you not.


Look at that monstrosity! Did they really think that fans of the game were gonna go for that...thing?
I... Oh.

Oh.

You have got to be kidding- *Checks* -but you're not...

Who in the world thought that was a good idea? What happened to the pink and blue Bomberman that we know and love?!
It get's worse.

SO MUCH WORSE.

1. They included a "First Person mode." Thankfully, they were not dumb enough to put an actual first person mode in a bomberman game, they did put in this really awkward third person mode that allows you to clearly see maybe a fifth of the stage, and will get you killed, a lot.

2. Half the time, you win because the enemy blew themselves up.

3. NO LOCAL MULTI-PLAYER. The only way to play is over Xbox live, and if the servers for this game are still running (let alone if anyone actually is playing it), I will laugh so hard.

4. To win, you have to beat 99 levels. In a row. No saving, no continues, they don't even give you codes. Besides maybe pausing (and having you Xbox over heat) you have to beat the game in ONE sitting.
I keep expecting this is some kind of elaborate joke....
But its too wide spread, and from legitimate sources too. This kind of thing is even beyond anon's usual level of antics.
Fuck...some one actually sat down and convinced someone that this might make money!
I'm not sure which is worse, someone thinking that it would make money, or someone would be sick enough to deceive a fellow human being that this would work.
 

CyberAkuma

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otakon17 said:
However, Seekers from Dark Souls are pretty overpowered from what I've seen.
Seekers (Or Pursuers as they are called)in Dark Souls isn't unbalanced on the simple reason that it has an insane Intelligance requirement.
All those points that go into that stat are points that aren't going to boosting health, endurance, resistance etc.
That means that any Scorcery-class build that is able to weild Seekers is pretty much a glass canon. Very little points to Endurance means shitty armor that can't absorb any damage what so ever. They can sure dish out some heavy damage with Pursuers but 2-3 hits with pretty much any decent weapon and they are literally dead as useless cheese. If you are on top of that using the TC-Catalyst you only get *ONE* shot with Pursuers which isn't really that difficult to deal with.

Already at lvl 100 a scorcerer class has to spend one third of their entire points to Intelligence which makes them immensly weak. Heck, one backstab and you're done for. And as all things in DS they are items that completely nullify Pursuers. The Spell Stoneplate Ring boosts your magic defense + Crest Shield +5 (which is available early-game) makes pretty much any spell entirely useless and any serious DS invader has those two in their arsenal.


I've spent hundreds of hours with Scorcery builds in DS and for the majority of the time it's not a walk in the park in duels. It serves *AS BEST* as a way to distract gankers leaving one off your back while you gain a few extra seconds.
But overpowered? Hell no.
 

Strazdas

Robots will replace your job
May 28, 2011
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The_Darkness said:
How exactly do you expect me to 'learn and get good at playing it'? If I go up against experienced players, I am guaranteed to die. Usually very quickly. That doesn't get me any experience whatsoever, and I will stay 'not-good'. 'Get good' is not useful advice, thank-you.

This isn't 'casualizing' the game for an 'inexperienced fanbase'. This is providing them with a way to play that doesn't feel like running into a brick wall over and over and over again until your nose bleeds and you give up on playing the game.
the only way to truly improve your skill is to play against somone who is better thank you. Well that or grind for thousands of hours trying every possible button combination imaginable till you get lucky.

If your game feels like your running into a brick wall over and over again, then have you thought that maybe thats not a game for you?

I was going to also talk about aiming improvements but you are getting it for 360, so using a controler already negates any form of "precise aiming" anyway.

capcha: take wrong turns.
yeah, thats how you learn the map.
 

Vegosiux

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May 18, 2011
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Strazdas said:
the only way to truly improve your skill is to play against somone who is better thank you. Well that or grind for thousands of hours trying every possible button combination imaginable till you get lucky.
I'd say, the best way is to play with someone close to your skill level, maybe slightly better. If they're much less skilled, you're not learning anything from them. If they're much more skilled, you won't even know which train just ran you down, so you won't learn anything from it.
 

Strazdas

Robots will replace your job
May 28, 2011
8,407
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Vegosiux said:
Strazdas said:
the only way to truly improve your skill is to play against somone who is better thank you. Well that or grind for thousands of hours trying every possible button combination imaginable till you get lucky.
I'd say, the best way is to play with someone close to your skill level, maybe slightly better. If they're much less skilled, you're not learning anything from them. If they're much more skilled, you won't even know which train just ran you down, so you won't learn anything from it.
If taken to extremes this is true. however you will rarely meet pros in random servers. most will be just like you, new guys. Unless your playing an old game, where it depends a lot on community. For example in CS 1.6 you will get slaughtered if your new because anyone that still plays that version are good at it and they hate anyone new. On the other hand when i tried COD4 multiplayer for the first time last year i was welcomed with open arms and even enemy team players gave me some tips in chat how to get better.

However as far as new games go your usually with similar skill level and asking for "noob guns because i such" will only lead you to never getting better to begin with. you cant get good with a sniper rifle if you never use a sniper rifle you know.
 

t850terminator

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Nov 21, 2013
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Oh my god. Are people actually trying to justify an auto-aim pistol in a FPS? What next, people trying to reason that microtransactions in fully-paid game is a good thing? Seriously, we let regenerating health run rampant, extreme linearity, QTEs, unfinished games....sigh....