The Big Picture: Batfleck

[Icehearted]

Ben Afleck as Batman, not feeling it. I don't get where you see talent. Yeah, he can be amusing, I've enjoyed some of the movies in which he's starred or supported, but not because of anything he had to offer, and in a lot of cases he was dead weight being carried by the rest of the cast and careful direction. His regularly wooden presence on-cscreen is akin in my mind to a slightly jocular and much more perfunctory version of Keanu Reeves, but I can at least take Keanu more seriously, and I mean this in the professional sense more than as a performance commentary. I realize a less serious Batman appeals to you, and I'm fine with the idea myself, but rather than lightening the role or the film with his personality Afleck often conveys no genuine screen presence, as if at any moment he'll either start laughing at his lines or breaking character ala Jimmy Fallon or inexplicably break the fourth wall. Sure he doesn't do that, but he leaves me feeling most of the time as if he will.

And let's not sit on street cred, shall we? Let's face it, Argo was a love letter to the pretentious and sycophantic Oscar crowd and should carry as much weight as the Nobel Prize; it's a title that, like gold, is only as valuable as someone arbitrarily decides it is, and unlike gold is handed out much more readily to those who do not deserve it... well actually a lot like gold I guess.

I've been good at keeping an open mind, but on this I cannot. Ben Afleck is an untalented and derivative performer woefully more successful and adulated than he deserves to be. Your somewhat fawning introduction and recognition of him as a performer only cements, at least evidently so, that rather than genuinely wondering why people aren't enthusiastic about this announcement you are genuinely interested in defending it. I would say to each their own, but since your voice is louder than mine and you've taken a clear position on this matter here there's nothing I can offer other than my own even more trivial opinion.

My 2¢.

 

[dubious_wolf]

I was completely neutral on the pick. It's gonna be a fine movie. One way or the other.

 

[stabnex]

I suppose in the context of The Green Lantern and The Man Of Steel, Ben Affleck as Batman makes a kind of sick sense. Congratulations Warner Brothers, I take my hat off to you for sticking to your guns. And standards.

Low, low standards. I hereby change my stance to "Looking Forward To" this... erm, interesting take on The Worlds Greatest Detective.

 

[jimClassic]

I have nothing against Ben Afleck, and I enjoyed Dare Devil.

 

[Callate]

*sigh*

A word about Affleck.

I don't hate the guy. I've really liked some of the movies he was in. What I've seen of him in the director's chair is fantastic.

And as an actor he is always- always- recognizably Ben Affleck. Best friend who aspires for Matt Damon to make something of his life Affleck = Roughneck oil driller blowing up asteroids Affleck = Sad sack mysteriously attractive to Liv Tyler Affleck = yes, blind lawyer with superhuman senses and reflexes Affleck.

To limit the comparison to Bale as "both made some goofy movies" completely ignores the fact that Bale actually made some significant transformations in those years of characters, and I'm not talking about some Hollywood crash dieting and gym training.

Go watch The Machinist, American Psycho, and 3:10 to Yuma and tell me if Bale is playing the same character. Hell, be honest: if you didn't know otherwise, would you think it was the same actor?

I'm not cheering for Affleck to fail. I hope he can pull it off. But overconfidence isn't warranted, and heaping undeserved scorn on Bale makes less of a case for Affleck's superiority and more of a case for a lack of critical perspective.

As for "the Bat", to continue to flog the "Oh we would be so much better off if we could get a fun Batman" line in the same stream as describing the character as "Mitt Romney with a doomsday bunker and a leather fetish" is wanting to have your cake and eat it, too. "The character will be awful until they do what I want them to do with him?" Does that sound slightly familiar amidst the torrent of abuse directed towards "entitled" fandom?

Yeah, yeah. Darker and grittier is getting old. I get it, just as I get how in another month a Superman movie that originally got a mixed-to-positive review is going to have metamorphosed into the sludge scraped off of some Hollywood producer's shoe.

I'm still hoping for a good Batman. And I really don't give a plugged nickel if that's a Batman so dark he makes Joel Schumacher's Batman and Adam West's Batman retroactively cease to exist, so long as it's interesting to watch. Batman has been a lot of things even in the relatively narrow range of comics I've read- a sane man in an insane world playing psychotic to keep his enemies off-balance, the philanthropist trying to create a Gotham that can stand on its own feet in the absence of its night-stalking vigilante, a rebel against a corrupt police-state, the uncompromising and unlikable commander of what amounted to a small army.

I would be thrilled to see any of those interpretations, as unlikely as they might be in the world of capsule summaries and high-concept pitches. What I don't want to see is "can't we make Batman more light and fun" without any deeper conception of what they want to do with him.

Last time they did that, it sucked hard enough to bring down a franchise.

 

[easternflame]

You utilize the academy award thing pretty conviniently... It seems to me that when it's convinient to the argument, this guy has two academy awards. When it's not, academy awards are a carefully crafted formula to be criticized.

 

[McMarbles]

I'd still like to here a single example of Ben Affleck putting in a 'great' performance. Anyone care to name a film that might change my mind about his acting skills?
His direction/writing is fine but I've never seen him act better than mediocre in anything.

At this point, my only real demand for an actor playing Batman is that he doesn't sound like he's gargling razor blades.

 

[Something Amyss]

You can tell Bob's making a rant video when he's talking in his Boston accent.

I figured it might simply have to do with the AFLAC connection.

But I was naive and optimistic.

 

[Urameshi13]

I hate to say it, Bob, but you missed the big picture of the Batman (pun oh so totally intended).

Sure, Bats has cash to burn, but he's also got something else, brains. One doesn't earn the moniker of "World's Greatest Detective" just because of his trust fund. You, of all people, should know that it's not enough to just learn something, but to retain that knowledge and make use of it.

I know a lot of your hate for what Batman has become in certain iterations is because of your huge distrust of capitalism, but again, you miss the point. The entire point of capitalism is that you use your brains to build your assets.

Are there dirty deals and cronyism in the American economy? Absolutely. But it's the same in so-called egalitarian economies such as socialism and communism.

 

[Baresark]

I think Bob's irrational hatred for the Man of Steel has finally blinded him to reality. I mean, say what you want about the movie, it's still the number 67 all time grossing movie. It sits right behind the first Pirates of the Caribbean movie. That could not be considered a box office failure if you tried. It cost a lot to make, but it brought in almost three times that cost, more than enough to warrant a sequel. We should honestly all be grateful for another chance at it rather than waiting for a new budget, new cast, new story turn around again.

Edit: I never commented on the actual story here. I for one am looking forward to this crossover, and more importantly, Ben Afleck is a talented actor and I think he will do a great job as Batman. I can't really stand or abide all this so called "nerd rage" that has come because of this. It's just another stupid knee jerk reaction from groups of people who find their most at home among other cynical assholes. Everyone always expects the worst, so then they find it. If everything else is great, the one thing they don't like will become central to the character and this will result in the any actor having failed in a given roll.

Superman and Henry Cavill failed because of the opposite reason above: the expectation was well above what could possibly be produced by any actor or any director. Bob was excited about Man of Steel before it came out because it was showing itself to be a new origin story and a coming of age story. Both of those things are true, and the coming of age story is particularly well told. He was excited about the Dragonball-esque powerups and ridiculous looking battles. Guess what was wrong with the movie? We all know the answer to this of course. Clark was not the happy go lucky character we all know to expect. He faced hardship based on who and what he is. He spent a portion of the movie torn about what he wants and what he needs, about choosing what's best for him and best for everyone. That is practically the definition of a coming of age story. The action was not believable and was too over the top. I'm not saying the movie was perfect, but when you are given exactly what you ask for and then you hate something for it... well that is just ridiculous.

It's with these two conditions that things will inherently fail. Expectations either so high as to be unobtainable resulting in "nerd culture" (in this case) hating the attempt. Conversely, when you expect something bad and you are not given something bad, you find something to not like about it, and that results in completely irrational dislike of something.

As far as all the defending of Batman is concerned.... just stop it. Stop saying that someone else doesn't get the character. Stop acting like you have a special connection or special understanding that no one else has. The reality is, everyone picks and chooses defining moments for any character. Those defining moments are based on individual world views. Since no two world views are identical, then each read of the character will be different in either many ways or a few small ways. The only reason Batman ever beats Superman is because Superman goes out of his way to not hurt anyone. It results in an interesting dichotomy because of who the two characters are though. You end up in a situation where Superman his holding back more than he normally would because of Batman's status as "a mortal man", and you get Batman going all out because Superman is one of the characters that he can throw literally everything at because not too many people in the DC Universe can withstand it like Superman can. This holding back is Superman's greatest strength and weakness all at the same time. Likewise, Batman would spare Superman when all is said and done because above all else, they are friends. So even in the situation where Superman is defeated by Batman, the results are no different than the reverse.

 

[General Vagueness]

Does anyone else wish Bob would just pick an accent already? I really don't care which one it is. It's jarring having him go back and forth to different degrees every week, and having him be all "pahk ya cah then go to Bawston, yeh that's a wicked plan" and then having the ad for his book where he's all enunciated whitebread Nebraska is like accent whiplash.

 

[daxterx2005]

I don't understand how Bob praised the hell out of Man of Steel....but now in all his big picture vids he wont stop complaining about it?

 

[Aardvaarkman]

The entire point of capitalism is that you use your brains to build your assets.

No, the point of Capitalism is capital, and trading different kinds of capital. I'm not sure where you got this idea that it's all about brainpower from.

 

[Olas]

Bob, you need to lay off the Dark Knight Rises, it's not comparable to the Green Lantern, even Man of Steel is nowhere near comparable to it, even according to your own reviews. You're complaints about Green Lantern circled heavily around horrible visuals which is what you praised about Man of Steel, and I don't think your problem with GL's script was that it was too "dark" and "joyless".

So why are you holding these movies side by side? I get that you've made a hobby out of complaining about Man of Steel every chance you get, but why does The Dark Knight Rises keep getting dragged into this? Was is really the B-movie fare you keep making it out to be?

Oh, and I think the best person to be playing Batman right now is NOBODY. Can we please give this character a rest.

 

[spartan231490]

Sorry Bob, I couldn't even make it to the two minute mark. I really really like your videos, and this one was particularly interesting, but for the love of all that is holy either speak with or without the Bostonian accent. I like your no-accent voice. I like your accent voice. However, I can't stand it when you slip in and out every 3 words, as a very auditory person, it's insanely annoying. Again, I love your videos, I even love your accent, it's the flickering on and off that drives me off the wall.

 

[pearcinator]

Affleck has the looks for Batman but I don't know if he can pull off the voice...he's always like baring his teeth while he talks and is sometimes hard to understand.

 

[Mirrorknight]

Been of the firm opinion of Can Affleck do Bruce Wayne? Oh hell yes, defiantly. Can he do Batman...ehh....not so convinced.
Of course, the main problem , as Bob has already pointed out, is that DC/WB need to quit being so damn embarrassed to do comic book movies and just let them be comic book movies. Working out fine for Marvel/Disney.

 

[drthmik]

I personally have no opinion on Ben Afleck as Batman
and I agree that it's silly to cry over it
However I am sick and tired of hearing movie bob cry like a little baby brat over Superman
in nearly every video
he puts out
to the point that he is now grouping it with the Green Lantern and bringing it up in subjects that have little to do with the superman movie.

It's kind of Hypocritical to call people out for crying like babies about something they don't like but that he is fine with then he turn right around and cries like a baby about something he doesn't like

this obsession of his makes me tired and at this rate I'm going to stop watching his videos which makes me sad as I used to enjoy watching them

 

[Li Mu]

Bob loves Affleck because Joss Wheadon loves Affleck. It's as simple as that. Bob can be a very professional film journalist at times, but he has something of a Jekyll and Hyde personality once comic books enter the room. When films based on a comic book or geek show (think Star Trek) come into the picture, Bob loses all objectivity and becomes a gibbering fan boy. He forgets to view the film based on it's qualities and sees it purely based on how well it caters to his fan boy passions.
Time and time again we have seen him worship the all mighty Joss Wheadon, blessed be his name, and treat him as a man who can do or say no wrong.
I am likely wrong, but I like to think that Bob hated the idea of Affleck as Batman before Wheadon showed his support.

In this particular case, I think Bob is actually right, but it doesn't change the fact that he needs to start trying to approach comic book movies with a bit more objectivity and a little less fanboyism.

 

[Kingjackl]

Bob loves Affleck because Joss Wheadon loves Affleck. It's as simple as that. Bob can be a very professional film journalist at times, but he has something of a Jekyll and Hyde personality once comic books enter the room. When films based on a comic book or geek show (think Star Trek) come into the picture, Bob loses all objectivity and becomes a gibbering fan boy. He forgets to view the film based on it's qualities and sees it purely based on how well it caters to his fan boy passions.
Time and time again we have seen him worship the all mighty Joss Wheadon, blessed be his name, and treat him as a man who can do or say no wrong.
I am likely wrong, but I like to think that Bob hated the idea of Affleck as Batman before Wheadon showed his support.

In this particular case, I think Bob is actually right, but it doesn't change the fact that he needs to start trying to approach comic book movies with a bit more objectivity and a little less fanboyism.

Where'd you get that idea from? If you followed his Twitter, you'll see Bob's been defending Ben Affleck since the first announcement. Know what his reasons were?

Hollywoodland, State of Play, The Town and Argo. No mention of Joss Whedon anywhere. He's a film critic for god's sake, when he says Affleck's a good actor, he knows what he's talking about.