The Big Picture: Off the Charts
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Mass Effect had a bad story. If you wanted to include a modern game with a good story you could have went with Winter Voices.danpascooch said:
Anyway, he said it because he is starving for attention. If you haven't noticed Moviebob is the online equivalent of Fox News, go through all his videos on "The Big Picture" and you will realize that everything he says is for sensationalism and that he tries to spur some controversy, mostly because this is the only way he can lure viewers. As someone said it earlier:
Currently, I'm just watching him for the ego-boost.tkioz said:
moviebobs so biased he could make fox news blush. he makes good points every now and then but i watch him for entertainment value, i take very little of what he says seriously. the first time i really started to question him was when he was talking about games as art and seemed to imply that mario 3 was the strongest example of games as art. really, bob, really? he looks especially bad when you compare him with extra creditsbmart008 said:
For all those who are clamoring for Fillion to be Drake: Seriously, give it a rest. He's too old and fat to be Drake.
To clarify why a lot of people, that I have had discussions with, have issues with the movie adaptation is not because they are not ripping the story out and just using that. It is because they have basically taken everything out of uncharted that is uncharted. Granted the actual story plot of the uncharted games would probably not make the best movie but they could at least leave the characters alone and not completely change the back story and motivations of the character. I think one of my favorite parts of Nathan Drake is that he really does not care about saving treasures as much as he cares about making money and that he is not your standard National Treasure character/Indiana Jones Character. There is so many directions they could go with a character like this but alas they are changing him to be a family oriented belongs in a museum character which is about as far from Nathan Drake as you can get.
I will give you another example Doom the movie alot of gamers I know would probably have given 2 shits less about any other part of that movie as long as it had 2 main themes. Hell has broken broken loose and some guy is going to chop shoot and blow up everything in his way. After that they could have added any story they wanted to it and most gamers I know would probably not hate it as much as we did when we found out that all the sudden the gates of hell has been transformed into a virus.
In conclusion I really do not think videogame movies need to be a direct rip from the game but at least keep the main overarching plot points there. They are the main reason most people love a game they are also what most people will be looking for consciously or subconsciously when going to the movie. We are familiar with the character and have spent a good amount of time with them playing through a game. We know their mannerisms we know how they should probably act in certain situations. So leave those details alone and build a story on top of it. IN OTHER WORDS PLAY THE DARN GAMES IF YOU ARE GOING TO MAKE A MOVIE ABOUT THEM get to know the characters get to know the world and what it is about and then build a story for that world if you have another story in mind with different motivations and characters great but do NOT use the game name just to use the game name. I AM LOOKING AT YOU FF:Spirits Within(which I thought was a decent movie but did not need or warrant the FF name)
I will give you another example Doom the movie alot of gamers I know would probably have given 2 shits less about any other part of that movie as long as it had 2 main themes. Hell has broken broken loose and some guy is going to chop shoot and blow up everything in his way. After that they could have added any story they wanted to it and most gamers I know would probably not hate it as much as we did when we found out that all the sudden the gates of hell has been transformed into a virus.
In conclusion I really do not think videogame movies need to be a direct rip from the game but at least keep the main overarching plot points there. They are the main reason most people love a game they are also what most people will be looking for consciously or subconsciously when going to the movie. We are familiar with the character and have spent a good amount of time with them playing through a game. We know their mannerisms we know how they should probably act in certain situations. So leave those details alone and build a story on top of it. IN OTHER WORDS PLAY THE DARN GAMES IF YOU ARE GOING TO MAKE A MOVIE ABOUT THEM get to know the characters get to know the world and what it is about and then build a story for that world if you have another story in mind with different motivations and characters great but do NOT use the game name just to use the game name. I AM LOOKING AT YOU FF:Spirits Within(which I thought was a decent movie but did not need or warrant the FF name)
As a avid movie goer, an freelance game writer, I would have to say it is very ignorant and displeasing for me to hear Bob open his month on this. And this is coming from someone who until now has agreed with everything you have posted.
Uncharted had better dialog then most movies out in the last couple of years, and not being able to explore the game or its 2nd then writing off its dialog, when can only be contextualized through game play, is not only dreadful but so unlike you Bob. I expect crap like that from Yahtzee, not from you.
Also saying that Nathen Drake is a douche shows that you miss allot of what actually is going on, and a character who is constantly being dicked over by others, while playing off his own adventurous greed and knowing what he must do to ether protect or prevent things form happening that have been set in to motion from his greed.
That is not even looking in to the character, this is all surface stuff.
I mean take it as you will, but i fell you missed a good opportunity to actually put together something more thought provoking.
Uncharted had better dialog then most movies out in the last couple of years, and not being able to explore the game or its 2nd then writing off its dialog, when can only be contextualized through game play, is not only dreadful but so unlike you Bob. I expect crap like that from Yahtzee, not from you.
Also saying that Nathen Drake is a douche shows that you miss allot of what actually is going on, and a character who is constantly being dicked over by others, while playing off his own adventurous greed and knowing what he must do to ether protect or prevent things form happening that have been set in to motion from his greed.
That is not even looking in to the character, this is all surface stuff.
I mean take it as you will, but i fell you missed a good opportunity to actually put together something more thought provoking.
I find this comment to be odd, because many Japanese games have more unique elements to their narrative than American games. Let's be honest, most American games, in terms of narrative, are either copying Halo, Half Life, Balder's Gate, or Elder Scrolls. Japanese games, more often than not, are doing odd things that we can't necessarily process because of our cultural biases, thusly, we take all the different things they do and catagorise it as 'wierd asian shit' when in reality, that stuff is as different to them as 'Red Riding Hood' and 'Hansel and Gretel' is to us. To an outside, those stories look some kids in the woods doing wierd stuff with cookies that get tricked and killed at the end. But we know the subtle nuances that make them VERY different.Nightv said:
Most of the time, this bias comes from the idea that, because Final Fantasy 7 is so much like Final Fantasy 7 that they must be derivatives of each other, that this is somehow something that japanese video game companies do as a total design philosophy.
So, let's say that Citizen Kane was instead called Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. It would still be one of the great classic films and loved by almost everyone, but you don't think fans of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles would have any right to be upset about it's content having nothing to do with TMNT? You don't see where the problem is?zelda2fanboy said:
Honestly, as far as Uncharted is concerned, I don't care about the film one bit. I played the games when they were called Tomb Raider and Drake had a much larger chest, and I watched the movies already when they were called Indiana Jones. Whether the Uncharted movie is any good or not doesn't make any difference. In fact, sure, if this new Uncharted that has very little/nothing to do with the games looks like a good movie I might go see it.. but I still think that fans of the Uncharted games have every right to be ticked off when a movie supposedly based off the game series is really just "borrowing" the name.
In an universe where 90% of the dialogue and scenes of characters standing around doing nothing would be cut. If it were put in a movie-form, necessarily that would happen, and even if it wouldn't be stellar, it would be better than the cutscenes in games.mireko said:
When I think of "Story" in games, the story-telling doesn't always come to mind as much as context, which attaches meanings to the elements of a game (characters, locations, etc.) to remember/refer them by, be it Eastern or Western. Take Demons' Souls for example:
* Story: The player is a silent adventurer on a quest to defeat an evil entity.
* Context:
** A stark contrast of Bolivia: between the "prosperous land" mentioned in the intro and the mess the player ended up in. [Uncertainty; Horror]
** The player dies soon after entering Bolivia. The soul remains, but cannot pass on even though, by in-game implications, it normally should. [Helplessness; Weakness]
** All five stages display just how much the land has fallen throughout. [Horror; Fear; Chaos]
** Amidst the hordes of hell-spawn and abominations, the player can die very very easily. [Survival]
These are just a handful of general context presented within the very first hour of the game. Sure, DS has a minimal/simplistic story, but it holds a lot of context by which it can be remembered. Various developers naturally prefer various methods to merge that context with their games, be it through cinematics (many modern titles), bodies of text (visual novels and many RPGs) or just passive narration (Demons' Souls); maybe there are more. I don't find one method to be superior/inferior to another; as long as the context is coherent enough, the players can take it in without much difficulty, and ultimately left an emotional impact on them after it's over, I'd call that a game's "Mission Accomplished".
* Story: The player is a silent adventurer on a quest to defeat an evil entity.
* Context:
** A stark contrast of Bolivia: between the "prosperous land" mentioned in the intro and the mess the player ended up in. [Uncertainty; Horror]
** The player dies soon after entering Bolivia. The soul remains, but cannot pass on even though, by in-game implications, it normally should. [Helplessness; Weakness]
** All five stages display just how much the land has fallen throughout. [Horror; Fear; Chaos]
** Amidst the hordes of hell-spawn and abominations, the player can die very very easily. [Survival]
These are just a handful of general context presented within the very first hour of the game. Sure, DS has a minimal/simplistic story, but it holds a lot of context by which it can be remembered. Various developers naturally prefer various methods to merge that context with their games, be it through cinematics (many modern titles), bodies of text (visual novels and many RPGs) or just passive narration (Demons' Souls); maybe there are more. I don't find one method to be superior/inferior to another; as long as the context is coherent enough, the players can take it in without much difficulty, and ultimately left an emotional impact on them after it's over, I'd call that a game's "Mission Accomplished".
I don't care how good the director might be, games are inherently designed in completely different ways to a movie. They deliver an experience that the GAMING audience desires. Movies are designed to deliver an uninteractive experience for MOVIE-WATCHERS. Making a video game movie is a Monumental task. Anyone capable of conquering such a feat, will have the foresight to think.... 'hmm... maybe i could work with the GAME makers, and integrate the story into their All ready established franchise.' This could create an interesting and very much in-depth way of creating a story for a game.
Some of you may, therefore, complain that this is just profit mongering. But, wouldn't you pay for an in-depth, immersive gaming experience? Even if that means you have to sit through 90 mins of prequel material?
And please don't quote Assasin's Creed at me. That was not a movie. That was a pile of dog shit.
Some of you may, therefore, complain that this is just profit mongering. But, wouldn't you pay for an in-depth, immersive gaming experience? Even if that means you have to sit through 90 mins of prequel material?
And please don't quote Assasin's Creed at me. That was not a movie. That was a pile of dog shit.
I couldn't sit through the first Uncharted game because it's bloom got boring at the story bored me fromt he get go, so hopefully the movie does better
I did start the 2nd game last night, and find the story a little more satisfying so far. Yes it's got National Treasure syndrome, but the levels started feeling sprawling, and I started to enjoy the game, maybe because I was picturing the Prince of Persia doing all this only unable to run on walls and flail while making wise-ass jokes, but the way it's told so far through flashbacks makes me wonder what the hell happened that Drake was on a train, and also how the hell he can leap across chasms and such with half his blood on the OUTSIDE of his body
Hopefully the film is able to capture that feeling I'm getting from the second game, because rarely do I enjoy the "let's see how it all happened through flashbacks" approach to story telling, who knows, it could work
I did start the 2nd game last night, and find the story a little more satisfying so far. Yes it's got National Treasure syndrome, but the levels started feeling sprawling, and I started to enjoy the game, maybe because I was picturing the Prince of Persia doing all this only unable to run on walls and flail while making wise-ass jokes, but the way it's told so far through flashbacks makes me wonder what the hell happened that Drake was on a train, and also how the hell he can leap across chasms and such with half his blood on the OUTSIDE of his body
Hopefully the film is able to capture that feeling I'm getting from the second game, because rarely do I enjoy the "let's see how it all happened through flashbacks" approach to story telling, who knows, it could work
Considering what examples he comes with for "truly good games with a great story"... yeah, he is a console fanboy.
And those games haven't got a good story either.
And saying a "good story for a western game" shows a real bias for Japanese games... which often have a ridiculous story. Especially RPGs.
And they already did Mario. Remember the disaster it was?
By the way, in which universe does Movie Bob lives where Metal Gear Solid ISN'T a movie?
Wait... what are you saying? It's a game!? Could've fooled me Kojima.
And those games haven't got a good story either.
And saying a "good story for a western game" shows a real bias for Japanese games... which often have a ridiculous story. Especially RPGs.
And they already did Mario. Remember the disaster it was?
By the way, in which universe does Movie Bob lives where Metal Gear Solid ISN'T a movie?
Wait... what are you saying? It's a game!? Could've fooled me Kojima.
Yeah, it's a real shame there isn't an androgynous whiny teenager with an oversized sword and garish outfit in this game.Bob said:
But I kid, and digress. The reason for Hollywood's constant and unabashed failure in making particularly good or honest video game adaptations, be they a fairly bad Silent Hill or a reprehensible Alone in the Dark, is actually a problem with the medium.
Books, movies, comics, tv shows: they all differ in many ways, but they do share a single constant. They all lack any form of viewer input(save for Choose Your Own Adventure, I guess). Sure, TV shows bow to ratings demands, as do book series, comics, and movie sequels. But none of these media are interactive.
Despite what jawless, crotchety old men may mindlessly blurt out, games are an artistic medium unto themselves. But the world they create differs from those created by competing media. The player crafts his/her experience far more than the game does(at least, if the game's any good at what it does). The art involved in a game becomes more than just a story woven by the developer, but a reflection of the player his/herself. Movies can't do that. They can come close, even as far as keeping themselves vague enough that the viewer will craft a perspective that differ wildly from their fellow man, but ultimately everyone sees mostly the same thing, in slightly different ways.
When creating a game, one has to create a reasonable, believable(not realistic, just believable) world, with a sort of underlying consistency. Games often have the luxury of subtlety: depending on how you play a game, there may be entire corners of that world you are completely unaware of. Games have hours upon hours to unravel their story and conjure up their characters. Movies have two hours to accomplish all this. Games have the upper hand with a lot of things: the player is more disposed to identify with their character, since if they don't care for how long they live they're not going to get far in the game. The player is often driven by other, less story-like aspects to complete the game, therefore having a reason to have their ass glued to the chair. Movies have to establish a story, make it involved enough to keep one watching, all while actually managing to tell a story.
Try as one might, cramming 10-80 hours of gameplay into a two-hour film reel is a herculean task, made all the more difficult by a director/writer/producer/actor/grip's passing interest in the medium they are taking things from. So, until you get someone who's actually chomping at the bit to make a movie based on a game, you're going to get mediocre sludge for the time being. Not good enough to be a standalone movie, not loyal enough to the source material to make for a compelling piece for the fans.
) keep it up