The Big Picture: Super Single
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They're not killing off Peter Parker though. They're killing off the 'Ultimate' version of Peter Parker which is basically an alternate universe version that was made up 10 years ago or so. The regular Peter Parker from the 60's is still alive and well.Okysho said:
While I really enjoy these videos shortening the stories of the comics down, it does make me sad to think that most of these comics and characters have such a massive backstory, that I'll never understand it all.
he named TWO big results of the reboot, and then talks about the one that is LESS interesting.
what about Barbara Gordon being able to walk again ?
does this mean she was never shot by the Joker ?
if so then this means :
A)No Oracle
B)No Birds of prey
C)No Cassandra Cain and (by extension) Stephanie Brown as Batgirl.
Congrats DC...
You just managed to erase 3 of my Favorite Elements in the DC universe from existing.
Bravo.
the Batgirl thing in praticular annoys me because, while i like Barbara Gordon a lot, she doesn't have all that much setting her apart as Batgirl.
as Oracle, she's a force to be reckoned with in the DC-verse.
but as Batgirl... she's diminished
she doesn't have the more interesting elements that make the follow on Batgirls unique.
she doesn't have Cassandra Cains insane combat skills and weird communications issues.
she doesn't have Stephanie Browns entire "she's basically the biggest screw up of the Batman family who is trying to redeem herself" angle that makes her so endearing.
hell, one of the best parts of the Newer Batgirl series is the fact that BOTH of them have a complex mentor/apprentice relationship with Barbara (especially Stephanie).
as Oracle, Barbara Gordon is an amazing character, and probably one of my top 3 characters in the DC-verse.
as Batgirl, she's just another masked crime fighter in a city where you can't throw a stick in the air without it landing on a masked crime fighter.
and they are having Gail Simone do the writing for the new series, which to me seems like a hail Mary pass.
they knew that this would be problematic
aside from erasing the characters i named, it also means removing what is probably the DC-verse prime example of a disabled person who is nevertheless a superhero.
having Gail Simone writing Barbara Gordon as batgirl seems like a dream come true on some levels...
but i can't help but feel that the price is too high.
what about Barbara Gordon being able to walk again ?
does this mean she was never shot by the Joker ?
if so then this means :
A)No Oracle
B)No Birds of prey
C)No Cassandra Cain and (by extension) Stephanie Brown as Batgirl.
Congrats DC...
You just managed to erase 3 of my Favorite Elements in the DC universe from existing.
Bravo.
the Batgirl thing in praticular annoys me because, while i like Barbara Gordon a lot, she doesn't have all that much setting her apart as Batgirl.
as Oracle, she's a force to be reckoned with in the DC-verse.
but as Batgirl... she's diminished
she doesn't have the more interesting elements that make the follow on Batgirls unique.
she doesn't have Cassandra Cains insane combat skills and weird communications issues.
she doesn't have Stephanie Browns entire "she's basically the biggest screw up of the Batman family who is trying to redeem herself" angle that makes her so endearing.
hell, one of the best parts of the Newer Batgirl series is the fact that BOTH of them have a complex mentor/apprentice relationship with Barbara (especially Stephanie).
as Oracle, Barbara Gordon is an amazing character, and probably one of my top 3 characters in the DC-verse.
as Batgirl, she's just another masked crime fighter in a city where you can't throw a stick in the air without it landing on a masked crime fighter.
and they are having Gail Simone do the writing for the new series, which to me seems like a hail Mary pass.
they knew that this would be problematic
aside from erasing the characters i named, it also means removing what is probably the DC-verse prime example of a disabled person who is nevertheless a superhero.
having Gail Simone writing Barbara Gordon as batgirl seems like a dream come true on some levels...
but i can't help but feel that the price is too high.
Regardless (how is that different from superman hooks up with wonderwoman in an alternate universe anyways?) I still would like to hear how Marvel reached this decision. I'm not going to try and understand what the point of the alternate universes are for (especially not after reading marvel zombies) I'm just curious, besides it'd make a good episode.Xenominim said:
I don't agree with removing the red underwear Bob. Weren't you the guy who advocated going back to the old school Batman costume in the films instead of the bulky power armor?
Does nobody realise this isn't a complete reboot? DC has stated again and again that they aren't restarting from zero. A brief glance at the Batman and Green Lantern books will tell you that. Whilst there are some tweaks to previous continuity (from the looks of things - Justice League, Superman, Teen Titans), it isn't as widespread and pervasive as most people seem to be thinking. The biggest thing about this relaunch (yes, 'relaunch', not 'reboot') is mostly the costume redesigns and a more diversified book line, coupled with a synchronised point at which any person can jump in reading. This isn't about erasing old continuity, it's about bringing in new readers.
Of course, whether or not it will succeed is open to interpretation.
Of course, whether or not it will succeed is open to interpretation.
You're fuckin' kidding, right?Shameless said:
I always thought a good way to deal with comic book marriage was to have the "regular" half of the couple develop a drinking habit to deal with the constant worry and stress.
If Mary Jane had become an alcoholic at least it would have given Spidey something else to keep harping on about every ten issues. Instead of "boo hoo, I killed my uncle; I can never relax again" or "boo hoo, I killed my girlfriend; I can never love again", we could have "boo hoo, I put my wife in rehab; I can never have anything to do with anyone ever again."
I loved the character and the comics for a long time (still like the character at it's core) but damn, the writers do like to make him a whiny ***** sometimes.
OT: As far as Superman and Lois being split up; I can see the arguments for it, but it just seems like something that would make him less connected to humanity to me.
If Mary Jane had become an alcoholic at least it would have given Spidey something else to keep harping on about every ten issues. Instead of "boo hoo, I killed my uncle; I can never relax again" or "boo hoo, I killed my girlfriend; I can never love again", we could have "boo hoo, I put my wife in rehab; I can never have anything to do with anyone ever again."
I loved the character and the comics for a long time (still like the character at it's core) but damn, the writers do like to make him a whiny ***** sometimes.
OT: As far as Superman and Lois being split up; I can see the arguments for it, but it just seems like something that would make him less connected to humanity to me.
Bob are you familiar with The Sentry? Pretty much Marvel's early 2000s ultra realistic version of Superman that has a cooler concept then most writers can handle if your not. Though more on topic, they show how the most powerful person in the world probably gets along with marrying a normal person, and that is not well. Not well at all.
And I hope they keep Supes single for a while and play the field a bit. Nothing says "internal strife that you simply solve by throwing it in the Sun" like a woman, am I right fellas?............. Yeah I'm totally right.
And I hope they keep Supes single for a while and play the field a bit. Nothing says "internal strife that you simply solve by throwing it in the Sun" like a woman, am I right fellas?............. Yeah I'm totally right.
I'm enjoying all of Bob's videos, even though big picture is 50% comics and I've never read them, I still find them interesting. Keep up the good work.
And then Sentry devolved into an invincible, boring, irritating character nobody liked. Nobody at Marvel knew what the hell to do with the guy.ManupBatman said:
Nope, all that stuff happened, she was Oracle, Cass and Steph were Batgirls and BOP happened. Babs is getting 'fixed' somehow.bladeofdarkness said:
The basic point of the Ultimate Universe is to tell stories that simply can't happen (mostly because of the inevitable fan bitching) in the regular Marvel universe, such as Peter Parker dying a heroic death and inspiring another young man to take up the Spidey mantle.Okysho said:
The reason they decided to tell this particular story is that the various writers and editors thought it would be a good story, simple as that.
You're not alone there... even if there is going to be a Birds of Prey series, Oracle is nowhere to be seen.bladeofdarkness said:
Even if for some reason Barbara got the use of her legs back, how would that make sense for her to go back crimefighting as BatGIRL? *facepalm*As for the video... I disagree. I understand the real world parallel of army wives but still knowing their spouse is going to be in constant danger does not prevent them from getting married, does it?
It does boil down to what was said above, running out of ideas, and trying to make sense of a world where time does not lapse and things have to stay the same and still appealing. They're just stirring the pot just to keep reader's attention, not by the quality of their work but by ticking them off. *shrug*
I think that putting Clark through a dating process could be entertaining. Usually Superman stories are fun, but his alter-ego is dull. This could be just what the comic needs.
For me, the Superman books just never caught my interest. I don't read the books; not because I don't like him as a character but simply because the everyday stuff he gets into between the huge events where he can be challenged by forces that could actually kill him just don't interest me. Supes is nigh indestructable against most things, so him doing anything less than fighting huge god-like entities like Darksied or the Anti-Monitor seems just dull to me.
As such, come the DC relaunch, I'm not going to use it as a jumping on point to start reading the Superman books. As such, I could not care less about whether he's married or not. The comics from what I've gathered usually treated their marriage as an incidental thing anyway, so there's that.
However, one thing about Superman and marriage irks me: the idea some writers (predominantly of elseworlds stories) have that Superman should be shipped with Wonder Woman. Bob touched on this a bit in the video, but here's the more important issue. The only reason they support this ship comes from the delusion that the most powerful man in the world should "logically" be paired with the strongest woman in the world.
Thing is, this isn't logical at all. Putting aside that the two have nothing in common outside of their superheroing, from a story perspective this severely limits what writers can do when it comes to their relationships. If a superhero marries or gets into a relationship with a normal human, that lends itself to endless drama and interesting storylines. If two superheros shack up, what tension is there to be had? Why should one worry about the safety of the other when both have saved the world a hundred times over?
And also, as that whole "Flash Family" saga of Wally West's tenure as the primary Flash (before Barry Allen came back), is it really better to abandon all the non-powered supporting cast of a book in favor of just developing the heroes? No damnit! The supporting cast is often the ones that get the most character development in a book because they need to be defined by more than just their name, costume, and powers, because they have none. What the SupermanxWonder Woman shippers are trying to do is define a relationship not through their individual characters, but simply through their powers. And that is how a hack writes!
As such, come the DC relaunch, I'm not going to use it as a jumping on point to start reading the Superman books. As such, I could not care less about whether he's married or not. The comics from what I've gathered usually treated their marriage as an incidental thing anyway, so there's that.
However, one thing about Superman and marriage irks me: the idea some writers (predominantly of elseworlds stories) have that Superman should be shipped with Wonder Woman. Bob touched on this a bit in the video, but here's the more important issue. The only reason they support this ship comes from the delusion that the most powerful man in the world should "logically" be paired with the strongest woman in the world.
Thing is, this isn't logical at all. Putting aside that the two have nothing in common outside of their superheroing, from a story perspective this severely limits what writers can do when it comes to their relationships. If a superhero marries or gets into a relationship with a normal human, that lends itself to endless drama and interesting storylines. If two superheros shack up, what tension is there to be had? Why should one worry about the safety of the other when both have saved the world a hundred times over?
And also, as that whole "Flash Family" saga of Wally West's tenure as the primary Flash (before Barry Allen came back), is it really better to abandon all the non-powered supporting cast of a book in favor of just developing the heroes? No damnit! The supporting cast is often the ones that get the most character development in a book because they need to be defined by more than just their name, costume, and powers, because they have none. What the SupermanxWonder Woman shippers are trying to do is define a relationship not through their individual characters, but simply through their powers. And that is how a hack writes!