The Devil

[AceDefective]

The devil or El diablo if you perfer is the evelist thing in existence he will come for you for douting his powers and he does not " play well with other"

 

[FallenRainbows]

I just realised that God is a dictator :S

Took ya time Didn't You?

 

[Gerazzi]

in utter randomness, I will now bring Shakespeare into this:
"there is no good or evil, just what we perceive as good or evil"
that is, yes, dumbed down to fit regular joes...
but you get the idea, right?

 

[Abedeus]

"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist."

Could someone explain me this one. Is it suppose to mark atheist or the christians that only beleive in god? Is it some kind of metaphor? Should we beleive that there is no symbol of evil for someone? Is it some kind of philosophical sentence that makes you think?

i think its meant to mean that if people believed there was no ultimate punishment afterwards then they wouldnt be afraid of killing, raping, watching high school musical etc. remember that christianity is basically a religion based on fear of being royally screwed in the end.....well at least it was in teh old days

No. People who worship God of fear are probably going to Hell anyway. Because they are doing it wrong.

People who worship God out of love will go to Heaven. Because they trust in God and know that he won't punish them if they don't do bad things.

...Or just Satan wants to punish people because he's spiteful. Don't forget, he makes people do bad things to watch other people suffer. He likes to see the pain.

Ah, but now you're saying that Satan makes people do bad things, which would mean that there is no free will and God failed in his task.

I worded it poorly. He suggests people to do bad things. If you are of weak will, you will give in and commit a sin. Then HE gets you.

can you explain to me the meaning of "god -fearing" as in every context it is seen as a plus, i.e in an old play i read back in 2nd year a minister said "dont worry child if you are truely a god-fearing disciple he will protect you....or something along those lines xD

God fearing is paranoic fear of God. It was one of the bad things in Christianity in the dark ages, in Medieval times. And it was really, really stupid.

If I was a Christian I'd be a heretic who believes Satan is just another person of the Holy Trinity (Holy Quartet?). If he's an enemy of God, why does God Almighty keep him around?
That or that he's equal to God like in Zoroastrianism.

Uhm. He doesn't keep him around? He banished him to Hell.

That's a detail. God let Satan exist and have influence on human lifes instead of destroying him without any effort...
Anyway, it's religion, it makes no sense, so you're just as right as I am.

Uhm. FREE WILL. And freedom to exist. God can't kill anyone. I mean, he can, but he doesn't do that. Because there would be no point in creating, as even the worst sinner can repent and (with enough remorse and sacrifice and so on) be saved. I'm not a preacher or anything, but it's just something like this:

Why create humans, if you know everyone will sin at least one time?

Dude, read the fucking Bible, God (the fictional one you all worship) allegedly killed thousands if not a few million.

Yes, let's blow it out of the proportions.

It was Old Testament. You want to talk about OT, talk to a Jew. I'm Christian (kind of) and Christians believe in OT, but only when it comes to stuff promising Jesus and so on.

 

[Shaenightbird]

I don't believe the Devil exists at all. It's a myth created to take the rap for human evil, the same as the god mythos is allegedly the force for good, because people consistantly refuse to take personal responsibility for either their evil or divine actions. They prefer instead to attribute their actions to influence from some outside source.

 

[fletch_talon]

because disproving omnipotence requires omnipotence

How does that work? Why do you think unlimited poweris required to see the flaw in the idea of unlimited power.

Omnipotent = all powerful
All powerful = nothing is impossible

If God creates an object/being that he is incapable of destroying then he does not have sufficient power to destroy the item, thus he is not omnipotent.

If God is incapable of creating such an object/being then clearly there is a limit to what he is capable of, thus not omnipotent.

I'm not challenging your belief in God, and should he exist then he would undoubtedly be the most powerful force/being in existance, all I'm saying is that the word omnipotent cannot accurately be applied to anything, not even God.

 

[Abedeus]

"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist."

Could someone explain me this one. Is it suppose to mark atheist or the christians that only beleive in god? Is it some kind of metaphor? Should we beleive that there is no symbol of evil for someone? Is it some kind of philosophical sentence that makes you think?

i think its meant to mean that if people believed there was no ultimate punishment afterwards then they wouldnt be afraid of killing, raping, watching high school musical etc. remember that christianity is basically a religion based on fear of being royally screwed in the end.....well at least it was in teh old days

No. People who worship God of fear are probably going to Hell anyway. Because they are doing it wrong.

People who worship God out of love will go to Heaven. Because they trust in God and know that he won't punish them if they don't do bad things.

...Or just Satan wants to punish people because he's spiteful. Don't forget, he makes people do bad things to watch other people suffer. He likes to see the pain.

Ah, but now you're saying that Satan makes people do bad things, which would mean that there is no free will and God failed in his task.

I worded it poorly. He suggests people to do bad things. If you are of weak will, you will give in and commit a sin. Then HE gets you.

can you explain to me the meaning of "god -fearing" as in every context it is seen as a plus, i.e in an old play i read back in 2nd year a minister said "dont worry child if you are truely a god-fearing disciple he will protect you....or something along those lines xD

God fearing is paranoic fear of God. It was one of the bad things in Christianity in the dark ages, in Medieval times. And it was really, really stupid.

If I was a Christian I'd be a heretic who believes Satan is just another person of the Holy Trinity (Holy Quartet?). If he's an enemy of God, why does God Almighty keep him around?
That or that he's equal to God like in Zoroastrianism.

Uhm. He doesn't keep him around? He banished him to Hell.

That's a detail. God let Satan exist and have influence on human lifes instead of destroying him without any effort...
Anyway, it's religion, it makes no sense, so you're just as right as I am.

Uhm. FREE WILL. And freedom to exist. God can't kill anyone. I mean, he can, but he doesn't do that. Because there would be no point in creating, as even the worst sinner can repent and (with enough remorse and sacrifice and so on) be saved. I'm not a preacher or anything, but it's just something like this:

Why create humans, if you know everyone will sin at least one time?

Dude, read the fucking Bible, God (the fictional one you all worship) allegedly killed thousands if not a few million.

Yes, let's blow it out of the proportions.

It was Old Testament. You want to talk about OT, talk to a Jew. I'm Christian (kind of) and Christians believe in OT, but only when it comes to stuff promising Jesus and so on.

So you don't believe in a book that pre-dates the book you believe in.
thats like dismissing a sequel because you don't like what was said.
Man you religous types sure can pick and choose and still remain orthodox to somebody.

Those are your words. Mine were "I don't believe in EVERYTHING they wrote there". Okay, how about a comeback? You read a Newsweek.

You accept everything? Even if you are not sure?
You don't accept something, even a tiny thing? You atheists are sure picky.

Who said I'm orthodoxic? I haven't been to church since... I think since Christmas. I just like the mythology. Every mythology. Even Chinese.

 

[Abedeus]

because disproving omnipotence requires omnipotence

How does that work? Why do you think unlimited poweris required to see the flaw in the idea of unlimited power.

Omnipotent = all powerful
All powerful = nothing is impossible

If God creates an object/being that he is incapable of destroying then he does not have sufficient power to destroy the item, thus he is not omnipotent.

If God is incapable of creating such an object/being then clearly there is a limit to what he is capable of, thus not omnipotent.

I'm not challenging your belief in God, and should he exist then he would undoubtedly be the most powerful force/being in existance, all I'm saying is that the word omnipotent cannot accurately be applied to anything, not even God.

God bends the law of physics/gravity/thickness of the item. Or makes it undone.

 

[Abedeus]

"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist."

Could someone explain me this one. Is it suppose to mark atheist or the christians that only beleive in god? Is it some kind of metaphor? Should we beleive that there is no symbol of evil for someone? Is it some kind of philosophical sentence that makes you think?

i think its meant to mean that if people believed there was no ultimate punishment afterwards then they wouldnt be afraid of killing, raping, watching high school musical etc. remember that christianity is basically a religion based on fear of being royally screwed in the end.....well at least it was in teh old days

No. People who worship God of fear are probably going to Hell anyway. Because they are doing it wrong.

People who worship God out of love will go to Heaven. Because they trust in God and know that he won't punish them if they don't do bad things.

...Or just Satan wants to punish people because he's spiteful. Don't forget, he makes people do bad things to watch other people suffer. He likes to see the pain.

Ah, but now you're saying that Satan makes people do bad things, which would mean that there is no free will and God failed in his task.

I worded it poorly. He suggests people to do bad things. If you are of weak will, you will give in and commit a sin. Then HE gets you.

can you explain to me the meaning of "god -fearing" as in every context it is seen as a plus, i.e in an old play i read back in 2nd year a minister said "dont worry child if you are truely a god-fearing disciple he will protect you....or something along those lines xD

God fearing is paranoic fear of God. It was one of the bad things in Christianity in the dark ages, in Medieval times. And it was really, really stupid.

If I was a Christian I'd be a heretic who believes Satan is just another person of the Holy Trinity (Holy Quartet?). If he's an enemy of God, why does God Almighty keep him around?
That or that he's equal to God like in Zoroastrianism.

Uhm. He doesn't keep him around? He banished him to Hell.

That's a detail. God let Satan exist and have influence on human lifes instead of destroying him without any effort...
Anyway, it's religion, it makes no sense, so you're just as right as I am.

Uhm. FREE WILL. And freedom to exist. God can't kill anyone. I mean, he can, but he doesn't do that. Because there would be no point in creating, as even the worst sinner can repent and (with enough remorse and sacrifice and so on) be saved. I'm not a preacher or anything, but it's just something like this:

Why create humans, if you know everyone will sin at least one time?

Dude, read the fucking Bible, God (the fictional one you all worship) allegedly killed thousands if not a few million.

Yes, let's blow it out of the proportions.

It was Old Testament. You want to talk about OT, talk to a Jew. I'm Christian (kind of) and Christians believe in OT, but only when it comes to stuff promising Jesus and so on.

So you don't believe in a book that pre-dates the book you believe in.
thats like dismissing a sequel because you don't like what was said.
Man you religous types sure can pick and choose and still remain orthodox to somebody.

Those are your words. Mine were "I don't believe in EVERYTHING they wrote there". Okay, how about a comeback? You read a Newsweek.

You accept everything? Even if you are not sure?
You don't accept something, even a tiny thing? You atheists are sure picky.

Who said I'm orthodoxic? I haven't been to church since... I think since Christmas. I just like the mythology. Every mythology. Even Chinese.

Atheists are not part of a collective group and cannot be analysed as one.

If your not religous why create this fuss?

Because I don't like ignorance. Whether about religion or anything else.

 

[Zydrate]

The 'devil' did not make nukes. Scientists and god-fearing religious politicians did.

 

[TheRightToArmBears]

I'm not that bad.

 

[fletch_talon]

because disproving omnipotence requires omnipotence

How does that work? Why do you think unlimited poweris required to see the flaw in the idea of unlimited power.

Omnipotent = all powerful
All powerful = nothing is impossible

If God creates an object/being that he is incapable of destroying then he does not have sufficient power to destroy the item, thus he is not omnipotent.

If God is incapable of creating such an object/being then clearly there is a limit to what he is capable of, thus not omnipotent.

I'm not challenging your belief in God, and should he exist then he would undoubtedly be the most powerful force/being in existance, all I'm saying is that the word omnipotent cannot accurately be applied to anything, not even God.

God bends the law of physics/gravity/thickness of the item. Or makes it undone.

Mmhmmm... so does he destroy it or not?
a)yes - then he couldn't create an indestructible object
b)no - then he couldn't destroy an indestructable object

Also, if God is omnipotent he can't make a being more powerful than he is, because such a being would be more than omnipotent, and since omnipotent means all powerful, that just isn't possible.

Because I don't like ignorance. Whether about religion or anything else.

You're suggesting we IGNORE part of the Bible because it's the part that primarily applies to the Jewish people. Yet it is still part of the Christian Bibleand it does seem to involve God killing people. If this isn't a side of God that the Christian faith believes is accurate then why is it still included in the book which is the foundation of all their beliefs.

 

[The Infamous Scamola]

I'm not that bad.

You're not that cool either, if you know what I mean.

 

[Del-Toro]

Now, as it stands, God is the seemingly benign dictator who hands out harsh sentences for every person who so much as nibbles on shrimp or doesn't sell off his daughter into slavery.

That's a very odd belief, I'm amazed how ill informed people are about religion and yet they choose to comment on it like they know something.

People talking about something they don't fully understand in a matter meant to believe they are experts? Sounds like your average "Freethinker" to me. I didn't quote the rest of what you said but it really does put those rules into perspective. Besides, a mistranslation resulting in something like that, especially from a religion that has been going at Judaism for so long sounds about right to me. Although the translation was probably made during the Roman or pre-diaspora era so that is probably an innaccurate observation to make. I never really got the fish thing but given that alot of the bible likely consists of secular laws built into the scripture for the sake of enforcement I'm sure there is a good reason for it. Of course, that's impossible to prove one way or another because none of us were alive back then, so all we can do is theorize. As is the case for everything in this thread. You can't reasonable say that something like Dante's Inferno is anything but fiction regardless of your beliefs. If you're christian, then it's an artistic interpretation, if you aren't then it's just fiction. So basically there can be no definitive stance in this thread, given that no side(theists,atheist) can prove their stance to carry any more weight than any other.

 

[Sindre1]

I just realised that God is a dictator :S

Took ya time Didn't You?

Yes, yes I did.
Mind you, most of the time I think of him I wonder if he is real or not, not what kind of leader he is.

 

[JoshasorousRex]

I'm a lazy Christian and don't think about this stuff much but I think the devil is the one who tried to tempt Jesus right?

 

[FallenRainbows]

I just realised that God is a dictator :S

Took ya time Didn't You?

Yes, yes I did.
Mind you, most of the time I think of him I wonder if he is real or not, not what kind of leader he is.

Let me help, He isn't.