Let me know how that works out for you... Oh wait, BioWare don't care since they aren't actually getting a cut for trade-in resales, hence the policy.Omnific One said:
Meanwhile, in Signature Edition territory, things are looking great.Assassin Xaero said:
Then I guess it IS free since other people will have to pay for it. And fuck capcom.obscurumlux01 said:
Above: Person who understands nothing about our economic system insulting others for their ignorance.obscurumlux01 said:
Goods and services are priced based off of their relative rarity and worth to the consumer, not by some divine statement that Game Developers Must Put Everything They Produce On One Disc For You, Always Priced At 50 Dollars USD. This is the way that it was in the past, but its not anymore. It HAD to be this way. There was no method for them to sell you more of their stuff. Expansion packs used to get a lot of shit for not being released in the main game or just expanded into a sequel. Game development costs have skyrocketed over the years, and yet costs have increased... nothing for PC gamers, and 10 dollars for console gamers. Maybe they need the money? You are not entitled to a single thing that a game developer produces. If Bioware decides to say that levels 1 through 6 are included in the main game, and 7, 8 and 9 will be sold separately as DLC, that's their decision too. If you think DLC should only be produced and made available after the games release, well that's fine, but the rest of us don't care. I'm not stupid because I'm willing to buy day 1 DLC, I'm willing to buy it because that is its value to me. That's how much I will enjoy it. Other companies offer all of their work up for 50 dollars straight up, and then start working on the next title. And I think their work is shit. I work for my money, and I'm more than willing to throw down 100 dollars total for all the content they will produce for Dragon Age 2 like I did for Dragon Age 1, because Bioware has proven time and again to me that it will be worth it.obscurumlux01 said:
You aren't entitled to that content in the first place. You didn't pay for it. You paid for exactly what Bioware and EA decided were to be included with the game. You never were entitled to everything they would ever develop in relation to the game. Get over yourself, growing up will be a lot less harsh for you if you face reality now.obscurumlux01 said:
Who, me? I don't know what you're talking about. Baaa.
It's not so much about entitlement as it is about an observable decline in value for money. Like you said, the value of a video game is a very subjective thing so it is quite difficult to observe when the customer is getting less worth for there money than they did in the past, but here it is obvious that they are.MisterShine said:
I considered that. Then I remembered, rolol, it's bioware.sir.rutthed said:
That's what I keep telling myself, but don't forget EA's in the equation as well. If they interfere too much it could cancel out Bioware's awesome. Also, mathematical speaking, the longer Bioware goes without making a bomb the more likely it is they'll make one. To this day, I don't think they've ever even made a mediocre game by most standards (except Mass Effect for iPhone, but honestly who counts that?) so they're long past due. Also, it's on Steam as of today. Comes with the 2 bonuses for preordering.TsunamiWombat said:
I would disagree. You and I may think so (And I do), but there is a large base of consumers and fans who would much rather pay 50 dollars for Modern Warfare 3 than Baldur's Gate 3, and would get a lot more enjoyment out of it. I think those people are inhuman monsters who I should flee to the safety of underground tunnels to escape from, but their enjoyment is no less legit than mine.T said:
Sure, and if I wait until 2012 to buy Dragon Age 2, I bet I could get the whole game plus the inevitable expansion and slew of DLC for about half the price of what I'm paying to get just the main game on release day. However, that isn't, to me, worth it. As my Warcraft goblin says so often, time is money friend! It is worth it, to me, to get to play 80% of the "full" DA2 experience and pay more for it immediately than to wait a while for it to get cheaper. I understand why you and many others don't agree, and that is your choice and I would never say that it's the wrong choice. My intent in my original post was to point out that people who DO make the choice that I do are not stupid for doing so, as that is how we value the product, and that we do not feel entitled to any content produced by the company. And since Bioware and EA are making stupid amounts of money off of this, obviously a lot of people agree with me. I know this makes things annoying for people like you, but you simply have to understand that Bioware and EA are doing only exactly what they are meant to do, and in fact HAVE to do: Make money.T said:
Here's the other side of the point I was trying to make. Why do you feel it is that you are entitled to this piece of content the company decided it didn't want to sell you with the main game?T said:
Ah, a Bio-boy. Fun.manythings said:
doesn't make sense as they DO care if I buy it new versus used. If they didn't why would there be Project Ten Dollar?
This is what I meant when I said that it is difficult to gauge when a customer is getting less value for their money becuase of the subjective nature of the experience. What I mean is that 95% of [Game X] is worth less than 100% of [Game X], regardless of whether Game X is Modern Warfare 3 or Baldur's Gate 3 or Dragon Age 2.MisterShine said:
I definetly don't think you're stupid for making the choice you are, I'm just trying to articulate why I'm making the choice I am (and work it out for myself too). The reason why I react so negatively to your choice is that it sort of renders my choice meaningless. The choice to boycott the product (or buy used or whatever) only matters if the loss of sales offsets the extra money they're making from your sale; it'll only work if enough people do it. Reading my original post again, I realise that I reacted a little too viscerally and described things too hyperbolically because of this. It probably won't lead to devs/pubishers selling all of the game, piece by piece; I don't think they're that brazen. It probably will boil down to me having to just wait longer for games so that the reduced costs offset the fact that I'll have to pay more for the DLC sections of the game, or I guess just miss out on those portions of the game, either of which I can live with (to be honest, I wouldn't have bought the game at release anyway, because I was very dissapointed in the first game). But I'll fight it because there's no reason for me to want it; I'm not getting some extra bonus in exchange for this, I'm just being charged more. Like you said: "Bioware and EA are doing only exactly what they are meant to do, and in fact HAVE to do: Make money." Well, I'm doing very much the same thing. We're both trying to get the best deal for ourselves, get the biggest value for the least cost.
I still don't think it's about entitlement. It's about...precendent, I guess. We used to have a deal where they made a game and sold it to me. Now they're offering a new deal wherein they make a game and sell me most of it and then sell me the rest of it. I see no reason why I should take them up on that offer. I don't begrudge the fact that they tried to make that offer, but it's just a bad deal for me compared to what we were doing previously.
But what I'd realy, really like to avoid is a situation where people buy DRM infested products becuase that's just how games come, because people bought them in the first place for the convenience and companies realised they could sell games with it in. It doesn't look like that's happening (maybe. Hopefully. Please don't let me down, Ubisoft) but it requires enough people to refuse to agree to deal with companies that put DRM in their games.
Well, consider this, if obscurum's original post had been said in such a manner, then you wouldn't have posted anything and we wouldn't be having this conversation and my evening would have been less interesting, so it was worthwhile. Sort of.
It's funny because of everyone thought this way Dragon Age 2 would flop and there wouldn't be a compilation version.seditary said:
Glad to see some common sense. Pre-order "bonuses" are ripoffs that try to lock people into early purchases, before reviews can come in. All they're doing is screwing over people who do not have limitless budgets and want to see what they'll actually be getting.obscurumlux01 said:
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