The Fallout Debate
- Thread starter MiracleOfSound
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It was a wise move by them to shift more units.Mozza444 said:
I agree with the OP. I do not hate fallout 3, it is one of the best games out with some quality download content. However as a sequal to the first two it's not great. It certainly is easier than 1 and 2. Anyone who hasnt played the first 2, you know not the true horror of a deathclaw.
This sums up my experience of the Fallout games too, playing both the original and F3 in a short time makes it obvious that they are different games that happen to share a setting.Nimzar said:
The first is very harsh and unforgiving, which is very appropriate for a post-apocalyptic wasteland, but it makes the game frustrating at times. F3 is easier on the player, but then this makes the game too easy at later levels, and you feel invulnerable when you can VATS anything you find to death before it can hit you.
The other main difference is the freedom and story-telling. F3 has the freedom to wander across the entire map, while the original was much more limited in where you could actually explore (unless you liked small squares of bland desert). But its dark humour was fantastic, and as atmospheric as F3's plot is, the original had a much better set of side-quests and moral dilemmas. Choosing between a blatantly good path and a clearly evil one isn't a moral dilemma, it's just a "do you feel like being a dick today" choice. Choosing to help one group of people over another when neither is good or evil is a much more interesting decision to make, and you learn a lot more about your opinions when you have to do so...
I played fallout and I think Fallout 3 is a much better game and I think I agree, mostly..
Humour: I thought Fallout 3 was much more "funny" than Fallout.
Claustrophobic Atmosphere: I agree the "feel" of the games is very diffrent, its prehaps too easy to use all skills in Fallout 3. That makes the game more open than any use of perspective.
Its still very Fallout and I like the way they made the Brotherhood Heros yet included the Outcasts, best of both worlds. I'm a bit annoyed at people who say the fallout 3 Brotherhood are not really the Brotherhood.
Its a Fallout game to the core, but you are right, its more suited to a cannon aside rather than a direct sequel, not being decended from the Vault Dweller most likely counts in favor of that.
Humour: I thought Fallout 3 was much more "funny" than Fallout.
Claustrophobic Atmosphere: I agree the "feel" of the games is very diffrent, its prehaps too easy to use all skills in Fallout 3. That makes the game more open than any use of perspective.
Its still very Fallout and I like the way they made the Brotherhood Heros yet included the Outcasts, best of both worlds. I'm a bit annoyed at people who say the fallout 3 Brotherhood are not really the Brotherhood.
Its a Fallout game to the core, but you are right, its more suited to a cannon aside rather than a direct sequel, not being decended from the Vault Dweller most likely counts in favor of that.
This pretty much sums up my feelings on the matter. I love FO3, I have bought all the DLC and played it to completion, but it just lost so much in the transition from FO2 - 3 that it seems like it isn't truly a fallout game. I just hope new vegas will bring back the RPG complexity and multiple ways to solve quests that was present in the first two.MiracleOfSound said:
No opinion is wrong, I agree with every point you make.
But I also like all three games, because they're different. If I want a game like Fallout 1 an 2, I play them.
But I also like all three games, because they're different. If I want a game like Fallout 1 an 2, I play them.
I like all 3, I just prefer Fallout 2, its just more my kind of game, every action can make or break your character.
I personally found the interface of the 1st 2 to have a hard learning curve to say the least. Fallout 3 was an execellent game but i can see why some people would hate it.
I found Fallout 3 to be dodgey and dull. One thing that really annoyed me about it was that you could just fast travel everywhere. There should of at least been a car like in Fallout 2.
I found the originals to be far more desolate and intriguing, though remember; while you judge the originals, they only have so much ability in the way of technology. Bethesda couldn't even make a great vanilla game though if it came up and slapped them in the face.
I found the originals to be far more desolate and intriguing, though remember; while you judge the originals, they only have so much ability in the way of technology. Bethesda couldn't even make a great vanilla game though if it came up and slapped them in the face.
I loved Fallout 1 and 2, and also loved Fallout 3, at first.
The beginning of Fallout 3 had all the atmosphere and story I expected, and the initial exploration was amazing.
However, further into the game I found it became a little too easy in places, with repetitive bandit encounters starting to become more annoying than threatening, as well as ending up with more loot than I could carry. I guess this is the sacrifice for being so open-world; if you're meant to be able to explore anywhere then you need to be able to deal with what's there.
Still, I'll be picking up the DLC while it's on offer this week
The beginning of Fallout 3 had all the atmosphere and story I expected, and the initial exploration was amazing.
However, further into the game I found it became a little too easy in places, with repetitive bandit encounters starting to become more annoying than threatening, as well as ending up with more loot than I could carry. I guess this is the sacrifice for being so open-world; if you're meant to be able to explore anywhere then you need to be able to deal with what's there.
Still, I'll be picking up the DLC while it's on offer this week
I've played Fallout 3, right through to all the DLC and for me it was a game like nothing I 've experienced before. Now reading the comments on people who have played the originals, I feel like I'm missing out on something. I realise that it too would be a completely different experience, but thats what I liked abot f3, it was something different. Now hearing thta Fallout 1 and 2 are tough and challenging games, I'm definitly keeping an eye out for them.
One thing I really wish Fallout 3 had:
The low intelligence dialogue options. So fucking funny...
Gotta hate those nefarious bugmen
The low intelligence dialogue options. So fucking funny...
Gotta hate those nefarious bugmen
Yeah, Fallout 3 has one nod towards that, but nothing else.MiracleOfSound said:One thing I really wish Fallout 3 had:
The low intelligence dialogue options. So fucking funny...
Gotta hate those nefarious bugmen
Also, power armour is meant to be POWER ARMOUR, not tin plate held together with chewing gum.
Thank god for mods- My Fallout 3 plays a lot harder. A couple of good hits with a rifle kills a raider. And the player. And most other things. Except dudes in power armour. You'll need a gauss rifle and a good sneak skill to get close to one-shotting them.
Yeah, the power armour was weak as shit, I always stick to my Ranger Battle Armour.Sebenko said:Yeah, Fallout 3 has one nod towards that, but nothing else.MiracleOfSound said:One thing I really wish Fallout 3 had:
The low intelligence dialogue options. So fucking funny...
Gotta hate those nefarious bugmen
Also, power armour is meant to be POWER ARMOUR, not tin plate held together with chewing gum.
Thank god for mods- My Fallout 3 plays a lot harder. A couple of good hits with a rifle kills a raider. And the player. And most other things. Except dudes in power armour. You'll need a gauss rifle and a good sneak skill to get close to one-shotting them.
I hate that the power armour makes you lose Agility... why Nerf the most iconic costume in the game??
EDIT:
Where was the nod, by the way?
I think the OP is dead wrong. F3 is hated because the story sucks, the ending is atrocious, the dialogue is poor and it lacks the humour of the first two. Those are the things that people loved about the first two, atleast the people I know. Bethesda always fails on these points in all their games and I can't for the life of me understand why they don't hire a professional writer to handle these things for them (or fire the incompetent one they have now).
Fallout 3 has the Wasteland Survival Guide and a few other rare gems, but mostly it was bland. I always read everything in games, but in Fallout 3 I stopped reading all the hacked computers because they were always pointless. It could have been the best game ever, but they failed. There's nothing I hate more than lost potential.
Fallout 3 has the Wasteland Survival Guide and a few other rare gems, but mostly it was bland. I always read everything in games, but in Fallout 3 I stopped reading all the hacked computers because they were always pointless. It could have been the best game ever, but they failed. There's nothing I hate more than lost potential.
I absolutely adore the Fallout series, so much so that I own Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel (for which my soul will burn in eternal hellfire), but anyways here is how I would rank the games in the fallout series
I consider Fallout 2 to be the best game in series by far, even with all the bugs not all of which are a detriment to the game (like the having the wandering luggauge compartment save my life on many occasions) and various patching issues. It has a great story, a certain charm and a dark sense of humour which I have yet to find in any other series, and as such I can't help not loving it.
Fallout 1 takes my second place; in small part because it is the first in the serious but mostly because it has a tight story arc and quest progression, and finally but not least because of The Master ("join. die. join. die." being my all time favourite villian speech ever).
Third place goes to Fallout Tactics: Brotherhood of Steel, if for no other reason than it introduced the "hawk" power armour and the gauss minigun. It was also the first fallout game that was radically different from Fallout 1 and 2 with its innovative CTB (Continous Turn Based) system.
Fourth place goes to Fallout 3, and my sentiments were pretty much described by
And taking last place is Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel, the main reasons being the lack of character creation,
the skill trees ripped directly from the baldurs gate console games(which are almost equally bad), shoddy gameplay, an interesting if rather weak story and last but not least your soul being damned to eternal hellfire for owning it.
I'm very much looking forward to New Vegas and fervently hope it will be good game, worthy of the fallout name.
I consider Fallout 2 to be the best game in series by far, even with all the bugs not all of which are a detriment to the game (like the having the wandering luggauge compartment save my life on many occasions) and various patching issues. It has a great story, a certain charm and a dark sense of humour which I have yet to find in any other series, and as such I can't help not loving it.
Fallout 1 takes my second place; in small part because it is the first in the serious but mostly because it has a tight story arc and quest progression, and finally but not least because of The Master ("join. die. join. die." being my all time favourite villian speech ever).
Third place goes to Fallout Tactics: Brotherhood of Steel, if for no other reason than it introduced the "hawk" power armour and the gauss minigun. It was also the first fallout game that was radically different from Fallout 1 and 2 with its innovative CTB (Continous Turn Based) system.
Fourth place goes to Fallout 3, and my sentiments were pretty much described by
The DLC helps to improve the game but ultimately if you just explore a bit you'll hit the level cap before having completed even a quarter of the game(something which comes as second nature to any fans of the originals). What I found the most lacking however, was the sense of humour present in the other games.
And taking last place is Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel, the main reasons being the lack of character creation,
the skill trees ripped directly from the baldurs gate console games(which are almost equally bad), shoddy gameplay, an interesting if rather weak story and last but not least your soul being damned to eternal hellfire for owning it.
I'm very much looking forward to New Vegas and fervently hope it will be good game, worthy of the fallout name.
I loved Fallout 1 & 2 when I got them way back in 2002. I had never played anything but JRPGs. Imagine my surprise when I found out you could literally kill anyone in Fallout. It was a very surreal moment for me.
"Holy shit! I can actually affect the outcome of my game?"
That being said, I still love Fallout 3, even with all it's limitations. It's my favorite Fallout.
I just look at the games as two different styles of design but set in the same world. I like both styles for very different reasons. As much as I like the first two - and they are hard as hell, that is no joke - I'm not able to immerse myself in them as much as the third. Perhaps it's because like the OP says, the third has a more serious, realistic tone. Whatever the case, I think they all stand on their own as great games, despite their flaws.
I don't think you are alone on the sequel thing being a problem. Bethesda is working pretty hard to remind everyone that New Vegas is not a sequel. It was in the first press release I ever read about the game.
"Holy shit! I can actually affect the outcome of my game?"
That being said, I still love Fallout 3, even with all it's limitations. It's my favorite Fallout.
I just look at the games as two different styles of design but set in the same world. I like both styles for very different reasons. As much as I like the first two - and they are hard as hell, that is no joke - I'm not able to immerse myself in them as much as the third. Perhaps it's because like the OP says, the third has a more serious, realistic tone. Whatever the case, I think they all stand on their own as great games, despite their flaws.
I don't think you are alone on the sequel thing being a problem. Bethesda is working pretty hard to remind everyone that New Vegas is not a sequel. It was in the first press release I ever read about the game.