Oh, really? Oop.ravenshrike said:Item one, Beale IS Day. Same person. Really, we don't need more than one.
That's a pretty colossal wall-o'-text, in all honesty. I'd appreciate a summary.ravenshrike said:Item two, you could have read the post 5 up from yours where I quote a post from Dave Freer on that very subject. And if you are dubious about what he claims, why, you could go look at the log rolling in the Nebula vote totals prior to 2010 yourself if you wished. Then you could note the names of those doing the log rolling and lo and behold, a series of VERY familiar names pops up.
As for the log, it's unfortunate, but hardly demonstrates that merit was dismissed in favour of other considerations.
Jesus Christ, that's utterly painful to read.Archon said:Non-Sad Puppies Author John Brown just posted an interview with VD asking him bluntly he genuinely believes. There is an insightful follow-up discussion with a bunch of sci-fi authors, too.
http://www.johndbrown.com/what-vox-day-believes/
Charming.Day said:"It increasingly appears that a society is improved by widespread female education through high school, and harmed by it beyond that level. If you look at the demographics, a society that sends its women to college stops breeding. How this is supposed to benefit a society, I do not understand".
[...]
"The reason women shouldn?t vote in a representative democracy is they are significantly inclined to vote for whomever they would rather f***".
Those arguing against the Puppies may simply be reacting to what they see as a highly-political attempt to affect the awards, not because they're an entrenched group protecting their interests.EvilRoy said:Basically my thought is that you can only have a war with at least two sides. If a group shows up with heavy politicization we would only ever even hear about it if someone decides to fight them on it. In this case we automatically got the fight, because as you said the new group (is it weird that I can't bring myself to type the name? it sounds so stupid to me...) claimed that they were the ones showing up to fight the first group.
Look at me; I'd fight them on it, and I'm not a part of any established clique. Look at GRRM, whose concern is for the awards.
Well, we can hope.EvilRoy said:But eventually, the people who showed up to fight because they heard there was a fight are going to get bored and leave. Around the same time the news services shut up, typically. Once they do, the only people left fighting are the people who were always part of the Hugos - and if there are enough to actually swing votes one way or the other, then chances are it means that ideology has played a role in the past. Before the fights took place under wraps - not because of nefarious schemes, but because people were voting politically on their own and one side just had more people - but now the genie is out of the bottle, so the fights will be public or not at all from now on because each side now knows the other exists.