The R Word

[Helmholtz Watson]

Maybe because we don't say rape because it can be a trigger that can send people into psychological meltdowns? murder torture and starvation are as bad or worse than rape regarding the act and it is no more insensitive to say rape then murder, but it can actually hurt people unlike the others.

I can think of some old Jewish people who would disagree with you about that, specifically about casually using words like torture or murder. They are very sensitive about those words, given what happened to them.

Well, when you put it in context, saying "rape" is hardly relevant to the subject of whatever it is used in (gaming, specifically when referring to another party as "getting raped" when they are getting owned), has trauma associated with it, and has hateful implications, as it is generally considered an act that can never be considered merciful.

And murder doesn't have any relevance when I'm playing and losing at a racing game like Gotham Project racing, and yet people still use that word to demonstrate how I have lost against them.

Murder tends to be a little more neutral as while trauma can be associated with it, murder can also mean one person killing another through any number of ways, a number of which are considered more kind-hearted and understandable (as strange as that sounds). It also has some vague associations with the acts that it is used to described, such as "I just murdered that guy!" in a FPS/fighting game (games about violent acts).

So what your saying is that murder has gone through a semantic shift? Well I think "rape" is going through a semantic shift as well.

In either case, that's not REALLY what everything is about. It's not the "Why this word is harmful?" but the "Why do we use this replaceable word with negative associations to describe an action that has nothing to do with said word?" Not why the word is bad, but why do we continue to use a word that's considered to be bad. The former is worth wondering about, but isn't what things are approaching.

I guess a semantic shift is the reason why.

 

[Farthing]

Nicely done.

With regard to Feminism:
I have no problems with people that support the independence and equality of the individual, but on numerous occasions I've had self-proclaimed feminists tell me that men are "inferior", "animalistic", "evil", and the source of all violent crime. These weren't one-of incidents, and the feminists were pretty high profile, one of them having a doctorate in sociology. A recurring theme was that men are the cause of all sexual crimes, and without men there would be no sexual crimes. The data doesn't wholly support this, but there is something like an 80-20 split between male and female perpetrators of sex crimes in the United States. So it is quite natural (in my experience) for feminists to bring up the subject of sex-crime. It is also quite natural for those taking the opposite position to claim that sex-crime is only a big deal because of feminists. In both cases, the majority of people discussing the issue are using the issue as a lever more than actually trying to stop it.

I'm not saying all feminists are like this, but when an author can publish several books on the subject I imagine there is at least a small-but-non-trivial group that supports these ideas.

With regard to Freedom of Speech:
It is possible to use foul words and concepts in a light-hearted context. For example see almost every comedian ever, but it remains that this possibility does not give one the right to make others uncomfortable, hurt, and remember things they wish to forget. No one can censor themselves for every possible trauma a person might have, but once aware of those traumas, as the gaming community is being made aware presently, it is our responsibility to be courteous to our fellows.

I wish you good luck in your journalism, and happiness in your life Anonymous.

 

[Imrix]

Why not? Why would I treat their friends and family with less care than the victim? Both are suffering.

...

No we can't agree. If you wouldn't tell my grandmother a holocaust joke, then don't tell me one.

So, your sympathetic pain for your grandmother's suffering, decades after the fact and second-hand, is equal to hers, who lived through it?

You're right, we can't agree.

 

[disappointed]

Thank you.

It's all a question of what sort of culture we want. Do we want it to be inclusive? If so then we should keep our behaviour civil and supportive. We are all strangers. It will be hard for us to get along with each other if we don't go out of our way to make it happen. Cheap, hateful, violent language is something we don't need.

Gaming should be better than this. When you're spending millions making a game, you shouldn't introduce an issue you know to be painful for many people without sanity checking your treatment of it with someone who better represents those people's experiences. The trouble is that gaming has made war and murder acceptable topics without ever doing these checks. It's set a poor precedent, a low bar that developers are reluctant to raise. Gaming should have better standards for itself, out of humanity, civility and self-respect.

Wrong, For example the call of duty guys do the whole game in respect of these people who had people die in a war. They actually do it and talk about it with people who survived a war or saw people getting killed infront of their own eyes. And these soldier are very grateful that other people can experience what they had to. They are grateful that its not a topic you dont talk about it.

Oh, that's good. We should do that for other subjects, like rape.

And here in the west such topics like rape when used in games will never be used without showing how cruel this is or without thinking.

Good, but that's slightly different from consulting with, for example, rape support charities on the presentation of the subject, which is what I was suggesting.

Take Japan for example. ITs almost normal to see pornovideos which feature rape. There are tons of games were you rape little girls in trains or school buildings. There are games and movies about rapeclubs and so on. Stuff you will never ever see in western games. Infact people arguing that these kind of openess prevents rape acts. Just look how Japan has not only one of the lowest criminal records but also less rape victims and attempts world wide.

I would say that "people [are] arguing..." is not a strong enough level of proof for a relaxing of our treatment of rape in popular media. There may be any number of other factors at play. Also, that doesn't address the issues talked about in the article, i.e. the effect of such media on victims. Assuming rape media were proven to cause a significant reduction in offending, that would have to be weighed against any undesirable consequences first. But it is something worth studying.

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

You're right, we can't agree.

Again, I'm not going to agree that its not ok to use the word "rape" because rape victims might get offended, but its somehow ok to use the term "murder" or "genocide" because "its just the victims families that will get offended".

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

You have free speech, you have the right to your opinion, but you do not have the right for that opinion to be correct or for your speech to go unchallenged. You can bet on it that I challenge your opinions that words such as "rape" or "genocide" are trivial.

I never said that my opinion can't be challenged, just that I have the right to say what I want on Xbox live.

Not on Xbox Live. Microsoft gets to dictate terms because it's their service. You can talk about rape and genocide all you want on your own website/blog/whatever.

People have and they do, whether or not it is allowed, it seems to be tolerated.

Of course not, that would be a dick move. But then, I wouldn't expect you to offer the same tenderness and sympathy to the friends and family of a rape victim as I would expect you to offer to the victim themselves.

Why not? Why would I treat their friends and family with less care than the victim? Both are suffering.

In the same vein, I'm not going to offer you the same sympathy I would to somebody who personally suffered such a massive loss. It still counts, it still deserves sympathy, but I think we can agree that the wound is not quite as raw, and requires a little less care.

No we can't agree. If you wouldn't tell my grandmother a holocaust joke, then don't tell me one.

If your grandmother is in the mood for those kinds of jokes I would.

She isn't nor shall she ever be.

 

[adamselene]

Take Japan for example. ITs almost normal to see pornovideos which feature rape. There are tons of games were you rape little girls in trains or school buildings. There are games and movies about rapeclubs and so on. Stuff you will never ever see in western games. Infact people arguing that these kind of openess prevents rape acts. Just look how Japan has not only one of the lowest criminal records but also less rape victims and attempts world wide.

?and an incredibly mysogynistic culture, in which women are rarely allowed to do any professional work. Note that I've personally worked with a few tech companies in Japan over the years, and not one of them had even a single female engineer. Is that really a shining example?

It's also just possible that rape is even more underreported there.

 

[darji]

Thank you.

It's all a question of what sort of culture we want. Do we want it to be inclusive? If so then we should keep our behaviour civil and supportive. We are all strangers. It will be hard for us to get along with each other if we don't go out of our way to make it happen. Cheap, hateful, violent language is something we don't need.

Gaming should be better than this. When you're spending millions making a game, you shouldn't introduce an issue you know to be painful for many people without sanity checking your treatment of it with someone who better represents those people's experiences. The trouble is that gaming has made war and murder acceptable topics without ever doing these checks. It's set a poor precedent, a low bar that developers are reluctant to raise. Gaming should have better standards for itself, out of humanity, civility and self-respect.

Wrong, For example the call of duty guys do the whole game in respect of these people who had people die in a war. They actually do it and talk about it with people who survived a war or saw people getting killed infront of their own eyes. And these soldier are very grateful that other people can experience what they had to. They are grateful that its not a topic you dont talk about it.

Oh, that's good. We should do that for other subjects, like rape.

And here in the west such topics like rape when used in games will never be used without showing how cruel this is or without thinking.

Good, but that's slightly different from consulting with, for example, rape support charities on the presentation of the subject, which is what I was suggesting.

Take Japan for example. ITs almost normal to see pornovideos which feature rape. There are tons of games were you rape little girls in trains or school buildings. There are games and movies about rapeclubs and so on. Stuff you will never ever see in western games. Infact people arguing that these kind of openess prevents rape acts. Just look how Japan has not only one of the lowest criminal records but also less rape victims and attempts world wide.

I would say that "people [are] arguing..." is not a strong enough level of proof for a relaxing of our treatment of rape in popular media. There may be any number of other factors at play. Also, that doesn't address the issues talked about in the article, i.e. the effect of such media on victims. Assuming rape media were proven to cause a significant reduction in offending, that would have to be weighed against any undesirable consequences first. But it is something worth studying.

Actually you have crime statistics for it but people can still argue that most rape victims dont go to the police or report these crimes because shame plays a very big role in the japanese society.

As for in western games. I am just saying that you should not make it a tabootopic. people need to be aware of such things. And silence about this will not help anyone. Even the victims themself. Even if its hard for these people alking about such events will help these people to to overcome thee traumas at least a bit.

 

[AncientSpark]

Well, when you put it in context, saying "rape" is hardly relevant to the subject of whatever it is used in (gaming, specifically when referring to another party as "getting raped" when they are getting owned), has trauma associated with it, and has hateful implications, as it is generally considered an act that can never be considered merciful.

And murder doesn't have any relevance when I'm playing and losing at a racing game like Gotham Project racing, and yet people still use that word to demonstrate how I have lost against them.

Fair enough, but that still doesn't necessarily necessitate the usage of "rape" as it is used in videogames. A person might go "" at most for being called out as being murdered in a racing game, but would understand the context. While I think it would be nice for "rape" to be disengaged from its negative connotation (not in the sense of the act's vileness, but how we can refer to murder in more everyday speech), that's not the reality of how people perceive it.

Murder tends to be a little more neutral as while trauma can be associated with it, murder can also mean one person killing another through any number of ways, a number of which are considered more kind-hearted and understandable (as strange as that sounds). It also has some vague associations with the acts that it is used to described, such as "I just murdered that guy!" in a FPS/fighting game (games about violent acts).

So what your saying is that murder has gone through a semantic shift? Well I think "rape" is going through a semantic shift as well.

Except that "rape" clearly isn't. The usage of Murder as a term is perceived clearly, so much so that when it is mis-used, it's understood what they meant. "Rape" isn't really THAT clear, despite as much understanding you and I have of it when we hear it on XBox Live. It's not really as neutral as the term "murder" is. It's actually getting less and less neutral as people become more offended by it, even as other people attempt to use it more and more as slang. It's not me who decides that, unfortunately, but the perceptions of people.

As to why that perception exists, well, look at the Jimquisition of this week. It's a pretty pedestrian, but reasonable view as to why that kind of happens.

In either case, that's not REALLY what everything is about. It's not the "Why this word is harmful?" but the "Why do we use this replaceable word with negative associations to describe an action that has nothing to do with said word?" Not why the word is bad, but why do we continue to use a word that's considered to be bad. The former is worth wondering about, but isn't what things are approaching.

I guess a semantic shift is the reason why.

But it's a semantic shift that is not accepted by the courtesy of most people. It's not us who decides that, it's society in general. It doesn't make any kind of statement to not accept that and we aren't really giving up anything by correcting its usage, so that's how things are.

 

[axlryder]

It's also just possible that rape is even more underreported there.

It is. It's considered unladylike to call out a groper, for instance.

 

[Deathwatch050]

Thank you for writing this article, anonymous person. It's people like you that give me hope that we really can make a difference by simply talking about and sharing our problems in an honest way. I really can't thank you enough for taking the effort and willpower and writing such an deep and meaningful article.

Big hug!

 

[axlryder]

Why not? Why would I treat their friends and family with less care than the victim? Both are suffering.

...

No we can't agree. If you wouldn't tell my grandmother a holocaust joke, then don't tell me one.

So, your sympathetic pain for your grandmother's suffering, decades after the fact and second-hand, is equal to hers, who lived through it?

You're right, we can't agree.

Actually, the children and grandchildren of Holocaust survivors have been shown to elicit symptoms similar to those of the individuals who went through the events, including PTSD. Obviously it's not identical to going through it, but the psychological trauma wrought on the child can be very severe.

 

[adamselene]

It's also just possible that rape is even more underreported there.

It is. It's considered unladylike to call out a groper, for instance.

The women I know in the U.S. who've been groped rarely do anything about it, either. Typically I advise them to kick the next one in the balls.

(Note: Not that groping is limited to men groping women.)

 

[axlryder]

It's also just possible that rape is even more underreported there.

It is. It's considered unladylike to call out a groper, for instance.

The women I know in the U.S. who've been groped rarely do anything about it, either. Typically I advise them to kick the next one in the balls.

(Note: Not that groping is limited to men groping women.)

Ah, the woman around where I am would probably go for an all out brawl (unless he had apparent gang affiliations). I guess the cultural climate across the U.S. is pretty varied. Also, yeah, I've seen some woman get pretty handsy.

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

Fair enough, but that still doesn't necessarily necessitate the usage of "rape" as it is used in videogames. A person might go "" at most for being called out as being murdered in a racing game, but would understand the context. While I think it would be nice for "rape" to be disengaged from its negative connotation (not in the sense of the act's vileness, but how we can refer to murder in more everyday speech), that's not the reality of how people perceive it.

Why are you assuming that those who have survived attempted murder can get over hearing the word "murder" online, but a person who has survived attempted rape can't get over hearing the word "rape" online?

It's actually getting less and less neutral as people become more offended by it, even as other people attempt to use it more and more as slang.

I would argue that because it is becoming more and more used as a slang term, it is more neutral than before. Thats not to say that it isn't still considered crude, but perhaps more along the lines of words like shit or ***** rather than ******.

As to why that perception exists, well, look at the Jimquisition of this week. It's a pretty pedestrian, but reasonable view as to why that kind of happens.

Again, I'm not downplaying that the word is still crude.

But it's a semantic shift that is not accepted by the courtesy of most people. It's not us who decides that, it's society in general.

Again I disagree, its usage at places like Xbox live shows that certain parts of society(see:teenagers and tweens) are accepting the word as a way to describe something that doesn't have to do with sexual violence.

 

[adamselene]

Why are you assuming that those who have survived attempted murder can get over hearing the word "murder" online, but a person who has survived attempted rape can't get over hearing the word "rape" online?

Let's be fair here. There are a LOT more people who have been raped than have come close to being murdered. In terms of offense/hurt/whatever per word usage, you're getting way more with the word ?rape?. Whether that inspires you to use the term more or less in a personal choice, but don't be surprised if people grade you on it.

 

[repeating integers]

Of course not, that would be a dick move. But then, I wouldn't expect you to offer the same tenderness and sympathy to the friends and family of a rape victim as I would expect you to offer to the victim themselves.

Why not? Why would I treat their friends and family with less care than the victim? Both are suffering.

In the same vein, I'm not going to offer you the same sympathy I would to somebody who personally suffered such a massive loss. It still counts, it still deserves sympathy, but I think we can agree that the wound is not quite as raw, and requires a little less care.

No we can't agree. If you wouldn't tell my grandmother a holocaust joke, then don't tell me one.

But does he have the responsibility to make sure he doesn't offend somebody?

 

[I_am_acting]

Rape is a word just like killed, murdered, starving, beaten, and genocide are words. There is no reason why the word rape should be treated like something special while the words I mentioned get an ok.

The grand majority of the Western World has trivialized starving. Violent video games by their very nature have trivialized murder, kill, and beaten. Why does sexual violence need to be brought into the picture for completely unrelated reasons? It doesn't. You don't need to make the word 'rape' mean nothing, because it fucking means something to the people who have been raped, and have to live with that for the rest of their lives. If you make a joke out of it, who's going to come forward to be laughed at?

And what of the family members of people who were murdered or who starved to death?