UPDATE: Microsoft Disallows Public Lesbians on Xbox Live

Andraste

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Cheeze_Pavilion said:
Andraste said:
Jamash said:
I agree with you, that it's the greater evil of the bigots who complained against her, which got her ToU violation noticed by Microsoft, that is the real issue here, not that she got banned for being a lesbian.

Microsoft can be accused of being many things, but I don't think homophobic is one of them (it's just not profitable to alienate a large section of society).
That is exactly the truth, very insightful with that parenthetical.
No it isn't--you really think anyone's going to stop paying for Xbox Live after finding out there's a lesbian on there?

If Microsoft thought it wouldn't be profitable to allow behavior on Xbox Live that alienates a large section of society...they wouldn't have included microphones.
I believe you are misunderstanding what I was saying. Allow me to clarify.

I do not think people will stop paying if there is a lesbian there. I DO think (and some people have said on this very thread) some people may stop paying if MS were to ban people for being gay. So it makes sense MS would not ban people for being gay.

And as the ToU disallow people from posting anything sex-related, not only was she breaking the terms of service, I suspect MS was trying to nip anything of this sort in the bud, as they don't want to have it remotely suggested they ban people for being gay. Or Chinese. Or purple. Just don't bring it up.
 

hippo24

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Who In their right mind puts "Im a lesbian" or something akin to that in their account?
I mean what would compel someone to put their sexual preferences in their public online profile, visible to stalkers and any malicious person?

Also I don't think putting something about sex in you profile, no matter how innocent, is a good thing when its visible to 5 year olds
 

Siris

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Jan 15, 2009
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This is unacceptable anywhere. I can't believe microsoft would allow this kind of behavior. Sony is not doing much better, but atleast they have openly admitted they were wrong. This can not be tollerated if we wish to make an open community for everyone to enjoy.

I will say this, however: you never see this shit happen with Nintendo...
 

Doug

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DraconianKing said:
Too many pages, so I'm just gonna post.

From what I did read, there's a lot of bitching about the girl because she shouldn't list "lesbian" on Xbox LIVE. Personally, if I were female, I'd probably listed "lesbian" or "married" even if I were neither just so the horde of immature males on the service wouldn't Friend Request me or send me messages.
I'm a straight male and I get enough as it is just by being good and respectful (for the most part). I'd rage if I had to fend off the horny nerds and other douches that seem to fill the majority of LIVE.

I think the parties are fault are the bigots who gave her shit and Microsoft for not fixing this problem by removing the neg-refs from her account and maybe even disabling the "reffing" ability of the people who neg-reffed her in the first place if they are continual offenders of neg-reffing people with no cause.

I know it's a big job, but I'd like to see some kind of right of a person who is neg-reffed to make some kind of case against the other party if they feel they are not in the wrong. Or even to make an apology to a gamer if they offended them.

But who listens to a bleeding heart democrat anyways?
Line of thought at Microsoft:

"We should really look into complaints in detail and make fair assessments about if someone needs to be banned or not"

"Oh...ok, how much would that cost?"

"Lets see....times the 4...minus the 3.... far too much."

"MEh, wanna just do it randomly?"

"Sure!"
 

Ginja Ninja

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xitel said:
violently anti-homosexual
Just quoting this bit for this

lololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololol

You can be labeled as "violently anti-homosexual" by reporting someone who states there sexual preferance... JUST BECAUSE THEY HAPPEN TO BE GAY??? You are a biggot, like a person who assumes a man who is gay must love all men, you assume all who feel it was inaproprate to state that must be homophobic.

Siris said:
This is unacceptable anywhere. I can't believe microsoft would allow this kind of behavior. Sony is not doing much better, but atleast they have openly admitted they were wrong. This can not be tollerated if we wish to make an open community for everyone to enjoy.

I will say this, however: you never see this shit happen with Nintendo...
Lol Microsoft aren't wrong it was perfectly fair. If Sony are just retarded for agreeing with what the majority think BECAUSE THE MAJORITY SEEM TO BE ANTI-anything that could be made out to be homophobic which probably isn't.
 

Doug

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Apr 23, 2008
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Siris said:
This is unacceptable anywhere. I can't believe microsoft would allow this kind of behavior. Sony is not doing much better, but atleast they have openly admitted they were wrong. This can not be tollerated if we wish to make an open community for everyone to enjoy.

I will say this, however: you never see this shit happen with Nintendo...
Erm... I don't have a Wii, so correct me if I'm wrong, BUT I'm pretty sure the Wii doesn't have a full profile/microphone/pseudo-social networking functions on its multiplayer system. Hence, makes it hard to get banned.
 

hippo24

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Baneat said:
Isn't that totally illegal?
Just as illegal as saying I love to have sex with women to a community that prohibits any sexual references in the terms and conditions.

Also I dont think anyone would be crying if someone got banned for saying they were "heterosexual" in their profile.
 

mooncalf

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Jul 3, 2008
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Microsoft has the legal resources to take whatever position it likes.
It has taken the position of "I don't mind homosexuals, I just don't want them around me."
Since this woman only used a profile to describe herself (that makes no sense, right?) She should have her subscription refunded in full.
 

Eldritch Warlord

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Something about online gaming networks that everyone should realize; the only people who would check your profile to find out more about you are either stalkers or going to freak out about it.

Therefore, don't put anything in your profile (aside from name and general locale if you want).

And most importantly, the only people you want giving a damn about your sexual preferences are people you know and trust (in other words, people who might learn it through long-term friendship or casual reference).

So in a way this is her fault, not saying Microsoft shouldn't make an effort to fix this (as the numerous complaints for offensive profile were unfounded). But she should have realized after people started following her and coercing others to file complaints that "I'm a lesbian" is not something she wants in her bio. Childishly denying that the world isn't perfect is no one's fault but there own.

EDIT: After skimming through a few posts it seems like a lot of people actually think she was banned for being a lesbian, this is not the case. She was banned because many people took offense at her being lesbian and filed a complaint under the category "offensive profile". Offensive profile is the sole detail in these complaints and the accumulation of enough complaint reports will result in banning. People can reverse this but the system is automated (and don't say it shouldn't be, the incredible expense of having people to payed to look into these things with a community the size of Xbox Live's is far greater than the expenses embodied in the occasional improper banning).
 

Doug

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Apr 23, 2008
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hippo24 said:
Baneat said:
Isn't that totally illegal?
Just as illegal as saying I love to have sex with women to a community that prohibits any sexual references in the terms and conditions.

Also I dont think anyone would be crying if someone got banned for saying they were "heterosexual" in their profile.
I would. I'm heterosexual and would be annoyed if someone was banned for stating they were so. Admittly, I'd wonder why they'd bothered to state the default, but that's not really important.
 

xitel

Assume That I Hate You.
Aug 13, 2008
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Ginja Ninja said:
xitel said:
violently anti-homosexual
Just quoting this bit for this

lololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololol

You can be labeled as "violently anti-homosexual" by reporting someone who states there sexual preferance... JUST BECAUSE THEY HAPPEN TO BE GAY??? You are a biggot, like a person who assumes a man who is gay must love all men, you assume all who feel it was inaproprate to state that must be homophobic.
I'm talking about the people that threaten to kill me when I'm playing games online because I happen to mention that I'm gay offhand. I mean start describing how they plan to slaughter me and laugh as I die because I'm a freak and a sick ******. I don't have a problem with people that say that it's offensive to put that information in her profile, since I know there are people who are offended by it. I'm talking about the people I have reported for threatening my life for being gay, and forwarding messages from them that said that, and being told "While we regret this kind of action, the users in questions have not violated the terms of use of our servers, and as such will not be banned".
 

Doug

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xitel said:
....I'm talking about the people I have reported for threatening my life for being gay, and forwarding messages from them that said that, and being told "While we regret this kind of action, the users in questions have not violated the terms of use of our servers, and as such will not be banned".
Now that's plain stupid. Mentioning sexual preference is a no-no but death threats and e-stalking is fine? Microsoft is so idiotic sometimes.
 

Ginja Ninja

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xitel said:
Ginja Ninja said:
xitel said:
violently anti-homosexual
Just quoting this bit for this

lololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololol

You can be labeled as "violently anti-homosexual" by reporting someone who states there sexual preferance... JUST BECAUSE THEY HAPPEN TO BE GAY??? You are a biggot, like a person who assumes a man who is gay must love all men, you assume all who feel it was inaproprate to state that must be homophobic.
I'm talking about the people that threaten to kill me when I'm playing games online because I happen to mention that I'm gay offhand. I mean start describing how they plan to slaughter me and laugh as I die because I'm a freak and a sick ******. I don't have a problem with people that say that it's offensive to put that information in her profile, since I know there are people who are offended by it. I'm talking about the people I have reported for threatening my life for being gay, and forwarding messages from them that said that, and being told "While we regret this kind of action, the users in questions have not violated the terms of use of our servers, and as such will not be banned".
Yes that makes more sense. Then that should have been dealt with... but why mention at all? If some people might take it wrong why say it?
 

Doug

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Apr 23, 2008
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Logan Frederick said:
UPDATE: Xbox Live policy director Stephen Toulouse responded to the Consumerist story via Twitter [http://twitter.com/Stepto?page=3] (via VG247 [http://www.vg247.com/2009/02/26/microsoft-finally-looking-to-stop-gay-bannings-on-live/], "Expression of any sexual orientation (straight or gay or otherswise (sic)) is not allowed in gamertags. However we've heard from the user base they want that capability, so I am examining how we can provide it in a way that wont get misused. I can't say any more at the moment, except to say I'm working right now in finding a way to safely express relationship preference."

Permalink
Nice to see that they don't make any comments on the verbal abuse nor on the e-stalking.
 

Ranooth

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Mar 26, 2008
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That is just disgusting, shame on Microsoft and those stalkers.

Honestly why would they follow a person and report them for that? No one does it with players too young for the game. Stuff like this makes me ashamed to be a gamer.
 

Yog Sothoth

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Dec 6, 2008
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Logan Frederick said:
...

UPDATE: Xbox Live policy director Stephen Toulouse responded to the Consumerist story via Twitter [http://twitter.com/Stepto?page=3] (via VG247 [http://www.vg247.com/2009/02/26/microsoft-finally-looking-to-stop-gay-bannings-on-live/], "Expression of any sexual orientation (straight or gay or otherswise (sic)) is not allowed in gamertags. However we've heard from the user base they want that capability, so I am examining how we can provide it in a way that wont get misused. I can't say any more at the moment, except to say I'm working right now in finding a way to safely express relationship preference."
Hey, maybe they could make an icon on your gamertag that denotes your sexual preference.... perhaps a rainbow colored unicorn for the queens, a flannel shirt for lesbians and a vanilla ice cram cone for the straight people....

What do you think, should I send Mr Toulouse my suggestion....?

EDIT: In all seriousness, I kinda have to side with M$ in this, though they could've handled it with more sensitivity... They've already stated that they don't want discussion of people's sexual preference on their network. Why is that so bad? That sort of content isn't related to online gaming, and the actions they took are consistent and even-handed. You'd get banned for stating you're heterosexual as well, so it's not like they've singled anyone out....
 

hippo24

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Doug said:
Logan Frederick said:
UPDATE: Xbox Live policy director Stephen Toulouse responded to the Consumerist story via Twitter [http://twitter.com/Stepto?page=3] (via VG247 [http://www.vg247.com/2009/02/26/microsoft-finally-looking-to-stop-gay-bannings-on-live/], "Expression of any sexual orientation (straight or gay or otherswise (sic)) is not allowed in gamertags. However we've heard from the user base they want that capability, so I am examining how we can provide it in a way that wont get misused. I can't say any more at the moment, except to say I'm working right now in finding a way to safely express relationship preference."

Permalink
Nice to see that they don't make any comments on the verbal abuse nor on the e-stalking.
Cant prove those unless there's a written message that has blatantly bad content in it, and is reported immediately. Things said online cant be easily tracked, and unless a huge group of people report him/her then a person who makes death threats or stalks people in game, are nigh impossible to pin.

Actually you can request for a change in gamertag, if you feel threatened. Last time I checked.
 

FarleShadow

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Oct 31, 2008
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Until they invent internet sex, stating your sexual preference online is pointless and not needed.

I also think that if you define yourself by the holes or poles you like, you seriously need to re-evaluate your thinking.