UPDATE: Microsoft Disallows Public Lesbians on Xbox Live
- Thread starter Logan Frederick
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I agree with you, that it's the greater evil of the bigots who complained against her, which got her ToU violation noticed by Microsoft, that is the real issue here, not that she got banned for being a lesbian.Baby Tea said:
Microsoft can be accused of being many things, but I don't think homophobic is one of them (it's just not profitable to alienate a large section of society).
But I do still think that if I put "I am straight" in my profile, I will get banned, or at least made to remove it.
Maybe not immediately, it would probably go unnoticed or as you said, most users would agree with me and not complain at all.
However, once a sufficient number of complaints had been filed against my account to warrant closer inspection by Microsoft, I'm sure I would be banned or at least called up on it.
They would see that by mentioning "content of a sexual nature" on my profile, I had clearly broken the Term of Use I'd agreed to.
Also, as well as violating the Terms of Use, mentioning that I'm straight in my profile seem a bit bigoted. It implies that I think homosexuality is wrong, at least to the extent that I want to make it abundantly clear to everyone that I'll game with that I'm not homosexual.
Making a point of not being gay in my profile is reason enough for homosexual users to file a complaint against my account, which in turn would bring my ToU violation to Microsoft's attention.
Somebody should start a petition to get microsoft to reinstate her account. I would if I had any clue how to.
Well I don't think anyone should be banned for their sexual orientation but I also don't see the need to post it in your profile. Although MS could obviously do something about it, it's not actually MS that are homophobic but rather the people she was playing with. We also don't actually know if she was banned because of her sexuality, maybe she's just a total ***** that's always trash talking online. I have fairly open gay and bisexual friends on XBL who have never been banned.
exactly, why do people put personal information (f.x. sexual orientation) on their gamertag?Wouldukindly said:
X-box live is obviously infested with endless homophobes and idiots, so why complain about this kind of stuff when you know that someone is gonna harass you.
An potential irony of the situation which has just occurred to me.
The same idiots who filed complaints against her are probably the same kind of idiots who do that 'tea-bagging' thing in FPS games.
That's always struck me as pretty suspect, I mean what could be gayer than putting your balls in another man's mouth?
If anyone's going to be banned for being homosexual then it's people who do that, but to ban people for "acting in a very homosexual manner" in FPS games would be bigoted, although it would be poetic justice of a sort.
The same idiots who filed complaints against her are probably the same kind of idiots who do that 'tea-bagging' thing in FPS games.
That's always struck me as pretty suspect, I mean what could be gayer than putting your balls in another man's mouth?
If anyone's going to be banned for being homosexual then it's people who do that, but to ban people for "acting in a very homosexual manner" in FPS games would be bigoted, although it would be poetic justice of a sort.
Oh I don't think so. Saying you're straight doesn't mean you're homophobic. It's saying you're straight. Just like this girl probably didn't mean anything malicious or demeaning to straight people. And I'm very certain that the homosexual community wouldn't take offense to you saying you're straight, or that you like women. It would simply be way too hypocritical.Jamash said:
Also, as a side note, I wouldn't be surprised if she put her orientation up there because so many guys would hit on her once they found out she was a girl (Basically, if she said anything). She isn't interested in guys, so what a perfect deterrent! Not saying it's the case, but I wouldn't be surprised.
That is exactly the truth, very insightful with that parenthetical. And as much as people like to demonize them for that attitude, what else would you have it do?Jamash said:
Microsoft is an IT, not a person. Its function is to make money. It has no feelings; it's a corporation. If it's not making money, it is failing in it's function and should (and will) die. If you see news contrary to carrying out this function of making money, there's likely much more to the story than you are seeing, in this case, the ToU violation.
That's not what I mean. I mean you listen to teenagers (and even some kids) and they use the word "gay" to denote something bad. That's the real problem. Using the word itself is not the problem, it's what you mean by it. It's like the N-word which I choose not to use (you know the one). Rappers use it one way, but some people use it as a racial slur. It's all about how you use the word.mrfredy5 said:
Please try to understand that I am not disagreeing with you. I do NOT think she deserved to be banned or suffer any lasting penalties for her profile. I think she has a perfectly legitimate position here. It IS who she is and she doesn't have to apologize for that to anyone else.Baby Tea said:Because it's a part of her life! I have that I'm a Christian on my profile, because it's a big part of my life! Both her, I, and anyone else shouldn't have to apologize or change our profiles because someone else thought something as simple as faith or sexual orientation is 'offensive'. It isn't promoting hate, it isn't saying 'convert to lesbianism!', it's just talking about her and who she is.Wouldukindly said:As much as this seems wrong, that's the only thing that sort of bothers me, I mean, I could go into detail about my lizard fetish on my account, but it may upset a few peoplekawligia said:
I understand it's an 'About Me' column, but you have to be a little realistic when you're on a network like Xbox Live. I'm not saying it's right they banned her, I'm just saying one has to wonder 'why'.
This isn't her fault in any way or form, and the people who did this to her (If I dare call them 'people') should be nothing short of ashamed for it, and they should be the ones who are banned.
Root, I wuv you.The_root_of_all_evil said:
HOWEVER, I AM saying that the opposing side is not entirely incorrect either. That subject is a controversial topic for a lot of people (obviously). Regardless of who is right or wrong, each side needs to realize that in order to get along together and have fun playing X-box live, there needs to be a little give and take.
That girl knew or should have known that her profile would create some negative responses in the real world, even if it wouldn't have in a perfect world. For the sake of getting along and having fun with others, she should have realized that this was not the right time or place to stir the pot, EVEN IF she had every right to say what she said.
Conversely, the complainers should have just dealt with it like adults. Nobody has a right to remain unoffended at all times. THEY ALSO should have realized that this was not the right place to stir the pot but they did it anyway.
This is why its just not appropriate to talk about certain things in certain places. Politics and religion should NOT be discussed in mixed company when you are all trying to work together to accomplish something ENTIRELY UNRELATED to either. All its going to do is piss EVERYONE off, ruin things, and accomplish nothing constructive. When somone breaks this social rule, they are in the wrong even if their argument is correct. AND when someone responds in kind with a counter-argument, they have ALSO broken the exact same rule and made things worse, even if THEIR argument is correct.
Seriously, you can see this concept at work on just about any internet forum. People can be talking about their favorite oldschool video games from childhood, but as soon as someone cracks a joke about politics, the entire thread devolves into a flame war. I doesn't even matter what party you are or which side will ultimately be proved th wisest. NEITHER side should have started it OR continued it after it started...don't feed the trolls. If you want to argue about that stuff, go to...well...a thread like this one.
Not sure what my status has to do anything but the fact you reconized it's me and missed the humour and my post might mean you don't watch my show. When I say fag is a "perfectly acceptable" racial slur, I am meaning it as what everyone who uses it via internet gaming.SuperMse said:
It means you are a newb.
When someone over an internet game calls you a "fag" they mean you are a "Newb". Someone camping behind a wall? That guys being a fag. Someone picks up all the extra health packs when your at 10% HP? Fag. Calm down, I nor the people using it like this really care about your sexuality, they are just saying it because they think you are lame. And you know what? In an Xbox live Profile, I don't need to know someones Sexual orientation because it doesn't matter to me and it shouldn't matter to anyone else. In fact, I bet if you find some guy/girl with a profile that says "I'm Straight" you can just go report it to xbox and have it removed too because it shouldn't be on a GAMING PROFILE.
The girl who posted this story is seeking attention. Thats why she put "Lesbian" in her profile. She wants people to see her and know that shes a lesbian and thats not acceptable behavior in a gaming community. Sexual orientation does not matter. If someone was harassing her for being a lesbian.. err wait how do they know shes a lesbian? Why didn't she just report them?
You kids play nice. You are missing the point. Microsoft isn't being biggots they are just being put into bad light by Ms Give-Me-Attention-Because-I-Am-Different.
So being open to your sexuality = bad enough to get suspended/banned from Xbox Live.
But being a prick and calling people fags, whores, ass holes, douche bags, or any other words that would make a childs ear bleed, even though it is most likely coming from them, is OK and not a suspendable/ban worthy offense?
I tell ya, some peoples kids...
But being a prick and calling people fags, whores, ass holes, douche bags, or any other words that would make a childs ear bleed, even though it is most likely coming from them, is OK and not a suspendable/ban worthy offense?
I tell ya, some peoples kids...
See one thing people on the internet seem to forget is that when you sign up for any internet service. XBL, Steam, WoW, even something as menial as Runescape, you are adhering to THEIR rules, and their interpretations of those rules. No matter how much you whine, or complain or think it's not fair/right/politically correct, as Sony put it: Live in your world, play in ours. It's another world, it's not the same as everyday America/Canada. Technically Microsoft is entirely in the right in this situation, XBL, if they had it their way, is a place for a target audience of 14-20 to screw around and play games that you pay them for. Not a place to even hint at sexual preference, religious orientation, or even if your male or female. They put the about you part in merely to please their audience by making them feel it was a more social outlet.
Having said all of this, I do agree that the user being banned is ridiculous... but at the same time, they have the right, the means, and you agreed to be their ***** when you hit OK on ToS.
Having said all of this, I do agree that the user being banned is ridiculous... but at the same time, they have the right, the means, and you agreed to be their ***** when you hit OK on ToS.
Then how did people know? Oh wait they most likely looked her up. Saw she was a lesbian. Wait what? Why is that kind of personal information in a Xbox live profile.Aries_Split said:
So.. wait. Now microsoft gave her a little break, removed the lesbian and now when people look up her profile they won't find intimate details to insult her of?
People don't go around expressing their sexual orination unless... "TA DAH" They want people to clearly know it. She wanted to let people know that she likes girls and that she doesn't care what they think. Well that right there is the problem. Personal information like that is what got her into little tiffs with people on the internet.
If some guy put his penis size on his Xbox Profile and everyone made fun of him and then he got suspended for having the size of his dick in his profile. Who is to blame?
The problem is more complex than that.Fruitloops89 said:
Our Lady of the Martyred Dignity was suspended because of sexual content in her profile, in print and indisputable as to who put it there. People (rightly or wrongly) found it offensive and reported it to Microsoft through the built-in reporting tools, and the Live staff found a violation of the Code of Conduct. Suspension followed, probably a short-term one with a warning to change her profile.
The Fearless Microphone Abusers, however, do their antics over voice chat... and because these antics are ubiquitous no one seems to want to bother to rat them out. I'll also add that unless it's a voice message sent directly to Our Lady's mailbox it's not recorded, so accusations of verbal abuse come down to "he said / she said" unless you start getting significant volumes of reports about particular users. (Or a user is unlucky enough to flap his/her gums in front of a Live employee who happens to be playing in the same match. It's fun to see that happen, but alas it's very rare to witness.)
So it's not that proclaiming one's undying love for boys/girls/hamsters/etc is the greater offense than hooting-dickholery, it's that violating the Terms of Use in writing is easier to catch and correct than violating the Terms vocally unless people report these violations with the tools provided, preferably every time.
-- Steve
This. The whole affair is a tempest in a teapot. Not that lesbians are gender-identity baiters as a rule, but I've known several with enough pent-up angst to take it to the streets when they didn't need to.Anton P. Nym said:
I don't really see the merit in her being banned. On the flip side, I don't think you should post stuff like that on your profile, cause kids could see it.
*sigh* It's a delicate issue to be sure. But MS makes the rules for their service, and if complaints pop up they'll make an addendum to them making it bad to do this sorta thing. I'm suprised there isn't one already. Honestly, I wouldn't call it obscene, but that's up to their interpretation.
I think that you should keep in mind this isn't really a MySpace profile: there's a place to post such stuff, and if you want people to know your orientation include a link to a website you use.
I'm not entirely convinced of her story either. Live players are often bags filled with douche, but if she only has this on her profile I doubt that she would get too much harassment: most players that rate down do so w/o ever veiwing the profile.
The way I veiw it, the word "gay/fag" is insulting only depending on context. I refer to gay people I respect as gay, and annoying gay people I hate as fags. To me there is no difference between this and calling a guy I hate a ass, besides the words being used. I'll also refer to bad situations as being gay: but I say the word another way. Context is KEY.
Ready for response Captain!
*sigh* It's a delicate issue to be sure. But MS makes the rules for their service, and if complaints pop up they'll make an addendum to them making it bad to do this sorta thing. I'm suprised there isn't one already. Honestly, I wouldn't call it obscene, but that's up to their interpretation.
I think that you should keep in mind this isn't really a MySpace profile: there's a place to post such stuff, and if you want people to know your orientation include a link to a website you use.
I'm not entirely convinced of her story either. Live players are often bags filled with douche, but if she only has this on her profile I doubt that she would get too much harassment: most players that rate down do so w/o ever veiwing the profile.
The way I veiw it, the word "gay/fag" is insulting only depending on context. I refer to gay people I respect as gay, and annoying gay people I hate as fags. To me there is no difference between this and calling a guy I hate a ass, besides the words being used. I'll also refer to bad situations as being gay: but I say the word another way. Context is KEY.
Ready for response Captain!
I report every one of these people AND rate them down. Hint, hint: having a magic speaking device does not mean you have permission to make my ears bleed. I do not appreciate your suggestions about what my mother does in her spare time. You also happen to be 10, which means that you should shut up now, as you don't know what you're talking about.Anton P. Nym said:
Live employees play in games? As part of the job or off-duty? That must be a hoot.
