US 2024 Presidential Election

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The best time to have stopped Israel's slaughter of The Palestinians was a year ago. The next best time is today.

We are allowing Israel to genocide an entire people using our funds and our weapons. Hell, unless Israel decided to go rogue, we could stop this genocide with a phone call. But we don't. We choose to continue to fund it and we continue to support it and we continue to allow it.

Hamas is fighting against an invading force. Israel isn't even hiding the fact that they consider every man, woman, and child in Palestine as Hamas and they will not stop their "war with Hamas" until they are stopped by an outside force. In 50 years when the history books question how we could let Holocaust 2.0 continue on, you won't even have the German people's excuse of "we didn't know" as The IDF itself gleefully uploads their genocide online.

Make all the excuses for Israel and The US that you want because assuming they don't manage to drag us into WW3 and kill us all, history will be an incredibly harsh judge over what we're doing
Also as a reminder of what was posted earlier in the other thread, and why we might have to wait a while for history to catch up with the truth -

https://www.mintpressnews.com/revealed-israel-unit-8200-spies-american-media/288457/
 
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Silvanus

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Why would this be controversial to you? People have all kinds of different priority lists and stances on lesser evil voting (including who is the lesser evil) and perspectives and apprehension of different facts and weightings of different factors; some of them would absolutely prefer Trump to Harris and indeed vote in such a manner because Trump, for what it is worth, is not as yet guilty of the genocide of Palestinians (or at the very least not on the scale that we've seen in this last year).

Happiness is irrelevant, but some would do it. People are complicated.
It's possible, sure. But after condemning me for supposedly making assumptions about other peoples' behaviour, it seems bizarre to me to then make these drastic assumptions yourself.

But also: this assumption was specifically made in order to expose a supposed contradiction in my own thought process. But... if I never made that assumption to begin with, then I'm not contradicting myself. I'm just not buying into your assumption.
 

Trunkage

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I am also very confused on your definition of "Voter Shaming"

I am talking about what I think happens when you vote Democrats. I am ripping the Democrats and what I think will happen if voters choose to reward The Democrats for genocide.

If all it takes to "voter shame" in your eyes is shitting on candidates, then anyone who has ever talked politics in their entire life is voter shaming because everyone has one side they want to win, which by default means they have (at least) one side they want to lose...

I've said in many posts at this point that I understand why people are choosing to vote out of fear rather than what they actually want but that doesn't mean I'm not incredibly disappointed in them. I guess if that's Voter Shaming, then I'm a Voter Shamer cause again, if Genocide can't be a Red Line for people, there IS no Red Line the Democrats can cross and they are going to 100% get that lesson out of this election because The Voters have told them loud and clear that Genocide is not a deal breaker for them.
The one in response to you being insulting and voteshaming him? Yeah, that really earns sympathy and proves your point.
My dudes. I spent a long time trying to pick the right words not to offend you and to make sure I got my point across.

It sounds like you are offended by my opinion and calling it shaming. My intention was not to shame you. I literally couldn't care less and I don't care what you vote. I'm telling you where you are wrong about how your vote matters.

But I'm also trying to gauge what you guys think what shaming is. Because definitely a difference of opinions. I'll also point out that I didn't say Tippy said I was vote-shaming them. That's why I was limiting it to Crimson because they were making that claim

But again and something that you guys either can't or won't understand
No, I actually understand. You're just confusing understanding with you not liking decisions. I'll pick random numbers to illustrate a point in a few short sentences

I'll predict that 200k Palestinians will die under Haris. 1 million will die under Trump. There is no option with 0 deaths. Some people here think that picking Harris is killing fewer people so they'll vote that way. If they don't, way more Palestinians will be killed

You think that if you don't pick, you don't shoulder any of the blame. And you are willing to risk more deaths to get it. Some people can't understand why you would risk 800k more people dying just so you can so you didn't vote
 
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tippy2k2

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My dudes. I spent a long time trying to pick the right words not to offend you and to make sure I got my point across.

It sounds like you are offended by my opinion and calling it shaming. My intention was not to shame you. I literally couldn't care less and I don't care what you vote. I'm telling you where you are wrong about how your vote matters.

But I'm also trying to gauge what you guys think what shaming is. Because definitely a difference of opinions. I'll also point out that I didn't say Tippy said I was vote-shaming them. That's why I was limiting it to Crimson because they were making that claim


No, I actually understand. You're just confusing understanding with you not liking decisions. I'll pick random numbers to illustrate a point in a few short sentences

I'll predict that 200k Palestinians will die under Haris. 1 million will die under Trump. There is no option with 0 deaths. Some people here think that picking Harris is killing fewer people so they'll vote that way. If they don't, way more Palestinians will be killed

You think that if you don't pick, you don't shoulder any of the blame. And you are willing to risk more deaths to get it. Some people can't understand why you would risk 800k more people dying just so you can so you didn't vote
Ultimately with the Voter Shaming thing, I couldn't care less. I was just more curious about your definition since you keep saying that I'm voter shaming people. People can "voter shame" me all they want because I'm never going to feel shamed for voting against Genocide.

For your "predictions" though...



All you're doing is lying to yourself if you are trying to convince me that Trump can possibly be worse than Biden/Harris on Gaza. Gaza is CURRENTLY being turned into a parking lot, there is no "Well if Trump wins, Gaza will be turned into a parking lot and made to be beachfront property!!!". It's already happening. We are seeing it live streamed by Israel and the IDF and the people of Gaza.

Vote for Harris if you want but I wish Democrats would just drop the damn act and just say "We don't care enough about the genocide in Gaza for it to factor into our vote". Just stop pretending like they're voting Harris because she'll be better for Palestine than Trump would be and that they're far more concerned about what Trump will do here than they are about a bunch of foreigners in some other country being slaughtered. I could at least begrudgingly respect that over lying straight to my face about how Harris will be better for Palestine because she pays lip service about how Israel needs to stop blowing up civilians.

As I've stated in every election since I started voting Third Party, I would be ecstatic if The Democrats would prove me wrong. I would love nothing more than to come back into this thread in six months and go "I was so very wrong, I'm sorry". But I haven't been wrong about The Democrats yet so I have no reason to believe I'll be wrong this time. Voting Democrat this go around is giving them the green light to do whatever the hell they want to and it's only a matter of when, not if, they decide a cause close to you becomes the next one to get the chopping block...
 
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crimson5pheonix

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My dudes. I spent a long time trying to pick the right words not to offend you and to make sure I got my point across.

It sounds like you are offended by my opinion and calling it shaming. My intention was not to shame you. I literally couldn't care less and I don't care what you vote. I'm telling you where you are wrong about how your vote matters.

But I'm also trying to gauge what you guys think what shaming is. Because definitely a difference of opinions. I'll also point out that I didn't say Tippy said I was vote-shaming them. That's why I was limiting it to Crimson because they were making that claim
Your point was to tell Tippy that he views people as pawns to be sacrificed when that is the precise opposite of his position. It shows a deep lack of understanding of the motivation of Stein voters and trying to diminish the precise reason they're voting for Stein.
 
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tippy2k2

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None of that changes that voting third party will not help a single Palestinian even one bit.
You are correct and it's a little refreshing to see someone on Team Harris not pretending like she isn't going to be the exact same as Trump when it comes to reigning in Israel

However what it will tell Democrats is that Genocide is NOT a deal breaker for voters. Sure, in the short term that probably won't mean much but once you've given them the greenlight to do a literal genocide, they'll know there is no line they can cross that'll make voters hold them accountable. It might not be today or tomorrow but eventually that Butchers Bill will arrive and somehow you will all still argue that they're the lesser evil so sucks for [Next Group being sacrificed] but we have to do damage control. Eventually they'll get to a cause you care about so you better hope by that point that there is still someone left to speak up for you when you stayed silent cause you weren't a [Next Group being sacrificed]
 
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tippy2k2

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I don't think they will take the lessions from a lost election that you want them to take.
I don't expect The Democrats to learn a thing whether they win or lose (Christ, they're literally using the same "She's not Trump!!!" playbook that worked so well for Hillary). They'll continue to slowly but surely inch by inch their way to the right, pretend that they're the left and it's evil to oppose them THIS time cause this election is the most important election of our lifetime but don't you worry next time we can try to really pressure them left, and then we'll do this all over again. Except next time with the knowledge that their supporters won't even stand up to them when Genocide is on the table.

The Democratic Party isn't my party. I'm not voting for them because I think it'll change their ways. I'm not voting for them because they don't represent my values. If they ever wish to court my vote, I am absolutely open to that but Harris is WAY closer to Trump than she is to me and that would have to change for me to even consider giving her a chance.
 
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XsjadoBlayde

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Gareth Gore joins to talk about his new book Opus: The Cult of Dark Money, Human Trafficking, and Right-Wing Conspiracy inside the Catholic Church.

https://x.com/gareth_gore

https://www.simonandschuster.com/book...

Gareth Gore then joins, diving right into the story of his research into the collapse of a Spanish bank that led him to uncover the outrageous and extensive financial connections between Opus Dei, said bank, and myriad “hospitality” schools across the globe that routinely trafficked women, before stepping back to unpack what Opus Dei is and its process of radicalization under Spanish Priest (and founder) Josemaría Escrivá in early 20th Century Spain to become the reactionary, militant, elite-connected, and Papal-doubting organization that we see today. After briefly expanding on the expansive state of Opus Dei’s connection to the contemporary US conservative movement, particularly in the Courts and Media, Gore steps back to analyze the rise of Opus Dei in the US, walking through its first few decades of struggle before its lingering presence around elite institutions finally took off, and exploring its central motive (from its roots in Spain) of pervading elite networks to grow its political power, with the ultimate goal of imposing their theocratic rule. Gareth also walks Sam through the story of Opus Dei’s “Hospitality Schools,” as a central example of their emphasis on abusive and exploitative hierarchy, and the overwhelming backlash to his reporting from Opus Dei-affiliated groups and individuals, before wrapping up by assessing the role the organization is playing in the ongoing US elections, with tight ties to both GOP Mega-Donor Leonard Leo and Vice Presidential candidate JD Vance.

https://www.house.gov/representatives...
https://www.senate.gov/senators/senat...

 
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Seanchaidh

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It's possible, sure. But after condemning me for supposedly making assumptions about other peoples' behaviour, it seems bizarre to me to then make these drastic assumptions yourself.

But also: this assumption was specifically made in order to expose a supposed contradiction in my own thought process. But... if I never made that assumption to begin with, then I'm not contradicting myself. I'm just not buying into your assumption.
I actually posted evidence that people think that way. For that matter, YOU actually posted evidence that people think that way.
 
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Gergar12

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