US 2024 Presidential Election

tippy2k2

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Democrats aren't tying anyone to the tracks.

Hamas is tying the Palestinian population to the tracks, Israel is controlling the trolley running them over, and Democrats are the ones building the trolleys.

If the Democrats stopped building trolleys today the Israelis would still have plenty of trolleys to keep their rail system running for months (though at a slower rate), right up until some other Muslim country decides to attack Israel while their supply of trolleys is low.

Then the US steps in and starts building more trolleys again while the Dems get scolded by Republicans and the country gets told "we told you so, this wouldn't have happened under Trump."
The best time to have stopped Israel's slaughter of The Palestinians was a year ago. The next best time is today.

We are allowing Israel to genocide an entire people using our funds and our weapons. Hell, unless Israel decided to go rogue, we could stop this genocide with a phone call. But we don't. We choose to continue to fund it and we continue to support it and we continue to allow it.

Hamas is fighting against an invading force. Israel isn't even hiding the fact that they consider every man, woman, and child in Palestine as Hamas and they will not stop their "war with Hamas" until they are stopped by an outside force. In 50 years when the history books question how we could let Holocaust 2.0 continue on, you won't even have the German people's excuse of "we didn't know" as The IDF itself gleefully uploads their genocide online.

Make all the excuses for Israel and The US that you want because assuming they don't manage to drag us into WW3 and kill us all, history will be an incredibly harsh judge over what we're doing
 
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Thaluikhain

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The best time to have stopped Israel's slaughter of The Palestinians was a year ago. The next best time is today.

We are allowing Israel to genocide an entire people using our funds and our weapons. Hell, unless Israel decided to go rogue, we could stop this genocide with a phone call. But we don't. We choose to continue to find it and we continue to support it and we continue to allow it.
Minor points, but the US could have tried to stop Israel long before a year ago. Also, the US didn't just support Israel when it was committing genocide, it greatly increased its support. The US didn't have enough munitions to share with Ukraine, but when Israel needed more than their usual subsidising of the US military/industrial complex, the US suddenly found a bunch more sitting around.

I mean, I know that you know this, but it's something that bears repeating.

Make all the excuses for Israel and The US that you want because assuming they don't manage to drag us into WW3 and kill us all, history will be an incredibly harsh judge over what we're doing
This part I'm less certain about. All sorts of things are conveniently forgotten about, what's one more? A big one, sure, but still.
 

Agema

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This part I'm less certain about. All sorts of things are conveniently forgotten about, what's one more? A big one, sure, but still.
Let's be clear: the longer this goes on, when the dust settles, the less confusion there's going to be that it was genocide.

The accounting may be well in the future, when the authors of this destuction are dead and safe from recriminations. Will it become a core part of US history, a nagging awareness in many Americans that their country was so complicit in genocide? Probably not, because Americans weren't pulling the triggers. But I strongly suspect the history books will write up the USA's part in it, those of culture will know, and that will be the record that lasts the centuries.
 
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Silvanus

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When the constitution literally says "NO XYZ" and the Supreme Court says XYZ is allowed, that's a massive blow to their perception of impartiality.
Their reputation for impartiality is already in tatters; most people in America already see the Supreme Court as a party-political organ already. Hasn't caused them much practical harm so far.

This would be merely one more nail in a coffin that's already nailed quite tightly. In reality, it's very much other concerns stopping them. They have no wish to allow it except under certain societally-accepted parameters like prison.
 

Silvanus

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For voters who feel betrayed by the Democratic Party's embrace of mass slaughter, your way of reasoning about the benefits of third party votes is that it is advantageous to the Democrats that they have an option to register their discontent that is not Trump.
So to be clear: you believe that people who've been put off the Democrats by their embrace of mass slaughter... would be happy to vote for a different party also embracing the same mass slaughter, if the Greens weren't there?

Yeah, that's a bizarre supposition. You seemingly have a great deal less respect for third party voters than I do.

It's pretty flimsy when you consider the full context of her quote which I posted some pages back with an edit that you proceeded to ignore.
Full context doesn't change the fact that "because of third party support" cannot be spun as "regardless of third party support". Full context gives some 'why'. That's all. She still came to the same conclusion about the effect of third party support.
 

Seanchaidh

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So to be clear: you believe that people who've been put off the Democrats by their embrace of mass slaughter... would be happy to vote for a different party also embracing the same mass slaughter, if the Greens weren't there?
Why would this be controversial to you? People have all kinds of different priority lists and stances on lesser evil voting (including who is the lesser evil) and perspectives and apprehension of different facts and weightings of different factors; some of them would absolutely prefer Trump to Harris and indeed vote in such a manner because Trump, for what it is worth, is not as yet guilty of the genocide of Palestinians (or at the very least not on the scale that we've seen in this last year).

Happiness is irrelevant, but some would do it. People are complicated.
 

Trunkage

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I'm looking at your response to Tippy where he says nothing about you, but you say he views others as pieces to sacrifice. Nah fam, stop your voteshaming bro. Stein is pro LGBT. With the signals coming from the dem party, greens might end up being the only pro T party here coming up soon.
Look at the post just above this one

What about this one?
 

Seanchaidh

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concerning the "men shouldn't play in women's sports" clip:


I am neither a Pro-life ‘abortion banner’ nor a transphobe. I believe firmly in the sacred dignity of every single human being. It saddens me to have to announce this, because I have NEVER - in public or in private - taken a position against a woman’s right to choose, or against the rights of the lgbtq and trans communities to live the lives they choose.

Yesterday I was made aware of the hurt caused by the proliferation of two shorts clip of my recent comments on a political interview program. These comments were taken out of context and used to paint me as holding views I fundamentally reject. Let me be clear: the values I stand for and the principles I uphold are rooted in full inclusion, respect, and justice for all communities, especially our LGBTQAI2S+ family, who have long been at the forefront of the Green movement for equality.

The remarks in question, presented in a hostile interview, were misrepresented through selective editing to suggest otherwise. In context, I was engaging in what I thought was a discussion of a nuanced policy on Olympic inclusion based on information shared by the IOC, not making a statement against trans inclusion. Unfortunately, certain individuals have chosen to distort my words, weaponizing them to undermine our movement and campaign.

In my eleven-week crash course into the world of electoral politics, I have learned that unethical people are paid good money to twist the words and sully the name of good people. They turn midnight into high noon with selective editing, cherry-picking sound bites to produce ‘gotcha’ moments that never were. The fear and desperation of democrats to drive a wedge into the Green Party base has driven this process into overdrive. They have now been caught multiple times trying to utilize black talk radio to further this agenda.

Throughout my career, I have been a vocal advocate for queer rights, and I remain committed to the liberation of all marginalized communities. It is a priority for me to stand alongside trans and queer individuals in every fight for equity, including the urgent struggle against violence targeting queer and trans women of color. I know that the misperception caused by these comments has hurt members of the LGBTQ+ community, especially those who have felt misrepresented or unprotected. For that, I am truly sorry.

I have already spoken with the officers of the National Lavender Greens Caucus and appreciate their willingness to engage in open, honest conversation on this matter. I am committed to continuing this dialogue beyond the immediate demands of this election season, to ensure that our party's values and my own are as clear and unwavering as ever.
 

Trunkage

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Democrats aren't tying anyone to the tracks.

Hamas is tying the Palestinian population to the tracks, Israel is controlling the trolley running them over, and Democrats are the ones building the trolleys.

If the Democrats stopped building trolleys today the Israelis would still have plenty of trolleys to keep their rail system running for months (though at a slower rate), right up until some other Muslim country decides to attack Israel while their supply of trolleys is low.

Then the US steps in and starts building more trolleys again while the Dems get scolded by Republicans and the country gets told "we told you so, this wouldn't have happened under Trump."
Ah, I would amend that to not intentionally trying an America to the tracks.

I would not be confident in this applying to people outside the US. Or general stupidity
 

Trunkage

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concerning the "men shouldn't play in women's sports" clip:

The IOC stance on transgender is like Roe v Wade. They both ban certain medical conditions up to a certain point and you need medical doctors, not politicians or pundits, to make decisions. (Based on regulations created by politicians, then they can fuck off)

If you stand in the middle, sometimes you're attack by both sides
 

tippy2k2

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Look at the post just above this one

What about this one?
I am also very confused on your definition of "Voter Shaming"

I am talking about what I think happens when you vote Democrats. I am ripping the Democrats and what I think will happen if voters choose to reward The Democrats for genocide.

If all it takes to "voter shame" in your eyes is shitting on candidates, then anyone who has ever talked politics in their entire life is voter shaming because everyone has one side they want to win, which by default means they have (at least) one side they want to lose...

I've said in many posts at this point that I understand why people are choosing to vote out of fear rather than what they actually want but that doesn't mean I'm not incredibly disappointed in them. I guess if that's Voter Shaming, then I'm a Voter Shamer cause again, if Genocide can't be a Red Line for people, there IS no Red Line the Democrats can cross and they are going to 100% get that lesson out of this election because The Voters have told them loud and clear that Genocide is not a deal breaker for them.
 

Chimpzy

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RFK Jr. says a future Trump administration will end public water fluoridation
The Trump campaign did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

Robert F. Kennedy Jr., a top ally and surrogate for Donald Trump, announced on Saturday that the next Trump White House, on Inauguration Day, will order the ending of public water fluoridation.

The Trump campaign did not immediately respond to a request for comment on Kennedy’s claim, which is the latest example of Trump allies getting out ahead of the former president and announcing plans for his next administration.

“On January 20, the Trump White House will advise all U.S. water systems to remove fluoride from public water,” Kennedy wrote in a post on X. “Fluoride is an industrial waste associated with arthritis, bone fractures, bone cancer, IQ loss, neurodevelopmental disorders, and thyroid disease.”

Kennedy tagged both Trump and former first lady Melania Trump, saying they “want to Make America Healthy Again” — a slogan Trump has reiterated on campaign trail as he has discussed Kennedy having potential influence on his next administration’s health policies.

The American Dental Association says water fluoridation is “safe, effective and healthy,” and that “70 years of research, thousands of studies and the experience of more than 210 million Americans tell us that water fluoridation is effective in preventing cavities and is safe for children and adults.”

Trump on Sunday said he plans to empower Kennedy, who has sought to cast doubt on the safety and efficacy of FDA-approved vaccines, to have some role in his next administration.

“I’m going to let him go wild on health,” Trump said at a rally in New York City. “I’m going to let him go wild on the food. I’m going to let him go wild on medicines.”