Most people only really trade in games they dislike or tire of. If a game is genuinely good then most players will hold on to it. Honestly, if car manufacturers can deal with re-sale then so can these companies, you never buy a used car and then have to pay an activation fee to the manufacturers.
Used Game Sales are a "Bigger Problem Than Piracy"
- Thread starter Andy Chalk
- Start date
I buy games I want to play new, when they come out. But when I go to EB games to kill some time between appointments or whatever I will browse the used game section and pick up a game that is a year or two old. It is not stealing revenue as I never would have bought the game but for the used game section. I wager that for folks like me, and I may not be the typical case, it raises revenue because if I like the game I will start looking for the sequel or into the developer's other titles.
Okay, here's the central problem for your argument. An average hollywood blockbuster, these days, starts at around $100m to produce.[footnote]Independent are substantially less, but let's ignore that for the moment.[/footnote] Major release Video games cost substantially less to produce, figure $40m.[footnote]These are both low estimates. Movies can easily hit $200m and games can hit the $100m mark.[/footnote] On top of this films can easily burn another $20m in advertising.[footnote]Sometimes this is included in the overall film budget, but often it ends up as an additional expense from the studio after the film has been produced.[/footnote]rockingnic said:
Now. Assume the average cost of a ticket is about $10. Assume that the average DVD on release is about $20. And realize that films make more money than the video game industry.
They don't do this because they have found some magical way to compress costs, they do it by putting more asses in the seats.
Now, you can argue about install base, but really that's a losing argument, because there wouldn't BE a used games market if the install base couldn't support it.
Make games less expensive and more share friendly and then also try to encourage people to go outside more. Let's make gaming more casual and less time intensive so that we can get out and be more outdoorsy types...
Won't the smart trade in places just mark any games doing something like 'project $10' and offer $10 less for them in trade in and make them $10 cheaper?
Ok EA still get their slice of the cake, but it's not going to stop preowned sales.
This all comes from neither sides agreeing on one point, customers feel they've bought something, and it's theirs to do what they want with, whereas the games companies feel like we pay a fee to borrow it for a while, but it's still their property.
I know legally, the games company's view is correct, but it's a pretty crappy way to view your customers.
Maybe in the future the car companies will latch onto this, build a retina scanner into the cars so that only the original owner can start the car, and of course this won't be to stop the second hand market in cars, it'll be a 'security feature'. (*cough* DRM *cough*)
Ok EA still get their slice of the cake, but it's not going to stop preowned sales.
This all comes from neither sides agreeing on one point, customers feel they've bought something, and it's theirs to do what they want with, whereas the games companies feel like we pay a fee to borrow it for a while, but it's still their property.
I know legally, the games company's view is correct, but it's a pretty crappy way to view your customers.
Maybe in the future the car companies will latch onto this, build a retina scanner into the cars so that only the original owner can start the car, and of course this won't be to stop the second hand market in cars, it'll be a 'security feature'. (*cough* DRM *cough*)
It's the developers and producers faults that people buy used games. Lower your prices quicker and we will buy the game. You can't do that? Then use Steam or some other form of online distribution. What's even better is...
There's someone with sense.Hithlain said:
Yes, it must be awful to have people who can't afford a brand new version every time they want something, and when that second hand version has obvious production flaws they shouldn't have a right to complain because they didn't support the developers. "Sorry Jane, Honda isn't responsible for your injuries even though all cars of this model had broken brakes. If you had bought directly from us we might have had the money to pay for your wounds and make better brakes. Next time don't buy second hand you dastardly fiend!"rockingnic said:
In musing about how we as a society should look to how profit is derived from distribution and not distribution,copies,ect itself. Its the flow of distribution where a profit is attempted that should be locked down and be made into licensed only, if it is not licensed then it can not generate money.
This dose not jsut mean websites that take donations or ad rev this also means the sale of used media as its no different IMO(something copyrighted is moved for money).
Of coarse the most the CP owners should get is 5-10% off the sale, and frankly we could use a simple net/digital storage tax as well so put that 5-10% on ISPs and digital storage devices and discs.
It would not be to hard for publishers to ban togather offer insentives and insted of making this part of it law that might fail aginst doctrine of frist sale make it supplemental to the the tax and something retialers of all sizes can ge onbaord with to save money on new items to give alil profit off thier used item sale.
This dose not jsut mean websites that take donations or ad rev this also means the sale of used media as its no different IMO(something copyrighted is moved for money).
Of coarse the most the CP owners should get is 5-10% off the sale, and frankly we could use a simple net/digital storage tax as well so put that 5-10% on ISPs and digital storage devices and discs.
It would not be to hard for publishers to ban togather offer insentives and insted of making this part of it law that might fail aginst doctrine of frist sale make it supplemental to the the tax and something retialers of all sizes can ge onbaord with to save money on new items to give alil profit off thier used item sale.
See, the problem I have with your mindset is that you think that somehow once i've brought a game, that I can't do what I want with it. I've paid the price it was sold to me at in full. If I want to trade it in, I will. Its MY game.rockingnic said:
Heck, I even sell my games to my friends on occasion. I don't want a game and my friend does? Because GAME will only give me £5 and sell it for £20, i'll do my friend a favour and sell it at £15.
I can do that with any car I buy, any house I buy, and any furniture I buy. If i'm not allowed to do what I want with my property (as long as it doesn't physically harm another person or break any laws) I believe that I should be allowed to do what I like with it.
If you came up to me and told me I couldn't do that, i'd just punch you in the throat and tell you to mind your own business. Same thing i'd do to any company representative who thinks the same.
This is a column, they write about interesting stuff, not news.danpascooch said:
That wasn't the employee being a dick, that was you being a dick.rembrandtqeinstein said:
Yeah, that's the figures...but like a lot of statistics, I've never seen any evidence. In fact, quite a lot to the contrary.Starke said:
For instance, if I buy GTA - break the disc accidentally, d/l a crack and buy it second hand - then these numbers allege 66% profit loss.
umkay seriously WTF? does big industry always try to find an excuse for making more money when they probably are making enough?
There's no used-game market until there's a new-game market. Used copies of a new game aren't generated out of a vacuum when that new game hits.
The price difference between a used game that's been recently-released and a new copy of that game is so slim that few I know don't opt instead to simply purchase a new copy.
By the time a used game is on its third or fourth cycle of ownership, it's usually either a case of that game is out of print, or it's so horrid it's passed around like a hot rash.
The used game market is strong. But it can never be stronger than the new game market, the one that dictates supply in the first place.
The price difference between a used game that's been recently-released and a new copy of that game is so slim that few I know don't opt instead to simply purchase a new copy.
By the time a used game is on its third or fourth cycle of ownership, it's usually either a case of that game is out of print, or it's so horrid it's passed around like a hot rash.
The used game market is strong. But it can never be stronger than the new game market, the one that dictates supply in the first place.
Yeah, but, seriously. You're telling me everyone who buys a game then downloads a torrent of the game for just the crack? Wait... something doesn't make sense here...The_root_of_all_evil said:
Oh, yeah, and the last time I verified this I used Modern Warfare 2... where once you buy it the disk is effectively a coaster, thanks to Steam. (Though, to your... marginal credit, I didn't let you know that before hand.) But, thanks for letting me know that 90% of the gamer population aren't pirates, just incredibly accident prone.
EDIT: Sorry, 100%, not 90.
Yeah, buh, what?acosn said:
I'm guessing that's not US$ (and I apologize that that's what I immediately think of when I see a $). In the states the standard price points are $50 for PC and $60 for 360/PS3. With $10 shaved off on some budget titles at launch.
Maybe they should print games longer. I don't trade games in since that's retarded but its nice to know I can go get basically any game for PS2 for dirt cheap without having to order it and hope the disc isn't messed up.
Also, kudos to EA. Fucking over Gamestop always gets a thumbs up from me.
Also, kudos to EA. Fucking over Gamestop always gets a thumbs up from me.
Okay
A) $60 is a LOT of %$#%ing money
I know the developers can't seem to understand this concept but the market price for a game is determined by market forces not what the accounting department comes up with to boost sales in the fourth quarter. Instead of only discounting new games I don't care about to $40 try discounting it to $20 after a few years. This way 1)we can pay for it. and b)you get a cut of the money.
B) Make interesting games
They sell used copies of FF7 for $70. Think about this. A highly demanded out-of-print game is $10 more than "Generic God of War Clone, Now with Eight Seconds of Tits."
It may be worth doing but its not worth overdoing. Why would I spend $60 for the rip-off when I can get the much better original for $20. It's like these guys have never sat in a single economics class. In order to sell a product you must provide a product customers are willing and able to buy for a price customers are willing and able to pay for.
Sorry but at this point the companies seem to have the heads three feet up their asses to not recognize the fact that they are doing wrong and need to correct this before they go belly up.
A) $60 is a LOT of %$#%ing money
I know the developers can't seem to understand this concept but the market price for a game is determined by market forces not what the accounting department comes up with to boost sales in the fourth quarter. Instead of only discounting new games I don't care about to $40 try discounting it to $20 after a few years. This way 1)we can pay for it. and b)you get a cut of the money.
B) Make interesting games
They sell used copies of FF7 for $70. Think about this. A highly demanded out-of-print game is $10 more than "Generic God of War Clone, Now with Eight Seconds of Tits."
It may be worth doing but its not worth overdoing. Why would I spend $60 for the rip-off when I can get the much better original for $20. It's like these guys have never sat in a single economics class. In order to sell a product you must provide a product customers are willing and able to buy for a price customers are willing and able to pay for.
Sorry but at this point the companies seem to have the heads three feet up their asses to not recognize the fact that they are doing wrong and need to correct this before they go belly up.
They can make a little money or no money at all, in my mind, the guy needs to shut up and let his masive paycheck come.