Utah creates 5 person commission to regulate one trans girl playing sports

[Phoenixmgs]

Lmao, it's useless virtue signaling. One trans girls every now and then isn't a threat

It's your rule, my dude. I'm telling you why it's ridiculous

Yeah, super getting the feeling that you're backing these bans to protect women's sport

No. Keep crying about it. A ban's a ban, even if you like it

State agencies have to follow state guidelines


Lmao, and yet it's only this specific issue getting these bans, regardless of the fact that most doctors are saying these bans do more harm than good. It's never circumcision or intersex surgery on infants

You've yet to provide any scientific evidence that trans girls are on an equal playing field and just handwave away sex differences that can't be changed via normal transitioning.

"My" rule? It's literally the rule of the entire world.

Don't even know WTF you're going on about here. Soccer isn't very popular in the US and is wildly popular elsewhere, thus players elsewhere get paid more than players playing in the MLS.

Guidelines inform clinical practice but don't dictate it.

You all keep forgetting I'm a deontologist, I gave my general rule and I apply that to everything equally (there's a Penn & Teller Bullshit episode on circumcision, why would you think I'm for that and against trans operations?). Other far more progressive countries have came to the same general conclusions where shit like this isn't political. This "most doctors" argument just sounds like it's just the doctors you agree with vs the actual science.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

You've yet to provide any scientific evidence that trans girls are on an equal playing field and just handwave away sex differences that can't be changed via normal transitioning.

Yeah. Mostly because they don't seem to be causing the huge (or even minor) advantages you claim they do

"My" rule? It's literally the rule of the entire world.

The entire world does not have a rule that men are banned from women's activities because they tend to be a couple inches taller

Don't even know WTF you're going on about here. Soccer isn't very popular in the US and is wildly popular elsewhere, thus players elsewhere get paid more than players playing in the MLS.

So? If you want to protect women's sport, it needs to exist

Guidelines inform clinical practice but don't dictate it.

Do you not have state clinics where you live.

You all keep forgetting I'm a deontologist, I gave my general rule and I apply that to everything equally (there's a Penn & Teller Bullshit episode on circumcision, why would you think I'm for that and against trans operations?). Other far more progressive countries have came to the same general conclusions where shit like this isn't political. This "most doctors" argument just sounds like it's just the doctors you agree with vs the actual science.

As an example you posted Sweden's new rules, which permit both hormones and surgery for children under certain circumstances

The "most doctors" argument is literally based on shit like The Endocrine Society and the American Academy of Pediatrics backing my point of view. You know, while organizations of doctors who know what they're talking about

 

[Phoenixmgs]

Yeah. Mostly because they don't seem to be causing the huge (or even minor) advantages you claim they do

The entire world does not have a rule that men are banned from women's activities because they tend to be a couple inches taller

So? If you want to protect women's sport, it needs to exist

Do you not have state clinics where you live.

As an example you posted Sweden's new rules, which permit both hormones and surgery for children under certain circumstances

The "most doctors" argument is literally based on shit like The Endocrine Society and the American Academy of Pediatrics backing my point of view. You know, while organizations of doctors who know what they're talking about

The separation of men and women in sports says otherwise.

I said "Women's sports must be a dumbass rule then..." and you said that it's "my rule" and then I said it's the rule of the entire world. Men being taller is one of many reasons why the sexes are separated.

Entertainment that makes money should exist. It's like do we have to publicly fund badminton because it's not a popular sport? If people don't want to watch women play basketball, you can make them watch. Some sports are the opposite way where the women's game is more entertaining like tennis, I'm assuming (as I don't watch tennis) because the women's game has more volleying back and forth because their serve speeds are lower. Protecting women's sports is done by keeping them women's sports or else you wouldn't have women playing.

I'm sure if these Florida guidelines you complain about being hard rules, there's at least one doctor out there explaining how this is inhibiting them treating their patients.

I don't think you understand my point at all. My point is that not doing XYZ is preferential based on actual science, not that you shouldn't ever do XYZ. I'm pretty sure most doctors agree with the GUIDELINES of the order of treatment, try A first, then B, then C and if none of those worked, then you might want to try XYZ.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

The separation of men and women in sports says otherwise.

We're talking about trans women and cis women. Dunno how you've missed that for 22 pages. And there's a separation of men's and women's shooting sports too, which doesn't prove jack or shit. Fact is, trans women aren't outperforming cis women by any appreciable measure. It's just math that if a trans person and a cis person are competing on an even level, sometimes the trans person is going to win.

I said "Women's sports must be a dumbass rule then..." and you said that it's "my rule" and then I said it's the rule of the entire world. Men being taller is one of many reasons why the sexes are separated.

Height was never a factor. It's all performance and/or misogyny

Entertainment that makes money should exist. It's like do we have to publicly fund badminton because it's not a popular sport? If people don't want to watch women play basketball, you can make them watch. Some sports are the opposite way where the women's game is more entertaining like tennis, I'm assuming (as I don't watch tennis) because the women's game has more volleying back and forth because their serve speeds are lower. Protecting women's sports is done by keeping them women's sports or else you wouldn't have women playing.

The odd trans girl playing high school sports is not a threat to that

I'm sure if these Florida guidelines you complain about being hard rules, there's at least one doctor out there explaining how this is inhibiting them treating their patients.

I don't think you understand my point at all. My point is that not doing XYZ is preferential based on actual science, not that you shouldn't ever do XYZ. I'm pretty sure most doctors agree with the GUIDELINES of the order of treatment, try A first, then B, then C and if none of those worked, then you might want to try XYZ.

"Your point" is grounded by lying about facts you directly linked to and supporting a guidance based on lying about the data *they* linked to

Florida advises against gender-affirming medical or social care for transgender kids

The nonenforceable guidelines single out socially transitioning rather than just medically transitioning — a step beyond other states.

www.modernhealthcare.com

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

Welp:

 

[Buyetyen]

Welp:

I look forward to Phoenix trying to tell us that this is good, actually.

 

[Trunkage]

I look forward to Phoenix trying to tell us that this is good, actually.

I am waiting for the 'This law doesn't actually target transpeople' just because they dont use transgender in the actual text of the law

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

@Phoenixmgs
Hey does this count yet or do they actually have to pull the trigger?

 

[Dreiko]

Welp:

I'm a supporter of medicare for all but to get that passed it will have to not cover things like boobjobs and botox and generally things done to make people feel better about themselves and not because they're ill, and I don't really see how this is any different than your average nosejob, I don't think we should pay for you to be as pretty as you feel you should be.

 

[Buyetyen]

I'm a supporter of medicare for all but to get that passed it will have to not cover things like boobjobs and botox and generally things done to make people feel better about themselves and not because they're ill, and I don't really see how this is any different than your average nosejob, I don't think we should pay for you to be as pretty as you feel you should be.

You're competing with Phoenix for "Most Out of Touch on the Forums" I see.

Gender-affirming therapy and medicine isn't about being, "pretty." It's about mitigating the effects of body dysphoria, which can have seriously devastating mental health consequences. Try talking to trans people before you shoot your mouth off about things you don't understand.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

I'm a supporter of medicare for all but to get that passed it will have to not cover things like boobjobs and botox and generally things done to make people feel better about themselves and not because they're ill, and I don't really see how this is any different than your average nosejob, I don't think we should pay for you to be as pretty as you feel you should be.

Hormones are more than cosmetic. The specific end around that they're using is calling these 50+ year olds treatments "experimental". Similarly, Medicare only covers "boob jobs" and Botox when they're medically necessary, which sometimes happens

 

[Dreiko]

You're competing with Phoenix for "Most Out of Touch on the Forums" I see.

Gender-affirming therapy and medicine isn't about being, "pretty." It's about mitigating the effects of body dysphoria, which can have seriously devastating mental health consequences. Try talking to trans people before you shoot your mouth off about things you don't understand.

Actually I know that not a lot of people who are going trans have a dysphoria diagnosis because that's like one in 30000 people or so. And either way you can treat this condition in many ways, it's not necessary to give in to it. There's people out there that feel they should only have 1 arm but the answer to that feeling they have shouldn't be to let them chop their arm off to be happy.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

Actually I know that not a lot of people who are going trans have a dysphoria diagnosis because that's like one in 30000 people or so. And either way you can treat this condition in many ways, it's not necessary to give in to it. There's people out there that feel they should only have 1 arm but the answer to that feeling they have shouldn't be to let them chop their arm off to be happy.

My dude, why are you not listening to the doctors that actually listen to these people?

 

[Buyetyen]

Actually I know that not a lot of people who are going trans have a dysphoria diagnosis because that's like one in 30000 people or so. And either way you can treat this condition in many ways, it's not necessary to give in to it. There's people out there that feel they should only have 1 arm but the answer to that feeling they have shouldn't be to let them chop their arm off to be happy.

So whose ass did you pull that fake medical degree out of?

Look, there's a difference between knowledge and belief. You don't know shit about trans people, but you believe you do. Your analogies are divorced from reality..

 

[Trunkage]

Guess what Ohio got through the House during Pride month

Ohio lawmakers advance trans sports ban with genital check

Ohio's House of Representatives passed a bill that would ban transgender girls from school sports and require verification from a doctor if a student's sex is called into question.

www.reuters.com

 

[Buyetyen]

Guess what Ohio got through the House during Pride month

Ohio lawmakers advance trans sports ban with genital check

Ohio's House of Representatives passed a bill that would ban transgender girls from school sports and require verification from a doctor if a student's sex is called into question.

www.reuters.com

Lost to another girl and bitter about it? Accuse her of being trans and subject her to humiliating and invasive inspection process. No way that system could possibly be abused.

 

[Phoenixmgs]

We're talking about trans women and cis women. Dunno how you've missed that for 22 pages. And there's a separation of men's and women's shooting sports too, which doesn't prove jack or shit. Fact is, trans women aren't outperforming cis women by any appreciable measure. It's just math that if a trans person and a cis person are competing on an even level, sometimes the trans person is going to win.

Height was never a factor. It's all performance and/or misogyny

The odd trans girl playing high school sports is not a threat to that

"Your point" is grounded by lying about facts you directly linked to and supporting a guidance based on lying about the data *they* linked to

Florida advises against gender-affirming medical or social care for transgender kids

The nonenforceable guidelines single out socially transitioning rather than just medically transitioning — a step beyond other states.

www.modernhealthcare.com

Trans women have biological advantages.

Height not being a factor in sports is hilarious.

Trans women have biological advantages.

Other countries guidance that are basically the same are based on lying about data as well? Your article literally says "Florida ADVISES against". Advising is now banning things? I asked for a link proving Florida has banned this stuff or a doctor saying it inhibits their treatment to patients and no such evidence has been submitted.

Welp:

OMG, that doesn't end any coverage...

@Phoenixmgs
Hey does this count yet or do they actually have to pull the trigger?

That's what the science is, other countries that couldn't care less about the stupid culture war here came to the same conclusions. Maybe you should read just the actual letter instead of the Twitter commentary that isn't supported by what's actually in the letter. STOP GETTING YOUR NEWS FROM TWITTER.

 

[Trunkage]

Actually I know that not a lot of people who are going trans have a dysphoria diagnosis because that's like one in 30000 people or so. And either way you can treat this condition in many ways, it's not necessary to give in to it. There's people out there that feel they should only have 1 arm but the answer to that feeling they have shouldn't be to let them chop their arm off to be happy.

So, what you are saying is that doctors are completely and utterly incompetent and cant do their jobs

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

Trans women have biological advantages.

Maybe, kinda

Height not being a factor in sports is hilarious.

Mugsy Bouges is 5'3"


Which girl should be banned for their natural height advantage?

Trans women have biological advantages.

Kinda, maybe

Other countries guidance that are basically the same are based on lying about data as well?

The country you selected does not say "basically the same thing". It, in fact, says significantly different things

Your article literally says "Florida ADVISES against". Advising is now banning things? I asked for a link proving Florida has banned this stuff or a doctor saying it inhibits their treatment to patients and no such evidence has been submitted.

Just ignore all the doctors objecting to it and then there's no objections, brillaint

OMG, that doesn't end any coverage...

View attachment 6299

Love how you continue to ignore cause and effect

That's what the science is, other countries that couldn't care less about the stupid culture war here came to the same conclusions. Maybe you should read just the actual letter instead of the Twitter commentary that isn't supported by what's actually in the letter. STOP GETTING YOUR NEWS FROM TWITTER.

Lmao, the letter literally says that professional organizations with tens of thousands of doctors are wrong because they found two guys who say differently.

 

[Dreiko]

So, what you are saying is that doctors are completely and utterly incompetent and cant do their jobs

No it's that schools especially have policies that accept people's claims without a demand for a doctor's visit and a confirmation of those claims so a lot of people without a diagnosis for dysphoria still are claiming to be trans. I mean, they have to be for the one in 30000 stat for the occurence of that condition to be accurate (which is a thing doctors found out, I didn't imagine it).