Valve Talks TF2 Engineer Update Failures

Grigori361

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Apr 6, 2009
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randommaster said:
Ninjamedic said:
DROP THE PS3 BOYCOTT ALREADY!! YOU BUMDERS!
...............Im, Im sorry about that.
An improved shottie would work.
Not until Sony desides to change the system architecture of their console to something that's easier to develop for.

Hm, I wonder what they could possibly do that would make a difference. We'll probably see a weapon change as that's pretty much a given. One thing that I think would be cool is the ability to construct bunkers. It switches vulnerability to sapping to needing actual teammates to make it effective.
Great idea, I think another interesting if impractical idea is the over suggested anti spy sentry, it detects spies cloaked or disused, can't be sapped, but has half health and only level 1. Deadly efficient security but no power so it's useless against say a soldier.

Maybe a welder as a weapon? repairs twice a fast but uses ammo, and more or less useless except for lighting spies on fire.
 

randommaster

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Sep 10, 2008
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Grigori361 said:
randommaster said:
Ninjamedic said:
DROP THE PS3 BOYCOTT ALREADY!! YOU BUMDERS!
...............Im, Im sorry about that.
An improved shottie would work.
Not until Sony desides to change the system architecture of their console to something that's easier to develop for.

Hm, I wonder what they could possibly do that would make a difference. We'll probably see a weapon change as that's pretty much a given. One thing that I think would be cool is the ability to construct bunkers. It switches vulnerability to sapping to needing actual teammates to make it effective.
Great idea, I think another interesting if impractical idea is the over suggested anti spy sentry, it detects spies cloaked or disused, can't be sapped, but has half health and only level 1. Deadly efficient security but no power so it's useless against say a soldier.

Maybe a welder as a weapon? repairs twice a fast but uses ammo, and more or less useless except for lighting spies on fire.
I think an exploding sentry would be a good alternative for the regular one. It would only be able to get to level 2, but if you tried to sap it, it would explode and deal heavy damage, if not outright kill, anything within sapping range. That means it gets to be effective against other classes while making spies think twice about sappin ma sentry.
 

Jared

The British Paladin
Jul 14, 2009
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Abedeus said:
Also an excellent reason is that...

Well, remember Pyro update, Sniper/Spy update, Scout update?

7 engies on each team...?
I remember...lol
 

hopeneverdies

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Oct 1, 2008
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I still remember someone thinking of making a backpack that the engy can carry that will let him move his buildings instead of demolishing and rebuilding them every time. Slows him down for every thing he carries and how upgraded it is. But I'm still waiting to see what Valve will eventually come up with.
 

Contun

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Mar 28, 2009
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[HEADING=1]THE NAIL GUN![/HEADING]
The Nail Gun would be able to repair from a distance making it easier for the Engineer to repair his buildings that may be taking abuse from the enemy, but be less powerful than his good ol' shotgun...
 

ninjajoeman

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Mar 13, 2009
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I was expecting there to be more stuff...awell


oh and the teleporters are importent botched my idea of making a skeet that shoots people into the air enemies/allies =P

but then again I still have the lasso =]

http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1136541
crap ideas yes but I just wrote them just incase valve does do this so I can go YEA WHO CALLED IT!
 

Altorin

Jack of No Trades
May 16, 2008
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Me55enger said:
They'll likely replace the sentry gun with a oil pump, meaning the Texan Engie can merely sell out the other team.

Still, cant be as bad as that sodding bow and arrow.
actually that's not a bad idea. It works form a thematic standpoint. Texan. Engineer. Oil.

Imagine if they replaced the sentry gun with an oil slick generator. Pyros could set the oil on fire.. wouldn't have any real range, it would basically just squirt oil at a specific spot, like a chokepoint.

It would be difficult to see unless you were looking down for it (it might just give the ground a different sheen, like that purple greeny sheen you get on something covered in gasoline). Then a pyro can light it in a pinch, and it will burn briefly, go out, and a new batch of oil will be splurted out.

When not lit, it could give a sort of "intoxicated" blur effect from the fumes to people who are walking over it.

It would definitely change the dynamics of who beats engineer - as of right now, it's spies... spies beat engies.. sneak past, zap their shit. It would change it to Pyros beating Engies, at least Engies that use the Oil/Gas Pump. Pyros can run right through the flaming gas without catching fire. and decimate what's on the other side - the reason Pyro's don't already kick engies asses is because of the sentry.. they're useless against them. It also would also help engies specifically against spies, as the fire would thwart them sneaking in unseen.

Also, for kicks, you could make it so the Pyro's Hadouken Taunt and the Spy's Cigarette Taunt both light the gas. Would make for a pretty awesome "Meet The" video.

----

Meet the Gas Pump

RED Engineer: Hey, Spy, checkout this awesome new rig I set up. I set it up so it would pump gasoline all over the ground there.

*pump squirts gas all over a hallway*

RED Engineer: All we need now is a little fire to light this badboy up!

RED Spy: Oui Monsieur..

*Takes a drag on his cigarette and throws it into the hallway. Screaming is heard, and BLU Spy rushes in on fire. RED Engineer and RED Spy laugh and Guffaw*

*A muffled yell is heard as BLU Pyro bursts through the flames relatively unharmed*

RED Spy: Merde.
 

AceDiamond

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Jul 7, 2008
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axle 19 said:
I cant really think of anything they can add to the engineer to make it better. Maybe a joke weapon or two like the jarate?

Knife-Wrench! Practical and safe.

Actually ever since Valve started the contribution thing I've been thinking up possible Engineer updates. I of course thought in the wrong direction, thinking of weapons and not buildables for the most part, but still. My ideas consisted of a shotgun that gave you metal for scoring critical hits and kills (the latter giving more than the former) and a sledgehammer that built structures faster but swung slower, and also dealt more damage at a further reach.

As far as buildables go? Well my joke weapon was a sentry gun disguised as a computer mainframe (basically a 1960s version of the laptop gun from Perfect Dark), and the other buildable isn't really a buildable but rather a PDA upgrade. Essentially replaces the "destroy" PDA with a "Self Destruct" PDA. The difference being that self-detonating a structure will set off a damaging explosion, or alternatively any time your structures are destroyed they go off in that fashion. Not the greatest ideas I know but that would make a bit of a nasty surprise for pyros and spies
 

Altorin

Jack of No Trades
May 16, 2008
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AceDiamond said:
a sledgehammer that built structures faster but swung slower.
Actually I like that, but make it a giant club, and call it the Rubble Club, after the Barney Rubble Method of Fixing things.
 

AceDiamond

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Jul 7, 2008
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Altorin said:
AceDiamond said:
a sledgehammer that built structures faster but swung slower.
Actually I like that, but make it a giant club, and call it the Rubble Club, after the Barney Rubble Method of Fixing things.
And come to think of it, the Engineer does have a permanent 5-o-clock shadow like Barney...

damn that fits almost too well.
 

scotth266

Wait when did I get a sub
Jan 10, 2009
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My personal idea for the Engineer update? A shrapnel gun that does more damage than the shotty, but uses metal instead of bullets (say 10 a shot, which would give you 20 shots total, less that the shotgun.) You could also lower the loading capacity, and make it look something steampunk-ish [http://bioshock.wikia.com/wiki/Shotgun] (I mean, this IS the engineer we're talking about.)
 

funksobeefy

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ugh I cant get enough TF2! I love that game and cant wait to get it on the computer. I have yet to play with any of the updates because I play on the 360
 

axle 19

Bearer of the Necronomicon
Aug 2, 2008
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AceDiamond said:
axle 19 said:
I cant really think of anything they can add to the engineer to make it better. Maybe a joke weapon or two like the jarate?

Knife-Wrench! Practical and safe.

Actually ever since Valve started the contribution thing I've been thinking up possible Engineer updates. I of course thought in the wrong direction, thinking of weapons and not buildables for the most part, but still. My ideas consisted of a shotgun that gave you metal for scoring critical hits and kills (the latter giving more than the former) and a sledgehammer that built structures faster but swung slower, and also dealt more damage at a further reach.

As far as buildables go? Well my joke weapon was a sentry gun disguised as a computer mainframe (basically a 1960s version of the laptop gun from Perfect Dark), and the other buildable isn't really a buildable but rather a PDA upgrade. Essentially replaces the "destroy" PDA with a "Self Destruct" PDA. The difference being that self-detonating a structure will set off a damaging explosion, or alternatively any time your structures are destroyed they go off in that fashion. Not the greatest ideas I know but that would make a bit of a nasty surprise for pyros and spies
Holy shit forgot that episode of scrubs. That would be a fantastic idea.
 

Zer_

Rocket Scientist
Feb 7, 2008
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Give the engineer a sort of hacking device and a remote control that allows him to control both friendly and enemy sentries. Of course it has its limitations.

-Only one sentry can be controlled at any given time.
-The engineer must actually throw the tapping device onto an enemy sentry without dying.
-He cannot control both himself and the sentry at once.
-The remote and receiver have limited range.
-Using the tapper, you can effectively shoot anyone in view, thus eliminating the effect of the short targeting distance for the sentry.

The hacking device could also cause things like teleporters and dispensers to malfunction. Imagine having your lower body come out backwards a-la Spaceballs due to teleport malfunction. This would cause your directional controls to be reversed. Other odd and funny malfunctions could prop up.

Hack dispensers so they dispense small furry balls known as Trubbles (Trek reference ftw) instead of ammunition. So basically, when the enemy team runs out of ammo, they end up having harmless Trubbles that they can throw at enemies. Trubbles could do something like 5 damage when hitting an enemy thus adding a comedy factor (and potential achievements).
 

randommaster

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Sep 10, 2008
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Sir John The Net Knight said:
randommaster said:
I think an exploding sentry would be a good alternative for the regular one. It would only be able to get to level 2, but if you tried to sap it, it would explode and deal heavy damage, if not outright kill, anything within sapping range. That means it gets to be effective against other classes while making spies think twice about sappin ma sentry.
No offense, but that's a bad idea. Like "Crossing the Streams" bad.

Level 2 sentries don't get rockets which means it's much harder for them to push back attacking enemies, especially Heavies. Also having the sentry explode when sapped makes no sense. When a spy saps a sentry, it's usually because he has friends waiting outside it's line of site looking to come in and wreak havoc. Or he's playing head games with the Engineer, hoping to lure him into an ambush. In very few cases is anyone but the Spy going to be taken out. Yes, the spy is dead, but so is the sentry. And if the Engineer is minding his sentry, he will also die because sentry guns can friendly fire their owners. To put it mildly, this functionality makes sapping a sentry an even more attractive prospect. Since there's no way for the Engineer to save the sentry and he has to spend time and metal to rebuild it. Assuming he wasn't caught in the blast.

If I can demonstrate using chess terminology. You took out a pawn with a rook, but on the next move you lost your rook to a bishop and you put your king in check. [small]Best I can do, rooks don't self-destruct. Not in standard chess, anyway.[/small]
I take offense to that, sir or madame! I challenge you to a game of exploding chess!

It was jus a thought, so I wasn't really considering all the gameplay implications. It's what Valve has done with pretty much every other class, though, and it lets the Engie leave the sentry alone, which was the point of the Repair Node and still let the Engie build teleporters and dispensers.

Anything new is going to be really hard to do, though, since swaping weapons doesn't change much and changing buildings messes with the game.

Who knows, maybe the engineer will be able to Voltron-out a bunch of structures and walk around in a homemade mech suit. Whatever it is, I'm interested in seeing how Valve solves the problem.
 

ahiddenfigure

Hunter of Monsters
Sep 14, 2009
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Triffid said:
I don't think teleporters are as necessary as they think. Dispensers, yes, but NONE of the TF2 (official maps) are so overly large that any class (with exception of the heavy) can't survive without them. Hell, most of the times I played, engies ONLY built teleporters as spy-bait, in essence, making them useless to the rest of the team
What game modes have you been playing? You've obviously never played Payload, they're practically necessary all the time on both offence and defence. Any team on Badwater Basin with no teleporters is doomed to failure.
 

Ninjamedic

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Dec 8, 2009
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randommaster said:
Ninjamedic said:
DROP THE PS3 BOYCOTT ALREADY!! YOU BUMDERS!
...............Im, Im sorry about that.
An improved shottie would work.
Not until Sony desides to change the system architecture of their console to something that's easier to develop for.
It's not that it is hard to develop for, it's hard to PORT games to it. Reason being that's it isn't microsoft. PC->360 is easy, PC->PS3 needs effort.
 

randommaster

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Sep 10, 2008
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Ninjamedic said:
randommaster said:
Ninjamedic said:
DROP THE PS3 BOYCOTT ALREADY!! YOU BUMDERS!
...............Im, Im sorry about that.
An improved shottie would work.
Not until Sony desides to change the system architecture of their console to something that's easier to develop for.
It's not that it is hard to develop for, it's hard to PORT games to it. Reason being that's it isn't Microsoft. PC->360 is easy, PC->PS3 needs effort.
That is what I meant to say, I just did so very badly.

There have been various developers who have complained about creating games for the PS3, though.