Vatican Voices Disapproval for Confession iPhone App
- Thread starter Logan Westbrook
- Start date
I don't mean job like that, so I can see your point there. I simply meant that a fair few people would find it easier to do this than talk to someone in reality, so it might hurt the numbers who go for actual confession, or possibly even who go to Church if the idea that they don't need a priest to be with God catches on. I simply thought that was a good idea.bushwhacker2k said:
You're probably right and it probably won't though.
I'll take your word for that.Cliff_m85 said:
I feel better letting a kid use this on an Iphone than the face to old man behind a thin wall in the shadows option.
Do you think when they uprgrade their app they'll call it the Reformation app?
But isnt paying for a confession called an indulgence and a sin? Or maybe usuary?
But isnt paying for a confession called an indulgence and a sin? Or maybe usuary?
Well, it was one of Luther's main sticking points at that point in the Reformation: at that time selling indulgences, which were basically "get out of Purgatory free cards" for after you had already confessed was a relatively common practice. The Catholic Church got rid of the practice in the Counter-Reformation. Indulgences themselves still exist, but are not physical objects and cannot be bought or sold for money. Instead, they are earned through prayer and good works. They still exist because the Church still believes that even if you confess your sins and are absolved of them, you must still spend time in Purgatory for your sins. Essentially, it's saying that you can't basically do whatever in the hell you want, no matter how bad, then waltz into confession and tell the priest and walk out with a clean slate. The only way you actually have a 100% clean slate is to go to reconciliation, then earn a plenary indulgence, which wipes all time in Purgatory for the sins in your life away. Of course, earning such an indulgence is not easy and can only happen at certain times.Prometherion said:
But, TL
R, it has never been OK in the Church to sell absolution from sins, and the sale of indulgences has indeed been banned for over 500 years now. Money is not the main issue here, it's a matter of administering a sacrament. Personally, I think that if this app is really just meant to help prepare someone for the sacrament (which is actually quite a nifty idea), they should probably rename the app to reflect that. Something like "Confession Preperation" or "Examination of Conscience". That way it would be clear as day that this is not meant to take the place of the sacrament. It's likely the Vatican doesn't have all the details about the app, and has spoken up based of the limited amount it knows, but given what they likely know and the impression the name of the app gives, their reaction is not surprising.
But, when you think about it, it's easier for a person to confess to an iPhone than it is to a person, because then it's more of a secret, sure it gets rid of the entire absolution dispension thing, but as long as it's a confession to God, be it Person, Bird or iPhone apps, it's still a medium of confession.Toriver said:
But the Sacrament of Reconciliation is one of the seven sacraments in the Catholic Church. And merely confessing is totally different than actually receiving absolution from your sins. Confession is basically saying you're sorry. You can do that any time, to anyone, sure. But to actually ensure you are forgiven and make things right with God again, that's where the sacrament comes in. How would you like it if I stole something from you, then felt bad about it, but instead of apologizing to you, I apologized on my iPhone to an app? Kinda defeats the purpose of apologizing.TerribleAssassin said:
Further, confessing your sins face to face with a priest is really a test of exactly how sorry you are for your sin, and can actually make a great first step to thinking about what you've done and taking action to improve yourself afterward. It feels great to get that guilt off your chest afterward, but thinking about it beforehand and actually confessing your sins to the priest is not a pleasant experience, nor is it meant to be. A phone or a bird is not a person, and certainly isn't a priest. You're not only confessing to a person, you're confessing to someone who is supposed to be a moral guide to the church community, and a person you know on top of that. This is not telling a stranger. Sure, it's water under the bridge the moment the priest absolves you, and he likely forgets everything you tell him within a day or two (priests hear a LOT of confessions), but to face him and tell him all that you've done, it's certainly something you've really got to be sorry about and willing to take action to change. Or something you're not ashamed to mention at all, at which point, according to the Church, although the priest can say you're absolved, it's not a valid confession. The point is, the fact that it's difficult can actually be seen as an overall benefit in this case. If it's not difficult, it's really not teaching you anything. What doesn't kill you makes you stronger, in this case, in a spiritual sense.
As to any sort of confession being good in the eyes of God, the Church itself doesn't even really deny this, but in regards to certain other sacraments and Church rites, such as the Eucharist, which should only be undertaken by those not in a state of mortal sin, reconciliation is kind of an assurance to both you and the Church that you're in good standing on that note. Any confession could be good in the eyes of God, but better safe than sorry, you know?
That would be like confessing to any other object, unless it's an online confession, either way, laziness much?
Gah, so much misinformation about catholic theology here.
No, the Pope doesn't define the practice of Catholicism, though he does have the authority to infallibly, but only in rare cases explicitly defined by scripture and Sacred Tradition, both in terms of required conditions and the topics where it is possible. This same authority is granted to the church as a whole.
In releases such as this, the Pope is to be respected, but his word is not absolute.
An app could not replace confession because of sacramental theology, though it does not seem to be what the app is intending.
No, the Pope doesn't define the practice of Catholicism, though he does have the authority to infallibly, but only in rare cases explicitly defined by scripture and Sacred Tradition, both in terms of required conditions and the topics where it is possible. This same authority is granted to the church as a whole.
In releases such as this, the Pope is to be respected, but his word is not absolute.
An app could not replace confession because of sacramental theology, though it does not seem to be what the app is intending.
I believe confession is something a little more personal, I don't agree with the app but that's IMO.
This seems more like something a guy would use right after telling his wife he's going to work and right before an coke-filled night of orgy-clubbing.
This seems more like something a guy would use right after telling his wife he's going to work and right before an coke-filled night of orgy-clubbing.
They're the ones that write the doctrine, so..... yeah. If you're a Catholic, you listen to them. It's in the paperwork when you sign up.Natdaprat said: