We Really, Really Don't Need New Consoles
- Thread starter Yahtzee Croshaw
- Start date
I grew up on console gaming (started with the NES). I've owned SNES, Genesis, N64, PS2, Gamecube, 2 360's, PS3, and Wii. Until about a year ago, I could count the games I played seriously on a PC, on one hand. In the past year, I don't know if I've turned on my 360 more than 2 times, my PS3 is used exclusively as a Blu Ray player, and my Wii was sold off long ago. Since then, I've played nearly everything on the PC or my iPhone.
Are there occasionally technical issues? Rare, but sure. The thing is, there's issues on consoles now as well, since the motto now is "ship now, patch later" on consoles as well. Only it takes a LOT longer to patch on consoles. My 360 is constantly trying to sell me anything other than games and slowing everything down to do so, and trying to sell me digital things which are going to vanish shortly (when the Nextbox comes out and they of course start turning servers off) for ridiculous prices.
I'm sorry, but PC gaming is just better right now. I hope console gaming returns to where it was 10 years ago, where I could trust that when I put a disc/cartridge in, it will just work, there won't be ridiculous security/monetary concerns, and everyone can be happy. But that's not what console-makers/game publishers want. They want to shove as much advertising, as much extra crap which would have been free unlockables, and as little time testing as possible down our throats, and then berate us for thinking we then own the games and can do with, and resell as we please. At least on Steam, I'm paying FAR lower prices, so even if I don't get to transfer the game, I've paid little to do so.
Also, and this is a bit off-topic, I know, but the other answer is tabletop gaming. Many board/card games are just more fan-friendly and more fun than video games right now.
Are there occasionally technical issues? Rare, but sure. The thing is, there's issues on consoles now as well, since the motto now is "ship now, patch later" on consoles as well. Only it takes a LOT longer to patch on consoles. My 360 is constantly trying to sell me anything other than games and slowing everything down to do so, and trying to sell me digital things which are going to vanish shortly (when the Nextbox comes out and they of course start turning servers off) for ridiculous prices.
I'm sorry, but PC gaming is just better right now. I hope console gaming returns to where it was 10 years ago, where I could trust that when I put a disc/cartridge in, it will just work, there won't be ridiculous security/monetary concerns, and everyone can be happy. But that's not what console-makers/game publishers want. They want to shove as much advertising, as much extra crap which would have been free unlockables, and as little time testing as possible down our throats, and then berate us for thinking we then own the games and can do with, and resell as we please. At least on Steam, I'm paying FAR lower prices, so even if I don't get to transfer the game, I've paid little to do so.
Also, and this is a bit off-topic, I know, but the other answer is tabletop gaming. Many board/card games are just more fan-friendly and more fun than video games right now.
It's already too costly, requiring larger studious and more intricate, complex and time intensive (to make) visuals on next gen consoles will not help things, and if you think otherwise, you know surprisingly little about tech and the industry. You can blame it on marketing, but only to an extent. It's obvious too many studious are sinking too much money into titles only to not meet their sales, while smaller projects or cheaper projects sell less, but actually make their money back and then some.Clovus said:
I agree with your closing sentiment, the rest just sounds like hit trolling to me tbh. Console hardware has to move forward or consoles in general will die, they already have valve snapping at their heels.
What is it with escapist staff and making stupid proclamations amount console/PC gaming? I still remember with great resentment that retarded opinion video movie bob put up.
What is it with escapist staff and making stupid proclamations amount console/PC gaming? I still remember with great resentment that retarded opinion video movie bob put up.
This is a sad example of finding points and examples to fit your pre-determined argument rather then coming to a consensus free from bias
I do agree with some of the points made...but this was just ridiculous.
The Wii U is not selling well because it's not much more powerful then PS3, xbox360 if at all. What existing console owner is going to spend £300 on a new console, which is basically the same, that most 3rd party devs are not supporting and who's exclusives are not even out yet.
If the Wii U was significantly more powerful we would be able to gauge what it's sales really mean for the PS4/nextbox
As someone mentioned above. COD sells a crap load on consoles. What Escapist wants is not what the market wants.
I am not sure on console or pc or both. Other PC fanantics can spare me their 'you can build a similar spec pc at the same price' rubbish because if you were to build a PC with 512RAM or 256 gaming RAM it would not even touch the PS3 or 360.
I will see the performance difference between PS4 and a good gaming rig 6 months after release, compare prices... and make a decision.
I do agree with some of the points made...but this was just ridiculous.
The Wii U is not selling well because it's not much more powerful then PS3, xbox360 if at all. What existing console owner is going to spend £300 on a new console, which is basically the same, that most 3rd party devs are not supporting and who's exclusives are not even out yet.
If the Wii U was significantly more powerful we would be able to gauge what it's sales really mean for the PS4/nextbox
As someone mentioned above. COD sells a crap load on consoles. What Escapist wants is not what the market wants.
I am not sure on console or pc or both. Other PC fanantics can spare me their 'you can build a similar spec pc at the same price' rubbish because if you were to build a PC with 512RAM or 256 gaming RAM it would not even touch the PS3 or 360.
I will see the performance difference between PS4 and a good gaming rig 6 months after release, compare prices... and make a decision.
Remember when the AAA market was totally unsustainable and the only games that could turn a profit were Call of Duty, Halo and anything made by a single college student in their dorm? And then a new console forced developers into a completely alien set of hardware that tripled the standards of the most costly elements to program for? And then do you remember that those companies couldn't afford to take chances like the ones that led to Halo?UrinalDook said:
The xbox "another one" that I want uses the exact same operating system and software, but just has upgraded hardware. Is that so weird? Run old things better, have the ability to run new things. Done. Sold. Let's keep playing.
Why do consoles feel the need to completely reinvent the wheel when they release a new version? Seems like a waste of energy.
Why do consoles feel the need to completely reinvent the wheel when they release a new version? Seems like a waste of energy.
The hardware companies are hoping their consoles will be the central house computer of the future. If they get that, it'll be like printing money. Alas, realising such a sci-fi dream will require a few generations of controllable devices, control protocols and technical standards and the first generation hasn't even started yet.
No TV/light switch/fridge/security alarm company is going to make their stuff controllable by a house computer unless they know what house computers and protocols will exist in lots of homes to control it. As that controller doesn't exist yet, that means at least another generation after the next one (unless PS4 or XBox whatever will suddenly come with such a set of protocols). That means the console designers have somehow got to stay in the game as they wait for the sci-fi dream to coalesce into working technical standards and industry partnerships. Until then, more generations of consoles being pushed despite having no good reason to exist.
If and when this eventually kicks off, imagine the mess as Microsoft, Nintendo and Sony uses their technical standards as weapons against each other. Imagine the profiteering if one succeeds in dominating such a market.
No TV/light switch/fridge/security alarm company is going to make their stuff controllable by a house computer unless they know what house computers and protocols will exist in lots of homes to control it. As that controller doesn't exist yet, that means at least another generation after the next one (unless PS4 or XBox whatever will suddenly come with such a set of protocols). That means the console designers have somehow got to stay in the game as they wait for the sci-fi dream to coalesce into working technical standards and industry partnerships. Until then, more generations of consoles being pushed despite having no good reason to exist.
If and when this eventually kicks off, imagine the mess as Microsoft, Nintendo and Sony uses their technical standards as weapons against each other. Imagine the profiteering if one succeeds in dominating such a market.
PREACH IT!
I hear ya, man. PC Gaming Master Race. Consoles can go fuck themselves, that entire industry can burn for all I care.
I hear ya, man. PC Gaming Master Race. Consoles can go fuck themselves, that entire industry can burn for all I care.
The reason the Wii didn't stand to well with "hardcore" gamers was more than just a simple gimmick. To play a Wii game had the player use so much physical excursion that players would tire out quickly from games that were enjoyable to play for more than 30 minutes. So much physical movement from the player to make an avatar move in a specific manner is far more annoying than having a touch screen on a game control.
To me, the touch screen is more than a gimmick. A gimmick in a video game console or game is when a "feature" is terribly implemented. When it is done right, it's now a feature.
I have a Xbox 360 and a ps3 and have already noticed how many shooters I have in my library compared to action/adventure games and fighting games. Though the game that sold me the most on the touch screen was not Mario or Nintendo Land. It was Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate. A game that allows the player to decide was secondary HUD options that they don't want to clutter the TV screen to be displayed on the gamepad screen. And I LOVE it so much. Do I "need" to see my comrades health? No, but I have it on the second screen just to see who is not healing. -_-
P.S. I have a gaming PC as well...but Monster hunter man....Monster Hunter O_O
To me, the touch screen is more than a gimmick. A gimmick in a video game console or game is when a "feature" is terribly implemented. When it is done right, it's now a feature.
I have a Xbox 360 and a ps3 and have already noticed how many shooters I have in my library compared to action/adventure games and fighting games. Though the game that sold me the most on the touch screen was not Mario or Nintendo Land. It was Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate. A game that allows the player to decide was secondary HUD options that they don't want to clutter the TV screen to be displayed on the gamepad screen. And I LOVE it so much. Do I "need" to see my comrades health? No, but I have it on the second screen just to see who is not healing. -_-P.S. I have a gaming PC as well...but Monster hunter man....Monster Hunter O_O
On the issue of backwards compatibility, SEGA, long ago, had hit upon a terrific idea, in my opinion, with the Dreamcast. As I recall, the Dreamcast hardware was designed to be scalable. This meant that improvements to the existing capacity (speed, resolution, sound, etc.) could be obtained by simply making incremental increases to the number of pipelines, clock-speed, etc. in the hardware, and it would still be the SAME underlying hardware architecture. As a result, the hardware is instantly and inherently backwards compatible without the need to invest further R&D (or packaging old hardware alongside the new hardware in the same box, like with the PS2 and original PS3). There were a lot of other nice ideas in the Dreamcast's design that were intended to enhance gameplay enjoyment; unfortunately, developers went with graphics escalation in the PS2 (because they were counting polygons and not understanding that the Dreamcast's lower polygon count was not as much a factor because it used those polygons more intelligently) and the false promises of being able to do things like Reboot in real-time.
Overall, I would agree with Yahtzee's basic point. We don't need new consoles; the current ones are more that adequate. What we need are better quality games, and by that, I don't mean higher polygon counts, higher-fidelity render engines, higher texture resolutions, or bigger empty landscapes; I mean games that play better, have more interesting gameplay and game-mechanics, have more interesting concepts and themes, and are designed with identifiable and unique styles and art-direction (used to be a time you could tell which studio or publisher developed a game just by looking at it and feeling how it played; nowadays, all games look and behave about the same). We're well past the point that graphics add anything to the game.
Overall, I would agree with Yahtzee's basic point. We don't need new consoles; the current ones are more that adequate. What we need are better quality games, and by that, I don't mean higher polygon counts, higher-fidelity render engines, higher texture resolutions, or bigger empty landscapes; I mean games that play better, have more interesting gameplay and game-mechanics, have more interesting concepts and themes, and are designed with identifiable and unique styles and art-direction (used to be a time you could tell which studio or publisher developed a game just by looking at it and feeling how it played; nowadays, all games look and behave about the same). We're well past the point that graphics add anything to the game.
Great article, Yahtzee, one that explains easily many of the reasons why neither the PS4 or XBox 3-Online Supertree are of any interest to me. It does leave out the biggest reason for my apathy, one that would understandably not occur to you given your job as a reviewer: I have such a massive backlog of games from this genreation that I am in no rush to grab the next game console. Especially one that has zero backwards compatability.
The word of the day is: anathema, something loathed or detested.
Anyways, I indeed agree. One of the reasons why I probably won't get a WiiU (besides the hardly useful tablet controller that drains energy like a flushing toilet) is its lack of Gamecube compatibility. What if I want to get back to Super Mario Sunshine or finish Zelda: Wind Waker? What if I want to play those weird Capcom games? The Wii doesn't seem to take much space in its backwards compatibility, so why can't the WiiU go back 2 generations?
Also, the PS4 had better have a dozen or so PS3 games or "streaming capabilities," or I'll just get a PS3 this summer with its wide range of exclusives and HD remakes.
Anyways, I indeed agree. One of the reasons why I probably won't get a WiiU (besides the hardly useful tablet controller that drains energy like a flushing toilet) is its lack of Gamecube compatibility. What if I want to get back to Super Mario Sunshine or finish Zelda: Wind Waker? What if I want to play those weird Capcom games? The Wii doesn't seem to take much space in its backwards compatibility, so why can't the WiiU go back 2 generations?
Also, the PS4 had better have a dozen or so PS3 games or "streaming capabilities," or I'll just get a PS3 this summer with its wide range of exclusives and HD remakes.
I don't want a new console unless it can make me a cup of coffee. Seriously. It doesn't make to make an upgrade at this point. If your fancy new machine can't play my last generation games or function without the internet there to hold it's hand, in what way is it an upgrade? Unless it can make coffee.
Time to save up for a new graphics card...
Time to save up for a new graphics card...
Uh, yes? And yes, and yes, and- maybe not for the specific reasons Yahtzee cites, but yes again?
I've been saying much the same for a while now, though I'm reasonably content to wear the "doomsayer" placard. The cost of games development is skyrocketing, the sale price hasn't kept up, people aren't willing to spend more on the games, the means they've come up with to bridge those cost gaps are largely questionable at best and self-destructive and audience-insulting at worst. The cost of manufacturing hardware is such that companies selling their consoles at a loss has gone from unthinkable to all but Standard Operating Procedure, and the cost of creating games that justify the new hardware promises no end to the above trends in sight.
But, much as I love my PC, I don't feel unfettered optimism in that area, either. The PC seems to be getting more exclusive games and more games developed for it cross-media this year than ever, and that's great. But Windows 8 suggests a disturbing trend of Microsoft trying to create a more closed market in which they can maintain a greater control in the hopes of creating a space where they have the kind of presence that Google and Apple enjoy today. And neither Google nor Apple seems like its about to re-create the combination of power and open development in their platforms that Microsoft seems in a hurry to squander. I'm no more in a hurry to do all my gaming on a Android or Apple tablet than Yahtzee is to shelve all his PS3 and XBox 360 libraries.
My prognosis remains: major video game market crash within five years. Would be happy to be wrong; don't see a way through.
I've been saying much the same for a while now, though I'm reasonably content to wear the "doomsayer" placard. The cost of games development is skyrocketing, the sale price hasn't kept up, people aren't willing to spend more on the games, the means they've come up with to bridge those cost gaps are largely questionable at best and self-destructive and audience-insulting at worst. The cost of manufacturing hardware is such that companies selling their consoles at a loss has gone from unthinkable to all but Standard Operating Procedure, and the cost of creating games that justify the new hardware promises no end to the above trends in sight.
But, much as I love my PC, I don't feel unfettered optimism in that area, either. The PC seems to be getting more exclusive games and more games developed for it cross-media this year than ever, and that's great. But Windows 8 suggests a disturbing trend of Microsoft trying to create a more closed market in which they can maintain a greater control in the hopes of creating a space where they have the kind of presence that Google and Apple enjoy today. And neither Google nor Apple seems like its about to re-create the combination of power and open development in their platforms that Microsoft seems in a hurry to squander. I'm no more in a hurry to do all my gaming on a Android or Apple tablet than Yahtzee is to shelve all his PS3 and XBox 360 libraries.
My prognosis remains: major video game market crash within five years. Would be happy to be wrong; don't see a way through.
But you ignored all my reasons why this isn't true. How come CDProjekt has no trouble making a AAA game with better graphics but SquareEnix loses money on Tomb Raider? It's not the visuals - the Witcher 2 looks better. The Witcher 2 is not a smaller game either. SE are just doing it wrong.grumpymooselion said:
There is absolutely no indication that the new console generation will be more powerful than current top of the line PCs. Some companies are already making games for those PCs, and they aren't losing money either. You just ignored my statement about the textures involved too. I'll change my mind on this as soon as someone explains what all these new costs are and why they're different than the costs current companies are already paying and still making plenty of money.
Seriously, the first few years of this console generation will just be comparable to the current PC versions with all the bells and whistles (High AA, PhysX or something comparable, hig res textures, etc.) turned on. These things already exist.