What is so great about Anime?

CJ1145

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Texas America Murphy said:
You think being film student is a guarantee against ignorance and knee-jerk opinions? I want to be snarky, but that thought is so innocent. So pure. So totally outside of real-world comprehension. It would be like taking away Santa.
If you're gonna be knee-jerk make sure you aren't wrong on a foundational level first.

thublihnk said:
Did I say I hated anime? No, I didn't, good job man! I said I don't dig it, and I also alluded to the fact that I don't dig pompous cocks.

I actually used to like anime as a kid, with the DBZ's and the Gundams and whatnot, but I grew out of that and found the more 'adult' (read: not hentai) Anime to be criminally shallow and fan-servicey when compared to other genres of animation, entertainment, etc. And this crusader-like fury that a fan of the form gets when I say I'm just not that into it doesn't really help the case. Kinda makes it sound like it's something for the less-intelligent, if you know what I'm saying, pal.
First off, I gotta back up and laugh for a second at your words. "Crusader-like fury" tells me you're a little too defensive of yourself. Just because I'm here to defend some viewpoints doesn't mean I'm some crazy frothing pilgrim out on his quest to slay the evil thublihnk and return peace to his humble village. I gotta ask, what "adult" anime are you watching that makes you think this? Because while fanservice is a big part in many shows, it's practically absent in a whole lot of others, to the point that western stuff is downright slutty in comparison.
 

Dimensional Vortex

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Texas America Murphy said:
I?m a film student at the University of Texas.
"They only got two things in Texas, steers and queers and you don't look like a deer to me!" - Full Metal Jacket. Naw I kid, I kid don't take any offense please.

I don't know why people like it so much, I watch it when it is good and that I how and when it should be viewed. To all the people who read this, you shouldn't be watching Anime because it is Anime, you should watch Anime if you like that particular Anime. I will only watch an Anime like Elfen Lied because I enjoy it and the fact that it is made in Japan or has a certain artistic way of it don't appeal to me, what appeals to me is the storyline and the enjoyment I get from watching it.

In short you should only watch an Anime because it is enjoyable for you too see, I know that a lot of people might a watch a crappy anime because it is an anime.

P.S. I guess if you like or don't like Anime it is because you are just that kind of person.
 

thublihnk

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banksie said:
thublihnk said:
I am so sick of this attitude that everyone has to like anime or else they just haven't watched enough of it. Look, it's a style, it's a specific thing for specific people. I'm an appreciator of animation and I'm a huge appreciator of film, but Anime has a culture behind it that I just can't get behind, and said culture heavily influences the content of the art. And I just don't dig the style.

I just don't dig. You dig?
Except that anime isn't a style per se, yes there are many common tropes and techniques that get reused but that isn't anime in totality. Studio Ghibli films have a wildly different animation style and look to what is typically called anime yet that is what they are. Even within Studio Ghibli the art style and conventions used vary greatly with 'My Neighbors the Yamadas' (it being directed by Takahata) having a very different artistic style to anything Miyazaki produces.

It is kinda akin to slamming all French cinema because you dislike the French New Wave films of the late sixties.

There is anime out there that caters to pretty much anyone's tastes. It may take a while to find it but it is there. I mean they made a series about competitive bread making for goodness sake, bakers of the world rejoice! :)

That said I don't believe in forcing people to watch something. If you really don't want to watch anime than that is both your choice and to some extent loss.
I get that, and I'll sometimes be up to watch an anime that my friends say I'll like (they're usually wrong) but MOST of the stuff is just completely not my cup of tea. I'm also a big film guy (filmmaker, really) so it takes quite a bit of convincing for me to watch anything that isn't live-acted. Like, I'm talking Pixar or bust.
 

Godhead

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In before lock(?)

OT: It's either a hit or miss thing in my opinion. Just don't watch it and try to not think about it, and if your girlfriend brings the subject up politely but firmly say that you don't want to watch anime.

Also welcome to the Escapist OP. :D
 

The Geek Lord

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Texas America Murphy said:
I couldn?t help but notice that virtually half the people on this board of some sort of Anime character as their avatar, so obviously people here love it and its popular. But for all my education I cannot possibly comprehend why people call this ?art.? I was hoping that maybe y?all could enlighten me. There must be something I am missing
I'm not bothered to go through this topic, but I'll just say that I'm a huge anime fan. And I'm also just going to say I laughed when you said "anime" and "art" in the same sentence.

If you'll excuse me, I'm off to watch the Black Lagoon box set I got today. Tits and guns, my friend. Tits and guns.
 

Bara_no_Hime

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Texas America Murphy said:
Dear Nerds, explain to me what the heck the deal with Anime is.

But for all my education I cannot possibly comprehend why people call this ?art.? I was hoping that maybe y?all could enlighten me. There must be something I am missing.
I am sure that many flames have ensued, but I won't even read them because I'm sure they will just upset and annoy me. Instead, I will respond directly to the OP as if his question was neutrally phrased (which it wasn't).

Anime is Japanese popular culture. Much of it's appeal is that it contains different archtypes, different tropes, and different stock characters than western culture. It also contains western characters and archtypes filtered through eastern culture. This creates a really strange and unique set of ideas.

This provided an entire generation (myself included) with something that was unlike anything we'd ever experienced before.

Additionally, because the Japanese generally have short attention spans, many series (not all by any means, but many) are fully realized within 13-26 episodes. This means that the writers can arc the plots with a clear beginning, middle, and end. Many older Anime fans (like myself) were originally attracted to this tendency. However, this stands out less now, since many western TV shows have adopted this style in the past ten years or so, because Anime proved that fans actually liked shows with that sort of plot.

Finally, returning to my first point, because there is another culture involved, there are new genres that do (or did) not exist in western culture. For instance, "Magic Girl Shoujo" is basically a genre dedicated to female super-heroes for female viewers/readers. I make this distinction because most western super-hero stuff is usually targeted to men or both men and women, but rarely just to women. The option to have a genre targetd to me is... nice. Female super-heros who aren't wearing fetish wear and bikinis? Great! Even if they do spend too much time worrying about Boys. **sigh**

But I digress. The main appeal of Anime is that it offers a unique insight into familiar forms of artistic expression. If you don't like japanese culture (samurai, ninjas, giant mechs, etc), or standard "nerd" genres (sci-fi, fantasy, speculative fiction, historical fiction), then you probably won't like anime, since it's just the japanese version there-of.

Anyway, I hope this answered your question in a non-fanish way. I've defended anime and manga in academia at the Doctoral level, so I'm quite experienced at looking at Anime from the outside and explaining it's appeal (and value). Hope this helped.

-- Bara no Hime

P.S. Also, I'm not a particular fan of Naruto (long ninja shows bore me) or Guren Lagen (hated every single character), and I've never seen Code Geas. I'm a huge anime fan, but I can see how those two shows could turn you off - they turned me off too.
 

thublihnk

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CJ1145 said:
Texas America Murphy said:
You think being film student is a guarantee against ignorance and knee-jerk opinions? I want to be snarky, but that thought is so innocent. So pure. So totally outside of real-world comprehension. It would be like taking away Santa.
If you're gonna be knee-jerk make sure you aren't wrong on a foundational level first.

thublihnk said:
Did I say I hated anime? No, I didn't, good job man! I said I don't dig it, and I also alluded to the fact that I don't dig pompous cocks.

I actually used to like anime as a kid, with the DBZ's and the Gundams and whatnot, but I grew out of that and found the more 'adult' (read: not hentai) Anime to be criminally shallow and fan-servicey when compared to other genres of animation, entertainment, etc. And this crusader-like fury that a fan of the form gets when I say I'm just not that into it doesn't really help the case. Kinda makes it sound like it's something for the less-intelligent, if you know what I'm saying, pal.
First off, I gotta back up and laugh for a second at your words. "Crusader-like fury" tells me you're a little too defensive of yourself. Just because I'm here to defend some viewpoints doesn't mean I'm some crazy frothing pilgrim out on his quest to slay the evil thublihnk and return peace to his humble village. I gotta ask, what "adult" anime are you watching that makes you think this? Because while fanservice is a big part in many shows, it's practically absent in a whole lot of others, to the point that western stuff is downright slutty in comparison.
Crusader-like fury was both an exaggeration and in reference to you stating, outright falsely, that I 'hate' anime. I don't hate anime, I don't feel anywhere near that way about Anime. I just don't dig a vast majority of it, and it takes a lot of convincing for me to watch any of it.

And Death Note. Started with promise, but a little weak, then continued with pure whoring to the fans, an inches-shallow narrative and drawing out the story that should've ended, like, WAAAAY earlier than it did (20 issues. MAYBE). Admittedly, I only read the Manga, but I was told the anime was even worse.
 

Keltrick

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CJ1145 said:
Texas America Murphy said:
OH GOD YOU'RE RIGHT! I AM ASHAMED! I AM SO VERY ASHAMED!
Sarcasm gets a fool nowhere. Right now you are about hip-deep in quicksand. If you're going to go on a rant and generalize, don't be surprised if you're called out on it, which I'm sure you have been dozens of times over through the course of this thread.
Amen.

OT: A genre and a medium are different things. I don't think there is really ANY hope of the OP enjoying anime with this mindset. I'm not a big fan of anime. I watched Yu-Gi-Oh and pokemon as a young one, and even a few episodes of other's here and there, but it boils down to this:

Anime is a medium, in the same way books are. They can tell wildly different stories. If I read a single chapter of Twilight, Pride and Prejudice, and the novel adaptation of "Batman: The Dark Knight" I probably wouldn't be able to safely say all books are a waste of my time, and highly overrated.

You have a lot of variety in what you saw, but you didn't see all there is and you certainly didn't see it in depth. There is anime for 13 year old kids who want to see explosions. There is anime for 20 somethings who like a good murder mystery. Its just like movies, American cartoons, anything. Yes there are idiots who assume anything with the stamp of Japan on it is made of artistic gold, and will grant them eternal youth. Then again there are people who say the same about any movie with a nude scene. >_>
 

CJ1145

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thublihnk said:
]Crusader-like fury was both an exaggeration and in reference to you stating, outright falsely, that I 'hate' anime. I don't hate anime, I don't feel anywhere near that way about Anime. I just don't dig a vast majority of it, and it takes a lot of convincing for me to watch any of it.

And Death Note. Started with promise, but a little weak, then continued with pure whoring to the fans, an inches-shallow narrative and drawing out the story that should've ended, like, WAAAAY earlier than it did (20 issues. MAYBE). Admittedly, I only read the Manga, but I was told the anime was even worse.
Ah, I see. Death Note. Now it makes sense. See, Death Note actually falls under the Shonen category. Somewhat interestingly, as I understand it it is actually intended for somewhat juvenile audiences. Not little kids, obviously, but late teens and early twenties is about as high as the intended audience gets. So your search for "mature" anime found you anything but.
 

DropoftheGun

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I think people enjoy anime because it typically doesn't get its hands tied in terms of social issues. It's really easy to get offended by people portraying something which they believe strongly on, but watching an animation makes the separation between reality and the show itself that much bigger.

Instead of thinking of anime as a "genre" like comedy or drama, think of it as a medium, like cinematic or televised. You can ask the same question about those questionable 'reality' shows on MTV and VH1, except that's a terrible analogy and kinda misses the point (moving on).

I saw a reply about watching anime like Ghost in the Shell and Cowboy Bebop, those shows would go on the same channels as Law and Order or Firefly, while the shows you watched would be straight to Nickelodean(?) or Disney.

Anime is also a great way to ignore physical limitations in storytelling and the resulting stories are really interesting.

Btw, this is my first post here; hey all!
 

-Samurai-

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Whats so great about movies, books, music, art, or any other medium of entertainment?

I like the anime shows that I like because I like the stories. Just like how I like some movies for the stories.

Most people don't like it simply because it's anime. They like it because they like the story and/or characters.

It's just a different medium for entertainment.
[small]Ugh. I responded to a troll thread.[/small]
 

Bradax24

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I'm a fan of anime, and if you want to know my reason for liking anime, it's because it's one of the few forms of animation that takes itself seriously.

Movies are a different story completely, compared to television shows. Many of the Renaissance Disney movies could easily surpass Japanese animated movies or shows. However, there are very few animated shows (that're not Japanese) off the top of my head that are in a genre other than humor. I guess since Looney Tunes, more people are inclined to think that humor is all animation is good for.

The first couple of anime shows I watched dealt with serious issues like death, the journey to find your own individuality, and prejudice; and these were kid shows. Because of this early exposure, I grew up along with this type of genre and have gotten a broader view of the genre. With this in mind, I can certainly say that the way you were exposed to the genre was beyond horrific.

First, the shows that you watched (while they are popular) are certainly not good. I can't really find a proper way to describe why there are people that prefer these shows beyond all else. I guess it's similar to why there are fans of Twilight and Family Guy, there's probably something in the show that people like that overshadows any other problem. In this case, I believe it was the action in all three shows.

Second, you can't really get the full enjoyment of a show until watch the whole series. Pretty self-explanatory; development, twists, story aren't all revealed in a couple episodes, you should watch a series from beginning to end to get the full enjoyment of it.

Third, the environment. These people are all fans, they normally can't relate to the average crowd that hasn't been exposed to this medium. It's like talking about current politics to a hardcore Trekkie, it doesn't really fit.

I say the genre's an acquired taste to instantly approve of, but at the end of it all it's just another form of film. You just need to find the right shows to see why people approve of this genre.

It you would like some recommendations of anime that shows the genre's true potential I'll give a few:
-Wolf's Rain
-Fullmetal Alchemist (the first series)
-Cowboy Bebop
-Paranoia Agent
-Deathnote

Just watch these shows by yourself to get the full enjoyment of the shows themselves, instead of the fan's commentary.
 

thublihnk

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CJ1145 said:
thublihnk said:
]Crusader-like fury was both an exaggeration and in reference to you stating, outright falsely, that I 'hate' anime. I don't hate anime, I don't feel anywhere near that way about Anime. I just don't dig a vast majority of it, and it takes a lot of convincing for me to watch any of it.

And Death Note. Started with promise, but a little weak, then continued with pure whoring to the fans, an inches-shallow narrative and drawing out the story that should've ended, like, WAAAAY earlier than it did (20 issues. MAYBE). Admittedly, I only read the Manga, but I was told the anime was even worse.
Ah, I see. Death Note. Now it makes sense. See, Death Note actually falls under the Shonen category. Somewhat interestingly, as I understand it it is actually intended for somewhat juvenile audiences. Not little kids, obviously, but late teens and early twenties is about as high as the intended audience gets. So your search for "mature" anime found you anything but.
See, this is... This is infuriating. There is literally no anime I can throw out here. I've seen quite a few, they were all really unimpressive. Death Note was just the most infuriating example. But let me ask you a question Mr. Interrogator Man. Why do you feel the need to defend Anime from me of all people? Honestly, I stated my point, I've given Anime a chance, I hardly think I'm being unfair to anime--so why do you feel the need to convince me that I must be wrong about something you're a fan of? I'm a huge fan of Action movies, my best friend them finds them positively stupid. We coexist, we talk about other things. Admittedly, I came to a thread about Anime, but I just kinda threw in my 2 cents agreeing with the OP (at least somewhat). I called you a dick, but that was kinda just riffing off someone else's joke, I assure you it wasn't really supposed to be a slight against you.

So anyway. Why? Why is it important that I watch all the bestest Animes and come to the light and just see how great they are?

BTW, OP, you're a Film student at UTA? This may be completely unimpressive, but I'm a film student up in Round Rock at the Art Institute of Austin. Admittedly, not as robust or prestigious of a program, but nearby and related. So cool, right?
 

lolnoobzor

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thublihnk said:
I actually used to like anime as a kid, with the DBZ's and the Gundams and whatnot, but I grew out of that and found the more 'adult' (read: not hentai) Anime to be criminally shallow and fan-servicey when compared to other genres of animation, entertainment, etc.
Hmm, your comparison with other forms of entertainement has me thinking now. I have the impression this perceived shallowness might be because of the youth of the genre - for a very long time, anime were really nothing more than children's shows, meaning that adult anime, or what I've called seinen above you, are relatively new (some 20 yrs old maximum I think, but I'm not familiar with the history), and have had less time to attract and inspire the talented artists that would bring the form to maturity.

If it helps, I've found seinen manga to be a much more developed genre than seinen anime, though I really don't know if it's a biased impression, or if I just haven't yet seen enough of them. This impression does make sense if you consider the economic imperative, as manga have a lower entrance fee on the market than anime, making an original manga easier to publish than an original anime. In fact, manga will be adapted to anime only if the manga develops enough of a following, which brings me to my next point:

Quite sadly most of the cross-overs from manga to anime seem to be motivated by the market's need for new crack, or shonen. Which means that I probably will never see adaptations of some of the most brilliant graphic novels I've ever read *sadface*
 

icame

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Texas America Murphy said:
icame said:
Personal preference. I for one think the fistful of dollars trilogy are boring, uninthralling, painful movies to watch. But thats my opinion.
And you are entitled to your opinion, no matter how woefully and undeniably incorrect it is.
Exactly. You can also have an opinion of an opinion I suppose, no matter how utterly wrong it is (imo).
 

thublihnk

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lolnoobzor said:
thublihnk said:
I actually used to like anime as a kid, with the DBZ's and the Gundams and whatnot, but I grew out of that and found the more 'adult' (read: not hentai) Anime to be criminally shallow and fan-servicey when compared to other genres of animation, entertainment, etc.
Hmm, your comparison with other forms of entertainement has me thinking now. I have the impression this perceived shallowness might be because of the youth of the genre - for a very long time, anime were really nothing more than children's shows, meaning that adult anime, or what I've called seinen above you, are relatively new (some 20 yrs old maximum I think, but I'm not familiar with the history), and have had less time to attract and inspire the talented artists that would bring the form to maturity.

If it helps, I've found seinen manga to be a much more developed genre than seinen anime, though I really don't know if it's a biased impression, or if I just haven't yet seen enough of them. This impression does make sense if you consider the economic imperative, as manga have a lower entrance fee on the market than anime, making an original manga easier to publish than an original anime. In fact, manga will be adapted to anime only if the manga develops enough of a following, which brings me to my next point:

Quite sadly most of the cross-overs from manga to anime seem to be motivated by the market's need for new crack, or shonen. Which means that I probably will never see adaptations of some of the most brilliant graphic novels I've ever read *sadface*
That is completely fair. Seriously, if Anime can evolve into something in the future that can grab me by the balls and give me something I can call F*UCK YEAH ART then I am on board, no doubt. I just haven't seen it yet. Hell, I've barely seen it in video games, the only reason I stick around with it is because I've seen the potential and I feel like things are really gonna start churning in that direction in the coming years, and I just love it as a pure pastime.
 

Veldel

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newer animes are not so great but older ones are you should try watching diffrent kinds and if you like martial arts look for Hokuto no Ken
 

Lord of Maggots

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Gosh, I hate hearing that whimpy "Oh well you can replace anime with anything and ask the same question" and "What genere this anime falls under is not the same as this anime".... Stop sounding like a philisophical hippie, and IT'S THE SAME DAMN THING... Does it have the same type of animation, same over the top stories, same copy paste, pre-teen looking, oddly dressed, silly hair colored, want-to-be-angsty, female like characters? Yes, Oh well then,IT'S A STUPID ANIME. Whats so great about comics? Continuity; linking a comic now to one 30 years ago is awesome. Whats so good about Star Wars and other giant fantasy setting shows/movies? MASSIVE amounts of backstory to learn and get lost in. Whats so good about westerns? It takes us back to a time in history we were not a part of but idolize. Whats so good about anime? ... the only thing that I can gather is the pictures of busty girls dressing up in little outfits... because you don't have to hear them talk about the stupid crap that goes on in those terrible japanimation abominatioins.
 

lolnoobzor

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thublihnk said:
That is completely fair. Seriously, if Anime can evolve into something in the future that can grab me by the balls and give me something I can call F*UCK YEAH ART then I am on board, no doubt. I just haven't seen it yet. Hell, I've barely seen it in video games, the only reason I stick around with it is because I've seen the potential and I feel like things are really gonna start churning in that direction in the coming years, and I just love it as a pure pastime.
I hate to be another guy jumping on the WATCH THIS bandwagon, but you might enjoy Paranoia Agent. Though I've mentioned a few good anime in my wall-of-text post, most of them are just fun entertainment, yet I warmly remember Paranoia Agent as one of the only anime that deeply affected me. That series is definitely 'art' for me, though I think this thread is troll-tastic enough without a debate about the nature of art :p

Heck, maybe the reason we can get so defensive about anime is that we see the potential in it too, and can't help but try to show it to other people?

Actually there is another one, by the same writer, called Boogiebop Phantom, that I've never seen yet! I guess I know what to watch once I finish Texhnolyze...