What's Wrong With Communism?

[Scarecrow38]

Communism has flaws due to human nature.

For a country to work, there are many jobs that need to be done within the society. If all people will receive equal allotments of resources despite what they do, there is no reason for them to do that. Very few people will work because they don't need to. The system will collapse.

For example, I want to be a barrister. However if you told me that everyone will feed and provided for anyway. I would probably just sit around watching TV, playing computer games and exercising once every so often to stay in shape. I would pretty much fill my time with hedonistic pursuits.

Secondly, there is the issue of the resources and human nature. Presumably there would have to be some panel or group who would decide how to allocate resources and how to ensure they were delivered. Essentially this group has incredible power, because no one can survive without this panels rationing. The panel can give themselves increased allotments while choking off supply to those who try to rebel. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Finally there's the issue of being a nation. No country can currently exist without contacting other nations around the world. Without a proper government, there is no way for this to occur. Therefore you cannot continue to import the resources you need to sustain you nations society. At best, your society would find equilibrium at a much lower standard of living than we currently enjoy in the Capitalist systems of the West.

 

[similar.squirrel]

people belive obama will make america a communist counry? since when?

Since they found Jesus, probably.
I don't think very many people worth caring about really think that.

OT: Communism would be great, were it not for people.
Although..Places like Sweden are reputed to have nice socialist kind of systems.

 

[Akai Shizuku]

Firstly, my friend, t'was a mistake to create this thread. Entirely because everyone expects me to get into it, then I do get into it, then we argue for thirty freaking pages and everyone just gets sick of it. So a bit inconvenient on my end, but whatever.

Still, you've got a question, and it shall be answered.

"What's wrong with comminism?" Is a subjective question, and peoples' answers to it will be different depending on how much money is in their wallet.

I'm not going to get into specifics because I don't want to start a flame war and it's 5:33AM and I'm tired. But in general the wealthier people in the world (America) are afraid of all their "hard work" being taken from them and given to feed starving children in Africa.

Basic information on communism:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communism

More in-depth information from the Young Communist League of Canada:
http://ycl-ljc.ca/en/who_we_are/faq.php

The biggest argument against communism is that it doesn't work because people are selfish. Why don't we change that, then? People can change.

My philosophy on this entire topic is "When there's a will, there's a way."

 

[Robert632]

people belive obama will make america a communist counry? since when?

Since they found Jesus, probably.
I don't think very many people worth caring about really think that.

your probably right. there probably the nut cases that thought 9/11 was a goverment conspircy.

 

[r0qu3]

hmm... communism isn't bad, people are...

 

[Akai Shizuku]

hmm... communism isn't bad, people are...

Sadly, it's true. But I think that it's something we can change.

 

[Vuljatar]

Communism is terrible, because it encourages laziness.

If you will never be able to achieve anything more than anyone else, no matter how hard you work, why work?

If the government will steal from those that do work and give everyone else enough so that they don't have to work, why work?

 

[Knight Templar]

Communism is terrible, because it encourages laziness.

If you will never be able to achieve anything more than anyone else, no matter how hard you work, why work?

If the government will steal from those that do work and give everyone else enough so that they don't have to work, why work?

That's not exactly how it works.

 

[Vuljatar]

That's not exactly how it's advertised, but that's how it ends up.

 

[Brett Alex]

Because, like Anarchy, it doesn't fucking work.

Nestor Mahkno would like to disagree with you. Seeing as he was an Anarcho-Communist, he'd actually like to disagree with you twice.

Nestor Makhno, actually.
I had to look it up, though.

Anyway, that would carry a lot more weight if I didn't have to Google him - clearly, he is not exactly world-renowned, as you would expect someone who had succeeded to be.
This says to me that he probably did not succeed.

I could be wrong - I don't know the first thing about him.

He's Ukrainian so I think its Multiple Choice Spelling.

But yes, he didn't succeed greatly, although in his defense he had to fight off the Germans, the Nationalists, the Bourgeois, the counter revolutionaries and eventually even the Soviets, so the odds were stacked quite heavily against him.

According to his claims, throughout a lot of the territory he controlled everyone lived in efficient and peaceful Anarcho-Communist communes, that, unlike the Soviet system actually worked. (IE: no transitional dictatorship, no corruption, proper unity etc)

The problem is, we only have his claims to go by. The Soviets, by their nature, were obviously heavily against the experiment, wether it actually worked or not, and don't really give us a non bias viewpoint, going so far as to re-absorb the territory and pretend it never happened. Due to the circumstances of the Russian Civil war there were no other observers who can give us an objective viewpoint.

Sadly, Makhno and is supporters are the closest we can get to the truth of the whole ideology. But, it might have worked, and if it did, it might have been very successful.


EDIT

That's not exactly how it's advertised, but that's how it ends up.

To be fair, the exact same can be applied to any system of government.

You can hardly call Somalia, Ethiopia or Zaire countries that started with a communist mindset.

 

[Lord Thodin]

people belive obama will make america a communist counry? since when?

Maybe he means Socialist.

OT: At its core communism is a great idea. In reality a dictator always takes over and thusly just drives it his way. I think China is the only country thats got its feet firm with a Communist government.

 

[Knight Templar]

That's not exactly how it's advertised, but that's how it ends up.

Where?

There has never been a true communist nation, keep that in mind when you judge using the USSR, China or North Korea.

 

[similar.squirrel]

people belive obama will make america a communist counry? since when?

Since they found Jesus, probably.
I don't think very many people worth caring about really think that.

your probably right. there probably the nut cases that thought 9/11 was a goverment conspircy.

Erm..No. These are probably the nutcases who think the Homosexual Agenda possessed the aircraft and flew them into the towers or something.

Please, clean up your spelling and grammar?

 

[Vuljatar]

EDIT

That's not exactly how it's advertised, but that's how it ends up.

To be fair, the exact same can be applied to any system of government.

You can hardly call Somalia, Ethiopia or Zaire countries that started with a communist mindset.

This is unfortunately true. We haven't yet discovered a "good" political system, but democracy is by far the best we've got.

 

[Death_Korps_Kommissar]

Well, I like being an individual. I like being able to go to the grocery store and decide what I'm having for dinner. I like being able to create artwork and play music with the things that I own. I like being on the internet.

In short, I like being able to decide my quality of life.

If I really thought that humanity could just drop everything and coexist, than I would be for it. The fact that I know it can't makes me quite sad.

If you had read the Communist manifesto instead of just listening to anti-commie propaganda you would know you could do all those things.

Snap I was just gonna say that.

 

[Death_Korps_Kommissar]

So your saying a society were a doctor and a shit cleaner get the same is perfect?

In theory it works but practice it sorta cocks up

That isn't how it works they don't get paid the same, that's just stupid, it's how much you put into society is what you get out of it. So if this was the greatest shit cleaner ever and this was a pretty lousy doctor, then they might get paid the same.

 

[Zenode]

Human Nature

GREED

Why work to be a lawyer when you earn the same as a garbage man people want more if they are doing the hard yard for it.

In theory if Humans were all robots then yes it may work but apart from that no it wouldn't work because humans always strive to be better than the other person in the room.

 

[Supraliminal]

Communism is terrible, because it encourages laziness.

If you will never be able to achieve anything more than anyone else, no matter how hard you work, why work?

If the government will steal from those that do work and give everyone else enough so that they don't have to work, why work?

Because... errr..
Everyone should have the occupation that they want to have. Something That you are good at, you like to do and what you enjoy.
Then you wound't think about the "unfairness" of the system, 'cause it wouldn't be.

Surely some crap jobs wouldn't be done with this kind of arragement.
Maybe in the future, when those jobs can be automatised.

And yeh, we would need every human being involved for this to work (over 7 billion). What a dilemma.

 

[Reklore]

Even if Communism work, it would make life a livening hell for all that have an ego or is better that the man next to him in the rice fields.

Communism goal is equally. Equally is a bad thing. Not having any self worth. No way of being better than anyone or no way of having ascents of achievement. The last day being the same as the last


By the way, free healthcare is not Communism a lone, it would be Socialism.

 

[asinann]

Too many Americans are afraid of it.
AND, others believe that Obama will make America a communistic society.
But, i see no problem in this. Communism is a great idea if a country already has a stable economy, and hey, free healthcare would be great. It's a great idea it's just been used wrong.

So really, what's wrong with Communism?

The problem is that communism by it's very nature destroys the economy (look at China before they started allowing more western style economics into the country, or any other communist nation larger than a gnat's dick.)

In theory communism is awesome, but it requires that humans ignore their natural impulses and nature. That just isn't going to happen.

In the end communism ends up as either a dictatorship (North Korean, Cuba [which is only still working because of the American trade embargo]) or a society with an extremely rich ruling class, and those that aren't a part of it being so poor they can almost not afford to feed themselves (USSR, China.)

What you are describing is socialism, the economic basis for communism. Socialism only works in doses. If you socialize every business in the country, the country stops innovating because there is nothing to motivate it. Things that need to be socialized: health care, schools, roads, law enforcement, military. Nothing else should be socialized or you start to eat the economy away little by little.