Why do you like Obama?

[crimson5pheonix]

I don't hate him because he's black, I never even said that. He's been judged because he is friends with Ayers, a man who bombed the pentagon and claimed he and the 9/11 bombers didn't do enough. He even announced his candidacy for senate at his house. he's friends with Farakan, head of the nation of islam, a terrorist organization. His pastor is racist, he hates whites, and prays death to America, and Obama is a deacon in his church, so he knows his pastor and his views...I don't give a shit that he's black...he could be whiter than McCain's hair I'd still think the man was evil...and no offense to you morning blues, but when the government decides to take over things that should be based on a free market, that's socialism...and that may fly in Canada but this is America, a country built upon the free market

See, here's the problem: you don't want a real conversation.

If you wanted a real conversation you'd read up on some of this stuff for ten minutes instead of just repeating it indiscriminately.

There's no point in saying anything good about Obama because you will respond with "Yeah, but what about ? Doesn't that kinda eclipse his good aspects?"

There's no point in saying anything bad about Obama because you will also respond with "Yeah, but what about ? Isn't that a lot worse than the thing you mentioned?"

-- Alex

And here's our problem, you don't or can't say anything good about him. All your doing is resorting to "what's the point, you're so immature" response which is flimsy at best. 54r93 is pro McCain but I'm undecided as it stands all I have so far are reasons not to vote for Obama because you haven't given me a reason to vote for Obama.

 

[Rooster Cogburn]

ok, all I seem to be getting is that Obama's a liberal and that's why he's good. And that's great if you don't live here, but what's he gonna do for an american that should make me want to vote for him? As far as I can tell he's not really helping anyone unless they're unbelievably poor, and he's hiking up taxes on some of the higher rungs of the middle class. I personally don't think you're rich if you're making above 250 k a year, i think that's the higher end of middle class

Well, I live in America and I support whoever is not the Republican. Since when is a yearly income of under $250,000 "unbelievably poor?" That's almost everybody. That seems awfully out of touch. Class labels aside, I have no problems increasing taxes for those with incomes even that high.

Like I implied before, there is no real discussion here. You already hate Obama, and you are not willing to change or add to that opinion. Not that you should, except that you made it the premise of your thread.

 

[asiepshtain]

You seem to be more biased against the democratic/socialist ideas then you are against Obama, While there is nothing wrong with that, you must accept that for a left wing person Obamas left wing ideas seem right ( no pun intended).

 

[AyaReiko]

Time to debunk your arguments

Finally, he has had very close relationships with known terrorists,

Obama was 8-years old when Ayers was a part of the Weathermen. Ayers has long since become a respected member of his community.

and his father has been revealed to be close friends with the man leading the current Kenyan genocide,

His dad abandoned him and his mother when Obama was 2.

and his citizenship is being challenged...by a democrat...all because he won't produce his birth certificate or health records...

Long since debunked.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcertificate.asp

So someone please tell me, what about this man is appealing to you? Why is he fit to lead this country?

Because he can make sound judgments and has a good head on his shoulders. We need someone like that after Dubya totally jacked up the country for the past 8 years.

 

[Ultrajoe]

Because he is not McCain.

And that's a solid endorsement for us overseas. McCain and what he represents is more of current America.

Have you had a look at current America? I believe it is cheaper to buy your dollars than actual Kitty Litter.

Obama, change or not, is a step in the right direction. This links to terrorists bullshit is a dying attempt by his failing opponent to smear him. So what if he's friends with a terrorist!? Im friends with a Sadist and a Parking Officer! They have lives outside of the reasons we hate them, Ayers could be a great guy, knowing a terrorist is not indicative of being a terrorist.

 

[Darkauthor81]

Edit: Posted in the wrong topic

 

[Alex_P]

And here's our problem, you don't or can't say anything good about him. All your doing is resorting to "what's the point, you're so immature" response which is flimsy at best. 54r93 is pro McCain but I'm undecided as it stands all I have so far are reasons not to vote for Obama because you haven't given me a reason to vote for Obama.

Bullshit about Ayers and Farrakhan aren't reasons not to vote for Obama. They're outright lies. Despicable, obvious lies.

It's like if I told you not to vote for McCain because McCain is going to institute a presidential droit de seigneur, allowing him and his entire Cabinet to have sex with a woman on her wedding night (in order of presidential succession, of course).

Dismissing the bullshit is the first step to actually talking about anything. Otherwise you're going to waste your whole time bickering about which candidate supports child rape (hint: neither).

-- Alex

 

[crimson5pheonix]

And here's our problem, you don't or can't say anything good about him. All your doing is resorting to "what's the point, you're so immature" response which is flimsy at best. 54r93 is pro McCain but I'm undecided as it stands all I have so far are reasons not to vote for Obama because you haven't given me a reason to vote for Obama.

Bullshit about Ayers and Farrakhan aren't reasons not to vote for Obama. They're outright lies. Despicable, obvious lies.

It's like if I told you not to vote for McCain because McCain is going to institute a presidential droit de seigneur, allowing him and his entire Cabinet to have sex with a woman on her wedding night (in order of presidential succession, of course).

Dismissing the bullshit is the first step to actually talking about anything. Otherwise you're going to waste your whole time bickering about which candidate supports child rape (hint: neither).

-- Alex

I don't care about that, I care about the fact that as far as I know he's done jack squat and is promising the world. Why do you care about him and why should I care about him. I'm going to look up and see if there's a pot party candidate because when he/she says s/he'll legalize pot, I can believe s/he will. I have no reason to believe McCain or Obama will do what they say they'll do and I perceive that as a fail on both their parts.

 

[54r93]

then tell me something about Obama's polices that helps america. And be specific, don't just say "they do"

 

[Ultrajoe]

then tell me something about Obama's polices that helps america. And be specific, don't just say "they do"

What part of his healthcare plan do you not understand?

 

[Brett Alex]

You could vote for him because he offers an alternative to McCain...?

I'm sorry I've fallen down on my reading lately and don't know enough about the situation to give you a response, but I can tell you that you are going about this topic the wrong way. If you really want to know, don't ask the question with a closed mind.

ok, all I seem to be getting is that Obama's a liberal and that's why he's good. And that's great if you don't live here, but what's he gonna do for an american that should make me want to vote for him?

That suggests you've already made up your mind, that and the fact that you have dismissed the legitimate answers people have given you with more and more outrageous claims about his character, without directly responding to aforementioned claims.

If you are really curious as to why someone would vote for him, ask in a gentler manner and don't jump on people as soon as they reply. Although this seems to be a moot point as it looks like you're already going to vote McCain no matter what anyone says.

 

[Alex_P]

I don't care about that, I care about the fact that as far as I know he's done jack squat and is promising the world. Why do you care about him and why should I care about him. I'm going to look up and see if there's a pot party candidate because when he/she says s/he'll legalize pot, I can believe s/he will. I have no reason to believe McCain or Obama will do what they say they'll do and I perceive that as a fail on both their parts.

Here's a sketch of his voting record, make up your own mind about what's worthwhile:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Senate_career_of_Barack_Obama
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_bills_sponsored_by_Barack_Obama_in_the_United_States_Senate

FactCheck.org is a good way to check claims.

OpenCongress.org is a good way to check voting records. Try looking at laws by issue.

-- Alex

 

[Brett Alex]

Dismissing the bullshit is the first step to actually talking about anything. Otherwise you're going to waste your whole time bickering about which candidate supports child rape (hint: neither).
-- Alex

I wouldn't be so certain, I heard that Obama is actively training a squadron of giant bats to swoop down and steal the souls of school children as soon as he is elected, and then sell them on eBay to Haitian drug dealers.

EDIT-Left out my response to that, woops:

 

[Imitation Saccharin]

also, his platform is quite socialist regarding many topics.

As long as I live I will never understand the pathological American hatred of socialism.

 

[crimson5pheonix]

I don't care about that, I care about the fact that as far as I know he's done jack squat and is promising the world. Why do you care about him and why should I care about him. I'm going to look up and see if there's a pot party candidate because when he/she says s/he'll legalize pot, I can believe s/he will. I have no reason to believe McCain or Obama will do what they say they'll do and I perceive that as a fail on both their parts.

Here's a sketch of his voting record, make up your own mind about what's worthwhile:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Senate_career_of_Barack_Obama
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_bills_sponsored_by_Barack_Obama_in_the_United_States_Senate

FactCheck.org is a good way to check claims.

OpenCongress.org is a good way to check voting records. Try looking at laws by issue.

-- Alex

i now have the facts I desire. I can now say, I definitely won't be voting for him but that's beside the point as you get an e-cookie for actually giving a good response. I congratulate you.

 

[Alex_P]

i now have the facts I desire. I can now say, I definitely won't be voting for him but that's beside the point as you get an e-cookie for actually giving a good response. I congratulate you.

4 minutes. That was quick!

What led you to make up your mind?

-- Alex

 

[sneakypenguin]

Well, I live in America and I support whoever is not the Republican. Since when is a yearly income of under $250,000 "unbelievably poor?" That's almost everybody. That seems awfully out of touch. Class labels aside, I have no problems increasing taxes for those with incomes even that high.

The problem with increasing taxes on earners over 250k(which is less than you make for being a DM for Target) is you hurt small businesses more. Obama said he would lower capitol gains taxes but small business don't pay those they pay income(which is that 250 k bracket) among FICA,sales and all the other assorted taxes.

Anybody hear his new plan to offer businesses a 3000 dollar tax credit if they higher full time employees. That is just laughable I guess he doesn't realize that to higher people you have to be making more money and be needing more productivity. and that 3k isn't gonna cover the cost of adding a new full time worker. A lowering of the corperate rate would be better to help companies out(at least according to my econ professor)

 

[SilentHunter7]

ok, all I seem to be getting is that Obama's a liberal and that's why he's good. And that's great if you don't live here, but what's he gonna do for an american that should make me want to vote for him? As far as I can tell he's not really helping anyone unless they're unbelievably poor, and he's hiking up taxes on some of the higher rungs of the middle class. I personally don't think you're rich if you're making above 250 k a year, i think that's the higher end of middle class

Well you're definitely well off if you make a quarter million a year. My parents make a little over $60,000, and that's with both my mom and my dad working full-time. And where I live, that's actually not too bad.

I dont know if Obama's policies will help me or not...

But I sure as hell know John McCain continuing the trend of saying fuck the middle class, and pour money into businesses does not help me one bit.

-edit-
just out of curiosity, what would you say is middle class?

And dont say $5 Million

 

[sneakypenguin]

also, his platform is quite socialist regarding many topics.

As long as I live I will never understand the pathological American hatred of socialism.

Because we love freedom over equality.

 

[Graustein]

also, his platform is quite socialist regarding many topics.

As long as I live I will never understand the pathological American hatred of socialism.

Because we love freedom over equality.

I thought it was because socialism is along the path to Communism, and is therefore evil.