Why it is acceptable to criticize smokers, but not fat people?

[smithy_2045]

Because there are more fat people than there are smokers. Makes them more normal, and therefore difficult to criticise.

 

[Custard_Angel]

Obvious:

People can be genetically predisposed to being fat. The same can't be said of smokers.

 

[Uncle_Brainhorn]

Facebook groups

Facebook groups aren't the population. I'm guessing you don't watch TV or you'd see many many commercials talking encouraging people to lose weight, and I don't just mean those weight lose pills.

 

[CrystalShadow]

However, it DOES harm other people, just not in the same way as second-hand smoke. According to a recent study, annual spending on obesity-related diseases is expected to rise by 13-16% in the US by 2030, leading to 2.6% increase in national health spending. Total medical costs associated with treatment of preventable diseases such as diabetes, hypertension, stroke, and coronary heart disease are estimated to increase by $48-66 billion a year.

That's all well and good, but second-hand smoke is a DIRECT, IMMEDIATE annoyance to non-smokers in close proximity to a smoker.

Only recently I had some smokers visiting me begging me to smoke inside my house.
Never mind the health issues.
The smell, and smoke can linger inside my property for hours afterward.

I've spent time walking around someone who was smoking on while walking down the street, and choking on the smoke...

That isn't even considering that this is bad for my health (or that of the smoker.). Just the immediate negative effects of being in close proximity to a smoker.

Anyway, I know you mentioned it's unlikely that a fat person is fat because of a legitimate health problem, but at the end of the day you don't know.

I know who smokes. I can see them doing it. And since this is the only element involved...


I know who is fat, because, well, they're fat. But being fat has no single cause. I can't tell why they're fat. Only that they are.

That's somewhat like the difference between having evidence that suggests someone is doing something wrong, compared to catching them in the act.

 

[ZippyDSMlee]

Who said it was acceptable?

 

[Irony's Acolyte]

You know Brawndo, you seem to have a knack for choosing somewhat controversial questions like this. I don't know whether to applaud you or be suspicious.

Anyway, to answer your question. I would say neither should be criticized that much, but one reason why smokers are a bit more acceptable to be criticized is that smoking doesn't affect only them like being fat/obese does with heavier people. Smoke does spread, especially in windy areas and can cause the air to be rather unpleasant for some people. Now you (for the most part) only need to worry about serious health issues when you're around smokers quite often. Fat people... are just fat. They take up space and that's about it.

 

[applesandoranges]

edit

 

[Pandorina Blythe]

People do criticize the overweight people... mostly its done in jest or in bullying. It is probably because of the later that the stigma comes from. I think it is more than just a person being lazy. There are emotional ties to eating and ones view of exercise. At any rate you have my opinion.

 

[MagicMouse]

Because I don't gain weight and start wheezing when I sit next to a fatty.

 

[Yopaz]

Where have you been the last decade? Have you ever seen shows like The Biggest Loser, Fat Camp, Super size vs Super skinny and a million other shows with the same message? The message media is sending out is "Fat people, you are disgusting and you need to lose weight". Back in the old days it was accepted to treat Jews or black people like they're less, now we treat fat people and smokers like they're less without seeing the connection.

Being Jewish or Black isn't a choice though is it? Stop being sensationalist, you sound like fox news.

Obese people and smokers cost money and cause strain on the health system (well at least in countries with a COMMUNIST HEALTH SYSTEM!!!1!11! anyway). Being black or jewish isn't one day going to cause you to be in hospital taking up time and resources for someone who needs it.

Just for the record I smoke, so it doesn't sound like I'm having a go at smokers for taking up hospital space, I'm just pointing it out. But I'll cross that bridge when I come to it, besides I'm not sure I want to live past 70 anyway -_- Saying that, I pay my taxes, which WILL have gone to some obese person or smoker, so when it's my turn I'm having that damn bed.

I wont go as far as saying that being fat is a choice. I can agree with you that my original post was poorly phrased though. However am I wrong? Now you're a smoker so strangers will judge you for it and think less of you for that thing alone. They will judge fat people and think they are lazy. Now I am neither smoking nor fat, but I don't think we should think less of anyone for any reason. Disagree?
Now you might think of me as a sensationalist here, but do not fucking compare me to Fox News cause then I will compare you to the people that believe what Fox News says. I didn't say we're being just as bad as the Nazis or anything down the line that's a meaning you put into my words just the same any frequent Fox News viewer does when he watches anything that isn't aired by Fox News. I am saying it's a part of being human to discriminate against others. If you don't think it's a bad thing to discriminate then I got another ground to compare you to Fox News.

Where have you been the last decade? Have you ever seen shows like The Biggest Loser, Fat Camp, Super size vs Super skinny and a million other shows with the same message? The message media is sending out is "Fat people, you are disgusting and you need to lose weight". Back in the old days it was accepted to treat Jews or black people like they're less, now we treat fat people and smokers like they're less without seeing the connection.

Are you seriously trying to draw parallels between The Biggest Loser and anti-smoking campaigns to Jim Crow laws and antisemitism?

Yes, I am comparing racism and discrimination against smokers and fatties.
However the holocaust is too horrible to compare this too. However if you think about it it's quite similar to when there were separate streets for white and black people. We don't want smokers or fatties where we are. If they walk on the bus we don't want to sit next to them because they smell. We prefer if they either walk where they want to go, take a taxi or keep a distance. Just like black people had to move back in the bus.
Of course it's not nearly as bad, but it's still discrimination against someone. We judge people without knowing them because we think we're better for having a BMI that's lower or for never having smoked. Some of us live in a free country where we're all supposed to be equal, some live in America. Now if we truly are equal and free should we be discriminated for our choices if they don't violate any laws?

 

[cthulhumythos]

smokers annoy me more than fat people.

the tribe has spoken.

 

[gmaverick019_v1legacy]

smoking effects other people too, and it makes you smell like horrid shit naturally..

so yeah. that's kind of why people hate when others smoke around them, i have plenty of friends who do smoke, but we generally ask them to go outside or whatever if they need to that badly in front of us if we are at a house or such.


also, define "fat", because i know plenty of people who are not by any means skinny, but eat 3x healthier than i do, they just don't have the luckiness that i do with my body/will to work out, so i don't see why they should be compared to smokers in the first place.


if someone is fat and uses it to their advantage/complains about it, then yeah, i'll tell them straight up they are fat and have a problem, otherwise who cares? smoking does 10x worse than any type of fatty food does, let alone fatty foods don't immediately effect those around you, so i really dont get the point of trying to shine smoking in a light similar to that of "fat" people.

 

[SimpleChimp]

It usually takes longer for someone to stop being fat than to stop smoking. Also, smoke stinks. The most a fat person could inconvenience another is by taking up extra space or food.

Unless you have ever been to a comic book convention.

BAM!

OT: While i do not agree with how people are treat smokers, it should not be socially acceptable to criticize either groups. I mean fuck, have you seen the people that tattoo and pierce 90 percent of their body, and they get news stories about them or become part of make up ads.
People have their quirks and their shit, every one should be able to be made fun of, but their should not be laws against them.

 

[XandNobody]

Do you want to know why? Because some people CANT be skinny.

Ive exercised, ate healthy, cut may daily intake of calories in half, and tried diet pills. I busted my ass, sweat clean through shirts and ruined perfectly good jogging shoes trying to lose weight.

But ive never gone under 230lbs.

>.>; Then people like you, who believe "im skinny so everyone else can be", come along and say being fat is a life choice for everyone.

Well guess what. Smoking is a life choice, being fat is not. Smoking can LITERALLY harm others, and the person who smokes. Being fat doesnt truly effect anyone but the person himself.

And the idea that a fat parent is more likely to have a fat child? Yeah, because there was something to cause the parent to be fat to begin with. Its literally impossible for me to go under 235lbs unless i go get liposuction once every 6 months to physically suck the weight off of me.

Now i understand not all fat people have this problem. But being fat is being different. Put on 150lbs and then talk to me about not being different from the general population >.>;

Sorry if this comes off as a RAAAAAGE post, but people like this piss me off, with good reason.

This, because it is truth.

Honestly, I've been both sides of the coin. Until I was eighteen, you could see my ribs I was so skinny. People thought I was being abused I was so skinny. These days? I weight a good deal more than I should, and eat one meal a day. One. And it's usually soup. Vegetable soup, home made even. Still a fat ass.

But as to the topics point? It is not a social issue, it is not a tax issue, it is not blah blah blah. The issue is, workers rights. Why should someone who works at McDonald's, a known enabler of fat people, live twice as long as someone who works at a bar where people smoke, simply because smoking seems cooler? I mean, I've seen the point that second hand smoke can be avoided, those who made this statement, never gave a flying crap about your waitress did you? Didn't think so. Also, don't tell me the 'get a job somewhere else' excuse, this generation cannot, period.

 

[Imperioratorex Caprae]

I don't know how it is the UK and Australia, but in the United States, smokers have developed a pariah-like status over the years. There are all kinds of anti-smoking campaigns, city ordinances not allowing smoking within X number of feet from a building, etc. But at the same time in the US, it is politically incorrect to criticize those who are overweight and obese. Some might argue: "Second hand smoke harms other people, but it's my choice to eat what I want and this doesn't harm other people."

However, it DOES harm other people, just not in the same way as second-hand smoke. According to a recent study, annual spending on obesity-related diseases is expected to rise by 13-16% in the US by 2030, leading to 2.6% increase in national health spending. Total medical costs associated with treatment of preventable diseases such as diabetes, hypertension, stroke, and coronary heart disease are estimated to increase by $48-66 billion a year.

That means as a fit person, my taxes will be higher and my insurance premiums will go up to fund increased health care costs associated with an increase in obesity. Also, children with fat parents are less likely to have access to healthy foods and are more likely to be overweight themselves. Other people ARE harmed by you being overweight.

But instead of a nationwide effort to promote healthy eating, there is a culture in the United States of being fat and proud of it. Facebook groups promoting concepts like "big women are beautiful" have millions of followers, and criticism of fat people is called "hate speech". Clearly some overweight people don't want to feel guilty about their behavior choices, so they try to make others feel guilty or embarrassed for criticizing them.

Let make this perfectly clear: being fat should not be a protected class like race, gender, sexual orientation, or ethnicity. Unlike those categories, being fat is almost always a choice. Only a small percentage of people are overweight because of a legitimate medical condition like hyperthyroidism. And sure, eating disorders with psychological roots exist, but let's be honest: most fat people are fat because of poor food choices and because they lack the willpower and motivation to exercise regularly. They just don't like to be called out on it.

TBH, its sort of screwed up to be called out on your shortcomings by non-friend, non-family members... Either way I can't stand people who criticize other people for their failings and not recognizing that they have their own to deal with.
I expect my friends to call me out when I'm an asshole, or overdoing something, but the random person who walks up to me calling me a murderer for ordering steak (fucking vegans), asking me "do you know what that does to you?" when I'm having a smoke, or otherwise pointing out something that clearly bothers them but not me in the slightest to me is the bigger asshole.

 

[Singularly Datarific]

I don't criticize smokers, as in I don't hold it against them that they are chemically addicted to a substance.
However, the fact that entire empires are built around selling an addictive poison to millions of people kinda makes me go "seriously?"

I mean, how the hell is it legal to make and sell cigarettes? They outlaw every other damn thing ever made, but NOT smoking?

 

[katsabas]

Because you can't breathe breathe someone's fat.

Someone's fat doesn't make my clothes smell like the fucking Titanic and force me to do laundry twice a week every time I decide to go out and have a drink with my friends.

Someone's fat will not give me passive cancer and the works.

 

[TacticalAssassin1]

The difference is very simple.

A fat person doesn't force bacon down my throat in order for them to eat. A smoker does force others to breath in his drug.

One is immediately self-contained, and the other inconveniences those around you.

Uh... I've never had a smoker come up and shove a cigarette down my throat.
If someone's smoking in a legal place to smoke, that means there's somewhere close by I can go to stand without any smoke to deal with. If you don't like the smoke, just go somewhere else.
EDIT: By the way I don't smoke and I think it's a disgusting habit, but they have the right to kill themselves slowly if they want, and you have the right to avoid them if you want.