Will the Nintendo doomsaying ever end?

JayRPG

New member
Oct 25, 2012
585
0
0
st0pnsw0p said:
Whatislove said:
- Nintendo do not "release the same game", and they definitely do not do it every year:
There have been 22 Assassin's creed titles since 2007
There have been 19 Zelda titles (including link's crossbow training) since 1987
There have been 16 SSB, Mario Kart, and MK Arcade titles since 1999

There have been 9 Farcry titles since 2004
There have been 3 Pikmin titles since 2004
There have been 5 Super Smash Bros titles since 1999

There have been 33 Call of Duty games (excluding digital re-releases/remakes) since 2003
There have been 20 Super Mario games (excluding digital re-releases/remakes) since 1985
I'd just like to point out how flawed this way of looking at releases is.

You say there have been 20 Mario platformers since 1985. I'm going to assume you went by the Wikipedia list when making that statement, so that's what I'm going to work with, even though there are 3 games on that list that I wouldn't count in the Mario series and 1 game not on the list that I would count.

20 games in 30 years means there's been 1 Mario game for every 1.55 years the franchise has been around. But if you start counting more recently, you'd get much different results. If you start counting from 2006, the year NSMB released, you get 8 Mario games in 9 years. That's 1 Mario game for every 1.125 years, practically a yearly franchise at this point.

For Zelda, (I only count 17 games btw, not including Crossbow Training), from 1986 to 1998, the release of OoT, there were 5 games, 1 game per 2.6 years. From 1986 to present day, 17 games, which is 1 game per 1.7 years. From 1998 to present day, there have been 13 games. That's 1 game per 1.3 years, twice as frequent as the first 13 years the franchise was alive.

And take Megaman as another example. From '87 to present day, there have been 10 games in the main series, which is 1 game per 2.9 years. From '96 to the present day, there have been 3 megaman games. That's 1 game per 6.33 years.

Both ways of looking at those series are technically correct, but the one that better reflects the current situation of the franchise is in every case the second way.

Also, saying "But this other series has more releases in the same timeframe" doesn't excuse anything. If Sony started releasing 2 new GoW games each year, that wouldn't make EA releasing 1 new FIFA/NFL game per year any less bad.
Putting Megaman in there doesn't make much sense, the last proper megaman game was donkey's ago and it's practically (or is literally) dead and has been for a long time, the last thing to do with megaman was japanese only re-releases of 1,2 and 3 on the DS; from 1987-1998 there were 9 Megaman titles (11 if you count the arcade titles), that's 1 every 1.22 years.

I wasn't trying to say that none of this is bad, I was trying to point out that Nintendo seemingly seems to be the only one constantly criticized for it, and they are actually not the worst offender.

Even Super Mario, by your numbers, is averaged outside the "annual release" window. There are companies out there who openly tout their yearly releases and rarely ever do they get dumped on for it. Sure, there is some occasional banter about the "new" CoD, but it mostly goes unnoticed and unheard, but the second Nintendo releases any game that has even a similar premise to something they've made before it is like the worst thing that could ever happen to the industry and Nintendo should just die.

Companies do yearly franchises because they continue to sell well, Nintendo releases titles (sometimes with slightly longer than a 1 year gap, and other times with several years to more than 5 years between titles) because they sell well, and are good games.

It's not like Nintendo are pumping out crap all the time either, every first party Nintendo title in recent memory has received favourable reviews (from both critics, and consumers), and have sold well. The last 4 New Super Mario Bros games have metacritic scores of 89, 87, 78, 84 respectively. The last 4 main series CoD games (I didn't include the horribly rated iOS games or the Vita title) have metacritic scores of 78, 74, 68, 78 (these numbers fluctuate between platforms, even if I picked the most favourable metascore from each game they would not match the numbers of NSMB).

If you release a game, and it gets an 89 critic score, and an 8.5 user score, why in the hell would you not release another game in that series? The next of which came 2 and a half years later and got similar ratings/reviews.

I, too, would like to see more from Nintendo, like back in the Gamecube days with Baten Kaitos, Geist, Custom Robo etc, and they are bringing some new stuff to the table soon, but that doesn't mean they should stop doing what is actually working. We have already established that Nintendo aren't in trouble, maybe if they were on their 5th straight year of $1Bn+ losses we could say that it isn't working, but they are already back in profit, it works, the people want these games. Nintendo is not the worst offender, and they cannot even be mathematically put into a "annual release" camp like just about every big AAA company is at the moment (with some exceptions).

TL;DR I just really, really, really do not think that the criticism Nintendo gets is in any way justified, considering all the companies getting a free ride on said criticism for often doing a lot worse than Nintendo is accused of.
 

Something Amyss

Aswyng and Amyss
Dec 3, 2008
24,759
0
0
Whatislove said:
You don't need to include ports for that AC number, the amount of spin-off AC games there are is astounding.
You do to get that number according to Wikipedia. You even then go on to remove a few titles to get a slightly smaller number, so I'm pretty sure you're even aware of this.

Meanwhile, as long as you couch Nintendo's side with a bunch of qualifiers, you're never going to have an honest comparison.
 

st0pnsw0p

New member
Nov 23, 2009
169
0
0
Whatislove said:
Putting Megaman in there doesn't make much sense, the last proper megaman game was donkey's ago and it's practically (or is literally) dead and has been for a long time, the last thing to do with megaman was japanese only re-releases of 1,2 and 3 on the DS; from 1987-1998 there were 9 Megaman titles (11 if you count the arcade titles), that's 1 every 1.22 years.
Puttting Megaman in there was just an extreme example of the flaws present in your method of counting games released to show you that those numbers can often fail to show the current reality of a franchise.

Whatislove said:
I wasn't trying to say that none of this is bad, I was trying to point out that Nintendo seemingly seems to be the only one constantly criticized for it, and they are actually not the worst offender.
You really haven't [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.837350-Ubisoft-Wont-Ship-Yearly-Assassins-Creed-If-Its-Not-Good-Enough] been paying attention [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.841712-Call-of-Duty-Switches-to-Three-Year-Development-Cycle], have you? I don't know about you, but I'm seeing plenty of criticisms of both those series' annual release schedule.

Whatislove said:
Even Super Mario, by your numbers, is averaged outside the "annual release" window.
Oh please, 8 games in 9 years is practically annual. Heck, if you count NSLU as a standalone game, which you very well could since Nintendo released it as a standalone game, that's 9 for 9. It's not literally annual since there were two years with no Mario games, but the two years with 2 Mario games make up for it.

Whatislove said:
It's not like Nintendo are pumping out crap all the time either, every first party Nintendo title in recent memory has received favourable reviews (from both critics, and consumers), and have sold well. The last 4 New Super Mario Bros games have metacritic scores of 89, 87, 78, 84 respectively. The last 4 main series CoD games (I didn't include the horribly rated iOS games or the Vita title) have metacritic scores of 78, 74, 68, 78 (these numbers fluctuate between platforms, even if I picked the most favourable metascore from each game they would not match the numbers of NSMB).
Now you're just being dishonest. Or maybe you haven't done your research and are just assuming? Take the highest scores and you get 88, 83, 78 and 83. An average score of 83 compared to NSMB's average score of 84.5. That's in the exact same ballpark.