Women aren't Babies

[Bassik]

People are terrible to other people? Tell me more of this strange developement...

I don't like most women, I find them self-absorbed airheads. I have the same issue with most men, but when I say it about men nobody loses his shit, they just assume (correctly) I am a weird loner.

People on the escapist excluded, off course

Its unusual to hear people so flatly try to excuse their misogyny with misanthropy.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

PS: people aren't supposed to be terrible to other people, otherwise the term "terrible" is not longer exceptional.

Two negatives can make a positive, look at maths man. Maths!

I'm not trying to excuse anything with misanthropy, I just think people have a tendency to be rubbish. Male or female. Yet you try to play the misogyny card against me, and I find that a pretty rubbish thing to do.

And unlike most people who don't care much for people, I don't think of myself as any better then the self absorbed airheads. It's just that I'm rubbish in a different, special snow flakey way. (Bum, full of himself, rareley sober)

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

SNIP

Well I think the problem of the misogyny is that it makes gaming feel less inclusive and that is a bitter problem.

Of course us girls don't need help off guys but it would be nice to be seen as just gamers and not a set of boobies. Even if it gets us treated nicer or poorer if you see what I mean. Which is why I pretty much agree with you even if I think the abuse is of a different flavour of nasty.

I've been gaming longer than a lot of people on this site have been alive and yet some lads online initially treat me like I'm somebodies random clueless girlfriend who doesn't know her butt from her elbow or simply say tits or gtfo. It gets very grating...

 

[MeChaNiZ3D]

Everything has been said really, treat people equally online.

BUT that said, can we stop having 'girl gamers' identifying themselves as if it's the only thing worth knowing about them? Equality isn't going to come about until these people get over themselves and realise it works both ways: You're a female, you play games. If you feel like you should be treated like every other person, stop putting emphasis on the fact that you are a female as if it SHOULD make a difference to how you are perceived.

But I'm a male, so my opinion doesn't count.

 

[Bassik]

Male or female... the only thing I am interested in is if they like Mario, and if they do, then they are my friends.

 

[Treblaine]

I just take this as proof that chivalry isn't dead, just lying on the floor convulsing.

In the words of Dave Chapelle, "Chivalry is dead, and women killed it."
I'm not sure what the comedy/truth ratio is there but it's damn funny.

Men and women didn't get along before. Men were fine, they told women to be quiet and lie back and think of England.

Dave seems to be reminiscing on his childhood when adult inter-gender iterations were idealised to children, and the differences between boys and girls were quite trivial. Historically men have gotten on TERRIBLY with women. Black men were able to vote in America before any woman of any race.

Chivalry comes from the days when women were treated as property. Violence against women was a crime against he father or husband, like how killing a slave was considered property damage rather than murder.

He's very true that men need women more than women need men. And once they are no longer subjugated and kept ill informed the men become superfluous. Look at a lion pack, the lionesses do everything to keep the pack alive from hunting to lookouts to caring for the young, what does the male lion do? Kills other lions. Even cubs. That's his role, to kill his own species. Lionesses are caught in an evolutionary trap, that they cannot escape from because they don't get to chose their male partners, the meanest lions kill the weaker lions and even all their cubs and forcibly impregnate the lionesses.

The implied subtitle to "100 ways to please your man" is "... so you don't have to suck his dick". It could equally be titled "100 ways to easily placate your man". See Dave Chapelle has got it backwards by reading it literally, he thinks this is how to make him happy. This is just to stop him being a drain on the wife. But maybe that is the joke, but the joke is on the men.

Here's a crazy thought, women like their breast for SOME OTHER REASON than to service men. Women appreciate the female form, especially their own female form.

I like my hands, I think they are pretty cool, I don't want to hide them. That doesn't mean I want someone to hire me to do manual labour because I show that I have hands.

Women may be emotional, but men seem far more prevalent to assume their emotions are factual. As in "I got angry and punched him" is not following the fact, it may be RATIONALISED as having a logical reason for being violent but the decision was made before hand and it was an emotional one. Men just don't want to acknowledge their emotions when emotions are in fact our ultimate drive, without them we wouldn't do ANYTHING! We wouldn't ever eat because we'd never be afraid of dying from starvation.

 

[Treblaine]

People are terrible to other people? Tell me more of this strange developement...

I don't like most women, I find them self-absorbed airheads. I have the same issue with most men, but when I say it about men nobody loses his shit, they just assume (correctly) I am a weird loner.

People on the escapist excluded, off course

Its unusual to hear people so flatly try to excuse their misogyny with misanthropy.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

PS: people aren't supposed to be terrible to other people, otherwise the term "terrible" is not longer exceptional.

Two negatives can make a positive, look at maths man. Maths!

I'm not trying to excuse anything with misanthropy, I just think people have a tendency to be rubbish. Male or female. Yet you try to play the misogyny card against me, and I find that a pretty rubbish thing to do.

And unlike most people who don't care much for people, I don't think of myself as any better then the self absorbed airheads. It's just that I'm rubbish in a different, special snow flakey way. (Bum, full of himself, rareley sober)

Yes, if you MULTIPLY two negatives together. You are adding those two thing together with how you interact. If you have a bank account where you are in debt of $50 to one bank and to another bank in debt $70, that doesn't mean you are in the green, you are in total debt of $120. How could you multiply two negative quantities of human attitudes? You can't. Only add them together.

Why hate people because they are rubbish, if everyone is equally rubbish maybe the problem is not the people but the standard they are compared to to be declared rubbish. Maybe you need to adjust your expectations both of others and of yourself.

It's good to be humble, but rubbish is a relative term: the used and unwanted leftovers of something that was better. But what was that un-used original if everyone is rubbish? But saying everyone isn't exceptional is a tautology. Maybe you need to accept people for what they are and appreciate all they have to offer and all they can do.

Misogyny is not relative to treatment of men, it is relevant to some wider subjective assessment of decency.

 

[zefiris]

Women don't need people to protect them.

Women don't need white knights.

Ah, this is the final line of the sexist nerd whining about women that are speaking up: Accuse everyone of not being a woman but instead of being a male white-knighting women.

It's funny, women get routinely harassed far harsher than any man, which men ignore, but when women complain, suddenly they aren't counted as women, because in the opinion of many, women evidently cannot speak up. Because women are polite and meek or something, or what?

Most of the people complaining about it are women.

Women don't need to be treated differently.

Yes. Which means, for example, that the vicious harassment women that speak up get should stop. Men never get even close to the amount of abuse a woman gets just for having a blog.

My sister blogs about toys and german p&p rpgs. She made the mistake of mentioning her being a woman in one blog post.

Ever since then, she got harassing emails and threats. None ever came before. Her only comment on sexism was one blog post having a single sentence about guys that talk over her during a P&P session. Enough for the male nerd brigade to bring out the rape threats, though.

Women do need to be treated like a human being, not a gender.

Yes, and that means that campaigns of rape threats, attempts to dig up private addresses to make hate-calls, and general sexism need to stop.

It's no more wrong to call a woman a sexist slur than it is to call a man a dickhead.

Actually, it is more wrong. A "dickhead" is a generally mild insult that carries exactly zero baggage with it. Sexist insults, on the other hand, do.

It's why sexist men use sexist insults against women, instead of "dickhead".

So stop treating women like helpless children that need to be shielded

Nobody is doing this. Stop bringing up imaginary issues.

 

[Your once and future Fanboy]

The problem with alot of the issues with misogynist comments and the reactions they get are the way people think/reacts to these comments.
Say for example a woman makes a video response to a youtube video by a man, and in her video she calls him X number of negative things (a**hole, motherf*cker, ect) but also male specific insults. Those would be concidered insulting, but if the roles where reversed and he would use female specific insults at her, it would raise flags as a misogynistic response.

We see the same with comments that use slurs about race or sexual orientation, if you are part of the percived minority (i.e not a white, straight male), any negative comment towards you from someone in the percived majority (white, straight male) it's more likely to be percived as a "hate" comment (whether it was or not).
(NB! I'am not inclining that acctual racist or homophobic comments are O.K or that people shouldn't react to them)
This is why many then tend to rally together and "defend" the person of the percived minority.
But the special thing with women are that a big part of their struggle for equality is the right to be viewed as though, strong and capable as any man, and therefore protective and assisting gestures/actions can be percived as belitteling, degrading or even misygonistic.

So I agree that we should hope and strive for true equality (or as close as we can get to it at least), but understand that all the baggage from civil rights movements and the disassemblement of the patriarchy are still effecting us and our views today.

 

[Don Savik]

Women don't need no man, eh?

Cool beans. And while you're speaking on behalf of all women ever, can you tell them via hivemind that I'm available and if they want my phone number just message me on my Escapist profile.

Might as well be opportunistic here *shrug*

I will not use my super powers to help you land a girlfriend! There's something seedy about it, lol.

Well aren't you a killjoy? Man just trying to get some companionship, and all of a sudden its SEEDY. Now that's just a negative stereotype :C

SNIP

I think you should take a break from debating when you've gotten to the point were thinking that relating humans to lions helps explain gender roles. Its quite frankly a bit silly. We have as much in common with lions as we do with badgers and elephants and kangaroos.

See how silly these threads have become?

 

[zefiris]

Oh, and small addendum:

Vicious harassment needs to stop in general, obviously. It's just harsher against women, but that doesn't mean vicious harassment and death threats against some random white guy would be okay.

Say, if a guy plays a Hobgoblin Mushroom farmer, they shouldn't get death threats just because they like Mushroom farming instead of Booger-golem building, despite many MMO-players evidently feeling otherwise (replace Mushroom farming with random class in random MMO)

BUT that said, can we stop having 'girl gamers' identifying themselves

Can you stop blowing a fuse whenever a female mentions she's female? Men do announce their gender all the time ("I'm a Paladin-loving guy", for example), but when a woman does it, suddenly she's accused of "attention whoring". Similarly, if you talk as if someone is a guy, and they correct you, that's entirely fine and not "attention whoring", either. If you don't like it, maybe stop gendering random people?

The hostility many men have towards a visible woman is downright silly.

 

[Malkavian]

I'm almost certain that someone else has asked you this already, but:

Women aren't babies.

Women don't need people to protect them.

Women don't need white knights.

Women don't need to be treated differently.

Women do need to be treated like a human being, not a gender.

What, then, are you doing in this very post?

 

[Clearing the Eye]

Oh, and small addendum:

Vicious harassment needs to stop in general, obviously. It's just harsher against women, but that doesn't mean vicious harassment and death threats against some random white guy would be okay.

Say, if a guy plays a Hobgoblin Mushroom farmer, they shouldn't get death threats just because they like Mushroom farming instead of Booger-golem building, despite many MMO-players evidently feeling otherwise (replace Mushroom farming with random class in random MMO)

BUT that said, can we stop having 'girl gamers' identifying themselves

Can you stop blowing a fuse whenever a female mentions she's female? Men do announce their gender all the time ("I'm a Paladin-loving guy", for example), but when a woman does it, suddenly she's accused of "attention whoring". Similarly, if you talk as if someone is a guy, and they correct you, that's entirely fine and not "attention whoring", either. If you don't like it, maybe stop gendering random people?

The hostility many men have towards a visible woman is downright silly.

I could make the joke about bleeding and not dying being the cause of such fear, but I won't. I'm just too classy ;P

 

[Bassik]

I'm almost certain that someone else has asked you this already, but:

Women aren't babies.

Women don't need people to protect them.

Women don't need white knights.

Women don't need to be treated differently.

Women do need to be treated like a human being, not a gender.

What, then, are you doing in this very post?

Oh, snap!

 

[Your once and future Fanboy]

Sorry for the double post but I wanted clarify something about my earlier post.

Here on the internet, what people use as insults are usually that which get the biggest reactions. It's something we see in gameing, forums and youtube responses.
That's why many use the word rape instead of words like beat (i.e "I raped you" instead of "I beat you", same can be said for the word owned/ pwned) in games like CoD, Halo or Street Fighter.

The provocative use of misogyny, homophobia and racism have become a part of the internet community's "humor", and many use these "jokes" even though there aren't real hate or bigotry there (I mean "jokes" in the loosest term possible).

That's what I meant when I refered to percived hate and use of slurs in my original comment.

 

[Clearing the Eye]

Male or female... the only thing I am interested in is if they like Mario, and if they do, then they are my friends.

I'm having a really hilarious vision of how you date someone right now. ;-p

"You know where the secret mushroom is, *****?"

-"What? I don't, um..."

"This date is over!

 

[Treblaine]

SNIP

I think you should take a break from debating when you've gotten to the point were thinking that relating humans to lions helps explain gender roles. Its quite frankly a bit silly. We have as much in common with lions as we do with badgers and elephants and kangaroos.

See how silly these threads have become?

Hmm, don't be so unscientific to dismiss human's common traits with other mammals. I am illustrating an evolutionary trap in sexual reproduction. You seem to be using the fallacy of Argument from Incredulity which is no argument by flatly calling it "silly" and denying any explanatory purpose.

We have a lot in common with lions, with a close group social structure and also extreme gender dimorphism. Most mammals the males and females are almost impossible to tell apart, Realise that it takes a close examination to tell chimp gender apart, our closest LIVING evolutionary ancestor. But men naturally grow beards and even without beards have much more pronounced jaw and loss of fat deposits in the face. I rememberer reading a study of rabbit behaviour that they could tell if a male human was approaching or a female, but didn't distinguish gender with any other animals.

Looking at early man it was in fact the females who provided most of the calories in pre-historic diet, as the men extended huge energy trying to hunt for meat while the women efficiently gathered for food. This can be seen today by how you will die if you try to eat mainly game meat like rabbits and birds, called protein poisoning because the human liver can digest so little protein and we need high carbohydrate diet that you get from seeds, tubers, fruits and nuts.

 

[Don Savik]

SNIP

I think you should take a break from debating when you've gotten to the point were thinking that relating humans to lions helps explain gender roles. Its quite frankly a bit silly. We have as much in common with lions as we do with badgers and elephants and kangaroos.

See how silly these threads have become?

snip

What I mean is look how obtuse you're becoming with your arguments. People that don't agree with you aren't going to be won over by an article about rabbits discerning male humans from females.

And in the end all this internet rambling isn't going to solve anything. I know the word "sexist" and "misogynist" have been thrown around this site a bazillion times, but I don't think the majority of people on the escapist (probably about 90%) are the type of people that spew these kinds of insults towards women anyways. If they did they would've probably been scared off or banned by now.

 

[Treblaine]

Hmm, don't be so unscientific to dismiss human's common traits with other mammals. I am illustrating an evolutionary trap in sexual reproduction. You seem to be using the fallacy of Argument from Incredulity which is no argument by flatly calling it "silly" and denying any explanatory purpose.

We have a lot in common with lions, with a close group social structure and also extreme gender dimorphism. Most mammals the males and females are almost impossible to tell apart, Realise that it takes a close examination to tell chimp gender apart, our closest LIVING evolutionary ancestor. But men naturally grow beards and even without beards have much more pronounced jaw and loss of fat deposits in the face. I rememberer reading a study of rabbit behaviour that they could tell if a male human was approaching or a female, but didn't distinguish gender with any other animals.

Looking at early man it was in fact the females who provided most of the calories in pre-historic diet, as the men extended huge energy trying to hunt for meat while the women efficiently gathered for food. This can be seen today by how you will die if you try to eat mainly game meat like rabbits and birds, called protein poisoning because the human liver can digest so little protein and we need high carbohydrate diet that you get from seeds, tubers, fruits and nuts.

What I mean is look how obtuse you're becoming with your arguments. People that don't agree with you aren't going to be won over by an article about rabbits discerning male humans from females.

And in the end all this internet rambling isn't going to solve anything. I know the word "sexist" and "misogynist" have been thrown around this site a bazillion times, but I don't think the majority of people on the escapist (probably about 90%) are the type of people that spew these kinds of insults towards women anyways. If they did they would've probably been scared off or banned by now.

You are misrepresenting my argument which was NOT merely "rabbits can tell men from women", you know that, I know that, we ALL know that.

SO you are making a straw man out of my argument, then think wilful incredulity is enough.

These terms are not just "thrown around". They are used in discussions that you refuse to address, only misrepresent and dismiss as silly.

And this is about the fundamentals of how men interact and view women on issues such as "chivalry".

 

[Charli]

He's a grandmotherfucker.

You saying there is something wrong about having sex with elderly women? You ageist!

Hey I could be a slut/*****/'Some deregatory term for a woman' too some people just like that sort of thing!

But damn would you need alot of lube. *wince* Doesn't appeal to my brain no.

Also my Grandmother (mothers side) is a unbelievably awful person, so the image is win-win in my brain.

 

[Clearing the Eye]

But damn would you need alot of lube.

Wh... Why wold bring that up? Fine. Whatever. I didn't want to sleep tonight anyway.