your child is transgendered

[Colour Scientist]

Transitioning would be a pretty new and unknown process for a vast majority of people so I think it's understandable why a lot of people would be wary about making rash decisions and wouldn't jump at the "high-five, let's start everything right fucking now" approach.

Yes, but wouldn't seeing a psychologist be more or less something you try to do immediately? Would you or anybody in the thread hold that off if your child came to you and said that they felt depressed, or were needed help dealing with some sort of traumatic experience? People are showing hesitation to bring their child to a professional, presumably because they believe that it may be indulging the idea that they're trans and therefore harmful, which is crazy talk. You don't not take your kid to the doctor that will help them because you're afraid that the doctor might think that you're child needs some sort of medical attention. If you treat mental conditions like their physical counterparts, it'd be the equivalant of seeing your child coughing up blood daily and saying "well, if its still happening when you're eighteen, we'll do something about it". I don't mean to be damning, but its basically child neglect to not do anything regarding the matter.

Most people here seem to be in agreement that they would take their child to see a psychologist or bring them to talk to someone. I think what people are hesitant or uncertain about is jumping head first into physical or hormonal changes at a young age.

I think it might do you a bit of good to assume the best in people.

 

[Deathmageddon]

And they're not growing out of it. ... Bear in mind we are talking about someone roughly around 13 years old.

13. And they're not growing out of it.

THIRTEEN?! When I was a teenager, I outgrew a litany of stuff a mile long and then outgrew my having outgrown it a year later! Thirteen year olds aren't old enough to drive, but making a decision that will affect them for their entire lives is fine? Should 13 year olds also be encouraged marry and get pregnant? Let's wait until they've at least stopped growing out of their SHOES before we say they're not growing out of it lmao!

Can't wait to see what kind of vitriolic responses I get in the name of some kind of ironically selective "tolerance" for saying this, but I'm against elective and cosmetic surgery as a general rule. People should learn to love themselves the way they were born. If you just artificially change whatever you don't like, you'll just find something you can't change with surgery and never get over it or grow as a person. I don't know what someone with those feelings is going through, and I have nothing but sympathy for them, but 70-80% of people with those feelings spontaneously lose them (study by Vanderbilt University and London's Portman Clinic) and a significant number who "transition" do regret it. My future kids can do whatever they want (this is me being tolerant), and I'll always love them and try to be a part of their lives, but that doesn't mean I have to agree and I'm sure as hell not paying for it.

 

[cleric of the order]

Well in all honesty I wouldn't be quite sure of what to do.
I'd still love them, that's simple.
It's not that much of a big deal.
But there's a number of things i don't really know how to react to i suppose.
Assuming they have full gender disphoria then well I'd get them some assessments, I'd have likely had to have themn tested for ASD anyway.
But shit, It's going to be annoying reading up on that shit, I mean my parents had to learn a bit about ASD too but I really just don't want to.

 

[Proto Taco]

This question exactly, is why people need to stop treating transgenderism like a stupid hipster 'decision' or 'expression' and actually do legitimate scientific tests to find out what causes it so that it can be detected early and dealt with at as young an age as possible.

Problem is people still largely see trans people as crossdressers, and 'edgy' hipsters have started hiding behind the 'genderqueer' umbrella to get more attention, which hasn't helped anything. As a trans person who's suffered through the trans dilemma my whole life, I can tell you with certainty that a large number of 'genderqueer' people are simply faking it for attention. This does not help matters when trying to get actual research done on the topic, seriously.

To those who wouldn't feel comfortable committing to their child's 'decision' to do HRT, I would recommend hormone blockers. But if they come out as young as 13, don't force them to suffer through a dysphoric puberty, that's just cruel, and you're setting them up for misery later in life. Put them on hormone blockers until such time as you and your child are comfortable with the decision and then help them get started. Don't kick them out or tell them to get a job and tough it out, help them. Make them feel like they're not a pariah and you actually care about their wellbeing.

There is nothing worse than feeling like a societal mistake for reasons beyond your control.

 

[Sigmund Av Volsung]

I'd give them my support and tell them that I'm behind everything that they want to do in life, so long as it makes them happy.

Unless their grandmother gets involved. Then I begin fortifying defences and protecting my kid from her bullshit. If there's any one factor that would ever affect any sort of familial decision in this hypothetical scenario is my current family tampering with anything.

They wouldn't get a say in this, and I'd tell them to fuck off. I get enough bullshit on what gets classified "manly" and "weak" that there'd be no way I'd let them in on something like this, if it were to happen. In that scenario, I would actively encourage my kid even more out of my own mal-adjusted though (hopefully) well-intentioned spite.

 

[waj9876]

THey're either unusually effeminate or tomboyish, liking my little pony or transformers

Like, current My Little Pony? Because that's designed to appeal to everyone. Even if it's old MLP, just because their interests are different than what they should stereotypically like, that doesn't really indicate they're transgendered.

Even if a kid expresses that they want to be another gender, do not immediately go out and get them started on transitioning. Because this is a huge decision that will impact the rest of their lives. Talk to them, seek out professional help to talk to them. Because if they later determine they want to be the gender they were born as, all of that money was wasted, and something either irreversible happened, or something happened that will take even more money to reverse. (I'm not an expert on the subject.)

Gender is a complicated subject. More complicated than most people actually realize. It's not just "I want to be this gender and will forever want to be this gender." It can be that, but not always. Because a lot of what "gender" means is a social construct. People can be confused about what they want, and at the age you're talking about, their brains are still developing.

 

[verdant monkai]

Take a good long look at myself as a parent. And try and see if I can fathom why on earth they would wan't to even think about that sort of thing at their age, I mean what have they been put through to start doubting/feeling out of place with their own bodies.

I'd just tell the kid straight up. No you are not having expensive surgery, that can go wrong and will definitely ruin your chances of being able to have kids. You are thirteen and thirteen year olds often cannot be expected to make sensible decisions on things which will affect them later in life. I wanted to change my name to Eric when I was thirteen, I am now twenty and do not feel the need to change my name to Eric. When you are thirteen you are not the person you will mature into as an adult, its up to the parents to guide their children to make sensible decisions that will benefit them later down the line, not allow them to start warping their genitals before they have even had sex.

The age minimum age for gender reassignment in the UK is 18 but you can start taking hormone pills at 16. I wouldn't allow my kid to start taking any kind of hormone pills until they were 18, those things would probably cost a bomb as well. To be honest I think the minimum age for gender reassignment should be at least 21, when you are young you are not worldly, you are inexperienced and you do not know yourself. People should spend years thinking before they cause drastic unalterable change to their bodies.

 

[Silvanus]

If you just artificially change whatever you don't like, you'll just find something you can't change with surgery and never get over it or grow as a person. I don't know what someone with those feelings is going through, and I have nothing but sympathy for them, but 70-80% of people with those feelings spontaneously lose them (study by Vanderbilt University and London's Portman Clinic) and a significant number who "transition" do regret it.

The scientific consensus is that for most, sex reassignment surgery is often the best course of action: it provides a better standard of life far more often than not.

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF02437545#page-1

[...]four aspects of the quality of life were examined: attitude towards the patients' own body, relationships with other people, sexual activity, and occupational functioning. In most transsexuals, the quality of life was improved after surgery inasmuch as these four aspects are concerned.

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1023/A:1024517302481#page-1

"[...]Psychological profiles as measured by the MMPI were more "normal" in the desired sex than the anatomic sex".

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF01542484

Allowing for the restrictive methodology of the (ex post facto) study, it is concluded that there is no reason to doubt the therapeutic effect of sex reassignment surgery.

http://bjp.rcpsych.org/content/157/2/261.short

Of two groups of 20 patients accepted for gender reassignment surgery, one was offered early operation and therefore had had surgery by follow-up two years later, while the second was still awaiting operation at two-year follow-up. Although the groups were similar initially, significant differences between them emerged at follow-up in terms of neuroticism and social and sexual activity, with benefits being enjoyed by the operated group.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3105355/

The least invasive intervention would be counseling such patients to accept the circumstance. As already noted, however, no available data support the success of such therapy [...] Although current transgender treatment is relatively invasive and does not address the problem completely, it is the most successful intervention available.

 

[Vault101]

Can't wait to see what kind of vitriolic responses I get in the name of some kind of ironically selective "tolerance" for saying this, but I'm against elective and cosmetic surgery as a general rule.[b/] People should learn to love themselves the way they were born.[/b]

yeeeeah....stop right there...please

[quote/]If you just artificially change whatever you don't like, you'll just find something you can't change with surgery and never get over it or grow as a person.[/quote]
you know not all trans people actually have or want operations?

I'd give them as much drugs and therapy to overcome there obvious mental disorder.

like hormones and therapy to transition?

that's...what you meant right? [sub/]right?[/sub]

 

[Sleepy Sol]

I saw this today and am going to leave it here, because it adds extra implications to the question at hand.

"Gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender adolescents who come out at school have higher self-esteem and lower levels of depression as young adults, compared to LGBT youth who don't disclose their sexual orientation or gender identity at school, according to a new study led by University of Arizona researcher Stephen Russell."

http://uanews.org/story/lgbt-teens-who-come-out-at-school-have-better-self-esteem-study-finds

Yeah, it seems a little bit obvious to me that suppressing what someone feels to be their true gender identity/sexual orientation (whether it's self-induced or forced by outside parties) is never much of a good idea. And that an acceptance of one's identity would be quite a bit healthier for one's psyche.

But to some people in this thread it doesn't seem to be so when it comes to trans individuals. And to me that's quite upsetting.

 

[Norithics]

Sounds like a great time to expound upon the "sex and gender in the world you live in" talk I'd been gradually feeding them piecemeal since they were small, to give them all the tools they need to make the decisions they're gonna need to make.

And then go wash the dishes, seriously the sink is SO FULL.

 

[elvor0]

ehh at 13, I'd just see how it goes. It doesn't necesarilly mean that they're trans. My Wife and my Mother both were massive tomboys to the point where they'd pretend they were boys when they were younger, they are both however quite happy being girls now. If they still feel the same way when they're 16+ then we talk about what route they want to go down. However, I wouldn't make a big deal about it, because that's why it's still...a big deal.

Being gay isn't something that's made a big deal of anymore (at least in Europe), from either straight or gay people, yet Trans for some people is something they feel the need to yell from the rooftops or become extremely exclusionary of people who are "cis". Fight for equality rights by all means, but they moment you stop being all "HELLO I'M TRANS I'M SUCH A BIG DEAL", is when people start treating you equally. Equality also includes equally not having your sexuality/gender state made anything of.

 

[CrystalShadow]

I'd be very cautious in assuming anything about their identity merely from the clothes they like or what their interests are.

But, knowing the process itself, I would probably get them started down the road of talking to psychologists, hormones and the like as early as possible into puberty, if it were clear they were serious about it.

Surgery can certainly wait until they are adults, but honestly, if you force them to go through puberty in the wrong body you are potentially causing them permanent physical harm that will make the rest of their adult life much more difficult than it needed to be.
That's not to say you should let them jump blindly into stuff like that, but don't go around forcing them to wait until they're 18. That's cruel, and far too late in some ways...
If there's doubt, puberty blockers are a good starting point. They have reversible effects, and cause no real permanent harm regardless of what the child may decide when they are older.

Surgery isn't time critical, but forcing someone to go through puberty is vicious and cruel, and has irreversible consequences that can make their whole life vastly more difficult than simply being transgender would already be for them.

It's as cruel as surgically altering your child against their wishes, honestly...

So... Think very carefully about it.

If there's doubt, don't rush into anything permanent either way (hormones, whether that produced naturally by the body, or given artificially have quite a few permanent consequences, so the best thing to do in case of doubt is block ALL of it, both what their own bodies would do AND artificial sources. - If it's ambiguous what they really want, this is the safest and least cruel alternative that is least reliant on knowing for sure what they actually want, and makes it possible for them to make the permanent decisions when they are adults, or at least older teens, without having to deal with reversing permanent damage to their bodies somehow. Which is difficult and expensive.)

But anyway, having said all that, it's not as simple as what kind of toys they like, and what their interests are. Reading too much into that leads into really dangerous territory that completely obscures the reality of the issue.

You are not transgender simply because of that. Sorry. There's something more fundamental, and if you have a child who is having issues, it's this fundamental aspect of identity that you need to be watching for, not the superficial nonsense of gender stereotypes...

 

[Reasonable Atheist]

I do not even find out about it, because i have run to south America to escape my adult responsibilities 13 years ago.

 

[Ambitiousmould]

Step one: Move out of this town. Unless I'm already living elsewhere. I don't think I know of anywhere in the UK that's less tolerant of anything other than a straight, white, working class person. Call me what you will. Say I'm a **** for not letting them adjust in the environment they've grown up in, or that I'm a coward. It's for their own safety.

Story not for the easily upset:
Someone wrote gay taunts on an autistic kid's face and body, then drenched him in tanning oil and burned him to death on his 18th birthday. In this town. And people wonder why I hate where I'm from.

 

[Abomination]

I wouldn't trust the average 13 year old to tell me the time correctly let alone diagnose their gender.

My primary opinion of gender is that it doesn't sodding matter. Like what you like, don't pigeonhole yourself and seek to "suit" particular traits associated with the binary.

They're a 13 year old kid with a penis/vagina who likes boys/girls. Anything else is pointless social construct.

 

[Thaluikhain]

They're a 13 year old kid with a penis/vagina who likes boys/girls. Anything else is pointless social construct.

A very large and very powerful social construct that many people will kill over.

 

[Abomination]

They're a 13 year old kid with a penis/vagina who likes boys/girls. Anything else is pointless social construct.

A very large and very powerful social construct that many people will kill over.

And thankfully next to none of the idiots who would kill over it happen to inhabit the country I live in.

I would hope to impart upon my child that they shouldn't get worked up over pointless shit like gender, and they should just like what they like.

 

[chinangel]

I would sit them down and have a proper talk about it. I would explain that there's no such thing as transgendered and it was just something people who were sick and unhappy did to themselves.

I would explain that you are who you are, that no amount of invasive surgical mutilation would ever make them a real girl/boy and that modern medicine was essentially offering a cathartic opiate like physical solution to a problem that does not need it.

I would tell them that it's okay to like anything, I'm a man. Straight, white male. Simple as that. Doesn't mean I don't like romantic comedies, or pink, or exfoliating face washes. I would finish by telling him everyone is unique, there's no point trying to pigeonhole yourself into social roles designed by wishy washy liberals with no scientific insight whatsoever. Just be happy being who are you and I'll take you to the butchers so you can see what you almost got yourself into.

as transgendered woman myself, i have to say that there is so much here that is wrong. There are so many psychologists, psychiatrists and mental health experts that would tell you you are wrong, as well as people who have lived this.

If your child was transgendered, you just told them 'i don't accept you', and they may struggle with their feelings for a long time.

Or they may just reject your viewpoint and do whatever they can to get where they need to be. With, or without your blessing.

 

[LadyMint]

If they would want to get a sex chance just because they're effeminate/tomboyish and like My Little Pony/Transformers, I would clear that shit up right quick and say that that's no reason at all to get surgery done. I liked My Little Pony when I was a kid, I also liked hitting things with a stick.

Seconded. If they define themselves as male or female on the grounds of gender stereotypes, then I'm going to treat the matter much the same as the claim that the boy down the street is gay because he'd rather watch the Sound of Music than the Superbowl...which is to say I'd roll my eyes and explain the difference between interests and gender identity/sexual orientation. Now, if they could give me a better reason than that, then I'd start doing research in earnest and talking to doctors and psychiatrists about the suggested course of action. Based on my current (admittedly lacking) knowledge, MarsAtlas's solution seems the most reasonable to me.

I'm in this camp. When I was younger, I watched things like Transformers and Pro-Wrestling because I had an older brother and that's what he watched. But on the flipside, we also watched things like Jem and the Holograms and he would play Barbie dolls with me. It was just the popular thing to do in our household. Nowadays our tastes have gone in different directions but we still talk about those things we used to enjoy together as children with positive memories.

I wouldn't take it too seriously but I wouldn't make light of it, either. Nothing damages a child like making fun of them for having an idea that might not be the norm in your personal point of view. If it still turned out to be a strong desire as my child got older, then we would have talks and possibly see a councilor before making any permanent decisions. Not to try and change the child's mind, but to help them work out the reasons why so the decision is more informed.