Zero Punctuation: The Evil Within - As Bad as Bad Horror Games Can Get

SuperScrub

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How about you play Five Night's At Freddy's and conquer your fear of theme park mascots. Hope you're good at resource management.
 

Ihateregistering1

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This is probably the angriest I've ever heard Yahtzee, but I'll admit, the game seems pretty crappy so far. It's one of those things you keep playing because you think that they're going to explain everything that's happening at some point, but of course they never do.

Honestly, the only thing I could think of while I was playing it was "damn, I really wanna play RE4 now".
 

xscoot

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I played this game and Yahtzee wasn't nearly as angry as I was about it. The complete lack of pacing, the jarring tonal shifts, the poorly balanced combat (Yahtzee was always lacking in ammo, but if you upgraded damage and only damage you'd be getting one hit kills all the time so I ended up with too much ammo), terrible enemy design (snipers hiding behind chest high walls. It seriously did that), a story that you have to figure out on your own but leaves too much unexplained anyways, the blatant plagiarism from Silent Hill (there's a recurring enemy that is absolutely not Pyramid Head), the poor dialogue, the game actually gives away the plot twist midway through and then all the characters forget about it, etc.

I hate, hate, HATE this game.

But what I really hate is the knowledge that it could have been good. That if they just focused on the psychological horror, or the campy combat, it would have been fine. It was a failure due to its ambition of trying to take the very best from Silent Hill and Resident Evil. I hate it because of what could have been.
 

Moeez

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xscoot said:
I played this game and Yahtzee wasn't nearly as angry as I was about it. The complete lack of pacing, the jarring tonal shifts, the poorly balanced combat (Yahtzee was always lacking in ammo, but if you upgraded damage and only damage you'd be getting one hit kills all the time so I ended up with too much ammo), terrible enemy design (snipers hiding behind chest high walls. It seriously did that), a story that you have to figure out on your own but leaves too much unexplained anyways, the blatant plagiarism from Silent Hill (there's a recurring enemy that is absolutely not Pyramid Head), the poor dialogue, the game actually gives away the plot twist midway through and then all the characters forget about it, etc.

I hate, hate, HATE this game.

But what I really hate is the knowledge that it could have been good. That if they just focused on the psychological horror, or the campy combat, it would have been fine. It was a failure due to its ambition of trying to take the very best from Silent Hill and Resident Evil. I hate it because of what could have been.
Is the Box Head the one ripping from Silent Hill?

Too bad the game was not enjoyable. I still haven't picked up Alien Isolation because of funds but looks like I'll skip out on this game.
 

PinkiePyro

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"resident evil six is indentying as a sea urchant" ROFL
still kinda want it myself but for those who want to hold out for better ...

gonna throw out there that they are working on Five nights at freddie's 2 so go throw likes at it on stream greenlight
 

Not G. Ivingname

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Thanatos2k said:
The game is like RE4? Wow, I have seen no promotional materials or articles written that seemed to suggest that. Marketing in gaming is completely broken.

The biggest problem is that RE4 is barely a horror game. Capcom doesn't understand this either, but Resident Evil 4 ruined the Resident Evil series. Because it was such a good game, Capcom mistakenly thought that this is what people wanted out of Resident Evil and horror in general. Nope. RE4 was just a really good game, but it wasn't a good Resident Evil or Survival Horror game.

And so we have another game dancing about how it's such a great horror game that modeled itself after RE4 without understanding why.
I am guessing near the end of developement the executive/publisher saw the sales of Indie horror games that were actually scary, so demanded that the developer turn this from an action "horror" game into a proper horror, so the programmers used the last two peas of the budget to crowbar in the stealth elements (rather than proper scene transitions) for the E3 gameplay trailer.
 

Garrett

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Casual Shinji said:
Johnny Novgorod said:
Casual Shinji said:
People like to say RE4 ruined Resident Evil, but the series wasn't really doing that much better before that. The last stand-out entry was REmake, and that was... a remake. Code Veronica was meh, and when REZero came out they were scraping the bottom of the barrel
I thought Code Veronica was OK. The dual-wielding was a weak gimmick, and the Ashford family history made the premise more idiotic than usual, but it still managed to be scary and pretty tough to be honest.
The thing is, Code Veronica was ruined for me by the real-time rendered backgrounds. Which sounds like a shallow reason, but the only real benefit pre-rendered backgrounds have is the high amount of detail, which greatly served the atmosphere of the Resident Evil games. That's the only reason we put up with the wonky camera angles and controls.

The benefit of real-time rendered backgrounds is for allowing better 3D maneuverability, since the environment pivots along with you. Which Code Veronica didn't do, because the camera was still fixed the majority of the time and you would still transition from screen to screen. There was basically no difference from older RE games, except the backgrounds looked worse. Capcom pulled the same thing with Dino Crisis and I hated that too.

Also Steve.
Except that CV didn't take a piss off of entire series storyline. I admit I didn't like natural virus introduced by it and bringing back Wesker as superhuman. But at least it was still RE storyline. You were fighting umbrella and the game happened within same year as first 3 games. And its ending told us that next we are taking offensive actions against Umbrella, so from next RE game I expected to follow this storyline. But then RE4 happened, in game events 6 years after CV starting with "Umbrella is no more" line. "Hey, remember that thing we were building up for 4 last games? Yeah that, screw it.". That's what destroyed RE series. I really liked RE storyline (and RE is my most favourite "zombie apocalypse" scenario) and they just scraped it and thrown away. All they had to do is to call it something other than RE game and it would be fine (I still wouldn't like it, because even as separate game it's pretty bad imo (I completely don't understand why it's getting so much praise)). The only positive thing about RE4 is that it made me enjoy CV much more.


Rainbow_Dashtruction said:
Thanatos2k said:
The game is like RE4? Wow, I have seen no promotional materials or articles written that seemed to suggest that. Marketing in gaming is completely broken.

The biggest problem is that RE4 is barely a horror game. Capcom doesn't understand this either, but Resident Evil 4 ruined the Resident Evil series. Because it was such a good game, Capcom mistakenly thought that this is what people wanted out of Resident Evil and horror in general. Nope. RE4 was just a really good game, but it wasn't a good Resident Evil or Survival Horror game.

And so we have another game dancing about how it's such a great horror game that modeled itself after RE4 without understanding why.
RE 4 is probably the only horror game ever to actually successfully bring fear at points without being a stealth game. I think its just the combination of both the chainsaw guys insane loudness and the fact that to retreat at a decent speed, you need to put your back to blockable throwing axe attacks. Regardless, while it was rarely that scary, its still a shitload scarier then RE 1-3 and 5 and 6. 1-3 are garbage with no redeeming features, and the only redeeming feature of 5 and 6 is their graphics for fuck sake.
I never understood people that play horror games for scares. Do you really get scared while playing a game in your home, the "safest" place on earth, where you feel most comfortable? I do like horror games, but not because they're scary, it's because they usually have very interesting premise which with good writing can turn into great storyline (eg. SH2), they have specific, heavier, atmosphere and invest you in their world. RE4 fails on all those accounts. It's just a boring game with terrible controls (I don't mind tank controls when they are used correctly, tank controls work in slow paced static camera enviroment, they don't work in an action game).
 

RavingSturm

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RE4 scary? Sorry I disagree. The game tosses way to much ammo your way and you basically shoot through enemies most of the time. It was basically the model that most modern over-the-shoulder cover shooters followed.
 

Casual Shinji

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Garrett said:
Except that CV didn't take a piss off of entire series storyline. I admit I didn't like natural virus introduced by it and bringing back Wesker as superhuman. But at least it was still RE storyline. You were fighting umbrella and the game happened within same year as first 3 games. And its ending told us that next we are taking offensive actions against Umbrella, so from next RE game I expected to follow this storyline. But then RE4 happened, in game events 6 years after CV starting with "Umbrella is no more" line. "Hey, remember that thing we were building up for 4 last games? Yeah that, screw it.". That's what destroyed RE series. I really liked RE storyline (and RE is my most favourite "zombie apocalypse" scenario) and they just scraped it and thrown away. All they had to do is to call it something other than RE game and it would be fine (I still wouldn't like it, because even as separate game it's pretty bad imo (I completely don't understand why it's getting so much praise)). The only positive thing about RE4 is that it made me enjoy CV much more.
Well, that's all a matter of a opinion, I guess. See, there really wasn't anything to piss on for RE4. The Resident Evil storyline is one of the stupidest, nonsensical pieces of tripe in gaming history. That doesn't mean most of the games weren't great, but every character in it was basically an idiot, especially the villians.

I would say RE4 finally flushed the toilet of all that...uhm, build-up. It had the most enjoyable story, because this time you weren't dealing with an evil, all powerfull conglomerate that somehow was too stupid to tie its own shoes. It was some backwater cult of mutated freaks led by an egomaniacal dimwit, where their incompetance actually made sense and was fun to watch.

And seriously, RE5 went right back to Wesker's skirt like a frightened child, and we all know how that turned out.
 

stroopwafel

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RE4's focus was more action-oriented but it still retained that typical Resident Evil atmosphere. And the original RE wasn't even meant to have a storyline(Mikami wanted it to just be about a haunted house), but Capcom insisted on it. No one could even predict the popularity of RE as it was a pretty low-key project for Capcom at the time. But anyways, I think all of the RE games by the 'original' developers(Mikami, Kamiya, Kobayashi) are fantastic(that is RE1-4, Zero, CV and Remake) but without a doubt the series sank like a brick when Mikami left Capcom. RE5 and 6 are just complete garbage despite having many of the series original designers on board(show's how important one man's vision and influence are on a franchise).

I also disagree Code Veronica wasn't an advancement in the series. It definitely was as it provided way more espescially in terms of lighting and ambient effects with more visual effects and clearer graphics(espescially character animations) which were impossible during the PS1 'pre-rendered' era. It might not be a big deal now but it was at the time. Also the storyline of CV(that is the original Dreamcast one without the additional ridiculous 'Wesker scenes' of CVX or CV: Complete on PS2) is the best in the franchise. It's genuinely creepy and unnerving.

Anyways this is a cool vid with the creators of the original RE games, made somewhere between the release of RE:0 and RE4(subtitles in the bottom right screen).


 

Thanatos2k

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Rainbow_Dashtruction said:
Thanatos2k said:
The game is like RE4? Wow, I have seen no promotional materials or articles written that seemed to suggest that. Marketing in gaming is completely broken.

The biggest problem is that RE4 is barely a horror game. Capcom doesn't understand this either, but Resident Evil 4 ruined the Resident Evil series. Because it was such a good game, Capcom mistakenly thought that this is what people wanted out of Resident Evil and horror in general. Nope. RE4 was just a really good game, but it wasn't a good Resident Evil or Survival Horror game.

And so we have another game dancing about how it's such a great horror game that modeled itself after RE4 without understanding why.
RE 4 is probably the only horror game ever to actually successfully bring fear at points without being a stealth game. I think its just the combination of both the chainsaw guys insane loudness and the fact that to retreat at a decent speed, you need to put your back to blockable throwing axe attacks. Regardless, while it was rarely that scary, its still a shitload scarier then RE 1-3 and 5 and 6. 1-3 are garbage with no redeeming features, and the only redeeming feature of 5 and 6 is their graphics for fuck sake.
Garbage? REALLY? The games considered classics by so many people?

RE4 isn't even scary, at all. The first RE games beat the pants off of it in that department.
 

Hugga_Bear

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I swear I'm the only person I know who finds RE4 boring and plain. It was just a mediocre at best shooter to me, I waded in and stompkicked, knifed and pap-pap'd my way to victory over everything in existence without really breaking a sweat. I found the campy dialogue irritating at best and I didn't really like the inventory system because the micro managing was tedious and unnecessary given the seemingly overwhelming amount of ammo and herbs the game kept shoving down my throat. I just...it was boring, it was just a slow paced shooter with the atmosphere of a shit stall in a mental asylum, everything's blurry and brown and you want the weird wailing noises to stop. Then there are the few jump scares which were so telegraphed they might as well put up signs and go "OH NO THERE'S A CHAINSAW MAN".

OT: I am not surprised.

It just seemed like a clusterfuck of everything horror from the start. Even the intro seemed derivative at best like they saw all these successful horrors and decided to do that.
Maybe they intended to subvert the stereotypical horror experience but something went horribly wrong along the way, I dunno I just doubt that the deception was an intentional attempt to money grab because it's easier to make a stealthy horror game. Feels like they tried for something else and it just didn't work.
 

Garrett

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Rainbow_Dashtruction said:
Ok that is absurd. Resident Evil 4 had fantastic controls. The only problem people seem to of had was tank controls, which really aren't that big an issue as people make out. And the camera was perfect. Aside from that, the well done combat mixed with extremely well balanced ammo conservation with a perfectly balanced level of progression made a great shooter.

Secondly, good set of headphones and a dark room works wonders into making you forget how safe you are in a good horror game.
The tank controls are not part of the controls, they ARE the controls. And like I said, I don't mind them when they are used in proper places and that is static camera environment. They really don't work TPS even if I personally don't have problems with them, they just plainly don't fit and cause the experience to be bad. And you know, up until recently I also didn't know what was everyone's problem with tank controls. Then I saw my friend playing REmake... I though I was going to kill either him or myself...

Yeah, maybe if you have reality checks problems or very good imagination. You still stare at flat rectangular picture in front of you. How does that make anybody scared is absolutely beyond me. And it's not like I have problems getting invested into what's happening on the screen, I can just discern real threat from fake one.

Casual Shinji said:
Well, that's all a matter of a opinion, I guess. See, there really wasn't anything to piss on for RE4. The Resident Evil storyline is one of the stupidest, nonsensical pieces of tripe in gaming history. That doesn't mean most of the games weren't great, but every character in it was basically an idiot, especially the villians.

I would say RE4 finally flushed the toilet of all that...uhm, build-up. It had the most enjoyable story, because this time you weren't dealing with an evil, all powerfull conglomerate that somehow was too stupid to tie its own shoes. It was some backwater cult of mutated freaks led by an egomaniacal dimwit, where their incompetance actually made sense and was fun to watch.

And seriously, RE5 went right back to Wesker's skirt like a frightened child, and we all know how that turned out.
Personally I find RE4 storyline to be boring, uninspired and kind of stupid, while I do love previous RE games storyline (except CV and Zero). The power of B movie gets unfold when it takes itself seriously, not when it knows it's B movie. And I don't see how RE stories are any more nonsensical than any other horror game/movie. In fact, I find its presentation of zombie apocalypse most realistic from all the zombie genre (and I do love me some zombies). Of course putting "realistic" and "zombie apocalypse" in one sentence is kind of wrong but you get what I mean :p

Anyway, I can agree to disagree on which storyline is "better" but seriously, if you create a game that has zero things in common (forcefully placed characters and "intrigue" to somehow tie it to previous games doesn't count) with previous installments (and I mean mostly storyline, I can live with redesigned gameplay), call it different. That way both camps get happy. One group of people gets an awesome (in their opinion) game and the other group is not screwed up.

stroopwafel said:
Also the storyline of CV(that is the original Dreamcast one without the additional ridiculous 'Wesker scenes' of CVX or CV: Complete on PS2) is the best in the franchise. It's genuinely creepy and unnerving.
Unfortunately I only know X version and quick search didn't get any results. What exactly was added in X? Does Wesker just have more scenes or was he never part of the original? Depending on your answer I might try find DC version (although I do have trouble imagining playing it on DC controller...).
 

Mahorfeus

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Different strokes, I guess. I personally thought that the game essentially improved on Resident Evil 4 in just about every way possible, which is the most that I could have hoped for from a game that had Mikami's name slapped on it. But I can definitely see why that could be a bad thing. RE4 and by extension, The Evil Within, had some pretty tense moments, but horror? For a game that was touted as being truly terrifying, I was terribly disappointed. Those stupid ads with the "real" footage of people playing the game did not help. Hell, even P.T. was scarier than this game.

That being said, I've been enjoying it immensely. Might just watch my brother play Akumu difficulty instead of playing it myself though, because seriously, fuck that.
 

Mangue Surfer

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Lots of post with "isn't horror". I think there's a misconception.

If it has gruesome imagery is horror.

If it has gruesome imagery + action is action horror.

If it has gruesome imagery + action and the odds are against you is survival horror.

If it has the feeling of uneasy but not the gruesome imagery is terror.

Since terror can kill without turn into horror there's no such thing as survival terror.

Action don't mean bullet in the head. Shoot, stab, run, send your dog, all these are actions. It's silly to want shooting be banned of horror games because of some random sense of superiority.

At least it's my shitty opnion. And remember, if you don't know how to classify call it Action Adventure.
 

stroopwafel

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Garrett said:
stroopwafel said:
Also the storyline of CV(that is the original Dreamcast one without the additional ridiculous 'Wesker scenes' of CVX or CV: Complete on PS2) is the best in the franchise. It's genuinely creepy and unnerving.
Unfortunately I only know X version and quick search didn't get any results. What exactly was added in X? Does Wesker just have more scenes or was he never part of the original? Depending on your answer I might try find DC version (although I do have trouble imagining playing it on DC controller...).

In the CVX version there is an extra scene with Wesker in the middle and the ending scene with Wesker wasn't in the original version. Now, both these scenes added nothing in my opinion and they were so over the top and ridiculous that they kind of broke the creepy atmosphere of the game. It's like they edited these scenes out of the original version(and for good reason) and then decided for some unknown dumb reason to put them back into the CVX re-release of the game(probably on insistence of higher-ups b/c the game needed 'extra content' for the re-release).

Anyways, I think the DC version of CV is stil the best version primarily b/c the textures are slightly sharper with some better animations. Makes sense though as CVX is essentially a port. It's not really a huge difference though as I only noticed it b/c I played the DC version first. Way back(2000 I think it was?) I bought a DC specifically for CV and coming off of the pre-dualshock phase of the games the controller didn't really bother me that much. The PS2 controller is superior though there is no doubt about that. :p But to be honest unless you're a really hardcore RE or RE: CV fan I wouldn't really bother with the DC original if you already played the PS2 version.
 

ThunderCavalier

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It's a shame that this game ended up being negatively received, since I thought that the ads that were going out for it were actually pretty cool.

Oh well.
 

RavingSturm

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People change their minds all the time. I thought I was getting what I wanted when Wasteland 2 came out but its really hard to get into now. I'm pretty sure opinions will more or less even out regarding Evil Within. I was playing RE6 last night, its really not as bad as some people make it out to be. The controls are best out of all the REs imho.